Canine Bone Cancer

[Meg]

Re: Receiving a most difficult diagnosis today

If it is cancer, carbs would feed it. I say, stay the course with raw meat and the other goodies you are feeding him and see how it goes.
He will "tell" you, I think, as Gimpy alluded to.

What about Jack? Is he 'telling you' he's tired?

 

[Voyageur]

Re: Receiving a most difficult diagnosis today

If it is cancer, carbs would feed it. I say, stay the course with raw meat and the other goodies you are feeding him and see how it goes.
He will "tell" you, I think, as Gimpy alluded to.

What about Jack? Is he 'telling you' he's tired?

Thank you Menrva, for your words and for pointing out a question by Gimpy that i was distracted to reply to.

Psychologically, energetically, he has been till now, generally, the mind of a pup. He loves to play with all dogs, shoe-away the deer, hops when he is about to be feed, beats me to the car if i'm heading out etc. Physically, he can spurt and run and chase, is nimble in the bush, yet he is not young and often limbers back slowly from activities. Through his life he has had both back legs on separate occasions (a good 4 & 6 years ago) repaired for knee ligaments - it was very successful. He does, says his vet, have a heart murmur, and he tends to sync his activities with rest as he feels he should. Even a few days before this happening, he was engaged with a little Jack Russel (running back and forth under his legs) and was wrestling with his girlfriend, our other dog.

With that said, he subtly tells me he is older and then dismisses it with his actions. With this change, it is hardest psychologically, he speaks with his eyes and i can understand that he wants to be doing other things and knows he can't, and that hurts his senses and there is depression. :(

I read about your resent loss Gimpy, and understand where the question is coming from.

 

[Voyageur]

Re: Receiving a most difficult diagnosis today

Have a quick question concerning asking my vet about a cortisone shot for Jack. I know this is generally for arthritic (inflammation) conditions, so if the possibility exists on the very outside that he suffers osteoporosis, would this be advisable as a transition intervention? If on the other hand it is indeed osteosarcoma, would this be wasted or have contraindications?

Thank you

Here is something found from Earth Clinic Folk Medicine: _http://www.earthclinic.com/Pets/cortisone_shot_side_effects.html


Cortisone:

Shot Side Effects

Cortisone shots are widely used by veterinarians as a treatment for allergies when a dog or cat is in a constant state of itching, chewing and scratching. Cortisone injections are also frequently used to treat arthritis in dogs as the cortisone creates an anti-inflammatory effect similar to cortisol that is helpful in reducing inflammation.

Cortisone Side Effects: On the flip side, it is reported that cortisone shots can sometimes produce quite serious side effects in dogs and cats. These side effects include panting, lethargy, vomiting, blood in the stools and dramatic changes of personality, and organ failure.

Below you will read reports from our readers about the side effects their pets experienced after receiving a cortisone shot. Sadly 21 people suspect that cortisone shots caused the untimely death of their pet.

Please let us know about any side effects you have witnessed after your pet's cortisone shot.

 

[Gaby]

Re: Receiving a most difficult diagnosis today

Have a quick question concerning asking my vet about a cortisone shot for Jack. I know this is generally for arthritic (inflammation) conditions, so if the possibility exists on the very outside that he suffers osteoporosis, would this be advisable as a transition intervention? If on the other hand it is indeed osteosarcoma, would this be wasted or have contraindications?

Hi voyageur,

Cortisone shots are not good when there is osteoporosis. But another anti-inflammatory possibility is Boswellia:

Dietary support with Boswellia resin in canine inflammatory joint and spinal disease.

_http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14994484

An open multi-centre veterinary clinical trial, comparing conditions before and after treatment with a herbal dietary supplement consisting of a natural resin extract of Boswellia serrata, was conducted by 10 practicing veterinarians in Switzerland. This traditional plant-based supplement is known for its anti-rheumatic and anti-inflammatory properties.[...]

_http://arthrorganics.com/boswellia.php

Boswellia is safe for use in dogs

Purported medicinal uses of the herb include:

Rheumatoid and osteoarthritis
Inflammatory bowel disease
Bursitis
Prevention of deterioration in cartilage and joint tissue
Treatment for varying skin disorders
Lowers cholesterol and triglyceride in the blood stream
Promotes a general sense of well-being and calmness

My 2 cents!

 

[Keit]

Re: Receiving a most difficult diagnosis today

Hi voyageur,

Cortisone shots are not good when there is osteoporosis. But another anti-inflammatory possibility is Boswellia:

Great idea! Here what is says about the dosage:

Boswellia Dosage for Dogs

The boswellia dosage for a Chihuahua is very different from the dosage for a Great Dane. How much boswellia a dog should take is determined mainly by the dog's size. As a general rule 10-20mg of Boswellia should be administered for every kilogram the dog weighs. The herb should be served with a normal portion of dog food. In the study mentioned earlier veterinarians administered 400mg of boswellia extract for every 10 kilograms the dog weighed, once a day.

Read more: http://www.ehow.com/way_5630932_much-boswellia-should-dog-take_.html#ixzz2bheBFxV8

 

[SMM]

Re: Receiving a most difficult diagnosis today

I know the film was poor in quality and it does confirm the higher percentage mentioned by the local vets, although 100% is not given. I don’t recall any trauma on that leg, nor bites or ticks, yet we do have ticks in the area – think this is what you are getting at re fungal?

No, he was referring to the fact that usual causes of osteomylitis ( inflammation of the bone and bone marrow which could produce similar changes to bone density on the radiographs) are either deep bytes by other dogs which get infected or fungal infections. Not usually carried by ticks. There is endemic histoplasmosis, blastomycosis, or coccidioidomycosis (fungi) in Mississippi valley and some southern states which dogs could acquire by inhaling or ingesting spores from the soil. Its more likely to cause other problems but it is also known cause of osteomyelitis.

Thank you for clarifying.

Jack slept in this morning (he was content) and i fixed his meal. As i did last night (which he ate), added Lipo-C (using up the commercial purchase) with the other additives. He ate part of his meal standing and then lay down. He started sniffing the food and stopped eating. Ok, why? Thought the Lipo-c, because i mixed it with the food or the anti-inflammatory or medication was the cause. In a new bowl, just had raw food and added the EFA - he ate this all. Then gave him a bowl 3/4 cup of Goats Milk and added the lipo-c (Laura's recipe) and he drank it all.

He likely did not get a full dose of his pain medication and i was thinking on adjusting it back anyway (due to his grogginess) and he seems to be doing ok. A local person had used Goats milk with her cancerous dog along with other similar additives, she said it was valuable, although i am not sure - any thought on this?

Thank you also l apprenti de forgeron and SMM and to others not individually relied to - the dear boy is lying in the sunshine, his favorite thing. :)

The idea of Goat's milk doesn't make me entirely comfortable.. though not sure what the effect would be on canines, having a hard time imagining it to be beneficial. SOTT posted an article Why Milk is so Evil & there is an excerpt from "Go Dairy Free" book:

“Goat milk is slightly closer in composition to human milk than cow milk is, with proteins that may be easier to digest. It is estimated that 20 to 40% of milk allergic individuals do not react to goat milk. However, milk allergic individuals should obtain an allergy test prior to trialling, as most people who are allergic to cow milk have similar reactions to goat milk. Plus, a rare few are in fact more allergic to [the casein or whey in] goat milk.

The lactose levels in goat milk versus cow milk are very similar (4.1% and 4.7% respectively), so lactose intolerant individuals might experience little to no relief from making the switch.”

Perhaps see how your pup responds to it? Would have to do some research on the matter.

I agree with Psyche regarding cortisone shots & Boswellia.

 

[Z...]

Re: Receiving a most difficult diagnosis today

I am very familiar with Boswellia resin use for kidney stone.In fact I have personal experience as I managed to dissolve two 4mm kidney stones within a week of use, the pain stopped after second day of use.
This resin is used as church incense in Balkans and its a well known old folk remedy for stones there. Apparently it should never come in contact with teeth as it has very damaging effect on them. Thats the lore, not sure if its true or not but it would make sense if its so powerful in dissolving calculi. Therefore I am not sure if it is a good idea to put it in dog's food. I was swallowing it concealed in emptied magnesium capsule and perhaps it can be given to the dog like this.

 

[Z...]

Re: Receiving a most difficult diagnosis today

I agree regarding cortisone, if you really want to relieve pain you can use NSAID-s ( non steroidal antinflamatory drugs) there are plenty in veterinary pharmacopoea - but perhaps you should try Boswellia first.

 

[Leòmhann]

Re: Receiving a most difficult diagnosis today

I am really sorry, Voyageur, and wish your puppy a lot of luck! He has a wonderful human companion to take care of him.

voyageur, have Jack and you in my thoughts, and my heart goes out to you both. Hoping that the diet change makes a difference and he can rebound.

What Keit wrote above is so true - Jack has a wonderful PapaBear

 

[Guardian]

Re: Receiving a most difficult diagnosis today

Physically, he can spurt and run and chase, is nimble in the bush, yet he is not young and often limbers back slowly from activities.

Well, this actually describes me and most of my friends too....you just hit that age ya know.

After Lily made her surprising recovery, one of the vet techs who is VERY into natural alternatives recommended "Curcumin" and OMG did it put the bounce back into Lily's step...and I mean that quite literally. She hadn't done the "I'm so happy, bouncy bounce bounce" thing in years, and she started again after I began giving her the Curcumin.

This is a good article I found about it:
http://www.askariel.com/product-p/146.htm

Snuggles to Jack!

 

[Voyageur]

Re: Receiving a most difficult diagnosis today

Ok, that takes care of the cortisone (no good, bad idea); thank you though Psyche for the information on Boswellia - i'll see if it is available by chance locally as well as Guardian's suggestion on the Curcumin.

Physically, he can spurt and run and chase, is nimble in the bush, yet he is not young and often limbers back slowly from activities.

Well, this actually describes me and most of my friends too....you just hit that age ya know.

Oh, i know exactly what you mean, yet the diet threads sure help!

I agree regarding cortisone, if you really want to relieve pain you can use NSAID-s ( non steroidal antinflamatory drugs) there are plenty in veterinary pharmacopoea - but perhaps you should try Boswellia first.

I'll keep this in mind, and i should on this point give a brief update. I cut the Tramadol by half (partly due yesterday because he did not eat all his food originally). This morning and tonight kept it to half 50mg of 100mg capsule and monitored. Tonight he was sniffing the drug (some on the surface of the raw food) and turned away and would not eat it, yet coaxed him another way - he is telling me something. As for the Goats milk (1 cup), the lipo - c is added to this and he loves it. He was much more normal psychologically today, and at the same time looked depressed at one point due to his impaired mobility, however not observably in pain. The old vw has a fold out seat/bed and sdecided he needed change - he was all over it. He was very happy to be going on an outing and we stopped at the lake and he wandered in the cold water and ate grass shoots (yes they graze).

The local pet food store, aka video store, aka at one point my organic smoke connection store (have to be versatile in small towns) is bringing me in raw Salmon food on Wednesday; he is on Bison mix right now. We had a discussion about Jack and she mentioned that another local has written a book on dog health and his experiences with cancer ; i'll get the name of the book and see if i can talk with him. Further to this interesting connection made, which addresses what you mentioned SMM, in a roundabout way, this is where the Goats milk idea came from - so i'll look into this further. Also, this author mentioned that he adds 6 drops of Frankincense; which does not make sense, yet ill check that rational out, too.

I've been able to spend a lot of time with him this week, so this has been cherished. :)

Thank you all for your support!

 

[sairie]

Re: Receiving a most difficult diagnosis today

voyageur, this might be of interest, http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2012/11/07/mushroom-cancer-treatment.aspx

I wonder if black cumin seed or turmeric might be of any help for Jack.

You and Jack are in my thoughts.

 

[Voyageur]

Re: Receiving a most difficult diagnosis today

voyageur, this might be of interest, http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2012/11/07/mushroom-cancer-treatment.aspx

I wonder if black cumin seed or turmeric might be of any help for Jack.

You and Jack are in my thoughts.

I see from one of the links that this mushroom treats Hemangiosarcoma, and then I see this is related to endothelial cells lining blood vessels. The study is quite remarkable, yet i don't know about other types of cancer.

“We were shocked. Prior to this, the longest reported median survival time of dogs with hemangiosarcoma of the spleen that underwent no further treatment was 86 days. We had dogs that lived beyond a year with nothing other than this mushroom as treatment.”

I think this study will be very useful for pet owners here with this condition - thank you for noticing it and for your other suggestions; through Jack's unfortunate experience, my list is growing to research out these many things offered here, and am learning from each.

 

[Laura]

Re: Receiving a most difficult diagnosis today

The best way I found to administer medicines that are nasty tasting is to put a can of sardines with oil in the blender, put the medicine in there, blend it, and put it in a feeding syringe and squirt it down. Of course, that was for a pup that wasn't eating. So if your guy is eating, maybe just mixing with the sardines is enough. It really covers the taste of about anything and the fish and oil is an added bonus.

 

[Forrestdeva]

Re: Receiving a most difficult diagnosis today

My heart goes out to you about Jack. Be careful about using DMSO as it is a chemical accelerant, meaning if Jack comes into contact with any chemicals/poisons it will be vastly absorbed into his skin.
Because DMSO increases the rate of absorption of some compounds through organic tissues, including skin, be careful with what he comes into contact with, home/lawn pesticides...etc. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dimethyl_sulfoxide