Éiriú-Eolas - Breathing Program

Incognito said:
Zim said:
So when I breath in I must do like Im trying to take my nasal fluid to my throat? Although I dont have any nasal fluid but just the feeling??? So in that moment I feel my throat have to be contracted ?

Yes, that's the idea. Or, the way it feels just before you snore through the throat, not the nose.

[quote author=Gawan]
I don't know if this has been already suggested, but what helped me a lot learning to pipebreath was the suggestion to clean some glasses/spectacles (to put some moisture on them).

The moisture on glasses is for the out breath, Zim is asking about the in breath I think. :)
[/quote]

Thanks Incognito for your confirmation
 
Rhys said:
Hi Zim

I don't know if this is helpful to you, but worrying too much about the process may be hindering you - making you think that your method "doesn't feel right". Part of this exercise involves finding the constriction 'sweet spot' through trial and error and taking note of the psychological and physiological effects - the changes are very noticeable and you don't have to breathe in a particular way for very long to tell if it is working or not. Relaxing into the process and having some faith in yourself will go a long way towards helping you find your method IMO. We are all built slightly differently! You may even find that you have already found it and never realised - maybe its a case of "not seeing the wood for the trees" :)

Good luck!

Hi Rhys

What Im worry about is to do the Pipe breath well since I feel dizzy after doing it so with some explanations about it I can clear my mind and picture it to do it fine.... I understood that the Pipe breath is very important in the process of healing becuase the stimulating of the Vagus nerve so I wanted to learn to do it very well!!! ;D ;)
 
Aragorn said:
I'm not quite sure what you're saying above. Are you suggesting that one should elevate the soft palate and thus depress the larynx? I really can't say how such a procedure would effect the vagal stimulation, but I can say that from my experience as a singer (who has tried many techniques, including the 'high soft palate'/depressed larynx technique - which nearly ruined my voice) that this kind of manipulation of the throat area WILL cause a lot of unnecessary tension in different muscles - including tongue, jaw and larynx. This is of course my subjective take on the subject, but I do feel that when I do the EE, as when I sing, I don't want any additional tensions anywhere if I can help it. I find that with minimum tension everything always works more smoothly and efficiently. IMO, just concentrating on the very subtle pinch in the larynx and imagining the nasal passage wide and extending all the way down to the throat will 'do the trick'.

Fwiw, some time ago I wrote this post, maybe some of you will find it helpful. :)

I agree, and found myself rather confused with Jerry's input as well. Thanks for the clarification, Aragorn.
 
luke wilson said:
Hi, there are 220 pages here and maybe the answer to my question is somewhere in here but 220 pages is to much to go through.

Hi,

Its a lot of material! :) You might try searching through the thread for specific words or phrases like "skip" or "skip warrior's breath" or "out of order" or something like that. If you need help learning to use the search function, read this: _http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?action=help;page=searching
 
Thank You Seamas... I've noticed you've been providing me with quite alot of useful feedback of late. Thanks for that, I really appreciate it!
 
zim said:
Hi Jerry

To picture in my mind I attached a picture showing the part I think I must move in my mouth when I do pipe B, are this correct ?

Hi zim, while this procedure of lifting of the palate makes the 'ujai-sound' louder and maybe clearer in your head it has, according to my knowledge and experience many disadvantages, see my previous post here. My suggestion would be to keep everything natural and simple; as some singing coach once said: "You'll recognize the correct singing technique by the fact that you can produce maximum efficiency [i.e. a beautiful, focused and well projecting voice] with minimum effort." I have found that this axiom can only be accomplished by complete freedom and relaxation of the muscles - the muscles that are needed do only as much as they have to, the other muscles don't interfere.

I could be wrong, but I think that this same principle would apply to the EE too.
 
luke wilson said:
Hi, there are 220 pages here and maybe the answer to my question is somewhere in here but 220 pages is to much to go through.

Is it ok to do the 3 stage breathing then baha then meditation/pots having skipped the Warriors breath section...?

Yes. I sometimes skip the Warrior's Breath when i do the program at night because it wakes me up ;)

luke wilson said:
Also when doing 3 stage breathing and Baha, I was in a sitting position, then when it came to the meditation and POTS section I stood up and went to lie down. So there was this break inbetween. Is this ok?

Yes. And if you want you can do the entire program laying down (except that you'll have to sit up for the WB - at least i have to).
 
zim said:
Gawan said:
zim said:
How do I know if Im stimulating my Vagus Nerve do I have to feel dizzy?

Actually no, as far as I'm aware of, did you breath with the counting (6 in, 2 hold, 9 out, 2 hold ...)? You will feel a certain clarity in your mind and it is easier to focus on something, also when you take your time for example for the 3-stage breathing, you will feel more and more relaxed.


Zim said:
So when I breath in I must do like Im trying to take my nasal fluid to my throat? Although I dont have any nasal fluid but just the feeling??? So in that moment I feel my throat have to be contracted ?

I don't know if this has been already suggested, but what helped me a lot learning to pipebreath was the suggestion to clean some glasses/spectacles (to put some moisture on them).

Hi Gawan

I have felt dizzy after the pipe breath so I think Im doing wrong.....but Im working on it, thanks for your comments ;)

Hi Zim. As Gawan says, the out-breath of PB must feel like the way our mouths/throats feel like when we moisture our glasses with our breath to clean them. Do it a few times and pay attention to the sensation/constriction this creates in your throat. In order to know whether your inbreath is also correct, try the outbreath as described, and midway, close your mouth and inhale through the nose holding that same sensation/constriction in your throat.

I hope that the above is clear and that it helps you.
 
luke wilson said:
I did a session last night before bed!

I was wondering, is it Ok to skip the warriors breath section and go straight to the baha portion?

I tried the warriors breath but it's too loud so I went to the baha section... so 3 stage breathing, baha and then finally meditation/POTS.

I was also wondering, what is meant to happen whilst you are doing the whole thing? I noticed whilst I was doing the 3 stage breathing, I was just kinda relaxed and calm. My mind was surprisingly still - just blank, very very few thoughts as I was just focusing on the breathing.

When I started to do the baha, eventhough there was a break between the 3 stage and baha section because I realized I couldnt do the warriors breath as it just causes to much noise [...]

Hello Luke,

imo the suggestions from Seamas are the way to go, to check for the EE-guide/faq which is created out of the way, cause the EE thread is too huge to read it from the beginning and the guide is including the most important questions and answers. :)

Your question regarding to make noise whilst doing the warriors breath, you can do it also silently, with making less "noise".

Have a look here:

http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=12837.msg118479#msg118479


Incognito said:
[quote author=Gawan]
I don't know if this has been already suggested, but what helped me a lot learning to pipebreath was the suggestion to clean some glasses/spectacles (to put some moisture on them).

The moisture on glasses is for the out breath, Zim is asking about the in breath I think. :)
[/quote]

Oh, you are right, my fault.
 
luke wilson said:
Thank You Seamas... I've noticed you've been providing me with quite alot of useful feedback of late. Thanks for that, I really appreciate it!

You're welcome luke wilson, I'm glad my feedback has been useful for you. :D
 
luke wilson, just for your information, you don't have to yell when you do the Warrior's Breath in a place where you need to be quite. It is more effective when you do yell, but if you bring your hands/arms down with enough force and whisper Hah!, the air does get pushed out of your lungs quite effectively because the forceful pulling down of the hands/arms forces the air out of the lungs.

Another thing, I think that somewhere you mentioned that you were confused about the "meditative seed". The meditative seed IS the Prayer of the Soul and this is what you focus on while listening to Laura recite the POTS during the meditation. I hope that this answers your question about it.

Keep on doing as much of the EE as you can twice a week and the three-stage breathing and POTS every day/night.
 
Aragorn said:
Jerry said:
The breath is normally resisted by a downward movement of the larynx when singing or speaking. The laryngeal-depressor muscles function simultaneously with the muscles which raise the soft palate. If one imagines smiling in the back of the mouth, the larynx will lower with ease and may assist for greater vagal stimulation.

I'm not quite sure what you're saying above. Are you suggesting that one should elevate the soft palate and thus depress the larynx? I really can't say how such a procedure would effect the vagal stimulation, but I can say that from my experience as a singer (who has tried many techniques, including the 'high soft palate'/depressed larynx technique - which nearly ruined my voice) that this kind of manipulation of the throat area WILL cause a lot of unnecessary tension in different muscles - including tongue, jaw and larynx. This is of course my subjective take on the subject, but I do feel that when I do the EE, as when I sing, I don't want any additional tensions anywhere if I can help it. I find that with minimum tension everything always works more smoothly and efficiently. IMO, just concentrating on the very subtle pinch in the larynx and imagining the nasal passage wide and extending all the way down to the throat will 'do the trick'.

Fwiw, some time ago I wrote this post, maybe some of you will find it helpful. :)

It's true that some techniques use a fixed lower larynx position. That wasn't what I was referring to above. Whenever a sound is made the larynx resists the breath with a downward movement. When an exaggerated attempt is made by pushing it too low via the base of the tongue there will be tension, yes.

The palate naturally lifts in various degrees according to vowel and hue, and also slightly when the larynx resists the breath. Any willful attempt to not raise it is contrary to what the body does naturally, causing imbalances of tension in other places and is not recommended.

I repeat, this was not to be understood as the low larynx/high palate singing technique but merely a suggestion based on natural functions, to aim for optimum friction of the breath in the larynx itself.

It's sad that you nearly lost your voice.
 
Hi Jerry

To picture in my mind I attached a picture showing the part I think I must move in my mouth when I do pipe B, are this correct ?

Don't try to move it. I suggested using the image of smiling in the back of the mouth. When conscious efforts are made to manipulate muscles that are normally involuntary, there will be tension that resticts their healthy performance. The body responds magnificently and naturally to the mind.

Please note this was only one suggestion to assist in the correction of a glottis that is a little too open causing the feeling of the breath against the back of the mouth. It's not to be taken as necessary.
 
An update on my recent EE practice:

I notice that when practicing EE I can more easily relate to the physical sensations associated with it, perhaps because my job is quite physical. In prior posts I have related a sensation in my chest, which throughout time and combined with a couple of life changing decisions subsided, emerging only very rarely. Well, lately I've been having this almost constant sensation in my forehead, as if something is going through it. It always happens during EE, and apart from that it can happen at basically any time.

This week I made an important decision in what concerns my past. I'm struggling to find words to describe it, but it has to do with putting the past to rest and moving forward. I had previously tried to "put the past to rest" by suppression, which "works" up to a certain degree....It "works" by helping one get on with life, but deep down issues are kept unresolved. I've ignored what I had inside and hoped everything would be ok. Well, obviously it wasn't, and since I started EE past traumatic events have been knocking on my door real hard! So for the past 10 months or so (and with the help of therapy I've started in the meantime) I have been dedicating myself to looking at it, really staring it in the face, and assume my feelings no matter how nasty, has rightfully felt. It proved to be such a big can of worms that for a moment I thought this wouldn't end....but I think it is finally paying off.

I have been feeling a shift in me lately. Very subtle, but also very deep. This shift has been accompanied by different bodily sensations during EE, the solar plexus, the throat, and always the forehead.
The shift culminated this past weekend when I began to feel that I was getting ready to let go. It has been a somewhat difficult week because something in me seems to be desperate to cling to a very old thinking pattern, and to the tools I had found throughout the years to help me get through life, BUT, there is now a much stronger part of me that feels ready to genuinely put the past to rest :D

As I was doing EE today, these thoughts suddenly came to mind with an intense sensation in my chest. It was very different then before, almost piercing right through my breastbone. I also had such an intense pressure in my forehead that I had to touch it to make sure nothing was actually sitting on it!

I haven't won this battle, but I feel that I am at least fighting it, and it is an extremely freeing feeling. There is a hard road ahead, but I feel that I have more tools to embrace it now then ever before.
Onwards and upwards we go, EE is just fantastic!
 
Alana said:
Hi Zim. As Gawan says, the out-breath of PB must feel like the way our mouths/throats feel like when we moisture our glasses with our breath to clean them. Do it a few times and pay attention to the sensation/constriction this creates in your throat. In order to know whether your inbreath is also correct, try the outbreath as described, and midway, close your mouth and inhale through the nose holding that same sensation/constriction in your throat.

I hope that the above is clear and that it helps you.

The other day I bought some new glassware and was peeling the sticker off. Sometimes when I am peeling a sticker off something, I'll breathe on it and try to have as much moisture out to help it come off cleanly (it seems to help). Would this action also be stimulating the vagus nerve? When I do this I make almost no noise at all, so if this works too then it's great for those times where I need to be quiet when doing the breathing exercise.
 
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