Ketogenic Diet - Powerful Dietary Strategy for Certain Conditions

[monotonic]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

I have found the salt in the bacon we eat does not help - rather it makes things worse. Processed salts, such as superfine salts coating roasted nuts cause me to have uncomfortable water retention episodes until it has run its course.

Endymion - the first line in your signature is attributed to Voltaire.

 

[mcb]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

I have found the salt in the bacon we eat does not help - rather it makes things worse. Processed salts, such as superfine salts coating roasted nuts cause me to have uncomfortable water retention episodes until it has run its course.
...

You do need to be especially careful with any processed meat, including bacon, sausage, and salami. Do test it. My body seems to be OK with a pound a week of uncured bacon (or I guess it is really sugar cured, but with minimal sugar). More than that doesn't seem to set as well. It's "cruelty free" but not natural diet.

At first I alternated between pork roasts, chuck roasts (beef), lamb shank, and beef ribs for my afternoon meals. The pork roasts were the first to go, because the meat -- while unprocessed -- just seemed to be "missing something." It was also a lower grade, "cruelty free" but boneless and not natural diet. The chuck roast went next because while it had plenty of fat and was grass fed/finished, it was also boneless. After a while that didn't taste right either.

I slow cook the remaining two, lamb shank and beef ribs, on the bone. It makes a big difference, and it makes broth too, both while cooking the meat and afterward when I use the bones for bone broth.

 

[LQB]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Gut Bacteria Need a Balanced Diet Too

A few lines of evidence suggest that low or moderate fiber intake may create a more healthful, friendly gut flora.

Bacteria not only need carbohydrates for food, they need other nutrients too: phospholipids for their membranes, amino acids for their proteins, minerals for their enzymes. And well-nourished gut bacteria may be more likely to cooperate probiotically with their host.

This may be a reason that tree nuts are healthful. Almond fats, for instance, have been shown to help probiotic bacteria flourish. The benefits of almonds are lost when the fat content is removed.

If gut bacteria need fats, and if providing fats makes the gut healthier, high-carb, low-fat diets may sabotage the gut by creating a scarcity of nourishing fats for gut bacteria. A low-carb, high-fat diet will create a smaller but healthier— and friendlier— population of gut bacteria.

Jaminet, Paul; Jaminet, Shou-Ching (2012-12-11). Perfect Health Diet (Kindle Locations 3259-3267). Simon & Schuster, Inc.. Kindle Edition.

Well, a little almond butter sandwiched between a good dose of probiotics sure fixed whatever was going wrong in my colon recently (and described above). Relief was complete and permanent.

Breeding has made some plants less toxic. Wild almonds contain amygdalin, a chemical that turns into cyanide in the body. Eating only a few wild almonds may be lethal. However, breeding has eliminated amygdalin from domesticated almonds, making them relatively safe.

Jaminet, Paul; Jaminet, Shou-Ching (2012-12-11). Perfect Health Diet (Kindle Locations 4335-4337). Simon & Schuster, Inc.. Kindle Edition.

If this is the same/similar compound as in apricot kernels, then it is harmless to normal cells and deadly to cancer cells. I can taste/smell the similarity. Yes, there is cyanide but it remains bound except in the chemical machinery of the cancer cell.

added: "kernels" should read "seeds"

 

[mcb]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

...

Breeding has made some plants less toxic. Wild almonds contain amygdalin, a chemical that turns into cyanide in the body. Eating only a few wild almonds may be lethal. However, breeding has eliminated amygdalin from domesticated almonds, making them relatively safe.

Jaminet, Paul; Jaminet, Shou-Ching (2012-12-11). Perfect Health Diet (Kindle Locations 4335-4337). Simon & Schuster, Inc.. Kindle Edition.

If this is the same/similar compound as in apricot kernels, then it is harmless to normal cells and deadly to cancer cells. I can taste/smell the similarity. Yes, there is cyanide but it remains bound except in the chemical machinery of the cancer cell.

added: "kernels" should read "seeds"

I haven't researched this, but the issue was with something that could be converted to cyanide the body, not with cyanide contained in the wild almonds. The statement is footnoted, but the footnote links seem to be munged in the Mac version of the Kindle reader. I will try looking up the citation using my actual Kindle device, when I have a chance. I may have to scan through all the footnotes to find it, and half the book is footnotes!

What about this? (See the "Toxicity" heading.)

 

[LQB]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

...

Breeding has made some plants less toxic. Wild almonds contain amygdalin, a chemical that turns into cyanide in the body. Eating only a few wild almonds may be lethal. However, breeding has eliminated amygdalin from domesticated almonds, making them relatively safe.

Jaminet, Paul; Jaminet, Shou-Ching (2012-12-11). Perfect Health Diet (Kindle Locations 4335-4337). Simon & Schuster, Inc.. Kindle Edition.

If this is the same/similar compound as in apricot kernels, then it is harmless to normal cells and deadly to cancer cells. I can taste/smell the similarity. Yes, there is cyanide but it remains bound except in the chemical machinery of the cancer cell.

added: "kernels" should read "seeds"

I haven't researched this, but the issue was with something that could be converted to cyanide the body, not with cyanide contained in the wild almonds. The statement is footnoted, but the footnote links seem to be munged in the Mac version of the Kindle reader. I will try looking up the citation using my actual Kindle device, when I have a chance. I may have to scan through all the footnotes to find it, and half the book is footnotes!

What about this? (See the "Toxicity" heading.)

Yep, same stuff. The toxicity is BS. I've eaten many seeds (as have many I know) as well as the refined "laetrile" concentrated. There is no health risk that I know of (except for cancer cells - but not all cancers). Like I said, I can smell the substance in raw almonds but it is much less than in apricot seeds. Calling out a risk for this in almonds is major disinfo (imo).

Added: BTW, a good book on this is G Edward Griffin's World Without Cancer - The Story of Vitamin B17

 

[mada85]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

I have found the salt in the bacon we eat does not help - rather it makes things worse. Processed salts, such as superfine salts coating roasted nuts cause me to have uncomfortable water retention episodes until it has run its course.

I've not had any problems from the bacon I buy, even though it is supermarket bacon that spits under the grill. However, my sensitivity to foods has been increasing over the past year so if I notice any signs that it may be affecting me I will test it. A bigger problem than the salt in the bacon is the sugar. It's very difficult where I live to find sugar-free bacon. The loons who make the bacon for the supermarkets remove the fat and add sugar! Jeez!

I've increased my daily salt intake, and halved my magnesium intake, and added potassium morning and bed time, with the result that I'm sleeping peacefully with no twitches or cramps in my legs.

My first batch of bone broth was finished this morning. I used six pig's trotters in a big pot and cooked it for 24 hours. It turned out quite watery, not the thick gelatinous broth I was hoping for. The bones didn't soften. I removed all the bones and left all the animal parts and put it through the blender. It made a sort of pale-ish brown soup with a not unpleasant but slightly 'challenging' flavour. Adding salt and pepper improved things.

I noticed that although I needed quite a lot of water to cover the trotters initially, they disintegrated after a couple of hours. The bones were actually quite small. So in relation to the size of the bones in the trotters, one would not need to cover the trotters but add only the equivalent amount of water to cover the bones, as if the bones were all there was in the pot. The trotters would cook and disintegrate completely after 2-3 hours leaving the bones submerged in the liquid. Another option would be to cover the trotters but allow the liquid to reduce over the cooking time.

Today was to be a normal protein day but I could only east a small breakfast. At about noon, feeling 'the need to feed' I heated a mug of broth and added a pat of butter. Wow! I could only take half of it. That stuff is so filling and warming!

A question: is it OK to make broth using frozen bones straight from the freezer?

 

[anart]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

A question: is it OK to make broth using frozen bones straight from the freezer?

Yep.

 

[dugdeep]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Just a short update on my situation. For the last couple of weeks I've been upping my carbs a bit in hopes of getting some fiber into my diet. Mainly in the form of salads or fried onions, the odd handful of nuts, etc. It's my way of trying to address my bowels' continuing refusal to move of its own accord.

Well there's been no success on that front and, to add another layer of challenge, the eczema that used to be somewhat chronic but hasn't bothered me in YEARS has returned, although not in a severe way (yet). It's in the same spot it's always been; left hand centred around the knuckle of my pinkie finger. It showed up and was at its worst when I was in the restaurant industry and calmed significantly when I left that industry (I think stress is a big component, although not the whole picture). Over the last 5 years or so I thought it was completely gone. Now this.

I don't know if something I've been eating specifically has been aggravating it (I suspect onions) or if it's just the carbs in general that my body isn't handling well. It could be that my digestive tract no longer has the ecology to handle fiber at all. I've started taking a probiotic and am going to be trying my hand at Megan's experiment with the sauerkraut to try and establish a better bacterial environment.

Anyway, today I was so fed up with not having had a movement in over a week, I made myself some coffee (which I haven't been having), thinking it was a surefire way to get things moving. It didn't work

On to sauerkraut. I have a friend with a large fermentation crock that he said he'd lend me. I haven't fermented in a long time, so I'm kind of excited about this :)

 

[anart]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Just a short update on my situation. For the last couple of weeks I've been upping my carbs a bit in hopes of getting some fiber into my diet. Mainly in the form of salads or fried onions, the odd handful of nuts, etc. It's my way of trying to address my bowels' continuing refusal to move of its own accord.

Well there's been no success on that front and, to add another layer of challenge, the eczema that used to be somewhat chronic but hasn't bothered me in YEARS has returned, although not in a severe way (yet). It's in the same spot it's always been; left hand centred around the knuckle of my pinkie finger. It showed up and was at its worst when I was in the restaurant industry and calmed significantly when I left that industry (I think stress is a big component, although not the whole picture). Over the last 5 years or so I thought it was completely gone. Now this.

Probably the nuts. Eczema isn't present without food issues of some sort and either your diet is not as clean as you think it is in general, or you're really sensitive to nuts. I am - which bums me out because I 'love' them.

 

[dugdeep]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Just a short update on my situation. For the last couple of weeks I've been upping my carbs a bit in hopes of getting some fiber into my diet. Mainly in the form of salads or fried onions, the odd handful of nuts, etc. It's my way of trying to address my bowels' continuing refusal to move of its own accord.

Well there's been no success on that front and, to add another layer of challenge, the eczema that used to be somewhat chronic but hasn't bothered me in YEARS has returned, although not in a severe way (yet). It's in the same spot it's always been; left hand centred around the knuckle of my pinkie finger. It showed up and was at its worst when I was in the restaurant industry and calmed significantly when I left that industry (I think stress is a big component, although not the whole picture). Over the last 5 years or so I thought it was completely gone. Now this.

Probably the nuts. Eczema isn't present without food issues of some sort and either your diet is not as clean as you think it is in general, or you're really sensitive to nuts. I am - which bums me out because I 'love' them.

Certainly could be the case. I hadn't thought of that since I'd had a few nuts over the holidays without incident and didn't have any issues show up until adding in onions (and lettuce). But, with delayed reactions and all, it's hard to tell. Today I took myself back down to near zero carb and will continue there until I start the sauerkraut test. I suppose I could add in onions and nuts (separately) down the road to see if they cause a reaction, but we'll see. I 'love' both nuts and onions, so they may both be causing issues.

I don't think it's that my diet isn't as clean as I think it is. I hardly ever eat anything I haven't prepared myself and am generally quite careful on the rare occasion when that's not the case. But it's a good reminder to renew my diligence.

ADDED: Actually, I just remembered another minor change in my diet your "not as clean as you think" comment brought to mind. I've been using xylitol mints at work for the last couple of years since going ketogenic (my boss actually complained about my breath at one point when I was in transition). It's just a habit for me to have a mint in the morning and one after lunch. Recently a coworker gave me a pack of the berry flavour. Nothing jumped out at me on the ingredients list, but maybe there's something in them that's causing the issue. I have been having quite a few of them lately...

 

[mcb]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

...
I don't know if something I've been eating specifically has been aggravating it (I suspect onions) or if it's just the carbs in general that my body isn't handling well. It could be that my digestive tract no longer has the ecology to handle fiber at all. I've started taking a probiotic and am going to be trying my hand at Megan's experiment with the sauerkraut to try and establish a better bacterial environment.
...

I didn't make a point of it and perhaps I should have, but this always applies: introduce the new foods one at a time, some days apart. I started with chard, I think (already thoroughly tested), then sauerkraut, followed some days later by mushrooms, followed some days later by onion. If you have reason to think a particular food could be trouble, give it even more time.

The only veggie I was concerned about was onion, because it has a higher density of carbs. When I say onion, by the way, I mean a thin slice of onion, not a whole onion. I have been going through less than one whole onion per week. That way the net carbs are only about 1 g/d.

The chard, sauerkraut, onion, and mushrooms add up to around 3-5 net carbs a day (depending on what I have), which may not really even "count" as I described earlier.

I checked my late-day ketones before and after starting this and they were at 2.4 mMol/L both times, with fasting glucose around 90. It would help if others trying the fermentables would check their ketones & glucose too to see what, if anything, happens.

 

[mcb]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Oh, by the way, if you are introducing fermentable saccharides (as above), do space the different foods out, but if you have had symtoms of excess fermentation in the past then don't eat major amounts of the new food, the way you might do with an ordinary elimination/challenge test.

I am avoiding foods with high fermentable content, such as avocado. The net carbs are low and the fat is high, but when I eat it the bacteria go crazy over it. I retested it like a regular food a couple of months ago (having quite a bit of it), and felt miserable for two weeks afterward. And it used to be one of my staples.

I don't know right now what the optimal amount of these foods might be, but my gut seems to be happy for now with just a little each day.

 

[dugdeep]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

...
I don't know if something I've been eating specifically has been aggravating it (I suspect onions) or if it's just the carbs in general that my body isn't handling well. It could be that my digestive tract no longer has the ecology to handle fiber at all. I've started taking a probiotic and am going to be trying my hand at Megan's experiment with the sauerkraut to try and establish a better bacterial environment.
...

I didn't make a point of it and perhaps I should have, but this always applies: introduce the new foods one at a time, some days apart. I started with chard, I think (already thoroughly tested), then sauerkraut, followed some days later by mushrooms, followed some days later by onion. If you have reason to think a particular food could be trouble, give it even more time.

The only veggie I was concerned about was onion, because it has a higher density of carbs. When I say onion, by the way, I mean a thin slice of onion, not a whole onion. I have been going through less than one whole onion per week. That way the net carbs are only about 1 g/d.

The chard, sauerkraut, onion, and mushrooms add up to around 3-5 net carbs a day (depending on what I have), which may not really even "count" as I described earlier.

I checked my late-day ketones before and after starting this and they were at 2.4 mMol/L both times, with fasting glucose around 90. It would help if others trying the fermentables would check their ketones & glucose too to see what, if anything, happens.

Yes, I think adding one food at a time wise at this point. I didn't think this would be an issue since I tested all these foods ages ago when doing the elimination diet and they all came up fine. These were staples when I was doing paleo. But I suppose once you've gone ketogenic, or perhaps more importantly zero carb, all bets are off (probably due to changed bacterial environment).

 

[Laura]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Just a short update on my situation. For the last couple of weeks I've been upping my carbs a bit in hopes of getting some fiber into my diet. Mainly in the form of salads or fried onions, the odd handful of nuts, etc. It's my way of trying to address my bowels' continuing refusal to move of its own accord.

Well there's been no success on that front and, to add another layer of challenge, the eczema that used to be somewhat chronic but hasn't bothered me in YEARS has returned, although not in a severe way (yet). It's in the same spot it's always been; left hand centred around the knuckle of my pinkie finger. It showed up and was at its worst when I was in the restaurant industry and calmed significantly when I left that industry (I think stress is a big component, although not the whole picture). Over the last 5 years or so I thought it was completely gone. Now this.

Probably the nuts. Eczema isn't present without food issues of some sort and either your diet is not as clean as you think it is in general, or you're really sensitive to nuts. I am - which bums me out because I 'love' them.

Certainly could be the case. I hadn't thought of that since I'd had a few nuts over the holidays without incident and didn't have any issues show up until adding in onions (and lettuce). But, with delayed reactions and all, it's hard to tell. Today I took myself back down to near zero carb and will continue there until I start the sauerkraut test. I suppose I could add in onions and nuts (separately) down the road to see if they cause a reaction, but we'll see. I 'love' both nuts and onions, so they may both be causing issues.

Yeah, onions are okay once in awhile for us, but if you eat them more than one or two days in a row, they "accumulate toxicity" or something like that. Nuts, too. I'm now able to have them without an immediate reaction, but if I have them two or three days in a row, the old reactions of pain and joint creaking come back.

I don't think it's that my diet isn't as clean as I think it is. I hardly ever eat anything I haven't prepared myself and am generally quite careful on the rare occasion when that's not the case. But it's a good reminder to renew my diligence.

ADDED: Actually, I just remembered another minor change in my diet your "not as clean as you think" comment brought to mind. I've been using xylitol mints at work for the last couple of years since going ketogenic (my boss actually complained about my breath at one point when I was in transition). It's just a habit for me to have a mint in the morning and one after lunch. Recently a coworker gave me a pack of the berry flavour. Nothing jumped out at me on the ingredients list, but maybe there's something in them that's causing the issue. I have been having quite a few of them lately...

Could be. I have pretty much the same issue as you are having and I've found a sort of solution while waiting for the sauerkraut to ferment: I just take a "moving dose" of magnesium every three days. Of course, I had to test to see what that dose was, which took three days, but now that I know it, I just take it regularly.

Since xylitol tends to kill off a lot of bacteria (which is probably a good thing in many ways) it may be doing that in the intestines so I'm thinking that the sauerkraut will help.

 

[mcb]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

...
Yeah, onions are okay once in awhile for us, but if you eat them more than one or two days in a row, they "accumulate toxicity" or something like that. Nuts, too. I'm now able to have them without an immediate reaction, but if I have them two or three days in a row, the old reactions of pain and joint creaking come back.
...

I am being very careful with the onions, because of my earlier experience with FODMAPs. One or two thin slices a day is enough for me, and I may reduce it further. Taste tells me to eat more; gut reactions tell me to eat less.

"Two or three days" can be a clue that whatever is happening is happening in the colon. All of my FODMAP issues are like that, on time delay.

Like the other FODMAP foods, onions can feed pathogenic bacteria that produce excess toxins, notably LPS endotoxin. The LPS seems to have a role in regulating the normal gut balance, but it can be trouble when the balance is broken.