Ketogenic Diet - Powerful Dietary Strategy for Certain Conditions

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Rennie564 said:
I have lost 95 pounds since we switched over to a ketagenic diet. I now weigh 125-130 lbs depending on the day of the week. That's appropriate for my petite 5'4" height. Before switching we ate no "junk" food. In fact, we raised or grew most of our own food then too. I don't follow the diet perfectly. There are a few no-no's in there....I love my coffee. But I no longer sweeten it and just put a dab of full fat cream in it. I used to drink it sweetened and with milk. I wish I could say I feel great right now, but I've run into complications....I have chronic EBV. I've had an active mononucleosis infection three times in my life and since starting this, the chronic EBV has moved into feeling like full fledged mono again. So I have to figure out what adjustments I need. I know I need to find a solid consistent source of a high amount of zinc....the supplements I used to take now make me sick. I special ordered them from a source that says they don't have any type of ingredients that would cause me problems but I know that's not true. If ANY grain or grain by-product is in a food we buy...I have an immediate reaction to it now. I can't go back to eating the way way we used to. I'm completely intolerant of those foods now.
Click to expand...

That's great about the weight loss on the keto diet Rennie. On the EBV, have you begun taking iodine?
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Rennie564 said:
I have lost 95 pounds since we switched over to a ketagenic diet. I now weigh 125-130 lbs depending on the day of the week. That's appropriate for my petite 5'4" height. Before switching we ate no "junk" food. In fact, we raised or grew most of our own food then too. I don't follow the diet perfectly. There are a few no-no's in there....I love my coffee. But I no longer sweeten it and just put a dab of full fat cream in it. I used to drink it sweetened and with milk. I wish I could say I feel great right now, but I've run into complications....I have chronic EBV. I've had an active mononucleosis infection three times in my life and since starting this, the chronic EBV has moved into feeling like full fledged mono again. So I have to figure out what adjustments I need. I know I need to find a solid consistent source of a high amount of zinc....the supplements I used to take now make me sick. I special ordered them from a source that says they don't have any type of ingredients that would cause me problems but I know that's not true. If ANY grain or grain by-product is in a food we buy...I have an immediate reaction to it now. I can't go back to eating the way way we used to. I'm completely intolerant of those foods now.
Click to expand...

Hi Rennie564, it would probably be beneficial to switch to a butter coffee and try to remove most dairy from your diet; until you do the suspicion may be that dairy is the problem, since it's almost as problematic as grains for most, apparently. Gaby's extensive article on the matter should help clear things up: why-milk-is-so-evil

Butter coffee is a delicious alternative - i do 1 x teaspoon of Xylitol and blend ~70g's (i have more, you may prefer less) with a hand blender. If you need a better idea of how it's done, search: 'bullet proof coffee' and I’m sure you'll find a video.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Rennie564 said:
I know I need to find a solid consistent source of a high amount of zinc....the supplements I used to take now make me sick.
Click to expand...

Why do you think you need to supplement with zinc? If the zinc supplements are making you sick, then you may not need them anymore. Liver is also a good source of zinc, so that could be a way to get zinc as opposed to supplements.

If you do need to supplement with zinc, I've used this brand with good results:

_http://www.amazon.com/Pure-Encapsulations-Zinc-60s-FFP/dp/B00TGFOYM0/

You may only need a little, so here's a version with less zinc in each capsule:

_http://www.amazon.com/Pure-Encapsulations-Zinc-15-60s/dp/B0017QCNUQ/

I'd also second the iodine for the EBV.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

I have not tried the iodine yet. I've been looking for an affordable one and I'm confused as to which type/brand would be best. It merits more research. I know I will probably find lots of info on here as well.

I will also give some thought to the limited dairy in our diet. I've been dairy free before...my youngest daughter is allergic.

Research has shown that low levels of zinc are associated with being more symptomatic when you have chronic active EBV. Those with high levels of zinc experience less symptoms. It particularly helps with the brain fog, concentration, memory, etc. I want to do as much as possible to protect myself from worsening symptoms. I know if I don't, it leads down the road toward a higher probability of Alzheimer's, lymphomas, etc.

The EBV chronic infection comes with some odd symptoms and some can be rather scary. I've had entire areas of lymph nodes simultaneously swell and harden...while breaking out in random fevers and night sweats. I have difficulty with memory and concentration. I have generalized muscle and joint pain. And most of the time I am so tired I could fall over asleep while standing. (I am a computer and electrical engineering student and homeschooling mom of four so all of that makes my average day harder than it should be) ANYTHING that might help, I will try. It took years for us to get to the place where we are as a family, my husband is a veteran and the only thing we truly want is some peace and quiet and time to LIVE.

Thank you.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Rennie564 said:
Research has shown that low levels of zinc are associated with being more symptomatic when you have chronic active EBV. Those with high levels of zinc experience less symptoms. It particularly helps with the brain fog, concentration, memory, etc. I want to do as much as possible to protect myself from worsening symptoms. I know if I don't, it leads down the road toward a higher probability of Alzheimer's, lymphomas, etc.
Click to expand...

Well it's possible to take too much zinc (too much of any good thing, for that matter), so if you're getting sick from it then it sounds like that isn't the solution that your body needs. I've personally taken too much before and really did not feel well from doing so.

Rennie564 said:
The EBV chronic infection comes with some odd symptoms and some can be rather scary. I've had entire areas of lymph nodes simultaneously swell and harden...while breaking out in random fevers and night sweats. I have difficulty with memory and concentration. I have generalized muscle and joint pain. And most of the time I am so tired I could fall over asleep while standing. (I am a computer and electrical engineering student and homeschooling mom of four so all of that makes my average day harder than it should be) ANYTHING that might help, I will try. It took years for us to get to the place where we are as a family, my husband is a veteran and the only thing we truly want is some peace and quiet and time to LIVE.
Click to expand...

I'd recommend prioritizing reading the iodine thread:

https://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php/topic,13371.0.html

This is probably the most popular brand of lugol's iodine:

_http://www.amazon.com/J-CROWS%C2%AE-Lugols-Iodine-Solution-Twin/dp/B00E3B49R2/

I've been using it with good results. It's a comparatively low dosage, which can be good to start if you've never taken iodine before. Based on your description of your situation, you may end up needing a higher dosage to nuke pathogens (I would suspect multiple pathogens, even). Some people have also purchased iodine and potassium iodide to create their own lugol's.

There's a lot that can happen in the process of taking iodine, so I'd definitely recommend reading the thread before trying it.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

When zinc is taken on an empty stomach it will often make you feel sick. Are you taking it with food, Rennie?
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

I am taking it with food. Most of the time I have to force myself to eat. I have utterly no appetite. Thankfully I have a wonderful man that will hunt me down at some point in the day armed with something he made for me to eat and a reminder to take any supplement. We are going to try the iodine as well. I'm beginning to think that with this diet causing such rapid weight loss for me, I just might well be swimming in toxins released from "fat quarantine"
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Rennie564 said:
I am taking it with food. Most of the time I have to force myself to eat. I have utterly no appetite. Thankfully I have a wonderful man that will hunt me down at some point in the day armed with something he made for me to eat and a reminder to take any supplement. We are going to try the iodine as well. I'm beginning to think that with this diet causing such rapid weight loss for me, I just might well be swimming in toxins released from "fat quarantine"
Click to expand...

Since around second half of February 2011, when I went into ketosis, I never had an appetite at all either. I used to just eat 2 meals a day - a late breakfast and dinner - just because I had to eat something. Since I started the iodine therapy in late November 2015, I've had a noticeable increase in appetite that kept increasing as time went on. In fact, now I eat between breakfast and dinner on most days, even though I'm still in ketosis, because I'm hungry. So if you try the iodine protocol, you're likely to get an appetite again. Just make sure to read up on what to expect and how to proceed before starting on iodine.

Also, you're quite likely to be right about releasing lots of toxins from losing fat mass, as a whole lot of toxins are stored in fat.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Found this interesting article - maybe something to keep in mind if you are treating some cancer at some stage with the ketogenic diet:

Front Endocrinol (Lausanne). 2016 Feb 2;7:5. doi: 10.3389/fendo.2016.00005. eCollection 2016.

Fenofibrate Induces Ketone Body Production in Melanoma and Glioblastoma Cells.

Grabacka MM1, Wilk A2, Antonczyk A1, Banks P3, Walczyk-Tytko E1, Dean M4, Pierzchalska M1, Reiss K4.

Abstract
Ketone bodies [beta-hydroxybutyrate (bHB) and acetoacetate] are mainly produced in the liver during prolonged fasting or starvation. bHB is a very efficient energy substrate for sustaining ATP production in peripheral tissues; importantly, its consumption is preferred over glucose. However, the majority of malignant cells, particularly cancer cells of neuroectodermal origin such as glioblastoma, are not able to use ketone bodies as a source of energy. Here, we report a novel observation that fenofibrate, a synthetic peroxisome proliferator-activated receptor alpha (PPARa) agonist, induces bHB production in melanoma and glioblastoma cells, as well as in neurospheres composed of non-transformed cells. Unexpectedly, this effect is not dependent on PPARa activity or its expression level. The fenofibrate-induced ketogenesis is accompanied by growth arrest and downregulation of transketolase, but the NADP/NADPH and GSH/GSSG ratios remain unaffected. Our results reveal a new, intriguing aspect of cancer cell biology and highlight the benefits of fenofibrate as a supplement to both canonical and dietary (ketogenic) therapeutic approaches against glioblastoma.
Click to expand...

Of ocourse, given the state of medical science this has to be taken with a grain of salt. Also I was unable to get the full text. I'll try to contact one of the authors ...
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Anybody know anything about this product line Keto OS (operating system)? I'm guessing it's just expensive MCT oil. Sorry if it's already been discussed. I did a quick search and nothing came up.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

genero81 said:
Anybody know anything about this product line Keto OS (operating system)? I'm guessing it's just expensive MCT oil. Sorry if it's already been discussed. I did a quick search and nothing came up.
Click to expand...

I didn't see anything about it having already been discussed either, but from the information presented here it looks interesting. The ingredients are MCT Powder, Beta Hydroxybutyrate, Natural Flavor, Malic Acid, Stevia, and Caffeine. If one were looking for a way to increase their ketone production without being on a ketogenic diet this looks like a good product. But $144 for 30 servings is pretty steep, and better results would be gleaned from becoming keto-adapted and adjusting the diet for higher ketone production.

Were you thinking of trying it out or recommending it to someone?
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Interesting article by Nora Gedgaudas

Low Carb, Higher Fat Approach To Eating Bad For Mice, NOT Humans
By Nora Gedgaudas, CNS, NTP, BCHN

An article titled “Paleo diets = weight gain” released through the University of Melbourne has hit the mainstream press in no small way. In it, researchers are extolling the virtues of their new mouse study being used to decry low carbohydrate/high fat Paleo diets as “causing weight gain” and leading to other adverse metabolic changes leading to diabetes and other related symptoms.

In the ill-conceived but much ballyhooed study, two groups of overweight mice with pre-diabetes symptoms were split into separate groups. One group was placed on a low-carbohydrate (20%), high-fat (60%) diet (LCHF) supposedly “similar” to certain Paleo diets. The other group remained on their normal diet.

After eight weeks, the group on the LCHF diet gained more weight, their glucose intolerance worsened and their insulin levels rose. They gained 15 per cent of their body weight and their fat mass doubled from two per cent to almost four per cent.

Researchers pretended to be surprised that what they referred to as the “Paleo approach” didn’t help, and seemed to make the diabetic mice worse. This news made headlines everywhere in Australia where the Paleo diet has been gaining some real traction in recent years.

But is this study really an indictment of low carbohydrate, higher fat Paleo approaches to eating in humans… Or is it really just a carefully orchestrated attempt to stop a growing trend toward improved health and away from corporate industrial profits?

There is so much wrong with this study it is hard to know where to start. If this wasn’t a blatant effort to intentionally smear the growing low-carb and Paleo movement, then at the very least someone who should have known better wasn’t thinking or paying attention.

For starters, the only way to fairly judge the effects of an ancestral diet on a mouse is to feed that mouse its own “ancestral diet”— not a human ancestral diet, which in truth bears no resemblance to the natural diet of a mouse.

But the real kicker here is the fact that the diet that the mice were eating doesn’t even come close to replicating– in any manner shape, or form–any manner of Paleo or ketogenic aproach to diet I would recommend to my worst enemy. What did the mice’s supposed LCHF daily diet consist of?

Cocoa butter (the mice’s primary source of fat. Really? As much as many Paleophiles love a bit of dark chocolate here and there, I have yet to meet one that uses cocoa butter as their primary fat source.)

Canola oil (a GMO, highly processed, typically partially hydrogenated or interesterified industrial vegetable fat that depletes the body of vitamin E and has so many inherent problems associated with it–including the generation of heart lesions—it does not even deserve to be listed as any sort of “food”. Canola oil is ANYTHING but “Paleo”.)

Casein (THE primary source of animal protein in this study—already known in numerous animal studies to have adverse effects—in fact casein was the animal protein conveniently used to disparage the health effects of animal protein in the massively flawed pro-vegetarian tome, ‘The China Study’ by T. Collin Campbell. Casein is a poorly digested and commonly antigenic protein found in cow’s milk—not anywhere on the LCHF Primal menu I promote in any way).

Sucrose – Yes, you read right. Refined sugar was on the overweight, pre-diabetic mice’s supposedly “low carb” menu! The combination of sugar and fat is always very, very bad… Which is one reason why sugar is nearly always eliminated in LCHF diets. To paraphrase professor, researcher and biochemist, Dr. Richard Feinman, the deleterious effects of fat have always been measured in the presence of sugar/starch. Which is probably why they added it, frankly.

Clarified butter fat (ghee). Again, we’re probably not talking about 100% grass-fed sources here. And ghee also contains other potentially antigenic trace dairy proteins, including casein.
Cellulose (a.k.a., fiber. From where who knows. Could even be wood pulp or cardboard. They don’t specify. But I digress.)

Calcium carbonate – literally the most worthless, least bioavailable form of calcium available. Known to be associated with arterial and coronary calcification in actual humans, btw.

AIN93G vitamins (anyone’s guess as to what that specifically means, and from what sources. Given the menu so far I wouldn’t guess the sources are organic and non-synthetic)

Potassium dihydrogen phosphate (inorganic and poorly bioavailable at best)

DL-Methionine (What is it? “The starting materials for production of DL-methionine are acrolein (a 3-carbon aldehyde) derived from propylene (a petroleum derivative), methyl mercaptan derived from methanol and various sulfur sources and hydrocyanic acid (HCN). Acrolein and methyl mercaptan are reacted to form a relatively stable intermediate, 3-methylmercaptopropionaldehyde, known as MMP. The MMP is then reacted with HCN to form a rudimentary mix of DL-methionine and contaminants which is further refined through clean-up steps.”

Sodium chloride (Pure sodium chloride was shown in one study to massively up-regulate IL-17 inflammatory pathways— an alarming recent finding. Nowhere in the diet I promote is refined salt on any “approved” list.

Potassium citrate (ummm…ok)

Choline chloride (a synthetic-source B-vitamin)

Potassium sulfate (Inorganic and poorly bioavailable. And why are there three sources of potassium—with only one that isn’t 100% inorganic and poorly utilizable?)

AIN93G trace minerals (again—what minerals…and from where? We are left to guess. I’m afraid to.)

THIS is the diet that supposedly proves a low carbohydrate/higher fat approach to eating is dangerous. I wish I were kidding.

There are ample HUMAN studies clearly extolling the considerable benefits of low carbohydrate, moderate protein and higher percentage fat “Paleo-oriented” diets in the existing literature. In fact, an article coming out of the UK in December featured a story about a nine year old Type 1 diabetic boy that came off of the need for insulin entirely following a fat-based, low-carb Paleo-oriented ketogenic diet. The article, based on a study published in the International Journal of Case Reports and Images stated: “After 19 months, the child is still on the Paleolithic ketogenic diet, and the researchers report it can ensure normoglycemia without the use of external insulin. No side effects or complications were observed, and the researchers stress the diet is sustainable in the long-term. They wrote: “We opine that the Paleolithic ketogenic diet ensures normal glucose levels and can be maintained on the long-term in those patients with newly diagnosed T1DM with residual insulin secretion.”

In the comment section of the article, a mother by the name of Beth McNally had the following to share, “Our 9 year old son was diagnosed in Canada in early Sept 2015. He was on the standard high carb diet and required insulin injections. In early November, 8 weeks after he was diagnosed we switched him to a Low Carb/High Fat diet, essentially a Keto/Paleo diet and he has been off insulin ever since. His blood sugars are stable even postprandial they rarely go above a 6.0 mmol/l. He has gained weight and grown in height since November. No hypo moments as he is not being administered any exogenous insulin. We hope to keep this going for as long as we can.”

Co-author of the research study, Csaba Tóth, MD had the following to add, “This is far beyond Honeymoon. Currently he is on the diet for 22 months. Almost 2 years. Actually “Honeyyears”. Note that the stimulated C peptid was in the normal range. In our previous case study C peptid increased within two months. This is the case in several our T1DM patients who are also on the diet but not yet published their case. Otherwise, on the standard diabetes diet, C peptid continue to decline after diagnosis. At two years the level of C peptide is typically about zero. Our data indicate halted autoimmune process.”

I, too have received countless emails and other reports from fans of my work over the years citing similar positive benefits as a result of adopting the fat-based ketogenic approach I promote in Primal Body, Primal Mind across a wide range of metabolic and other diseases. The list decidedly includes positive effects in those having type 1 & 2 diabetes, obesity, cardiovascular disease, autoimmunity, mood-related and/or cognitive/neurological issues and far more.

For that matter, anyone attending a Paleo event can tell you based on cursory observation that these are (at least on the surface of things) overall some of the healthiest looking people anyone would ever want to see— with the exception of those that are in the earlier stages of adopting this approach and still working toward reclaiming their health. Even the overweight people you run into at these events will typically tell you how much weight they have already lost, and how much better they feel and function following this dietary change.

The Paleo dietary approach has gained quite a bit of press in recent years and is unnerving the food industry, Big Agribusiness and other corporate interests that profit handsomely from a populace eating a carbohydrate-dominated diet. Low carb, fat-based versions of this are really rocking some boats. Let’s just say there’s a vested interest in making LCHF Paleo/Primal— and those promoting it— look as bad as possible. If Paleo/Primal wins, multinational industrial corporate profits lose.

Even if the diet fed to these mice in the Melbourne study consisted of actual food, mice are largely herbivorous creatures (read: naturally eat a high carb diet) and are poorly equipped to make much use of significant dietary fat. Dr. John Briffa wrote an excellent article titled, “Why Human, Not Mice, Studies are the Most Appropriate for Judging the Effects of Diet on Human Health” following a similarly ridiculous mouse study a few years ago. In it he points put that “these researchers chose an inappropriate animal model to test their theory on, and then fed the animals an inappropriate diet to boot. These actions suggest that the researchers were doing what they could to design an experiment to produce a desired outcome.” Dr. Briffa also added, “Such diets [LCHF] generally give better results for weight loss than, say, low fat diets. They also tend to be extremely useful in the management of diabetes and metabolic syndrome. Also, even for those not afflicted by these conditions, they usually lead to changes in physiological and biochemical parameters that are associated with a reduced risk of heart disease such as lower levels of blood sugar and blood fats (triglycerides) as well as higher levels of ‘healthy’ high density lipoprotein (HDL) cholesterol. In my view, anyone with a special interest in the field of nutrition would have to be unaware of the research or choose to ignore it not to admit to the broad merit in lower-carb eating for human health.”

The glossy, front-page Technicolor emphasis on this one puny mouse study in Australia should have anyone with a modicum of discernment smelling a rat. It is pure garbage. The fact that they disparagingly—and very specifically mentioned “celebrity chefs” in the article tells you everything you need to know about the motives. Efforts by celebrity chef, Pete Evans to positively impact the health of Australians with a low carb, more fat-based Paleo-oriented message (largely based on Primal Body, Primal Mind) have ruffled more than a few feathers among mainsteam dietary dictocrats there. It is also clearly changing the way Australians are eating, to Industry’s/mainstream diet authorities’ considerable chagrin.

I have a question for anyone reading this: if the results of the study were opposite would this story be equally publicized in the front-page news? No way. In fact, there have been innumerable studies—human studies— including large meta-analyses human studies clearly demonstrating the exact opposite conclusions of this mouse study… but where is the glossy mainstream fanfare or even basic acknowledgment? The Melbourne mouse “study” wasn’t remotely designed to lead to any success associated with the LCHF dietary approach whatsoever (much less Paleo). The idea that the researchers “expected things to improve and were shocked when they didn’t” is an out and out lie. It’s all a ridiculous, orchestrated sham. Or it isn’t orchestrated, then the scientists involved didn’t even really know what they were doing.

What did the mouse study manage to prove? That mice are not designed to thrive on canola oil, casein and refined table sugar…any more than we are.

We all need to exercise discernment when hyped up stories like this get mainstream press. I say we move on and focus on what works best for humans. And let’s face it, if the Paleo diet didn’t work for us, we wouldn’t be here in the first place.

~ Nora Gedgaudas, CNS, NTP, BCHN
Click to expand...

Link
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

A Jay said:
genero81 said:
Anybody know anything about this product line Keto OS (operating system)? I'm guessing it's just expensive MCT oil. Sorry if it's already been discussed. I did a quick search and nothing came up.
Click to expand...

I didn't see anything about it having already been discussed either, but from the information presented here it looks interesting. The ingredients are MCT Powder, Beta Hydroxybutyrate, Natural Flavor, Malic Acid, Stevia, and Caffeine. If one were looking for a way to increase their ketone production without being on a ketogenic diet this looks like a good product. But $144 for 30 servings is pretty steep, and better results would be gleaned from becoming keto-adapted and adjusting the diet for higher ketone production.

Were you thinking of trying it out or recommending it to someone?
Click to expand...

I was just thinking it might be more convenient than making fat bombs but I decided it wouldn't be worth the extra money. At least not right now.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Rhythmik said:
Has anyone debunked this study?

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2989112/

Low-carbohydrate diets and all-cause and cause-specific mortality: Two cohort Studies
Click to expand...

I don't recall any specific debunking of that article. However, their database does raise an alarm:

_http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2989112/

Setting

Nurses' Health Study and Health Professionals' Follow-up Study
Click to expand...

About the Nurses Health Study:

_https://thebigfatsurprise.com/critique-dean-ornish-op-ed/
Any and all lifestyle variables confound these studies, including many that are not measured (for example, the Nurses Health Study, which is the biggest epidemiological study in the US, cannot accurately measure sugar consumption—and therefore cannot control for it.). Moreover, these studies rely on self-reporting of the diet, which has been demonstrated to be highly unreliable. And there are other problems with epidemiological findings, particularly with regard to red meat (see page 108-111 and 261-266 in The Big Fat Surprise, or this article in the New York Times by Gary Taubes). These fundamental structural problems in epidemiology are the reason that their findings have only a 0-20% chance of being right when tested in clinical trials, according to an analysis from Stanford University.
Click to expand...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom