Would you go to war?

No problem murph :D networking and all that.

Thank you seaniebawn. Brilliant.
It is good to aspire towards 4d sto but we currently live in 3d sts. There is no escape. Even Julius Caesar rolled with an army.
Don't get me wrong. I am anti violence but I will protect out of love to any degree

I'm against violence myself, but don't shy from it when pushed, unfortunately we are living in increasingly chaotic times, where the choice
that is currently only a hypothetical could become reality. god forbid but it's looking that way.
 
So far there has been heaps of great posts. BUt mostly about violence when it comes to war. I think war is beyond violence in a way. I think its a great aspect of a certain path. I think its better to have courage in psychological war. I believe this forum to some degree is an aspect of war. A search for truth and the work. Considering how this has all been hidden, to some degree i think of it as a resistance.

War wouldn't happen without a community behind it/ a network. I feel what Cassiopaea is, is to some degree the resistance to deception.

Do people think that psychological warfare is more widespread than physical war in todays world?
 
wand3rer said:
So far there has been heaps of great posts. BUt mostly about violence when it comes to war. I think war is beyond violence in a way. I think its a great aspect of a certain path. I think its better to have courage in psychological war. I believe this forum to some degree is an aspect of war. A search for truth and the work. Considering how this has all been hidden, to some degree i think of it as a resistance.

War wouldn't happen without a community behind it/ a network. I feel what Cassiopaea is, is to some degree the resistance to deception.

Do people think that psychological warfare is more widespread than physical war in todays world?
With psychological war is the real war begins.
 
wand3rer said:
So far there has been heaps of great posts. BUt mostly about violence when it comes to war. I think war is beyond violence in a way. I think its a great aspect of a certain path. I think its better to have courage in psychological war. I believe this forum to some degree is an aspect of war. A search for truth and the work. Considering how this has all been hidden, to some degree i think of it as a resistance.

War wouldn't happen without a community behind it/ a network. I feel what Cassiopaea is, is to some degree the resistance to deception.

Do people think that psychological warfare is more widespread than physical war in todays world?

wand3rer, you bring up a very good point. With the propagandizing in the MSM, for example, the "war" is for hearts and minds.

The word "war" has Indo-European roots meaning "to confuse, mix up" :evil:
 
Thaigrr said:
wand3rer said:
So far there has been heaps of great posts. BUt mostly about violence when it comes to war. I think war is beyond violence in a way. I think its a great aspect of a certain path. I think its better to have courage in psychological war. I believe this forum to some degree is an aspect of war. A search for truth and the work. Considering how this has all been hidden, to some degree i think of it as a resistance.

War wouldn't happen without a community behind it/ a network. I feel what Cassiopaea is, is to some degree the resistance to deception.

Do people think that psychological warfare is more widespread than physical war in todays world?

wand3rer, you bring up a very good point. With the propagandizing in the MSM, for example, the "war" is for hearts and minds.

The word "war" has Indo-European roots meaning "to confuse, mix up" :evil:

Hey Thaigrr, thanks i didn't know that.

Makes sense though as mixing up morals, ethics, perceptions is to create the evil of physical war. I think psychological war is were the true mess lies. So to a degree, coming back to the original question of would we go to war. In a psychological sense, every single person on this forum has... to some degree
 
wand3rer said:
Thaigrr said:
wand3rer said:
So far there has been heaps of great posts. BUt mostly about violence when it comes to war. I think war is beyond violence in a way. I think its a great aspect of a certain path. I think its better to have courage in psychological war. I believe this forum to some degree is an aspect of war. A search for truth and the work. Considering how this has all been hidden, to some degree i think of it as a resistance.

War wouldn't happen without a community behind it/ a network. I feel what Cassiopaea is, is to some degree the resistance to deception.

Do people think that psychological warfare is more widespread than physical war in todays world?

wand3rer, you bring up a very good point. With the propagandizing in the MSM, for example, the "war" is for hearts and minds.

The word "war" has Indo-European roots meaning "to confuse, mix up" :evil:

Hey Thaigrr, thanks i didn't know that.

Makes sense though as mixing up morals, ethics, perceptions is to create the evil of physical war. I think psychological war is were the true mess lies. So to a degree, coming back to the original question of would we go to war. In a psychological sense, every single person on this forum has... to some degree

In the "theater of war" where I stand, strategic enclosure is my main "battle". Many family members whom I have been close to over the years are the penultimate authoritarian followers. Knowing when and how to "fight" is supremely challenging. :(
 
Thaigrr said:
In the "theater of war" where I stand, strategic enclosure is my main "battle". Many family members whom I have been close to over the years are the penultimate authoritarian followers. Knowing when and how to "fight" is supremely challenging. :(

Same for me. My entire family just the other day were saying how much they like obama. Truly unknowing and not factoring the idea that people lie. Like i don't understand that type of obedience.

What would you define strategic enclosure as?
 
wand3rer said:
Thaigrr said:
In the "theater of war" where I stand, strategic enclosure is my main "battle". Many family members whom I have been close to over the years are the penultimate authoritarian followers. Knowing when and how to "fight" is supremely challenging. :(

Same for me. My entire family just the other day were saying how much they like obama. Truly unknowing and not factoring the idea that people lie. Like i don't understand that type of obedience.

What would you define strategic enclosure as?

Go to thecasswiki.net for a complete definition. I would copy it here but my skill with that is lacking.

Suffice to say, in my conversations with them, topics of politics and such revolve around evil and injustice in the world at large. That becomes a springboard for introducing the study of ponerology in general. Our family's Catholic upbringing provides common ground for our discussions. It has been a starting point anyway.
 
Thaigrr said:
wand3rer said:
Thaigrr said:
In the "theater of war" where I stand, strategic enclosure is my main "battle". Many family members whom I have been close to over the years are the penultimate authoritarian followers. Knowing when and how to "fight" is supremely challenging. :(

Same for me. My entire family just the other day were saying how much they like obama. Truly unknowing and not factoring the idea that people lie. Like i don't understand that type of obedience.

What would you define strategic enclosure as?

Go to thecasswiki.net for a complete definition. I would copy it here but my skill with that is lacking.

Suffice to say, in my conversations with them, topics of politics and such revolve around evil and injustice in the world at large. That becomes a springboard for introducing the study of ponerology in general. Our family's Catholic upbringing provides common ground for our discussions. It has been a starting point anyway.

very good points mentioned, and it is a psychological, a war for your mind, to go against your own nature, there are some thing's I can't abide and I have four concrete examples of this in my own life, I've seen large groups of people and even crowds of people stunned into silence by the action's of a pathological/authoritarian individual, I have stood up in these times even when the Individuals around me disappeared, In the times I've done this it with the treat of violence, but the thing that drove to action wasn't self preservation the contrary I couldn't abide someone brutalizing another.

This is small fry, considering what go's on in the world, and only and example on a small scale what life is about, but it gave me an insight what my character is like.

I think there is a direct link between the strategic enclosure and external/internal considering there was a post this morning about this by the bull
http://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php/topic,37338.0.html
and a link to the esoteric glossary on the definition.
glossary.cassiopaea.com/glossary.php?id=40&lsel=
 
D'Ankhiar said:
Dylan said:
D'Ankhiar said:
I don't think it's about being a pacifist. We all "fight" for what we believe differently. If they're coming into your house, raping your children, bombing your neighborhood, you first gotta ask yourself why. Why is it happening? Clearly it's something you brought upon yourself in a way or another. It wouldn't happen if you hadn't. Knowledge protects.

This sounds like blame the victim to me. Absurd.
I admit I worded that wrong, I'm sorry my message didn't go through clearly enough. It's also not about blaming anyone. You'd have to be pretty ignorant or entitled to look for fault or someone to blame. It's the simple fact that everything happens for a reason. How good or bad something is, really just depends on how the individual sees it. I believe we sign up for the things that happen to us in a way or another, to experience them, and eventually learn from them.

I understand what you mean. I was thinking about what you said when reading an article in Sott.net about people that refuse to go to war in Ukraine. (http://www.sott.net/article/292487-A-line-in-the-sand-When-Ukrainians-choose-not-to-die-in-a-war) To a certain point there is a moment where you can say NO or YES. And if you don't make a decision because you believe what the PTB are saying to you, you will suffer the consequences. But sometimes even if you refuse to follow the mass, you are in the middle of it, you like it or not. That's why it is important to take a position, like the people in Ukraine, in the article. But even if they say no to war, they are in the middle of war.
 
On the other hand i will defend my children, my family and mu community if somebody attacks them. Maybe in that act of defensing, somebody will get hurt or killed but its not the same as all the wars that i have seen on the Balkan.

How is that different from some cases that happened on the Balkans? Where there not some people taking arms to defend their homes and people from genocide that happened? You think it is different because you were never in such a situation, but it is not so different.

You can avoid war but it will eventually find you when other side is psychopathic and hell bend on destruction like it is a case in Ukraine, and with the west. In the time of WWII it was different, if there was not physical resistance we would live in modern nazism today. Rising of consciousness is one part of a puzzle, second is the fight, spiritual and physical in a sense. There were also evils from other side that can not be justified because there are morally depraved people and psychopaths from both sides. Would not giving physical resistance to nazis in WWII and keeping your hands clean stop them from killing all those they classified as unworthy? Yes, there were those that are drafted under the threat of death or no way out of financial situation, but like said there can be found a way out, or better to face death for disobedience then be killed spiritually by killing others as a occupation force, but there are different people for different lessons.

Today it is a different thing, if there is going to be WWIII, there is no need to fight because most population will die, same with comets, only hope is independent communities arising when there is a collapse, there is no exit other way, so I think it is better for some people to stay alive because they are of greater use for universe for that time and transition. But still if there was not resistance in a physical way through war in some countries that is stopping western bid to domination, west could have gone much further in their plans for domination and enslavement, not just with other countries but with it s population also, so everybody is resisting in a way it can and it knows(because not all people are well informed or capable yet to take higher road or do not have material conditions for that, which is in itself and a good thing in a bigger way and has a purpose as mentioned when it comes to stopping total enslavement). Those volunteers who join in eastern Ukraine is because they want to help those that are defenseless, not everyone can leave, especially those older who worked all life for that little property they have, it is not like in the west, leaving is not an option for them because it is hardly they ll find jobs with that age, and with the younger ones is the same - having children and working to make a better life for them, and now having to leave all that and start again, no surprising they choose to fight, they have nothing to lose especially those who lost children or family members. Try yourself to be put in that situation that your children, parents, husband, wife's were killed, "you would probably say yea, not a big deal, let s carry with my life, start anew and try to forget about it". Those who say there was no need for a war because the same result was created with war and deaths as if that country just accepted western dictates is naive, first of all not resisting to pathocracy is self-defeating to souled human, and with all those victims through war at least all world would get a chance to see it for what it is, and economic consequences on population after choosing to become western puppet would have much bigger consequences on human lives then through war as was the case after soviet collapse(excluding nuclear war).

War is a horrible thing, and I would avoid it if living in the western country or that is a member of NATO, but if in the east if it came knocking on my door with fascism and there is no other option left would resist. As my country being puppet of NATO and EU and myself being part of that enforcing structure and how things look it seems when the times comes I could be facing death for disobedience, but even if getting out of it chances of surviving without a community are slim, even with all the training and weapons you can not hold out against higher numbers and without supplies. Thought about learning Russian and maybe trying to move there but still can not leave my family, but in a way I accepted my faith, and that is physical death.
 
I agree with Seaniebawn and Captainmurphy. You do what you have to do, when there's a gun pointed at you it's too late to be trying to work out what led you to this situation. If you survive I guess you just have to come to terms with the things you had to do, which I'm sure alot of the guys and girls in eastern Ukraine will have to do if peace comes.

No one has mentioned the soldiers of the Syrian army. If it was not for Imperialist interference they would be just training and getting an education from the army but instead they are fighting to save their country.

Regarding the stats about soldiers not pointing their guns at the enemy, here is an interesting documentary http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2732932/?ref_=ttpl
 
and ..... maybe now we are at war .... we are constantly "bombarded" with advertisements, as we should we dress, how we should talk, how we should eat, as how we sleep, what kind of personality we should have to be "best "in society, we are actually experiencing a" deculturation ". Are trying to mold the population in a way that they benefit. We enter to internet, our accounts facebook, twitter, instagram, etc. and since we assume that governments have free access to our profile, our "privacy". Injustices occurring throughout the world and nobody gives solutions (and who gives solutions peacefully was described as "enemy") then would have to think if we are at war actually, obviously not as shown in the movies, I do not think necessary to implement guns and bombs (although they do) to indentificar an action as a war. If I remember correctly the C's said that at one point the war was not to us but through us, so probably that this happening.
 
Dave_posse said:
If I remember correctly the C's said that at one point the war was not to us but through us, so probably that this happening.

Indeed. The war is always fought through us and how we interact in the world. We can choose to fight that war, if we try to apply "the work" as defined by Gurdijeff, to become aware about our mechanical behaviour and try to become less mechanic and thus we begin slowly to be in a better position to fight that war.
 
Pashalis said:
Dave_posse said:
If I remember correctly the C's said that at one point the war was not to us but through us, so probably that this happening.

Indeed. The war is always fought through us and how we interact in the world. We can choose to fight that war, if we try to apply "the work" as defined by Gurdijeff, to become aware about our mechanical behaviour and try to become less mechanic and thus we begin slowly to be in a better position to fight that war.

Fully agree Pashalis & Dave_posse. This is how i understand it from the C's communications as well. Thats why i think its critically important to begin the process of the Work. After that the war starts and "battles" follow; where each battle leads to knowledge, and better understanding of objective reality step by step. This process i think is best described by the quote from Aeschylus that Laura uses in her Forum signature.
 
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