"Life Without Bread"

[Gawan]

I'm doing much better know, more energy. Still a little bit nauseated and week on the legs, but better than 2 days before. My body is now also in a much higher ketosis, especially in the evening I have the certain mouth-feeling.

 

[Thor]

...
Diarrhea once or twice a day, and occasional intestinal cramps are still with me due to upping Vit C and Mag probably, but at least this mostly keeps the constipation away. Once the colon problems are remedied, I probably will weigh at least 10 lbs less when all the gunk comes out. I have noticed all my clothes are looser.
It smells like bad/old stuff is coming out in the bowels, but not all at once. I might have to do this enema thing. I am guessing that back in May when I was stressed out with preparations to move, I was lowering carbs and having a lot of protein, but not enough fat, and this may have been the start of the constipation problem along with still eating a goodly amount of veggies. (Now I realize I should not have started a dietary change when stressed out, reading this recently in the New Atkins.)

SolarMother, I can highly recommend the coffee enema and in particular while transiting to the new diet. Not only does it help to get the clear out what's in the bowels but I have also found that on the days when my energy is very low and I do the enema it is as if my fatigue lifts considerably. I noticed this after it had been happening for at couple of days and can now say that it is a consistent result. I'm guessing that the transition to a high-fat low-carb diet puts some additional stress on the liver and gall bladder's detox capabilities and the detox enema helps in making those work better.

 

[Jefferson]

I dropped carbs mid April (with gluten, dairy, sugar, caffeine dropped already last year) and have still not gone into ketosis according to the test which showing levels of more than 4mmol/l but not as high any higher than 6-8mmol/l according to the color.

Jefferson, I don't know whether I understood you correctly, but do you mean to say that your test is showing 4mmol/L? If so, that, according to my bottle, is already a state of ketosis.

Hi Gertrudes,
Yes my test is showing somewhere around 4-6mmol/l, and I too thought that would be ketosis as I have strictly eaten protein and lots of good lard, duck fat, ghee, and coconut oil, with limited carbs for 3 months.

However Redfox mentioned when I first posted my test results of 4-6mmol/l:

I assume this means I am without doubt burning ketones?

My understanding is this means you are producing ketones, but have yet to start fully utilising them (your cells are in transition to burning ketones).
Once you go fully into ketosis, your score on the urine test will drop to almost nothing as all the ketones are being used up before they can be excreted.

So I pose the question, what is the mmol/l level that shows one is in ketosis? Does a low mmol/l level show one is in ketosis or a high mmol/l level?

I think I have to read the books a bit more carefully. Or forget the urine test altogether

Jefferson

 

[Jefferson]

How much carbs are you getting in average per day? Are you getting enough protein and fat?

In the first month I aimed for the 72g per day , but was likely between 70-100g depending on the day, then I learned more about amounts of carbs in certain foods and in second month I was below 72g. Since the end of June I have some days eaten closer to 10g of carbs per day, and at highest 50g per day.

I have eaten quite a bit of saturated fat and protein, even though I haven't counted the amount, but enough to keep me feeling satisfied.

So I am doing things according to the book, but I just want some confirmation that I am heading in the right direction. I will stick to my goal of keeping carbs very low.


Jefferson

 

[Mr. Premise]

SolarMother, I can highly recommend the coffee enema and in particular while transiting to the new diet. Not only does it help to get the clear out what's in the bowels but I have also found that on the days when my energy is very low and I do the enema it is as if my fatigue lifts considerably. I noticed this after it had been happening for at couple of days and can now say that it is a consistent result. I'm guessing that the transition to a high-fat low-carb diet puts some additional stress on the liver and gall bladder's detox capabilities and the detox enema helps in making those work better.

I think that the lifting of fatigue you're feeling is more likely from the caffeine you're absorbing!

 

[dugdeep]

I dropped carbs mid April (with gluten, dairy, sugar, caffeine dropped already last year) and have still not gone into ketosis according to the test which showing levels of more than 4mmol/l but not as high any higher than 6-8mmol/l according to the color.

Jefferson, I don't know whether I understood you correctly, but do you mean to say that your test is showing 4mmol/L? If so, that, according to my bottle, is already a state of ketosis.

Hi Gertrudes,
Yes my test is showing somewhere around 4-6mmol/l, and I too thought that would be ketosis as I have strictly eaten protein and lots of good lard, duck fat, ghee, and coconut oil, with limited carbs for 3 months.

However Redfox mentioned when I first posted my test results of 4-6mmol/l:

I assume this means I am without doubt burning ketones?

My understanding is this means you are producing ketones, but have yet to start fully utilising them (your cells are in transition to burning ketones).
Once you go fully into ketosis, your score on the urine test will drop to almost nothing as all the ketones are being used up before they can be excreted.

So I pose the question, what is the mmol/l level that shows one is in ketosis? Does a low mmol/l level show one is in ketosis or a high mmol/l level?

I think I have to read the books a bit more carefully. Or forget the urine test altogether

Jefferson

Hi Jefferson. I think it's more than likely you are in ketosis. Unfortunately, the urine test can only show that we're making ketones, it can't determine whether or not we're burning them. But if you're not eating much in the way of carbs (and it sounds like you're not) and you're producing ketones, which the sticks say you are, you're probably burning them too. Otherwise you would likely be extremely fatigued; maybe unconscious!

Everyone is different, so you may end up with more residual ketones in your urine than others do. I don't think this is a big deal. If you start to get up over 8mmol/L, then it might be time for concern (although I think this is unlikely unless you're type 1 diabetic).

 

[Gertrudes]

So I pose the question, what is the mmol/l level that shows one is in ketosis? Does a low mmol/l level show one is in ketosis or a high mmol/l level?

Hi Jefferson,

If my understanding is correct, I think that means that you are indeed in ketosis, although Redfox is also right, in that your ketones will no longer be noticeable in the test once you are fully adapted.
From what I recall reading it does take some time (perhaps a couple of months?) for your body to adjust and start producing the right amount of ketones so that there isn't excess expelled through urine, which is, right now, what is being accused in your test.

My ketone stick is now accusing large amounts, although I haven't yet experienced any of the body odor nor bad breath issues others have mentioned.

Edit: Just noticed dugdeep's response, we must have posted at roughly the same time

 

[Renaissance]

I was thinking to make a vegetable broth to ensure that I get some nutrients.

You might want to consider a bone and/or organ meat broth instead (add some salt). No carbs and as many nutrients as the vegetable one (plus lots of fat from the bone marrow).

Thanks, RedFox - that's a good idea. I hadn't thought of that. Unfortunately, I won't be able to get organic bones today from the organic butcher but if this persists I will get some tomorrow.

Increasing your dose of Vit. C can help too while on the DMSA detox.

 

[Gertrudes]

Everyone is different, so you may end up with more residual ketones in your urine than others do. I don't think this is a big deal. If you start to get up over 8mmol/L, then it might be time for concern (although I think this is unlikely unless you're type 1 diabetic).

Would that be considered approaching ketoacidosis? I should be at about 8mmol/L right now, although I'm not diabetic.

 

[Gaby]

Are we still recommending fish oil supplementation? I remember some questions were raised about it so I stopped it for a while.

Well, these guys recommend it because, as they point out, most meat is too high on the 6s due to grain feeding of cattle. I'd say it wouldn't hurt to take one or two a day or so.

It seems that the issue has risen when it comes from eating junk food along your omega 3s. If you have saturated fats, your omega 3s will be much happier.

 

[RedFox]

Just wanted to add a small point of data. I've been struggling to reach the point where my energy is back again, and decided to do the full EE program every night so far this week, which seems to have really made a big difference/shifted something.
I had my first nights sleep (in months - despite sleeping in total darkness) where I experienced first/second sleep and that blissful state in between (which suggests my brain chemicals had been out of balance until then?).

 

[Gaby]

Most members keeping up with this thread are more than ready to go into ketoadaptation and experiment to see what is their carb intake in order to stay in fat burning mode. But although if some experts have positive and solid experience dealing with patients with delicate health issues, I still feel the need to mention a word of caution.

Some of the symptoms of a strict carb restriction are really not suitable for those of you who are VERY sick and are starting a low carb diet after a lifetime of eating junk food. I'm referring mainly to those of you who have had a heart attack or are dealing with an ischemic cardiovascular disease and probably even had a surgery because of that. Cardiovascular disease here refers to diseases leading to ischemic (lack of blood flow) strokes or heart attacks.

I know for a fact and actually seen it over and over again that any stress to the body can trigger a disaster and strict restriction of carbs after a lifetime on a high carb diet qualifies as stressful. That doesn't mean these people can't do the diet, on the contrary, only this diet would address and heal the problem. But I think that Lutz' approach in Life Without Bread is the safest for these cases. He explains a more gradual transition to a low carb diet. Actually, a combination of Lutz approach while doing the "ultrasimple diet" might be the best in order to detoxify and eliminate food sensitivities. In other words, doing the elimination diet while restricting the amounts of carbs to 110 grams for a 2-3 months before undertaking further restrictions. A person will already be switching to a higher fat diet during the transition period after the first week of the elimination diet. The period of adaptation is gentler this way and the liver plus whole body, can adjust gently while still doing some detoxing.

Most of us have already made dietary changes, eliminating gluten and processed foods which is already a big plus. Again, the concern above refers mainly to those on a SAD diet (standard American diet) with an ischemic disease and who are planning to do this diet.

I'm thinking that those who don't have cardiovascular disease will probably address all their food sensitivities issues with the "Atkins" diet because if it heals leaky gut and eliminates most (if not all ) sources of food allergens (which usually comes from carbs), they might find no need for the "ultrasimple" diet. Probably experimenting with the elimination of some foods will still be in order, with the understanding that evil foods are not welcomed in the diet (gluten, MSG, alcohol, etc.).

Here is the relevant information from Life Without Bread:

Blood Clots

Animal fat that contains abundant saturated fatty acids has certain effects on the body's clotting system. This seems to be connected, on the one hand, with the heparin requirements (a protein that inhibits clotting of the blood) and, on the other, the formation of the clotting enzymes. The occurrence of thrombosis in occasional instances of a too-rapid changeover to a low-carbohydrate diet might be due to the state of starvation in which the body finds itself—expecting carbohydrates, for which it is prepared, it instead receives fat and protein, for which it is not immediately equipped, or not ready to handle in high quantity.

Thrombosis often occurs in stressful situations. For example, there is a tendency for thrombosis to occur following surgical procedures, childbirth, and severe physical exertion. Likewise, the changeover to the genetically correct diet of high fat and protein can be a stressful situation to the body. And the bigger the change, the greater the stress.

Those who are reducing their carbohydrate intake from, say, 40 percent down to 72 grams per day (10 to 20 percent of total calories) will experience fewer problems than those who have been consuming 80 percent of their daily calories as carbohydrates. The same holds true for age and existing health conditions. Thus, the people who eat the most carbohydrate often are the ones who have the most health problems, so they would naturally experience the most difficult transition, just as a person addicted to the highest dose of a drug will have the most difficulty in the early stages of reducing the drug.

Dr. Robert Atkins was accused of provoking heart attacks with his low-carbohydrate diet back in the early 1970s, and he was even invited to a hearing of the U.S. Senate because of it. In principle, Atkins's diet is the same as ours; however, his suggested procedure radically differs from the one used by us: Atkins initially withdrew all carbohydrates and relaxed the restriction afterward, whereas we never go below 6 BUs (72 grams of carbohydrates) out of caution, and hold the reins rather more loosely at the beginning. We don't know just how many heart attacks have been caused by the zero-calorie diets that became popular a few years ago. We do know that every sudden change in the body raises the blood-clotting tendency and can therefore elicit a clot at an already damaged place in the circulatory system, hence a catastrophe. Our low-carbohydrate program is by far the safest and most effective. We are confident in saying this because it is based on data from thousands of patients with diseases who have been treated by Dr. Lutz since the late 1950s.

Even if other authors have 0 incidences of heart attacks in the strictest and sudden restriction of carbs and on the contrary, see only benefits, I see no need for unnecessary potential and unpleasant surprises. As a heart surgeon I saw enough of miscellaneous stressful situations causing disastrous events, so this advice really does sound very sensible.

One could exclude from dietary treatment those individuals whose age places them at increased risk for heart attacks (men over fifty and women over sixty), but that would not be doing them a favor, since they would be barred from a fundamental healing of their illness. Only a low-carbohydrate lifestyle is capable of putting a stop to arteriosclerosis and, therefore, to subsequent heart attacks.

People who are overweight with a sedentary lifestyle, who have diabetes, high blood pressure, or heart problems, should ease into carbohydrate restriction (e.g., beginning with 9 BUs [108 grams of net carbs]) and only try to reach the desired 6 BUs over a few months. If you have any of these conditions, we urge you to be completely up front with your physician about your desire to begin a low-carbohydrate program. The intention should be that you work together to observe the results. Some intermediate medications may be necessary during the transition, such as blood-thinning agents like aspirin or coumarin. If you're taking cholesterol-lowering drugs, you will probably find that you're able to slowly reduce the amount taken as your health improves. These drugs are not particularly useful anyway, since low cholesterol is not a good marker for heart disease, and they suppress the levels of CoQ 10.

Unfortunately, there are some people whose health is already compromised to the point of no return. If nothing is done, they have a heart attack; if something is done, the attack can occur through side effects of the low-carbohydrate treatment, as discussed above.

 

[Gawan]

Everyone is different, so you may end up with more residual ketones in your urine than others do. I don't think this is a big deal. If you start to get up over 8mmol/L, then it might be time for concern (although I think this is unlikely unless you're type 1 diabetic).

Would that be considered approaching ketoacidosis? I should be at about 8mmol/L right now, although I'm not diabetic.

I read a few days back something about it, alas I can't remember where. But ketoacidosis can only be happening to diabetics (diabetics Type I and also some of Type II, according to Dr. Bernstein, who almost lost all insulin producing cells (beta-cells)). It happens due to no insulin is available anymore that normally puts the sugar into cells. The body starts in a really bad ketoacidosis to "eat" it's own organs, dehydrates the body/brain due to the kidneys are trying to get rid of the ketones and it is combined with a very high blood-sugar (from ≥350 mg/dl). So actually I wouldn't be too worried when you are still producing insulin, nonetheless keeping up the guard is still recommended.

 

[anart]

For those struggling with the low carb diet adaption. I had the major depression, the anger, the total lack of energy for almost two weeks - and then I went seriously low carb. I went four days with less than 15 carbs per day (three of those days I had zero carbs) - felt horrible (especially in mood), then, the fifth day in the late afternoon it felt like I was on rocket fuel! This is the sixth day and I don't even know what to do with this much energy - it is that noticeable!

It's really astonishing - just bursting with energy, my mind is clear and quick and I think my vision is even clearer - it's bizarre! So - hang in there and do NOT give in to those sweet cravings! It only took me four days of extreme low carbs (of course this was after years on the diet, following the forum threads as we all went along experimenting) - but once I went really low carb, only four and a half days or so, then - a pronounced shift.

So - don't give up - lots of water, lots of potassium, lots of fat and lots of vitamin C water with salt and the bad times do pass. Of course, if the energy surge is only temporary, then I'll let you know that too (crossing my fingers that's not the case...). Even if it stabilizes a bit from this energy high, I'll still be away ahead of where I was when I wasn't watching carb intake at all. I'm going to slowly increase my carb intake - no more than 20 a day for another week or so and then I'll go up to 40 and see where things are.

 

[Keit]

Thanks, anart, for sharing.

I also was on a low carb diet for a while (though while still eating sweet potatoes soaked in fat) and my stomach and mood were a mess until I started taking digestive enzymes, then it became much better. The energy levels then were really high, clear head too. Though I was really craving sweets and actually fantasizing how on my birthday I was going to buy organic chocolate and treat myself! But then, the thread about low carbs progressed, and it was clear that if I would do it, it would break the process, not to mention causing couple of days of fogginess. So the chocolate plan had to be ditched (it was really hard!) and substituted with an organic almond butter (3.5 carbs in 100g). There were no overt symptoms, but who knows. Almond butter is going to be reserved to rare and festive occasions only anyway.

But it kind of switched when I eliminated carbs completely or almost completely (5 carbs a day) for several days. It coincided with my period, so this could be the main contributor to the fatigue (I even lack breath after climbing stairs on the way home!) and fogginess, not to mentioned bleak and morose thoughts, and depression. Even don't have enough energy to be pissed off properly. ;) Hope it will improve eventually. Now increased the carbs till maybe 10-12 tops, but still have fatigue.

Still have sometimes thoughts about sweets but they are just thoughts, no actions taken. ;) It is also possible that the low mood and possible candida die off due to carb restriction contributes to sweet craving, or wanting something comforting. Try to push through it and keep in mind that this too will pass!

And yes, I drink so much water these days, it's unbelievable.