Éiriú-Eolas - Breathing Program

[Ollie]

Hi KC Kelly, Incognito and DanielS.

Each small battle won is a step to the accumulation of lots of small battles to finally win the overall battle. When you decide to be un-afraid the battle is won, as each 'wounding' and 'programme' is powerless once we choose to be un-afraid. Victory lies in choice, we accept what we want to accept, and it's never too late to 'change your mind' and decide to live un-afraid.

 

[Turgon]

Hi KC Kelly, Incognito and DanielS.

Each small battle won is a step to the accumulation of lots of small battles to finally win the overall battle. When you decide to be un-afraid the battle is won, as each 'wounding' and 'programme' is powerless once we choose to be un-afraid. Victory lies in choice, we accept what we want to accept, and it's never too late to 'change your mind' and decide to live un-afraid.

Interesting that you would mention that being un-afraid in a given situation is a small battle won, because I had realized a few weeks ago that fear, in itself, is the biggest determining factor in most of the decisions I make in my life. When I had come to that realization I was blown away how powerful a force fear is in my life. The thing is, once I had come to this realization, I wondered why I should be so surprised about this. It (fear) has been in the background pulling my strings for so long that I should have seen this a lot sooner, but I either didn't or ignored it. I can think of so many examples of opportunities missed because I was too afraid to take advantage, or situations that became worse because I was too afraid to do something about it.

Not long after I had realized this, Biomiast wrote this post http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=12837.msg124257#msg124257 which I wanted to comment on, because it resonated so well with the realizations that occurred with me, but, again, fear prevented me from posting.

Hopefully typing this can be one of those small little battle's won against the programs that try and dominate my life.

 

[KC Kelly]

You're certainly not alone there either! I hope you know that you're not worthless and 'nobody's a nobody'

...and bless you back. Wink

Incognito is right, you most definitely are not alone. I have the same program that runs in me on a consistent basis. It prevents me from posting and deleting posts when I feel that I'm not saying anything relevant, which is fairly often. So thank you for sharing as it's helpful to know that we all have similar programs and struggles that are surfacing and we need to confront.

Each small battle won is a step to the accumulation of lots of small battles to finally win the overall battle. When you decide to be un-afraid the battle is won, as each 'wounding' and 'programme' is powerless once we choose to be un-afraid. Victory lies in choice, we accept what we want to accept, and it's never too late to 'change your mind' and decide to live un-afraid.

Thank you Incognito, DanielS, and Trezrivent for your responses and support.

Even though I have had difficulty in confidence and worthiness to be more active here, I do consider it to be a (small) victory that I got so far behind in this thread and have managed to dig myself out and get caught up to speed. At some point I "managed" to get about 20 pages back and when I would get the time to read and catch up, a few more pages would appear. :(

If there is any one thing that is increasingly obvious to me, it is that the members here are definitely growing in empathy and care deeply about one another. It's a wonderful thing to witness taking place, and at times I become emotional as it affects me deeply.

 

[Turgon]

Also, just a quick update in regards to EE. Last night I did the regular Pipe breathing (Redfox, I started utilizing your tongue up for breathe in, tongue down breathe out technique) along with the POTS, but decided to extend the POTS on my own. So after Laura's initial 5, I did roughly an additional 7 more, 12 altogether, the most I've ever done at one time and went to bed. Mind you, I wasn't planning on that number, my whole intent was to just continue on with the POTS, it just felt like the right thing to do after the audio ended.

Nothing strange or what not happened while doing the prayer, but last night, for the first time in quite a few months I had a dream that wasn't shrouded in darkness or taking place at night time. I was at Laura's house and she was on the porch giving a speech to a bunch of us, some of which were in the house at the windows listening. I wish I could remember the details of the speech but I cant, but all of a sudden I end up at my old house, and the sun is pouring through the windows throughout the house. I was supposed to get help from my Mom's 'helper' but instead he pigs out on chocolate pudding and lounges at his airplane rather then helping me. He ends up getting real bloated and 'high' off of the pudding and tries to eat me. I end up in the living room extremely angry and upset about this. How I was supposed to have received help but instead he tried to sabotage what I was doing. I was livid, and my grandma keeps telling me to calm down, but I refuse to, as I feel I have a right to be upset about this.

The things is, is that lately, I've felt that I just wanted to either scream or cry at the top of my lungs, that I want to release my emotions somehow. But I've been so used to suppressing my emotions over the years that I just cant do it. Everytime I want to, I get this odd sensation of a ripple that travels outward through my body and the emotion just seems to disappear. I've been having a tendency as well to analyze everything going on with me to the nth degree, and feel as if somehow I'm robbing myself of much needed emotions or emotional release by doing this. That sometimes I need to to just feel what's going on with me rather than constantly dissecting it.

So, basically what I'm trying to say is, it feels good to have some emotional release, even if it was in a dream.

 

[Nienna]

The things is, is that lately, I've felt that I just wanted to either scream or cry at the top of my lungs, that I want to release my emotions somehow. But I've been so used to suppressing my emotions over the years that I just cant do it. Everytime I want to, I get this odd sensation of a ripple that travels outward through my body and the emotion just seems to disappear. I've been having a tendency as well to analyze everything going on with me to the nth degree, and feel as if somehow I'm robbing myself of much needed emotions or emotional release by doing this. That sometimes I need to to just feel what's going on with me rather than constantly dissecting it.

So, basically what I'm trying to say is, it feels good to have some emotional release, even if it was in a dream.

You are right. Analyzing everything is not the way to go. Whenever you find yourself doing this, stop. Try to do these things without anticipation. Without analysis. Just do it. If you find yourself analyzing again, stop.

I think that you will find that as you keep stopping yourself from analyzing things (rewiring the brain), you will begin to notice that you don't do it as often. Maybe, then, you will be able to let the emotions flow all on their own.

Do not expect too much from yourself. Do not expect anything. If you feel emotions welling up inside, don't try to analyze them, just feel them. Let them wash over you like a wave in the ocean. Ride with them.

After doing this, and it may take awhile, you may find yourself able to release them. And it may come upon you unexpectedly when you are not doing the meditation at all.

But, as you also said, maybe you are releasing them in your dreams. It was mentioned that some of these things we are going through will be worked out in our dreams.

So relax. Don't anticipate. Enjoy your meditation. Just do it without thinking about it. And remember, we all go at our own pace. We all have different things to work out. No two of us are the same. So there is no need to compare, which means that there is no need to analyze. :)

 

[Human]

The things is, is that lately, I've felt that I just wanted to either scream or cry at the top of my lungs, that I want to release my emotions somehow. But I've been so used to suppressing my emotions over the years that I just cant do it. Everytime I want to, I get this odd sensation of a ripple that travels outward through my body and the emotion just seems to disappear. I've been having a tendency as well to analyze everything going on with me to the nth degree, and feel as if somehow I'm robbing myself of much needed emotions or emotional release by doing this. That sometimes I need to to just feel what's going on with me rather than constantly dissecting it.

So, basically what I'm trying to say is, it feels good to have some emotional release, even if it was in a dream.

Hi DanielS,

I've been dealing with the similar issue about analysis myself, and found Gurdjieff's words (ISOTM) about self-study to be very helpful.
Hope they can help you too.

[quote author=Gurdjieff]

"There are two methods of self-observation: analysis, or attempts at analysis, that
is, attempts to find the answers to the questions: upon what does a certain thing
depend, and why does it happen; and the second method is registering, simply
'recording' in one's mind what is observed at the moment.
"Self-observation, especially in the beginning, must on no account become analysis
or attempts at analysis. Analysis will only become possible much later when a man
knows all the functions of his machine and all the laws which govern it.
"In trying to analyze some phenomenon that he comes across within him, a man
generally asks: 'What is this? Why does it happen in this way and not in some other
way?' And he begins to seek an answer to these questions, forgetting all about further
observations. Becoming more and more engrossed in these questions he completely
loses the thread of self-observation and even forgets about it. Observation stops. It is
clear from this that only one thing can go on; either observation or attempts at analysis.
"But even apart from this, attempts to analyze separate phenomena without a
knowledge of general laws are a completely useless waste of time. Before it is
possible to analyze even the most elementary phenomena, a man must accumulate a
sufficient quantity of material by means of 'recording.' 'Recording,' that is, the result
of a direct observation of what is taking place at a given moment, is the most
important material in the work of self-study. When a certain number of 'records' have
been accumulated and when, at the same time, laws to a certain extent have been
studied and understood, analysis becomes possible.
"From the very beginning, observation, or 'recording,' must be based upon the
understanding of the fundamental principles of the activity of the human machine.
Self-observation cannot be properly applied without knowing these principles,
without constantly bearing them in mind. Therefore ordinary self-observation, in
which all people are engaged all their lives, is entirely useless and leads nowhere.

[/quote]

 

[Ollie]

This week’s experience of the E-E Breathing-Meditation programme is a vast improvement on my previous report. I continued using RedFox’s suggested breathing technique and continued listening to the tape of the meditation beyond the point where Laura finishes speaking.

This week I’m happy to report that both the yawning and itching have gone, and when I’ve done the programme on the evening’s of Monday and Thursday I’ve zoned right out shortly after Laura starts reciting the PotS, and coming to well after Laura stops talking. During my daily morning meditations the yawning and itching have disappeared too, however no zoning out is present then, even when listening to more of the ‘meditation music’.

 

[no-mans-land]

Hi friends

Some amusing progress happens today while I was cycling home. Usually I do the POTS silent just for fun in my mind to overcome the distance and get into a meditative state, but sometimes I had to push myself forward by loud soliloquies and today I was asking myself in anger because of my tiered legs "Why do you do this? Why do you allways think about your burdens, try to explain them to others? It's self-pity! Who do you want to convince?........... then, silence........ What had I said? Who do I want do convince? Why should I want to convince someone anyway? I dint want to say this and it surprised me, like a door was opened suddenly.

I felt a big step forward and after I had internalized the implications of this words, I decided to do the prayer loud, as a gift for these astonishing insights. I wanted to do it as loud as I can, but first I was able to express it only in a medium volume because I was afraid that somebody could hear me and after realizing how silly this thought was, because I was deep in the woods and why should I care what people may think, I turned up the volume and with a unsteady voice the prayer was getting louder and louder. After a few trials I made a full steady voice filled with deep conviction (I actually convinced myself). At the end I was laughing loud, but that was not a shy laughter but rather a "grown up" one, a wise one. It came from the heart and I got the feeling that my bike had lost some significant weight.

That was a very beautiful experience and from now on I will try to do the prayer more often loud and, who knows, maybe I find the courage to do it in German so that people who hear me also could understand what I am say. ;)

 

[Turgon]

Thanks Nienna and msasa! I appreciate your insights and the quote from ISOTM. It seems that I've completely misunderstood what observing and seeing is.

I think that you will find that as you keep stopping yourself from analyzing things (rewiring the brain), you will begin to notice that you don't do it as often. Maybe, then, you will be able to let the emotions flow all on their own.

Do not expect too much from yourself. Do not expect anything. If you feel emotions welling up inside, don't try to analyze them, just feel them. Let them wash over you like a wave in the ocean. Ride with them.

"But even apart from this, attempts to analyze separate phenomena without a
knowledge of general laws are a completely useless waste of time. Before it is
possible to analyze even the most elementary phenomena, a man must accumulate a
sufficient quantity of material by means of 'recording.' 'Recording,' that is, the result
of a direct observation of what is taking place at a given moment, is the most
important material in the work of self-study.

I initially thought observation and analysis went hand-in-hand together. But I now see it's not the case at all. I've been practicing a fundamental error by analyzing everything because I've stopped proper observation and expression of my feelings by doing this. This is a really big revalation! I feel a flood of emotions coming over me right now, I'm so grateful for having this understanding. Thank you again. :D

 

[Avi]

I may have to try and find more pink to ware too (given I'm a guy this may be a challenge).

I had reached 19 or so, I was "in the pink" and I really didn't know why. I just knew it made me feel better. After all, it's pink and fluffy! It's cotton candy, it's clouds at sunset, it's cherry frosting, strawberries in cream, flowers, babies, somewhere between passionate red and pure white. What's not to like about rose?

I hate to say this, but over a year ago, my husband and I were walking past the laptop aisle in Best Buy and I stopped to gawk and admire a Sony Vaio that was PINK!!! I mean, not only was the lid a pearly pink, but the inside too! All around the keyboard, the screen, it was PINK! I'd never seen such a thing. Now this was back when most laptops were either black or silver, like the Dell I owned.

Yessireee, Pinky went home with me. :) She's got Vista but I won't hold it against her. ;D

Funny that, I'm currently customising a laptop for my girlfriends sons girlfriend which will be pink and sparkly instead of dull and grey when I'm finished! Maybe I'll post some pics in the creative arts section?

I did have a dream that may or may not be related to the new website last night, rather than add to this thread I posted it in the dream section here.

Hi Friends,

I just want to say, RedFox, that I think it is a great idea to wear more pink. :) One of my favourite shirts is pink, long-sleeve button up with collar, not too bright or flashy, a nice modest colour but also a great combination, as mentioned above, "somewhere between passionate red and pure white." I once read that the Universe when seen by seers is supposedly Pink, or rather the Spirit at the Creative Trinity appears as this hue. Certainly interesting concept, whether it is factual or not who knows. Pink or rose and a deep majestic purple, as well as tints of orange, are my favourite colours. ;)

With kind regards,

~L

 

[seek10]

The things is, is that lately, I've felt that I just wanted to either scream or cry at the top of my lungs, that I want to release my emotions somehow. But I've been so used to suppressing my emotions over the years that I just cant do it. Everytime I want to, I get this odd sensation of a ripple that travels outward through my body and the emotion just seems to disappear. I've been having a tendency as well to analyze everything going on with me to the nth degree, and feel as if somehow I'm robbing myself of much needed emotions or emotional release by doing this. That sometimes I need to to just feel what's going on with me rather than constantly dissecting it.

So, basically what I'm trying to say is, it feels good to have some emotional release, even if it was in a dream.

You are right. Analyzing everything is not the way to go. Whenever you find yourself doing this, stop. Try to do these things without anticipation. Without analysis. Just do it. If you find yourself analyzing again, stop.

I think that you will find that as you keep stopping yourself from analyzing things (rewiring the brain), you will begin to notice that you don't do it as often. Maybe, then, you will be able to let the emotions flow all on their own.

Do not expect too much from yourself. Do not expect anything. If you feel emotions welling up inside, don't try to analyze them, just feel them. Let them wash over you like a wave in the ocean. Ride with them.

After doing this, and it may take awhile, you may find yourself able to release them. And it may come upon you unexpectedly when you are not doing the meditation at all.

But, as you also said, maybe you are releasing them in your dreams. It was mentioned that some of these things we are going through will be worked out in our dreams.

So relax. Don't anticipate. Enjoy your meditation. Just do it without thinking about it. And remember, we all go at our own pace. We all have different things to work out. No two of us are the same. So there is no need to compare, which means that there is no need to analyze. :)

I too was struggling with this problem for number of months. End less negative introject stuff like worthless ness emotions keeps popping up. over and over keep coming. I get lot of pressure asking what to do with them. I feel frustrated with it. when they come I can't concentrate on the POTS instead mind runs away . it wants to analyze or run away to another irrelevant issue or I want to day dream or feeling when all this well end or some image or film strikes carries me away and forget. I can sit like that writing the emotions or feeling emotions , which repeat over and over for hours. many times, I feel this time is waste of time. This is the problem I am facing. Often wonder why I struggle to resolve these narcissistic issues even after 2 years of analysis. they come back like in a time loop drains the time and energy. 3or 4 days emotions in control and then one day I decide focus on some other WORK. they are back. again it is a struggle. of course it is anticipation, lack of patience, lack of proper WILL to control monkey mind. I feel what ever I am doing is mechanical. Initially I did a mistake of breathing in and out from nose during POTS. Now I started changing to in with nose and out with mouth.

some times, I stop every one prayer and write it in the book and start again. to capture the emotion, image etc. Once I write it on paper all sounds like they disappear . some other thing will come. Again same thing will repeat next time .

 

[Nienna]

some times, I stop every one prayer and write it in the book and start again. to capture the emotion, image etc. Once I write it on paper all sounds like they disappear . some other thing will come. Again same thing will repeat next time .

I am not quite sure that I am understanding what you are writing other than the fact that you are analyzing EVERYTHING all the time.

Have you ever just observed them without analyzing them.? This is the first step that Gurdjieff talks about in doing the work. To just observe, no analyzing.

And the part of your post I quoted above, are you saying that while you are doing the POTS, you will stop and write down what you are feeling?

As far as I understand, stopping to write things down is letting your intellect take over instead of letting your emotional center do its work, which is to feel the emotions that are rising to the surface. When you stop to write these things down, you are stopping the flow of these emotions, or so I think.

You need to just let the emotions rise to the surface, if this is indeed what is happening. Let them come to the surface and just feel them. No analyzing, no stopping to write them down. Just lay there and feel them. Observe them without analyzing them. Just float in them.

It seems to me that you are shutting off your emotional center when it is trying to do what it is suppose to do. Instead, you turn it off and switch on the intellectual center. Stop that! ;) I know, easier said than done.

Anyway, that's my 2 cents.

 

[sitta]

Hi all, an update on EE program.
In the last two months I did only the POTS (with veeery few exception when I did the full program).

I'm calmer than before. My depression subdued. I don't beat myself for not reading/learning as much as I tought I should, or that I read/watch things for fun. I don't think it's a waste of time anymore. There was a time not so long ago, that I thought, that doing ANYthing that wasn't learning orientetd was a waste. I know better now, after all everything we do is in a way learning experience. I started to really understand on a deeper level ( i did know it intelectually) that my life is a school. All of it. Whatever I do is part of this learning process.

Sometimes during meditation I see different light shapes but none of them are defined. Three mabe four times I saw blinding flash of white light when Laura recited "Clear my eyes ..." but only then. I zoned few times, but not every time I meditated.

As for my dreams that's one busy sector of activity. I often dream about my brother. I don't have a good relationship with him for a few years now. Those dreams are very emotional for me. Hurt, anger, disappointment, love, confusion - it' all there. There are other ones too.
There was one dream that stood out for me. I was dreaming that I was in a room that looked like mine but was bigger and lied on my bed on my tummy. Suddenly I felt a presence on my back. It looked like a dog, a doberman to be precise. I thought "ok" and lied still. A few moments later I felt that this presence was engulfing me and wanted me to surrender to it. I felt dread. In that moment I started to recite the POTS. I woke up still reciting it. My heart was beating like crazy.

 

[seek10]

some times, I stop every one prayer and write it in the book and start again. to capture the emotion, image etc. Once I write it on paper all sounds like they disappear . some other thing will come. Again same thing will repeat next time .

I am not quite sure that I am understanding what you are writing other than the fact that you are analyzing EVERYTHING all the time.

I tried NOT to analyze them , tried to just observe. but some how I find it very difficult to do. I get carried away by the emotions and day dreaming becoming the norm and sense that mind is not control of what is happening there, thus breathing of IN with Nose and OUT with mouth is getting inconsistent. If I do it on bed, I end up sleeping with in a fraction of second with so many materialist dreams which I doesn't remember. I know this zoning is good, but I had some sort of feeling that mind is out of control, when emotions raise, (these emotions are preceeded by a prickling sensation in the feet, as if some thing initiating it ). so I thought I will experiment with stopping and writing, I find that specific emotion disappears and some other things appear. probably this is due to shutting down of the emotional center, that is why it feels better. or probably disciplining mind could be another way to controlling the mind.

Have you ever just observed them without analyzing them.? This is the first step that Gurdjieff talks about in doing the work. To just observe, no analyzing.

TRUE . I will change that.

And the part of your post I quoted above, are you saying that while you are doing the POTS, you will stop and write down what you are feeling?

I experimented this during POTS yesterday, as I started feeling I am going in loops with no relief. the emotion is always the same " this is too much, I can't take it , I am loser , I should have done this way or that way" the standard self defeating tricks. there are others thoughts how long shall I do this?." In reality I am not doing any thing that is too much, once this emotion goes away, for some time I can work, but sure it will come back.

As far as I understand, stopping to write things down is letting your intellect take over instead of letting your emotional center do its work, which is to feel the emotions that are rising to the surface. When you stop to write these things down, you are stopping the flow of these emotions, or so I think.
I know, easier said than done.

Anyway, that's my 2 cents.

some thing to struggle with.


Another observation I made while rereading the EE introduction is " shallow breathing and emotional constipation go together". I observed during the intense emotions ( which are always sort of narcissism related ) , chest thumps, breathing becomes very rapid. I generally use it for ask questions my self and try to see the reason behind it. at the time I can see the program behind it , but when I take deep breathing , the intensity of emotion disappear so the rapid breathing, at the same time I find it difficult to look at the program or sort of disappearance of some thing. I was puzzled by the difficulty at looking at the program or remembering the program that initially created. I know I had unconscious breathing habit which is shallow and intense trauma's too. so I making it a point to breath deeply and heavily as much as possible during the day. I stopped doing round breathing couple of months ago to avoid stirring them up.

 

[sitta]

I was dreaming that I was in a room that looked like mine but was bigger and lied on my bed on my tummy. Suddenly I felt a presence on my back. It looked like a dog, a doberman to be precise. I thought "ok" and lied still. A few moments later I felt that this presence was engulfing me and wanted me to surrender to it. I felt dread. In that moment I started to recite the POTS. I woke up still reciting it. My heart was beating like crazy.

Forgot to add, that when I started to pray the dog thingy turned to black ash and flown out of my room.