4th density earth

[NormaRegula]

That part about a True Dimension is facinating. Hmmm...could that mean an entity might wishfully create a new universe that winds up in a "false" dimension?

 

[RflctnOfU]

It seems to me that the "true" dimension is none other than 7th density - the one - god - gravity - the "well" from which all "springs" forth. $.02

Kris :)

 

[RedFox]

I had a few observations, but not having read the wave fully (I've read the online one, now going through the books) it may be inacurate/wishful thinking.

Since we're out in hypothetical land, one other aspect of this that might be 'fun' to consider is that since there is no time and the 4D denizens of this 'other earth' have so increased their activities in their 'need for total control' on 3D earth - the fact that they are still interfering so heavily and so often might indicate that this 4D earth is not 'currently' how they want it to be.

In short - they're still working over-time (as it were) to exert total control on 3D earth. Considering that there is no 'time' - why would they need to do that, unless - 'then' and 'there' is not how they want it to be - they do not have the control they intended to have? Theoretically, they already see the outcome, since there is no 'time' - sooooo the fact that they're still working so hard might mean that they have to...

I've been mulling that over...

Maybe they are too busy with wishful thinking so they can't see everything, especially when they are people using their free will even for a split second, I guess it is like running after millions of toddlers who are all trying to get out of bed at the same time because they don't want to sleep.

lol....then I considereded wishful thinking and how one could practically keep 'millions of todlers' from running off.....electric fence came to mind (sheeple). Why bother chasing when you can 'enclose' them all. You then just maintain the enclosure...maybe the running after indeviduals comes when they pose a threat to escaping said enclosure. Just a (rather unplesant) thought...


The conclusion I came up with as to why there fighting so hard was todo with wishful thinking....or rather seeing things subjectively vs objectively.
The more subjective we are, the more controll they have over us I think...

Well I was actually wondering, if there is no time and these beings are hyperdimensional, why do they need to "do" anything to manipulate what happens in our "future". As in, why can't they just go to a reality/dimension that they want? Just define the parameters - say, we want to go to the reality where we have total dominion over 4th density earth, and simply access that dimension/possibility? It appears they cannot do that for some reason. It must be either some sort of limitation on their part or somemething about how the universe works that prevents somebody from doing that.

The C's said every possibility that can exist, does. But if in every single reality the lizzies basically just "wish" themselves into 4th density earth where they have full control - shouldn't there be at least one reality where the lizzies must actually put in the effort and do all the right stuff to "make" that reality exist in the first place? So I'd think at least one "version" of the lizzies will have to do it the hard way? Of course, being STS, the lizzies would never "choose" to do something the hard way, so why would they ever choose such a method in ANY reality? They must have no choice - something is limiting them from having such an open access to every reality they can conceive of. Cuz the C's also said the lizzies can create new universes and merge them with ours in order to "change" ours. But again, why can't they just create a universe they want and go live there? Also must be a limitation that we just don't know about that stops it from being quite so easy.

I think limiting factor is how objective we can be.....which comes down to free will and learning.
How does a penorology work in relationships? The simplest way I understood it is gaining control by 'selling' a certain image (subjective preditor and victim required), then undermining confidence (again requires both parties to be subjective), down to out right violence/'I love you/never do it again' type behaviour....which again requires subjective/wishful thinking.....none of this can exist if the victim is being objective

So maybe thats all this 4th denisty stuff comes down too?? If it manifests what you subjectively think about.....then your still in the same lesson as above (or might aswell be).....if you can learn objectiveness...to see the truth in everything.....what happens when you arrive in 4th density?
The lizzies subjective control won't work on you if your not also subjective still (perhaps this is too simplistic)

Watching the obama stuff on tv gives me chills just thinking about tranfering something like that to 4th density....I wonder if thats what they have planned...

Hope theres something useful in this and its not too much of my own subjectiveness.

 

[Tigersoap]

then I considereded wishful thinking and how one could practically keep 'millions of todlers' from running off.....electric fence came to mind (sheeple). Why bother chasing when you can 'enclose' them all. You then just maintain the enclosure...maybe the running after indeviduals comes when they pose a threat to escaping said enclosure. Just a (rather unplesant) thought...

yeah I think it is clearly explained in the Evil magician story for example.
That's why they're trying hard to brainwash everyone but I may be wishfully thinking myself that on some occasions there a small flashes of independant thoughts in some persons and that it tilts the balance to the opposite side.

EDIT :Fixed link Thanks Redfox ;) / I also benefit a lot from re-reading the materials !

 

[RedFox]

Thanks Tigersoap. Just so you know the link doesn't directly work, so needs editing.
I've read that example a few times.....as with all things here I've learnt to go re-read things when people suggest them, and not assume I've taken all that I can from them already.
It all seems to make more sence this time/ties quite a few thoughts together...what was also striking was the apparent pathology behind the magicians lies....

He hypnotized all the sheep and suggested to them first of all that they were immortal and that no harm was being done to them when they were skinned, that, on the contrary, it would be very good for them and even pleasant; secondly he suggested that the magician was a good master who loved his flock so much that he was ready to do anything in the world for them; and in the third place he suggested to them that if anything at all were going to happen to them it was not going to happen just then, at any rate not that day, and therefore they had no need to think about it.

 

[Brenda86]

Quote from C's posted by SAO:

Q: (T) Well, this J does not seem to be able to grasp the
idea that time is not a dimension, it is just a localized
variable. (L) The C's said once that 4th density is
"going with the speed of light." I think I remember that
you said that there was NO speed of light there because
"speed" was a 3rd density concept.

If this has been discussed elsewhere, feel free to point me in the right direction. I haven't gotten around yet to actually reading the particular material this quote came from - THERE IS SO MUCH. :)

But it immediately jumped out at me because I have this recurrent thought about 4D a lot during my meditations.

Quote from C's

Q: (A) Now, how did we come to this grid from UFT?
A: Grid construction represents application of...
Q: (L) Somehow we went from the increased gravity of the Sun, to UFT, to the grid...
A: UFT explains the "increased" gravity of Sol. But, is there not something in UFT about increase/decrease???
Q: (A) There is no reason for it to increase or decrease... but this is Einstein's theory which we were told is incorrect... (L) Well, maybe it is speed? When two things are rotating in tandem, when they come together, wouldn't it increase their speed, and doesn't speed increase gravity? (A) No, we were told that there is some interaction between gravity and EM wave, and this is what UFT is about... If we use other dimensions which we are supposed to use in this UFT, going with Kaluza-Klein, then the very concept of mass is something which is not so clear, and mass can be variable...
A: Yes, variability of physicality.
Q: (T) Fourth density. (A) We were told earlier that this UFT opens the door to other densities...
A: Yes.
Q: (A) Can we have a UFT which unifies EM and gravity and does not include the concept of other densities. In other words, can we put in a textbook all about the gravity and electromagnetics, and a student could learn all of this and still know nothing about other densities?
A: No. Other densities become apparent when...
Q: (A) So, it means that Einstein and Von Neumann knew about these other densities?
A: Yes, oh yes!!!
Q: (T) Just a thought: having UFT and being able to manipulate different fields within it, creates different effects. So, as we understand it in the apparent present state of science, we have to spin something in space in order to create gravity. But, with the UFT, one small offshoot is that one could create real gravity without spinning anything. So, the problem of weightlessness is really already solved...
A: Elementary my dear Terry, elementary.

Anyway, I was thinking about the idea of no time at 4D and higher. I was thinking something about that type of physicality, the paraphysicality, would involve a state of being where one was "moving at the speed of light". Of course it would not be perceived as such because you would be riding with it. We also have the idea here about the idea that mass can be variable that is part of the true UFT which has been hidden from us. It's so hard to really imagine in the mind's eye due to not being part of a 4D existence. But both of these ideas together seem to make perfect sense to me even though I can't "Imagine" it per se. But at one point we have a pretty clear description that I finally found again.

Quote from the C's:

Q: (L) Am I getting warm when I say... we have light and gravity, optics and atomic particles, matter and anti- matter, all are ways of talking about a transition... are these three pairs of relationships?

A: Close.

Q: (L) What is the thing that collapses the wave? Is it consciousness?

A: Yes...

Q: (L) There is more. Can this consciousness be expressed...

(T) We are trying to get from a third density concept to a fourth density concept where there is no physicality, per se. At fourth density they don't have a problem with going at the speed of light and disintegrating, because it doesn't exist there...

A: Close.

Q: (T) So, for us to try and think of this in third density...

A: Variable physicality is the key.

Q: (L) What makes the physicality variable?

A: Awareness of link between consciousness and matter.

Q: (L) What is the link between consciousness and matter?

A: Illusion.

Q: (L) What is the nature of the illusion?

(T) That there isn't any connection between consciousness and matter. It is only an illusion that there is. It is part of the third density...

A: No. Illusion is that there is not.

Q: (L) The illusion is that there is no link between consciousness and matter.

A: Yes.

Q: (T) The illusion is that there is not a link. In third density...

(L) I got it!

(T) Don't disappear on me now! [Laughter] The relationship is that consciousness is matter.

A: Close. What about vice versa?

Q: (L) Just reverse everything. Light is gravity. Optics are atomic particles, matter is anti-matter... just reverse everything to understand the next level... it can't be that easy.

(J) Wait a second: gravity equals light, atomic particles equals optics, anti-matter equals matter? It is all about balance.

(L) And the answer must always be zero.

A: And zero is infinity.

Q: (L) So, you are saying that it is not that there is a link, the illusion is that there is separation. There is no difference, they are the same?

A: Yes.

Q: (T) If you warp space/time you travel by bringing your destination to you.

(L) Or, you can reverse that and understand that there is no distance between us and, say, Alpha Centauri, it is the alteration of perception that turns the axis and creates the illusion of distance.

A: Now, all you need is the "technology."

(L) So, you are saying that it is not that there is a link, the illusion is that there is a separation. There is no different, they are the same?

I can't shake this. I keep seeing it in my mind. That the illusion is due to our current perspective. We are bound to this constant mass, this total physicality, that we cannot "see" in our minds the variability of mass (because of the higher awareness/consciousness) that makes it possible to be "going the speed of light" per se so that we would not experience time as we see it now from our current perspective.

And also, I keep thinking that this Wave that is coming, being on it is part of being at a level of density higher than this one. That those of us who progress to 4th density will then be on the Wave, too. That being "on the Wave" is the different perspective. I'm not sure if I'm making this as clear as it is in my head, but the same thing keeps coming every day or so in my mediation.

Any feedback on this would be much appreciated. And maybe questions will help me clarify my own thinking.

 

[anart]

I can't shake this. I keep seeing it in my mind. That the illusion is due to our current perspective. We are bound to this constant mass, this total physicality, that we cannot "see" in our minds the variability of mass (because of the higher awareness/consciousness) that makes it possible to be "going the speed of light" per se so that we would not experience time as we see it now from our current perspective.

To my understanding, that is pretty much the case, though I'm not sure it entails actually 'going the speed of light' since speed is a construct of our current limited perspective. Our current perspective is so monumentally limited that we literally have no idea at all where we exist or what 'exists' around us (though we might catch very fleeting glimpses that are almost impossible to piece together into a coherent whole). I liken it to viewing the entire Universe through a slit the width of a gnat's eyebrow; like trying to sense true existence while wearing one of those ancient diving suits with the big round helmets and flat glass plates over the face, weighted boots and a manually wound air tube to the surface - completely and totally separated from the reality of what we are trying to sense and understand. Lost - really - blind, deaf, blocked from the full 'stream of data' that is the Universe. And with that infinitesimal amount of information we attempt to craft an understanding of the Universe, and ourselves, that is really just a lightly sketched outline of the shadows that the Universe, and ourselves, might occasionally cast.

As far as time, it is my understanding (which is constantly changing) that at our current level, we are bound by it; time is inflicted upon us, as it were. Despite its variability, as experienced during times of heightened emotional stress, we are bound by this perception of linearly passing time (in only one direction), and from our limited perspective, (locked in this 3D physicality) there is no escaping that. While 'time' may exist at higher levels, it does not exist in any way we would currently recognize it. That, in itself, makes it almost impossible to discuss without just wandering around in fields of subjectivity, though if one considers the idea that time becomes a variable (that is subject to conscious control) and not a constant in the equation, one might approach at least the basic framework - though that's just my current interpretation and that can always change! fwiw.

 

[JAKSUN]

I can't shake this. I keep seeing it in my mind. That the illusion is due to our current perspective. We are bound to this constant mass, this total physicality, that we cannot "see" in our minds the variability of mass (because of the higher awareness/consciousness) that makes it possible to be "going the speed of light" per se so that we would not experience time as we see it now from our current perspective.

To my understanding, that is pretty much the case, though I'm not sure it entails actually 'going the speed of light' since speed is a construct of our current limited perspective. Our current perspective is so monumentally limited that we literally have no idea at all where we exist or what 'exists' around us (though we might catch very fleeting glimpses that are almost impossible to piece together into a coherent whole). I liken it to viewing the entire Universe through a slit the width of a gnat's eyebrow; like trying to sense true existence while wearing one of those ancient diving suits with the big round helmets and flat glass plates over the face, weighted boots and a manually wound air tube to the surface - completely and totally separated from the reality of what we are trying to sense and understand. Lost - really - blind, deaf, blocked from the full 'stream of data' that is the Universe. And with that infinitesimal amount of information we attempt to craft an understanding of the Universe, and ourselves, that is really just a lightly sketched outline of the shadows that the Universe, and ourselves, might occasionally cast.

As far as time, it is my understanding (which is constantly changing) that at our current level, we are bound by it; time is inflicted upon us, as it were. Despite its variability, as experienced during times of heightened emotional stress, we are bound by this perception of linearly passing time (in only one direction), and from our limited perspective, (locked in this 3D physicality) there is no escaping that. While 'time' may exist at higher levels, it does not exist in any way we would currently recognize it. That, in itself, makes it almost impossible to discuss without just wandering around in fields of subjectivity, though if one considers the idea that time becomes a variable (that is subject to conscious control) and not a constant in the equation, one might approach at least the basic framework - though that's just my current interpretation and that can always change! fwiw.

No time. No space. A trans-dimensional entity with variable physicality. Jaksun is a tiny little sensory unit, like in the eye matrix of a fly perhaps. BUZZZZZ. Sorry too much effect. But it does make one think. As we do Eiriu Eolas, some of us are experiencing in real time; dimensional slips, time fracturing, audio/visual hallucinations and other paranormal experiences that imply participating in something we cannot see or understand, but which is stupendously present - immanent.

Yes, Brenda, our current perspective, and I can subjectively say that my perspective is broadening with each meditative breath cycle. But I think also that there is no speed. Perhaps it is the sensation of the vibrancy of everything existing at once - or not existing depending on your perspective. Carlos Castaneda talked of moving your perspective in order to 'see' other realities. If I remember correctly, he described perspective as a point on an arc, which could be moved at will, after some training. Perhaps our breathing program is loosening this point of perspective so that it can slide along the arc. Perhaps paranormal sensations are the effect of small movements of one's perspective. Ripples on a pond anyone? ;)

Thanks anart for this: "I liken it to viewing the entire Universe through a slit the width of a gnat's eyebrow"

 

[Brenda86]

Thanks for the feedback you guys.
Quote from Jacksun:

Yes, Brenda, our current perspective, and I can subjectively say that my perspective is broadening with each meditative breath cycle. But I think also that there is no speed. Perhaps it is the sensation of the vibrancy of everything existing at once - or not existing depending on your perspective. Carlos Castaneda talked of moving your perspective in order to 'see' other realities. If I remember correctly, he described perspective as a point on an arc, which could be moved at will, after some training. Perhaps our breathing program is loosening this point of perspective so that it can slide along the arc. Perhaps paranormal sensations are the effect of small movements of one's perspective

Quote from anart:

To my understanding, that is pretty much the case, though I'm not sure it entails actually 'going the speed of light' since speed is a construct of our current limited perspective. Our current perspective is so monumentally limited that we literally have no idea at all where we exist or what 'exists' around us (though we might catch very fleeting glimpses that are almost impossible to piece together into a coherent whole). I liken it to viewing the entire Universe through a slit the width of a gnat's eyebrow; like trying to sense true existence while wearing one of those ancient diving suits with the big round helmets and flat glass plates over the face, weighted boots and a manually wound air tube to the surface - completely and totally separated from the reality of what we are trying to sense and understand. Lost - really - blind, deaf, blocked from the full 'stream of data' that is the Universe. And with that infinitesimal amount of information we attempt to craft an understanding of the Universe, and ourselves, that is really just a lightly sketched outline of the shadows that the Universe, and ourselves, might occasionally cast.

I actually did not mean to imply real speed, which is why "going to speed of light" is in quotes. It's just the only way I have to describe it right now - like you have both said - with my current limited perspective. But the analogy about having the ancient diving suits on really describes those limits I think.

Quote from anart:

As far as time, it is my understanding (which is constantly changing) that at our current level, we are bound by it; time is inflicted upon us, as it were. Despite its variability, as experienced during times of heightened emotional stress, we are bound by this perception of linearly passing time (in only one direction), and from our limited perspective, (locked in this 3D physicality) there is no escaping that. While 'time' may exist at higher levels, it does not exist in any way we would currently recognize it. That, in itself, makes it almost impossible to discuss without just wandering around in fields of subjectivity, though if one considers the idea that time becomes a variable (that is subject to conscious control) and not a constant in the equation, one might approach at least the basic framework - though that's just my current interpretation and that can always change! fwiw.

I am in total agreement that we seem to be bound by this perception of linearly passing time from our current, limited perspective.

Quote from jacksun:

Yes, Brenda, our current perspective, and I can subjectively say that my perspective is broadening with each meditative breath cycle. But I think also that there is no speed. Perhaps it is the sensation of the vibrancy of everything existing at once - or not existing depending on your perspective. Carlos Castaneda talked of moving your perspective in order to 'see' other realities. If I remember correctly, he described perspective as a point on an arc, which could be moved at will, after some training. Perhaps our breathing program is loosening this point of perspective so that it can slide along the arc. Perhaps paranormal sensations are the effect of small movements of one's perspective. Ripples on a pond anyone?

But I also get this feeling a lot with the meditation - that at least DURING, I seem to be getting glimpes from other perspectives from time to time. I feel this great understanding of something for a moment, but when I'm back focused on my "real" perspective again, I can't for the life of me describe the information properly. But the glimpses are exciting and do help me to look at this reality in a much different way than before.

I think the most exciting thing for me is how my perspective on learning has changed with my experiences with The Wave series, the meditation and all the other myriad sources we have at our disposal here. It is so fun to me now, I don't find myself worried about being wrong. I just want to throw ideas out and hear feedback. It's about the growth, not being right anymore. I used to be obsessed with being right and could not bring myself to participate in discussions in school, etc, due to this fear of being wrong. Now I realize we are all going to be wrong about a lot of things, but you have to weed through the bunk to get to the good stuff (get through the subjective to find the objective).

 

[anart]

I actually did not mean to imply real speed, which is why "going to speed of light" is in quotes. It's just the only way I have to describe it right now - like you have both said - with my current limited perspective. But the analogy about having the ancient diving suits on really describes those limits I think.

Well, just for clarity's sake it's not only your limited perspective - it's pretty much everyone on this planet, existing as 3D STS humans (that's probably what you meant, but I didn't want you to think I was saying that you are the only one who is limited, we all are!)

 

[Brenda86]

I actually did not mean to imply real speed, which is why "going to speed of light" is in quotes. It's just the only way I have to describe it right now - like you have both said - with my current limited perspective. But the analogy about having the ancient diving suits on really describes those limits I think.

Well, just for clarity's sake it's not only your limited perspective - it's pretty much everyone on this planet, existing as 3D STS humans (that's probably what you meant, but I didn't want you to think I was saying that you are the only one who is limited, we all are!)

I totally understood, but thanks for being thoughtful enough to clarify. We're all in the same boat for now :)

 

[pirataloko]

Hi everybody.

I guess, we must wait and see (like the C's use to say) to completly understand the 4th desnsity earth. In my case I've been dreaming, seeing and hearing things lately in meditation and even in other situations.....these experiences are very dificult to explain in words... basically I have the sensation that the meaning of these things is not limited to their appearance, i fell there is something more I can't explain or understand consciously. All i know is that these things are changing me slowly, for example I used to walk in the street clueless, always thinking in my things, but now i use to walk looking everything and everybody.

I don't know if i understand them in my subconscious or unconscious mind... i guess that someday perhaps i'll know the answer.

I'm fighting with my ownself because sometimes i want the answers anxiously in that moment and in the other hand i know that i can't get to the second floor since the ground without pass through the first floor and i have to live and learn in the present and whatever will be.... will be. Anwers will come when they come, not in the moment i want.

About 4th density earth the only sensation i can express at the present moment is that in 3th density, sometimes in diferent situations (in which we're limited) we use to say if I could do........ mi sensation about 4th is that we will do it. ----> the end to "if i could do"...... I don't know if it's clear.

Greetings!

 

[Brenda86]

Hi everybody.

I guess, we must wait and see (like the C's use to say) to completly understand the 4th desnsity earth. In my case I've been dreaming, seeing and hearing things lately in meditation and even in other situations.....these experiences are very dificult to explain in words... basically I have the sensation that the meaning of these things is not limited to their appearance, i fell there is something more I can't explain or understand consciously. All i know is that these things are changing me slowly, for example I used to walk in the street clueless, always thinking in my things, but now i use to walk looking everything and everybody.

I don't know if i understand them in my subconscious or unconscious mind... i guess that someday perhaps i'll know the answer.

I'm fighting with my ownself because sometimes i want the answers anxiously in that moment and in the other hand i know that i can't get to the second floor since the ground without pass through the first floor and i have to live and learn in the present and whatever will be.... will be. Anwers will come when they come, not in the moment i want.

About 4th density earth the only sensation i can express at the present moment is that in 3th density, sometimes in diferent situations (in which we're limited) we use to say if I could do........ mi sensation about 4th is that we will do it. ----> the end to "if i could do"...... I don't know if it's clear.

Greetings!

I think I understand what you mean in a way when you say " I feel there is something more I can't explain or understand consciously". I know for me with the breathing/meditation I have been having some interesting experiences and especially dreams. I will feel like I understand something very well for the first bit when I wake up from the dream and then it's hard for me to hold on to.

And yes, it is definitely something we have to wait and see on. Like the C's have said, we don't have to understand 4th grade material to go to 4th grade, we just have to be done with 3rd grade. :)

I'm just happy to be doing to the work that might help me get there, but if for some reason I don't get there, then I obviously had more to learn and that is okay too. I still want to learn as much as I can this time around.

 

[John G]

This for me was a very interesting clue about 4th density in addition to the "true dimension" and "speed of light" clues.

Q: (A) What is the relation between the fourth density that we know and the fifth dimension of Einstein
and Bergman?
A: Identical.

That fifth dimension is the loop that the time machine experimenters played with. In other words it's a window/portal thing. The "true dimension" perhaps creates "many worlds" possibilities via portals. Even in our damaged DNA 3rd density experience, we take these portals to different possibilities all the time. There was a real version of Laura who went through the portals differently and was still married to her first husband in a parallel universe. Our problem is that we don't perceive these portals and thus don't perceive any control of them. Thus we have built in illusions when it comes to something like time.

It's still OK to have time in equations. In fact there are different math/physics concepts that can relate to the word time. There are equations with more than one timelike variable. You can think of quantum transactions as being timelike even though it's not time in the Einstein sense. You can think of loopy time as a complex number instead of a real number which math-wise is often thought of as two dimensional but one can also think of this using projective geometry and the dimensions are handled differently.

As for the "speed of light", what we see as a photon going the speed of light, is perceived quite differently by the photon. The photon can bounce arround for the life of the universe as we see it and still never perceive the passage of any time. It does its whole path instantly from its point of view. We never see it have a chance to do another quantum transaction. Anything it might do as part of a sentient quantum transacting being is outside our view of the universe even if we lived as long as the universe.

 

[Seljuck]

4th Density Society

Hi Everyone,

This is my first post, so if it's inappropriate or in the wrong forum please let me know.

I've just started reading some of Laura's work. I've read all the intro material on the website, and half of the 1st Wave book. The question that keeps coming up for me, is about living in 4th Density. I realize that it is a variable physicality, but how does that effect the kind of society we will have. Will we still have governmental institutions? Some form of commerce (ie. Capitolism or some other)? Will we use some form of money? Will we still need to work to provide for our family? Will we still need schools?

If we will still have the above institutions, should we be concerned with keeping the current ones functional until the wave arrives? For example, I run a family business, should I be concentrating on keeping going through the coming econcomic troubles? So it is a viable business going into 4D?

And to top all that off, are all of those questions just putting me into STS?

Thanks,
Daniel