"Project SERPO" story: HOAX
We come now to my own exchange with Bill Ryan of SERPO.
The posting of the SERPO stuff on the Sarfatti list happened in late Dec of 2005. We published the Flying Fish article on about Dec 31st, following which we had the little to-do with abovetopsecret.com which I have chronicled on my blog. Things died down until this next item. From here on out, it will be self-explanatory..
At this moment, I'm tending toward Anart's explanation. The material itself probably is a hoax. As some of Jack Sarfatti's food fight list members said about Jack, I'm inclined to agree with ATS on this one (surprise) though I don't think they are pronouncing it a hoax for the sake of the truth. They probably DO want to own it. And maybe they DID write that email to Bill Ryan and thought they would drag us into it by sending it to us, or thought that they would embarass Ryan into compliance by sending it to us. Or maybe the whole "food fight" between ATS and SERPO is set up just to generate interest.
We need more data to make a determination about the parties behind this though I think we can pretty well conclude that the SERPO material itself is, as Sarfatti says, garbage.
We come now to my own exchange with Bill Ryan of SERPO.
The posting of the SERPO stuff on the Sarfatti list happened in late Dec of 2005. We published the Flying Fish article on about Dec 31st, following which we had the little to-do with abovetopsecret.com which I have chronicled on my blog. Things died down until this next item. From here on out, it will be self-explanatory..
Subject: ATS are menacing me
Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2006 02:24:39 +0000 (GMT)
From: Bill Ryan *******
Reply-To: bill.ryan*******
To: sott*******
I run Serpo.org and ATS have been trying to discredit me. Now they have sent me this email, who do they think they are the Mafia?Please don't use my name in this, but check out what they are doing to me and my site, its a brutal smear campaign.email below...
Bill you sure made a fool of yourself over the last email. I don't recommend such hysterics again. Remember we can deny just as loud as you can shout. You failed the first loyalty test. Just like Victor has done, you need to decide which side your bread is buttered on.
Lets get down to business.Your website and book will never succeed with our presence on the internet. We dominate Google and any searches will bring up serpo killing threads first.
Your credability is zero.However we can change this, instead of fighting ATS why not work with us? Here is the proposal.
1. You give to ATS the serpo site and all materials within. We will brand it with our own logo and promote it on the internet. Afterall we own it already, just as a giant parasite can own its host. If we suck blood you die.
2. We will market and promote the site and the material. We will also use our lawyers and publishers to publish the site and attendant information in book and movie formats.Royalties will be divided between us and yourself. As there are 3 of us and only 1 of you, you recieve 25% of all royalties. Twenty five percent is better than nothing, so its a good deal.You will be expected to divide your royalities between any partners on your side. Get Victor a decent computer out of his share to save us more hassle.
3 All further communication on the serpo topic will be vetted by ATS admin before being added to the site. 4 ATS writers will take over from the flawed Anon 2 that you are using. We have some very good talent on ATS who can write professionally much better than your current weak writers are attempting. Too many logical holes, poor proofiing of facts.
Your position will be to defend such writing in the public arena, as you are currently doing, leaving the ATS admin as silent partners.
We are happy to write your own defence articles for you, as well as publish them under your name. That way you won't have to do anything. In the future we may also see you moderate the serpo forum on ATS as a staff member. Many of our staff have successfully integrated their sites into ours on a similar basis to that proposed
here.
We forsee ATS as a world wide conspiracy portal with sites such as yours incorporated into it. The few sites that have not followed our direction have disappeared from the net soon after, we have powerful backers with many talents.We expect your agreement to this proposal. The consequences of refusing our fine gesture will see your site and hard work wasted, no one wants that sad future.
http://www.sharpmail.co.uk - "Live in your world, email in ours" Send 'fake' email for free!
Remove this footer by upgrading.
From: Laura Knight-Jadczyk
To: <bill.ryan*******>
Subject: Re: [Fwd: ATS are menacing me]
Copies to: bill.ryan@*******
Date sent: Thu, 16 Feb 2006 14:35:38 +0100
Hi,
Can you send me the original email from the ATS people (the entire exchange
would be helpful, with FULL headers?
Do you want me to publish an article about this?
Don't see how I could do that without using your name and site. If I don't
use your name, the ATS people will know anyway. So using your name and the site address might actually give you more protection.
Up to you.
Laura Knight-Jadczyk
Since I hadn't received an answer to my Feb 16 email, Ark had also written to Bill Ryan, so here is that exchange:Date sent: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 08:39:03 +0000
Subject: Re: [Fwd: ATS are menacing me]
From: Bill Ryan
To: Laura Knight-Jadczyk
Hi, Laura -
Yes, I¹d very much like to talk and co-operate! But first...
I NEVER SENT YOU THIS:
“I run Serpo.org and ATS have been trying to discredit me. Now they have sent me this email, who do they think they are the Mafia?Please don't use my name in this, but check out what they are doing to me and my site, its a brutal smear campaign.email below...Bill you sure made a fool of yourself over the last email.”
What did you get, and from whom and when?
I¹d also be happy to talk on the phone to disentangle this... someone, somewhere, is intent on causing a lot of damage. (Interestingly, we also know that they are on Victor Martinez¹s UFO list.)
It looks as if the mischief-maker¹s intention was to persuade you to take up the crusade on my behalf. Maybe, therefore, this is a reason why you should NOT do this!!
To clarify, I did get this message, pasted here in full, verbatim but I DID NOT forward it to anyone whomsoever and merely ignored it. ³sharpmail² is an e-mail faking program... the authors are seeking to wreak havoc with this, intent on discrediting me themselves. My thoughts are to ignore it... then it¹ll fade out and go away. What they probably want to see is a reaction.
But the possibility remains that this is actually someone from within ATS itself disguising their malice as sharpmail is a kind of plausible deniability: they can always say ³Hey! This is not us. It¹s some kid fooling around.² The content of the original faked mail I received, drawing my attention to their very malicious http://www.projectserpo.org (which is full of falsehoods, however they got there), indicated that there is a strong link between ATS and the faked mails. I¹ll append that one below the longer one below, so you have sight of both.
All thoughts welcome!
Best wishes to you,
Bill
------ Forwarded Message
From: The three Amigos <admin@abovetopsecret.com>
Reply-To: "admin@abovetopsecret.com" <12884215-1173@sharpmail.co.uk>
Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2006 02:18:13 +0000 (GMT)
To: <bill.ryan*******>
Subject: tut tut Bill.
Bill you sure made a fool of yourself over the last email. I don't recommend such hysterics again. Remember we can deny just as loud as you can shout. You failed the first loyalty test. Just like Victor has done, you need to decide which side your bread is buttered on.
Lets get down to business.Your website and book will never succeed with our presence on the internet. We dominate Google and any searches will bring up serpo killing threads first.
Your credability is zero.However we can change this, instead of fighting ATS why not work with us? Here is the proposal.
1. You give to ATS the serpo site and all materials within. We will brand it with our own logo and promote it on the internet. Afterall we own it already, just as a giant parasite can own its host. If we suck blood you die.
2. We will market and promote the site and the material. We will also use our lawyers and publishers to publish the site and attendant information in book and movie formats.Royalties will be divided between us and yourself. As there are 3 of us and only 1 of you, you recieve 25% of all royalties. Twenty five percent is better than nothing, so its a good deal.You will be expected to divide your royalities between any partners on your side. Get Victor a decent computer out of his share to save us more hassle.
3 All further communication on the serpo topic will be vetted by ATS admin before being added to the site. 4 ATS writers will take over from the flawed Anon 2 that you are using. We have some very good talent on ATS who can write professionally much better than your current weak writers are attempting. Too many logical holes, poor proofiing of facts.
Your position will be to defend such writing in the public arena, as you are currently doing, leaving the ATS admin as silent partners.
We are happy to write your own defence articles for you, as well as publish them under your name. That way you won't have to do anything. In the future we may also see you moderate the serpo forum on ATS as a staff member. Many of our staff have successfully integrated their sites into ours on a similar basis to that proposed
here.
We forsee ATS as a world wide conspiracy portal with sites such as yours incorporated into it. The few sites that have not followed our direction have disappeared from the net soon after, we have powerful backers with many talents.We expect your agreement to this proposal. The consequences of refusing our fine gesture will see your site and hard work wasted, no one wants that sad future.
http://www.sharpmail.co.uk - "Live in your world, email in ours" Send
'fake' email for free!
Remove this footer by upgrading.
------ End of Forwarded Message
------ Forwarded Message
From: anon <admin@abovetopsecret.com>
Date: Mon, 13 Feb 2006 04:26:52 +0000 (GMT)
To: <bill.ryan*******>
Subject: you are owned...
We now have the domain ProjectSerpo.org At some point tomorrow,this will be on the url http://www.abovetopsecret.com/serpo/give up your book deal, ATS will rip your integrity out.
http://www.sharpmail.co.uk - "Live in your world, email in ours" Send
'fake' email for free!
Remove this footer by upgrading.
------ End of Forwarded Message
From: Arkadiusz Jadczyk
Date: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 00:43:58 +0100
To: <bill.ryan*******>
Cc: <*******>
Subject: (Fwd) Re: [Fwd: ATS are menacing me]
Hi,
As we are not sure if you have received our email, here is the copy
of the email to you from Laura. It is VERY important to analyze the
exact copies of the emails you think you received from ATS. They may
have been faked. They may be coming from someone else - for instance
from Vincent Bridges or from Simon Grey himself writing via a proxy.
Therefore, if you are SERIOUS - forward to us the WHOLE emails,
headers intacted. Then, prhaps, we will be able to suggest something
useful. Otherwise we will consider it being a bad joke.
Regards,
ark
Date sent: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 09:05:31 +0000
Subject: Re: (Fwd) Re: [Fwd: ATS are menacing me]
From: Bill Ryan
To: Arkadiusz Jadczyk
Copies to: Laura Knight-Jadczyk
Hi, Ark -
Very many thanks I replied to Laura just now. I do very much appreciate
your interest. I would say that this definitely comes under the heading of
abuse!
The first message was this:
We now have the domain ProjectSerpo.org At some point tomorrow,this will be on the url http://www.abovetopsecret.com/serpo/give up your book deal, ATS will rip your integrity out.
http://www.sharpmail.co.uk - "Live in your world, email in ours" Send
'fake' email for free!
Remove this footer by upgrading.
Here is the header:
Return-Path: <apache@localhost.seproductions.co.uk>
Received: from n001.sc1.cp.net (64.97.168.30) by n067.sc1.cp.net (7.2.066)
id 43474C06011F8363 for bill.ryan@*******; Mon, 13 Feb 2006
04:26:53 +0000
Received: from localhost.seproductions.co.uk (213.171.206.2) by
n001.sc1.cp.net (7.2.069.1)
id 43E202F500633FB3 for bill.ryan@*******; Mon, 13 Feb 2006
04:26:53 +0000
Received: by localhost.seproductions.co.uk (Postfix, from userid 48)
id E4EEBFAB4; Mon, 13 Feb 2006 04:26:52 +0000 (GMT)
To: bill.ryan@*******
From: "anon" <admin@abovetopsecret.com>
Subject: you are owned...
X-Abuse:
X-Abuse:
X-Abuse:- ABUSE - COMPLAINTS - ABUSE -
X-Abuse: To report Abuse please email
X-Abuse: Abuse@sharpmail.co.uk
X-Abuse: and quote - 12883081
X-Abuse:- ABUSE - COMPLAINTS - ABUSE -
X-Abuse:
X-Abuse:
X-PMID: 12883081
X-Abuse: Abuse@sharpmail.co.ukX-Mailer: Sharp Mail v1.2
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed;
boundary="------------1DB888E95C444C889DA5371C"
Message-Id: <20060213042652.E4EEBFAB4@localhost.seproductions.co.uk>
Date: Mon, 13 Feb 2006 04:26:52 +0000 (GMT)
The second message was this:
Bill you sure made a fool of yourself over the last email. <snipped>
And here¹s the header:
Return-Path: <apache@localhost.seproductions.co.uk>
Received: from n024.sc1.cp.net (64.97.168.31) by n067.sc1.cp.net (7.2.066)
id 43474C0601266BE3 for bill.ryan@*******; Thu, 16 Feb 2006
02:18:23 +0000
Received: from localhost.seproductions.co.uk (213.171.206.2) by
n024.sc1.cp.net (7.2.069.1)
id 43E203BF00833728 for bill.ryan@*******; Thu, 16 Feb 2006
02:18:21 +0000
Received: by localhost.seproductions.co.uk (Postfix, from userid 48)
id 97D8DFACC; Thu, 16 Feb 2006 02:18:13 +0000 (GMT)
To: bill.ryan@*******
From: "The three Amigos" <admin@abovetopsecret.com>
Reply-To: "admin@abovetopsecret.com" <12884215-1173@sharpmail.co.uk>
Subject: tut tut Bill.
X-Abuse:
X-Abuse:
X-Abuse:- ABUSE - COMPLAINTS - ABUSE -
X-Abuse: To report Abuse please email
X-Abuse: Abuse@sharpmail.co.uk
X-Abuse: and quote - 12884215
X-Abuse:- ABUSE - COMPLAINTS - ABUSE -
X-Abuse:
X-Abuse:
X-PMID: 12884215
X-Abuse: Abuse@sharpmail.co.ukX-Mailer: Sharp Mail v1.2
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed;
boundary="------------B77F04962311A57BEB84FDD0"
Message-Id: <20060216021813.97D8DFACC@localhost.seproductions.co.uk>
Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2006 02:18:13 +0000 (GMT)
The second message was a reply to my response to the first, which I sent to
this group (so we can assume that the sender of the second message was one
of these people):
To: anon <admin@abovetopsecret.com>, "Mark@abovetopsecret.com"
<Mark@abovetopsecret.com>, <SkepticOverLord@abovetopsecret.com>
Cc: Dr Harold E Puthoff
George Knapp
<snip private emails>
<Apollinair@*******>,
<ArtBell@*******>,
<snip more private emails>
*******
<snip more emails>
*******
<Colm_Kelleher*******>,
<snip>
<DandelionBooks@*******>,
<DanTSmith@*******>,
<DarkEditor@aol.com>,
Dee777@aol.com
<snip bunch more>
<DerrelWSims@*******>
<snip a vew more>
<Dmmcmah@sandia.gov>,
<DonaldMetzger.militaryemail@*******>,
<DonWare@*******>,
<DrBobWood@*******>,
<DrJLake@*******>,
<DrMSalla@exopolitics.org>,
<EarthFiles@earthfiles.com>,
<snip bunch more>
<EnterpriseMission2001@yahoo.com>,
<EricKrieg@*******>,
<Ernst.KellerStrass@wpafb.af.mil>,
<ETDiplomat@aol.com>,
<snip>
<GNoory2000@yahoo.com>,
<GSB@starstreamresearch.com>,
<snip some more>
<Info@disclosureproject.org>,
<InstituteNewEnergy@sbcglobal.net>,
<snip bunch more>
<Joe.Firmage@corp.manyone.net>,
Richard Dolan
<snip bunch more>
Eugenia Macer-Story
<snip bunch more>
<RickDoty166@msn.com>,
<snip even more>
Saul-Paul Sirag
<SkepticOverLord@abovetopsecret.com>,
<still more snipped>
<TheRealJimMarrs@yahoo.com>,
<big snip>
<Whitley@unknowncountry.com>,
Victor Martinez"
Capt Robert M Collins <Figaro*******>
With best wishes to you both Bill
(+44) *******
From: Laura Knight-Jadczyk
To: Bill Ryan
Subject: Re: [Fwd: ATS are menacing me]
Date sent: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 11:09:07 +0100
On 18 Feb 2006, at 8:39, Bill Ryan wrote:
> Yes, I¹d very much like to talk and co-operate! But first...
>
> I NEVER SENT YOU THIS:
>
> I run Serpo.org and ATS have been trying to discredit me. Now they have sent
> > me this email, who do they think they are the Mafia?Please don't use my
> name > in this, but check out what they are doing to me and my site, its a
> brutal > smear campaign.email below...Bill you sure made a fool of yourself
> over the > last email.
>
> What did you get, and from whom and when?
Well, we suspected as much because it just didn't seem "right" for some
reason. That's why we ask before we do anything.
But, considering that we have had our own issues with ATS, and I have
published about it, including numerous emails that "insiders" have sent me,
it wasn't TOO unusual to receive such an email.
>
> I¹d also be happy to talk on the phone to disentangle this... someone,
> somewhere, is intent on causing a lot of damage. (Interestingly, we also know
> that they are on Victor Martinez¹s UFO list.)
Not a surprise.
You might want to see my series of blogs on the subject of ATS here:
http://laura-knight-jadczyk.blogspot.com/2006/01/is-above-top-secret-forum-cointelpro.html
http://laura-knight-jadczyk.blogspot.com/2006/01/how-to-spot-cointelpro-agents.html
http://laura-knight-jadczyk.blogspot.com/2006/01/cointelpro-updates-above-top-secret.html
http://laura-knight-jadczyk.blogspot.com/2006/01/abovetopsecretcom-cointelpro-update_10.html
http://laura-knight-jadczyk.blogspot.com/2006/01/abovetopsecretcom-cointelpro-update-2.html
http://laura-knight-jadczyk.blogspot.com/2006/01/more-inside-scoops-on.html
http://laura-knight-jadczyk.blogspot.com/2006/01/spider-and-fly-skepticoverlord-and.html
http://laura-knight-jadczyk.blogspot.com/2006/01/cult-of-plausible-lie.html
http://laura-knight-jadczyk.blogspot.com/2006/01/abovetopsecret-ethics-and-google-bombs.html
And then, just the opening paragraph of this blog article refers to ATS:
http://laura-knight-jadczyk.blogspot.com/2006/02/abortion-psychopaths-and-mother-love.html
We have done some investigation and discovered many interesting things about ATS and I think they know what they are hiding, so they suspect that we know what we know but aren't saying... yet.
>
> It looks as if the mischief-maker¹s intention was to persuade you to take up
> the crusade on my behalf. Maybe, therefore, this is a reason why you should
> NOT do this!!
Yes. Seems like some kind of "bait."
>
> To clarify, I did get this message, pasted here in full, verbatim but I DID
> NOT forward it to anyone whomsoever and merely ignored it. ³sharpmail² is an
> e-mail faking program... the authors are seeking to wreak havoc with this,
> intent on discrediting me themselves. My thoughts are to ignore it... then
> it¹ll fade out and go away. What they probably want to see is a reaction.
Yes. Well, if you read my blog posts on ATS, you'll have a pretty good idea
of what I think already. And apparently, they "backed off" from going
after us because we have too much web presence already, and decided to try
tricks instead.
>
> But the possibility remains that this is actually someone from within ATS
> itself disguising their malice as sharpmail is a kind of plausible
> deniability: they can always say ³Hey! This is not us. It¹s some kid fooling
> around.² The content of the original faked mail I received, drawing my
> attention to their very malicious http://www.projectserpo.org (which is full
> of falsehoods, however they got there), indicated that there is a strong link
> between ATS and the faked mails. I¹ll append that one below the longer one
> below, so you have sight of both.
That sounds about right. At the same time, I also think that the "faked
email" may very well represent their "attitude" and intentions. We think
that cointelpro operations like this need to be exposed, but OH, so
carefully.
>
> All thoughts welcome!
Read my blog posts about them and then maybe we can put our heads together and come up with a strategy.
Laura
From: Laura Knight-Jadczyk
To: Bill Ryan
Subject: Re: (Fwd) Re: [Fwd: ATS are menacing me]
Date sent: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 11:40:06 +0100
On 18 Feb 2006, at 9:05, Bill Ryan wrote:
> The second message was a reply to my response to the first, which I sent to
> this group (so we can assume that the sender of the second message was one of
> these people):
Okay, this is interesting. We either know or know of many of the people on
this email list.
I shared the info with Kurt Nimmo and John Kaminski - both of whom are very
concerned with the cointelpro factor that they see in the 9-11 truth
movement - we have all three been subjected to all kinds of covert and not
so covert attacks. I think it is all connected with the whole New Age, UFO
cointelpro gang.
I know that "coast to coast" is cointelpro (darkeditor on the list), and
there are others that we have identified over the years that I see on the
list. There are some we KNOW are working (either consciously or
unconsciously) for the "Powers That Be." And others that we suspect. I'll
comment on a few of them:
<admin@abovetopsecret.com>, "Mark@abovetopsecret.com"
<Mark@abovetopsecret.com>, <SkepticOverLord@abovetopsecret.com>
Pretty sure about the ATS people being gov funded cointelpro on a pretty
large project.
Dr Harold E Puthoff <Puthoff@*******> Probably.
<Apollinair@aol.com> Isn't this John Alexander? If so, he's a certainty.
After "Blue Resonant Human" interacted with him, he was "taken out"
completely. Long story and maybe I'll tell it someday.
<ArtBell@mindspring.com> Certain.
<CloudRider@*******> Dick Farley is interesting. Never could make up my
mind which side he was on.
<DandelionBooks@cox.net> Know a couple people who [say they] have been royally taken by this one.
<Dee777@aol.com> Unconscious dupe. Airhead, basically.
<DonWare@*******> I've thought Don Ware was a "dupe" for a long time. But don't know where his head is nowadays so can't say.
<EnterpriseMission2001@yahoo.com> Pretty sure that Hoagland has been co-opted. But I always leave it open that he could just be an unconscious
dupe. Anybody who doesn't study the "enemy" has no possibility of avoiding
the traps.
<Info@disclosureproject.org> dupe or conscious disinfo.
<Joe.Firmage@*******> Think Joe had good intentions, but not sharp enough to see the manipulations.
<MagickMirr@*******> Eugenia is, IMO, either schizoid or psychopath... VERY nasty customer.
<Whitley@unknowncountry.com> definitely cointelpro - but maybe not
conscious.
If you want to talk, what is a good time to call? You are in UK, right? We
are in France.
Laura
Send reply to: bill.ryan*******
From: "bill.ryan*******
To: Laura
Date sent: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 07:11:12 -0500
Subject: Re: (Fwd) Re: [Fwd: ATS are menacing me]
Hi, Laura -
Many thanks. This really is very interesting to me.
A brief reply just now...
I'd also classify Hal Puthoff as a friend, though I've only met him once.
I'd stake everything I own on the fact that he's clean as well... though I
know he's been an "insider" since his SRI days. Basically, he's a very
ethical guy and I'm certain would not be part of any dirty tricks.
Yes, It'd be a pleasure to talk... my number is ***********.
Tomorrow morning (Sunday) would be ideal, as then I have a four hour car
journey and you'd have my total attention.
Best,
Bill
I didn't call Bill because I was out and I figured the whole thing was just an attempt by ATS to stir stuff up. I thought that if Ryan didn't respond to them, and we stayed out of it, nothing more would come of the issue. Ten days passed and I received this:Send reply to: bill.ryan*******
From: *******
To: Laura Knight-Jadczyk
Date sent: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 08:29:44 -0500
Subject: Re: [Fwd: ATS are menacing me]
Thanks, Laura - the delay getting back to you here is because I was reading
your blogs with considerable interest.
I must say, I do feel I was definitely lured/tempted on to ATS, rather like
the sirens luring the unwitting sailor on to the rocks. At first I was
greeted like the Prodigal Son, but then they gradually changed their tune
and are now totally hostile; it's now being heavily and positively promoted
by them that I'm a hoaxer, even to the extent of their having set up a
special website to this end. That really bewildered and angered me.
I'm NOT a hoaxer... I assure you of that personally. The COINTELPRO
explanation is the only one that answers why they're going to such extreme
ends to attack me after I'd done my best and bust a gut to answer all and
any questions...
My stance is that (I hope!) the Serpo information will vindicate me in the
end...
Best,
Bill
Send reply to: bill.ryan*******
From: "bill.ryan*******
To: Laura Knight-Jadczyk
Copies to: sott@signs-of-the-times
Date sent: Wed, 1 Mar 2006 14:06:21 -0500
Subject: More on ATS
Dear Laura, Ark,
Please click here...
http://www.serpo.org/debate.html
...to read an account of the latest ATS dirty tricks, which really took my
breath away.
The original page is here, which the above replaced:
http://www.serpo.org/debatejrikzf.html
You will see that it references hundreds of pages of links to the (now
closed) original ATS Serpo forum. The debate at that time was high quality
and even-handed.
Every one of those links has now been redirected to their debunking
projectserpo.org site. The debate has been quashed and hijacked. “Deny
Ignorance” (ATS’s supposed watchword), with heavy irony, is more like
“promote dishonest thinking using any means, fair or foul”.
You’ll see that I have referenced all your COINTELPRO links. There a lot of
visitors to my serpo.org site, and a large number of them will now be
alerted to your thesis. There will now be a counter-attack... I’m sure. I
hope it’s fine with you that I’m keeping you updated with these
developments.
By no means everything in the research summary was pro-Serpo, but it was
honest and even-handed. The team of eight (who are not involved in this
latest development) put a lot of work into it. It was also an excellent
means by which new visitors could follow the various arguments pro and con.
This is now no longer available and has been completely quashed.
With best wishes, Bill
--------------------------------------------------------------------
mail2web - Check your email from the web at
http://mail2web.com/ .
From: Laura Knight-Jadczyk
To: bill.ryan@*******
Subject: Re: More on ATS
Date sent: Wed, 1 Mar 2006 22:04:48 +0100
On 1 Mar 2006, at 14:06, bill.ryan@******* wrote:
<snip>
> Every one of those links has now been redirected to their debunking
> projectserpo.org site. The debate has been quashed and hijacked. “Deny
> Ignorance” (ATS’s supposed watchword), with heavy irony, is more like
> “promote dishonest thinking using any means, fair or foul”.
We suspected as much when they tried their heavy handed tactics on us. But
we've been working in this field now for quite a few years and my husband
has 30 years experience as an educatior and administrator so there's not
much that gets past him.
>
> You’ll see that I have referenced all your COINTELPRO links. There a lot of
> visitors to my serpo.org site, and a large number of them will now be alerted
> to your thesis. There will now be a counter-attack... I’m sure. I hope it’s
> fine with you that I’m keeping you updated with these developments.
Of course. I think that the number one thing that people need to be aware
of today is Pathocratic COINTELPRO. It's a plague on the human race.
>
> By no means everything in the research summary was pro-Serpo, but it was
> honest and even-handed. The team of eight (who are not involved in this
> latest development) put a lot of work into it. It was also an excellent means
> by which new visitors could follow the various arguments pro and con. This is
> now no longer available and has been completely quashed.
I just wish I had time to look into it more myself, but I don't. I'm trying
to get some of our researchers interested in having a look but you have to
understand that our team has seen just about everything you can ever imagine
and they have followed links and paper trails until they feel like they are going
blind, and what we mostly find, again and again is circles within circles, lies
and disinformation, and it's hard as the dickens to pick the
gems out of the mud. We've been flamed and stalked and threatened and
harassed in ways that most people can't even imagine; and only because we
have a large, bright group that keeps their eyes open have we managed to
stay out of the traps.
If you could point me to one or two pages that give the synopsis of the
whole thing with any pertinent research findings (positive and negative)
that would help.
Best,
Laura
And that is it so far.Send reply to: bill.ryan@*******
From: "bill.ryan*******
To: Laura Knight-Jadczyk
Copies to: sott@signs-of-the-times
Date sent: Wed, 1 Mar 2006 19:34:57 -0500
Subject: Re: More on ATS
Hi, Laura, Ark -
Many thanks. I had no need to urge you to consider all the
Serpo information (which is a really complex labyrinth) - the
issue was ATS. The ATS dirty tricks were rolled out very
much to quash even-handed debate on Serpo (whether true,
false, or some of each), and is simply crude, heavy-duty
propaganda to browbeat people into believing that it's a hoax.
Why would they feel they have to do that so desperately?
THAT's the issue I wanted to report...
With best wishes to you both -
Bill
At this moment, I'm tending toward Anart's explanation. The material itself probably is a hoax. As some of Jack Sarfatti's food fight list members said about Jack, I'm inclined to agree with ATS on this one (surprise) though I don't think they are pronouncing it a hoax for the sake of the truth. They probably DO want to own it. And maybe they DID write that email to Bill Ryan and thought they would drag us into it by sending it to us, or thought that they would embarass Ryan into compliance by sending it to us. Or maybe the whole "food fight" between ATS and SERPO is set up just to generate interest.
We need more data to make a determination about the parties behind this though I think we can pretty well conclude that the SERPO material itself is, as Sarfatti says, garbage.
