George Floyd's Death, Protests and Riots across the US

[Ketone Cop]

Since the abolition of slavery, the Americans have not really solved the problem of racial discrimination to date, it is systemic racism. Systemic racism is also a European problem. All states that used to rule over others and become rich with them, somewhere in street names, museums and palaces, retain the memory of a golden age that was bloody for other people. Racism is part of Europe's cultural identity, a deeply rooted evil. The European way to modernity was not possible without colonial exploitation. In contrast to Germany, which is still forced by the whole world to process its past every minute and make amends, this process did not take place in most countries. The refusal to process the story is also the fear of the truth. Society's deeply rooted racism and racially motivated police violence are leading to collective repression.

I think I passed over this too quickly when I read it the first time. This is such a hard topic to write about with so many nuances...it is impossible to write on racism without bias. It is implicit in each and every one of us that has a skin color (since invisible men don't exist yet). But I want to say a few words about systemic "racism" in America.

(I won't comment on what you write about Germany - I'm not there and I have no cultural basis to make a useful analysis (though I do think that Germany has been purposefully driven to division with forceful immigration).)

But I would differ in thought re: Americans and the "problem" of racial discrimination being systemic. I agree that there are areas where outright racism is still a problem, but they really are very few and mostly exist now only in the deep south. And I agree that there are many who relish reading about black-on-black violence and who make themselves feel superior intellectually when reading about such things. I see them posting every day on news site forums.

In my own personal experience however I just don't see it. I live in an area where there is a large black, Hispanic, and Asian presence, and I lived in the south for a time. All of my interactions (other than once in Houston when I entered a bus with all black people, who merely laughed at me) with minorities have been positive, and with no thought given about race. No one in my family, or friends or even work associates over the years, has come out and said anything malicious about any race in general (though individual members, heck yeah!).

I think that for the majority of Americans who have grown up since the 60's, race is basically a non-issue. It is not systemic, though I agree it is present in certain pockets. I agree also that some who should know better sometimes blame other races for creating problems before they examine their own contributions to those very same problems. But overall here in America I think the issue of "racism" mostly exists as an MSM construct meant to divide and conquer, and take attention away from those who are pushing these issues in the first place.

 

[Nachtweide]

I think I passed over this too quickly when I read it the first time. This is such a hard topic to write about with so many nuances...it is impossible to write on racism without bias. It is implicit in each and every one of us that has a skin color (since invisible men don't exist yet). But I want to say a few words about systemic "racism" in America.

(I won't comment on what you write about Germany - I'm not there and I have no cultural basis to make a useful analysis (though I do think that Germany has been purposefully driven to division with forceful immigration).)

But I would differ in thought re: Americans and the "problem" of racial discrimination being systemic. I agree that there are areas where outright racism is still a problem, but they really are very few and mostly exist now only in the deep south. And I agree that there are many who relish reading about black-on-black violence and who make themselves feel superior intellectually when reading about such things. I see them posting every day on news site forums.

In my own personal experience however I just don't see it. I live in an area where there is a large black, Hispanic, and Asian presence, and I lived in the south for a time. All of my interactions (other than once in Houston when I entered a bus with all black people, who merely laughed at me) with minorities have been positive, and with no thought given about race. No one in my family, or friends or even work associates over the years, has come out and said anything malicious about any race in general (though individual members, heck yeah!).

I think that for the majority of Americans who have grown up since the 60's, race is basically a non-issue. It is not systemic, though I agree it is present in certain pockets. I agree also that some who should know better sometimes blame other races for creating problems before they examine their own contributions to those very same problems. But overall here in America I think the issue of "racism" mostly exists as an MSM construct meant to divide and conquer, and take attention away from those who are pushing these issues in the first place.

Thanks for your review. It is definitely not possible for me to analyze or assess this question for another country. For Germany, I can look at it from the perspective of my ancestors and with the experiences that I have personally. My view of racism in all other countries is that of a viewer with no real knowledge. And so I've learned a new lesson: never judge a situation if you don't have enough knowledge.

 

[hlat]

There's at least one example of legal systemic racism against a racial minority in the US, which is affirmative action against Asians. Most people don't care. The courts uphold it as legal.

 

[SummerLite]

So, how do people here feel about this? Are you considering arming yourselves so you can protect your home and your family? If not, how are you thinking about such a possible turn of events?

I've also thought about the gun issue often these last few months, starting with the virus and now because of the rioting. I know i could shoot someone if they where endangering my life or a loved one. I grew up around guns since my brother is a hunter and my son as well. I don't really want to buy one...but I'm considering it. However, that would require learning how to use it well and safely, going to a firing range and taking what classes where available, so its a commitment. Very good points have been raised here. I've been a little concerned about the lack of ammo.

And I think there’s the rub. It’s one thing to own a weapon, but another to know how to wield it well and ensure that it doesn’t get used against you.

Also the danger of renegade bullets! When I was a kid, my brother accidentally shot his rifle in the basement and the bullet ripped through my bedroom floor!

I guess a lot would depend in what situation you found yourself in that would require using one. Defending ones home may be easier then being grabbed on the street for instance. At the moment I live far from the madding crowd, I'm not fearful and I don't sense an urgency to rush out and buy one so I have time to consider it.

I'm also thinking about helping to home school my grandkids, something I never thought would happen. Look how the public school system is being dismantled as well. I've considered that may be a good thing for them but its an even bigger commitment then learning to use a gun.

We're seeing people around the country successfully protecting their stores, neighborhoods and towns when they band together. So thats good.
Several months ago the Democrats where campaigning on taking everyones guns away. That caused me to seriously think about getting one.
So much insanity these days. Maybe fast acting tranquilizing guns would be good then call in the cops if any are left.

 

[Ketone Cop]

Thanks for your review. It is definitely not possible for me to analyze or assess this question for another country. For Germany, I can look at it from the perspective of my ancestors and with the experiences that I have personally. My view of racism in all other countries is that of a viewer with no real knowledge. And so I've learned a new lesson: never judge a situation if you don't have enough knowledge.

I would add that it is sometimes hard to understand what someone else who shares your own skin color, who has had experience and history that seems so divergent from your own, can appear to have such a different ideology - until you realize that we not only live in different countries with their own unique histories, but we also use a different language in our daily lives to communicate with others. Communication was *made* hard, purposefully, over the millennia in this way, through this separation.

Underneath everything Nachtweide, I see in you that you care, deeply. I appreciate everything that you have shared on this forum.

And I have to admit, this thread has been very hard for me. Many issues have come up here that I now know I have not given enough time to understand properly. Many posts I have left alone because I don't think I have the required background to reply adequately. I imagine this thread must be a nightmare for the moderators because so many different issues and biases come up and they are so hard to adjudicate because doing so often directly confronts people's deeply ingrained belief systems. I don't envy them.

But don't be hard on yourself, Nachweide. We are all still learning. It just so happens, some of these lessons are hard. We aren't masters yet, but let's keep working!!

 

[Gary]

Not sure if this has been posted anywhere but it's Tucker Carlson's update on Seattle and the new nation of CHAZ. One of the funniest and insightful monologues I've probably ever seen on mainstream media. Well worth the watch.

Here is his latest update on CHAZ, that most progressive of new nations!

 

[Woodsman]

I was addressing your presumption, which was


I do not presume the uniform status or darkness status will inform me whether someone is really planting weapons or not.

Why not? They seem like reasonable presumptions in this case. Much more so than fake police causing mischief in broad daylight. That seems like crisis actor territory, and this isn't a grassy knoll situation, I don't think. It seemed prosaic at best.

But people are having trouble determining reality in these high energy times. It's certainly easy to let one's imagination run away; I know mine is doing so more than usual and requires extra effort to reign in these days. I come here in part to stay grounded.

 

[Arwenn]

So, if there are fewer blacks, the reason is almost certainly that this is reflective of a relative absence of the relevant aptitudes and skillsets in that population. They'll say they'll "start seeking out top black talent", but in practice this means they will reduce hiring requirements on grounds of race, in order to fill a quota.

Which means there will be white guys, better qualified for the position, who will not get it, because of their race.

This is what I meant earlier about paramoralism. Not discriminating on the basis of race, but looking only at merit, is obviously good to most people. No reasonable person can disagree. But then, there's the hidden assumption that any difference in outcome must be because of discrimination - whether overt or 'implicit bias'. That's of course not true, but to suggest otherwise violates a central dogma of society, which is that there are no racial differences. As a result of which, in order to square the circle, the imperative not to discriminate on the basis of race seamlessly mutates into the imperative to discriminate on the basis of race.

This is the difference between equity (which is equality of outcome, based on quotas) vs equality of opportunity (which takes merit into account without discriminating based on gender, race, religion etc.) JBP talked about this a lot when he was actively giving interviews. Equity, diversity, inclusivity is the mantra of the progressive left, much to the detriment of the workplace & society in general, OSIT. To hell with merit and competence, companies look better if they have said number of women, trans people etc.

Equity: When the Left Goes Too Far – Jordan Peterson

www.jordanbpeterson.com

 

[Arwenn]

grew up around guns since my brother is a hunter and my son as well. I don't really want to buy one...but I'm considering it. However, that would require learning how to use it well and safely, going to a firing range and taking what classes where available, so its a commitment. V

Then there’s also the legalities of defending yourself, and I’m not sure what they are in the US. If one does shoot an intruder/rioter fatally in self defence, can charges be brought against them? Hopefully just being armed is a deterrent in itself, but if you did have to take it further, you’d need to know what your rights are.

 

[Gary]

The good news is the folks at CHAZ have a community garden project up and running....

https://twitter.com/x/status/1271653002982469632

...but there are some initial problems, which is to be expected of course.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1271537979157131264

'Everybody I've talked to feels significantly safer': A protester living near Seattle's 'autonomous zone' explains why the neighborhood is better without cops.

As long as they don't run out of weed, vegan meat substitutes and stuff to vandalise all should be fine in CHAZ.

 

[Arwenn]

Basically the narrative is that white people need re-education on racial inequality, their privilege and inherent racism. I’ve seen now the same propaganda everywhere but just reformatted for different audiences. Even a “workshop” was posted on one of my local expat groups, a year long workshop on “educating” white people about these “issues”

This is the Unconscious Bias training that is slowly being rolled out in various corporations and work places. It is based on Critical Race Theory (with the assumption that everyone has inherent subconscious biases). The main points of this theory are summarised below (from an article on SoTT):

Eight big reasons critical race theory is terrible for dealing with racism

As unlikely as it seems, a highly obscure academic theory known as Critical Race Theory has completely mainstreamed in society, and now everyone is discussing it. While Critical Race Theory has the noble goal of pointing out problems that can be...

www.sott.net

Critical Race Theory...
• believes racism is present in every aspect of life, every relationship, and everyinteraction and therefore has its advocates look for it everywhere
• relies upon "interest convergence" (white people only give black people opportunities and freedoms when it is also in their own interests) and therefore doesn't trust any attempt to make racism better
• is against free societies and wants to dismantle them and replace them with something its advocates control
• only treats race issues as "socially constructed groups," so there are no individuals in Critical Race Theory
• believes science, reason, and evidence are a "white" way of knowing and that storytelling and lived experience is a "black" alternative, which hurts everyone, especially black people
• rejects all potential alternatives, like colorblindness, as forms of racism, making itself the only allowable game in town (which is totalitarian)
• acts like anyone who disagrees with it must do so for racist and white supremacist reasons, even if those people are black (which is also totalitarian)
• cannot be satisfied, so it becomes a kind of activist black hole that threatens to destroy everything it is introduced into

 

[hlat]

The good news is the folks at CHAZ have a community garden project up and running....

https://twitter.com/x/status/1271653002982469632

...but there are some initial problems, which is to be expected of course.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1271537979157131264

'Everybody I've talked to feels significantly safer': A protester living near Seattle's 'autonomous zone' explains why the neighborhood is better without cops.

As long as they don't run out of weed, vegan meat substitutes and stuff to vandalise all should be fine in CHAZ.

Apparently the ground layers are grass, cardboard, and then the visible dirt. I'm not sure a lot will thrive with the cardboard layer.

 

[mrtn]

I'm not sure a lot will thrive with the cardboard layer.

It's common practice. It's a lot of work to remove the turf. With the cardboard the grass beneath can't grow through upwards and will rot, while the plants on top will have no problem to grow through with their roots if the cardboard is moist.

 

[SevenFeathers]

I think that for the majority of Americans who have grown up since the 60's, race is basically a non-issue. It is not systemic, though I agree it is present in certain pockets. I agree also that some who should know better sometimes blame other races for creating problems before they examine their own contributions to those very same problems. But overall here in America I think the issue of "racism" mostly exists as an MSM construct meant to divide and conquer, and take attention away from those who are pushing these issues in the first place.

Yes, there are certainly haters still out there. I know some old timers who fall into that category. But I agree that for most, race is not an issue until MSM wants to make it an issue.

 

[shellycheval]

Interesting. Do you happen to live in the South? I live in upstate New York, and although New York is a blue state, upstate is largely red -- but still no gun shops are open here, or sporting goods stores that sell guns. At least in my area.

I live (for now) in the Southern part of the Mid Atlantic area, which culture wise is the Northern edge of the US South . Our restaurants and churches are still closed but Walmart, Lowes, and the gun store remained open throughout the Lockdown.