No Longer Interested in Sex

Iron said:
I understood your sentence as not willing to look at the issue. Or at least not considering all possibilities. Since others have pointed other possibilities than seeing the feeding aspect of sex and no reply of yours about trying to see if some of these possibilities is true, I assumed that you were stuck at this thought.

But I did post about looking into other possibilities - beginning with the book "Cupid's Poisoned Arrow"! I also posted the possibility of menopausal hormones affecting me, but pointed out that I may be close to menopause but not yet seeing many symptoms.

Now I understand you. Perhaps it was not really your fault. Maybe its me how should have read with more attention.

Sometimes it can be difficult to communicate through the written word alone, much nuance is lost! I am glad to have cleared up this much at least.

Iron said:
FireShadow said:
Yes, those vedas may be corrupted or they may reflect a piece of truth.

Depends on whether or not the theory of 2 kinds of sex is accurate. If it is, the truth would depend on what kind of sex you are engaging in - fertilization/orgasm-based sex that feeds the Lizzies/physicality and keeps us firmly rooted in physicality/feeding cycles or bonding-based sex with facilitates enlightenment/increased intimacy.

I agree with you, that the mode of sex can be of feeding the STS chain, and that with effort and knowledge perhaps can transform itself in something more sublime.

FireShadow said:
If there is only one choice and it is fertilization/orgasm-based/feeding sex, perhaps coming to a place where you are repulsed is part of a process.

In pondering your words and my reply, it occurred to me that my repulsion seems related to recently being able to really see (as opposed to just knowing about) the "feeding-behavior" aspect of sex. I have only recently been able to see that aspect as I was very entranced by the hedonism for so long. I am thinking that upon first sight, it is repulsive. I am not aware of any guilt feelings, I don't really regret much of my past, I learned a lot from it.

The part were I dont agree is on the dopamine/orgasm being the reason why couples stay longer or not. Perhaps I would have to read the book, but it seems to me a very weak explanation. It fails to take into account narcissism, the emotional wounds that each partner sustains, their own reactive programming.
Many things more are under a relationship than just dopamine highs and lows. Perhaps those dopamine highs and lows are different in people less narcissic, in other words tending more to the STO side of things?
The problem with basing observation solely on the physiology of the body, is that for many process it is just the endpoint.
Many other things happen before this endpoint, and since the ongoing discoveries that the mind controls more process to the genetic level than was thought before, I think that avoiding orgasms = to longer relationships is a somewhat shallow reasoning for me at the moment.

Not saying that you agree 100% with the authors of the Cupid's poisoned arrow, just trying to show you a different view, and to try not to toss the baby out with the bathwater in this sex issue.
The thinking of many is rather black and white in this issue.
Either you must have it, and have it now, in the worst way, or you shouldnt have it, never, yuck!

I think reading the book is a good idea as she goes into the details of this very complex issue. No, she does not talk of the other issues of relationship - that is outside the scope of the book.

However, in my previous training as addiction counselor, I can say that what she describes fits in well with the previously known aspects of the addictive cycle. And, it was known to us (counbselors) that to really determine the underlying issues of emotions/psychology, it was necessary to get clear of the addictive cycle and balance the neurochemistry before a true analysis of those other issues was possible. The chemistry can cause someone to mimic several other disorders.

And, the information fits in well with much of what the C's and Laura have said (see thread on book review of "Cupid's Poisoned Arrow" - http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=21030.0 as I have recently added more quotes from my studies).

And, I think I am taking the emotional/psychological issues under consideration as in this post:

Add these factors to my "issues" of abandonment and feelings of not being loved that I developed during a dysfunctional/abusive childhood, I can now see why it was so very hard for me to work through these issues in my past. The biology seemed to have intensely exacerbated my emotional issues. I do wish I had known then what I know now! But, at least I do have the information now - better late than never.

Now it is the time for testing this new information - without dismissing it as shallow reasoning.

I thank you for taking the time to answer this post in a so gentle manner.
And still one of the most important thing you are doing, that is to discuss with your Husband! I salute you for that... shows concern!
And for trying a alternative even feeling strongly against it... whatever you two learn don't forget to post it.

Not a problem! It is good to question.
 
wanderer33 said:
Well, Fireshadow after reading all you've said on the matter, I understand exactly where you are coming from. After I'd read what your thoughts were and how you felt about relationships vs sex. I thought I'd written it. I agree with and understand your view. I don't think you need any help. I think you are enlightened.

Although if you remain in a relationship, its going to be difficult if your partner continues to have urges. After my last relationship which I have written about on these forums, I decided to never again enter into a sexual relationship. I'm OK with that as I really have lost the urge to indulge. Even thinking about having sex at my age makes me cringe with....uuuummm....its absurd.

I've got nothing left to prove. I've produced three sons who are all academics and since September, I'm a grandfather. If I want to get creative, I'll do it in another way, write, paint, make music or whatever. I'm over it. The idea of people having sex at my age makes me laugh.

In support of this unpopular or odd view, the vedas suggests that people should retire from sex life after 50 and contemplate their lives and concentrate on further spiritual growth. That's why getting old is a valuable time. Enjoy it and don't feel guilty.

Not sure how enlightened I am! I think I am just in a process and am not sure where it will lead. I do think I am on the right track as many things seem to be "coming together", but we will see.

Yes, the relationship issue is the thing. We are working on it best we can. At least we can talk about it and that is a big part, I think. And, perhaps experimenting with Karezza will be a solution for both of us.
 
FireShadow said:
wanderer33 said:
Well, Fireshadow after reading all you've said on the matter, I understand exactly where you are coming from. After I'd read what your thoughts were and how you felt about relationships vs sex. I thought I'd written it. I agree with and understand your view. I don't think you need any help. I think you are enlightened.

Although if you remain in a relationship, its going to be difficult if your partner continues to have urges. After my last relationship which I have written about on these forums, I decided to never again enter into a sexual relationship. I'm OK with that as I really have lost the urge to indulge. Even thinking about having sex at my age makes me cringe with....uuuummm....its absurd.

I've got nothing left to prove. I've produced three sons who are all academics and since September, I'm a grandfather. If I want to get creative, I'll do it in another way, write, paint, make music or whatever. I'm over it. The idea of people having sex at my age makes me laugh.

In support of this unpopular or odd view, the vedas suggests that people should retire from sex life after 50 and contemplate their lives and concentrate on further spiritual growth. That's why getting old is a valuable time. Enjoy it and don't feel guilty.

Not sure how enlightened I am! I think I am just in a process and am not sure where it will lead. I do think I am on the right track as many things seem to be "coming together", but we will see.

Yes, the relationship issue is the thing. We are working on it best we can. At least we can talk about it and that is a big part, I think. And, perhaps experimenting with Karezza will be a solution for both of us.

Hello FireShadow! I am back online again after the chaos of the Holidaze is finally over! Good to get away from the internet for some time too. Your thread is one of the few I am able to stay up to date on, and it sure is an interesting one--and yes, the devil sure is in the details! :evil: It is sometimes quite difficult to get oneself across just by writing online. You have done very well, IMO! I am guessing that not all of what you have been saying was read by the last few posters, but it got cleared up nevertheless. There was that separate thread on Cupids P Arrow that I missed.
I resonate with what wanderer33 said above. Maybe he is around my age, but I had to laugh (hard) when he said the idea of people having sex at his age makes him laugh! :lol: It is funny to me too. At the same time, I have had two nights in a row with sexual dreams--strong ones, and I am now feeling that those dreams were "planted," as it were, by 4D STS to throw me off track for a bit. This happens every once in a while, and I am not sure why, except that it might be part of getting free of very strong programs!
I wake up feeling those old, strong sexual urges and at the same time that I am being food for 4D STS- it takes me a few hours to get out of the feeling of the dream. These dreams were very lusty and hale back to my own promiscuous days. One of them had to do with my hubby's good male friend and I. Waking up it felt so real. Maybe it is that the stronger I get about being authentic or truly myself about sexual programs, the more I seem to get attacked in order to try to pull me back into old ways of being.
Your words, "yes, the relationship issue is the thing..." I think relationship issues will always be there no matter what, and all you can do is work on it, which you are. And sharing your process on the forum is very helpful and very good!
 
SolarMother said:
Hello FireShadow! I am back online again after the chaos of the Holidaze is finally over! Good to get away from the internet for some time too. Your thread is one of the few I am able to stay up to date on, and it sure is an interesting one--and yes, the devil sure is in the details! :evil: It is sometimes quite difficult to get oneself across just by writing online. You have done very well, IMO! I am guessing that not all of what you have been saying was read by the last few posters, but it got cleared up nevertheless. There was that separate thread on Cupids P Arrow that I missed.
I resonate with what wanderer33 said above. Maybe he is around my age, but I had to laugh (hard) when he said the idea of people having sex at his age makes him laugh! :lol: It is funny to me too. At the same time, I have had two nights in a row with sexual dreams--strong ones, and I am now feeling that those dreams were "planted," as it were, by 4D STS to throw me off track for a bit. This happens every once in a while, and I am not sure why, except that it might be part of getting free of very strong programs!
I wake up feeling those old, strong sexual urges and at the same time that I am being food for 4D STS- it takes me a few hours to get out of the feeling of the dream. These dreams were very lusty and hale back to my own promiscuous days. One of them had to do with my hubby's good male friend and I. Waking up it felt so real. Maybe it is that the stronger I get about being authentic or truly myself about sexual programs, the more I seem to get attacked in order to try to pull me back into old ways of being.
Your words, "yes, the relationship issue is the thing..." I think relationship issues will always be there no matter what, and all you can do is work on it, which you are. And sharing your process on the forum is very helpful and very good!

Glad to see you back! Hope the holidaze were enjoyable.

It is interesting that you speak of sexual dreams. Last week, I had one as well - the first in many years (that I remember). I am reminded of when I was an addictions counselor - As people were recovering from their drug/alcohol addictions, they would have what we used to call "using dreams" - almost like a siren song to lure them back to using. They usually happened when the person seemed to really be committing to sobriety. Hmmmm....
 
Glad to see you back! Hope the holidaze were enjoyable.

It is interesting that you speak of sexual dreams. Last week, I had one as well - the first in many years (that I remember). I am reminded of when I was an addictions counselor - As people were recovering from their drug/alcohol addictions, they would have what we used to call "using dreams" - almost like a siren song to lure them back to using. They usually happened when the person seemed to really be committing to sobriety. Hmmmm....

Ahhhh! Yes, Hmmmmm...'using dreams', addiction, siren song, luring...eat, eat, eat! Me, I'm just :knitting: :D
 
Hi SolarMother, it's nice to meet you (in text and thought).

Its coincidental (synchronistic) that you mentioned dreams. For about 6 months I've been having dreams related to relationships. I've had about four of these dreams. They are similar in the following regard; the partner is always a different exquisitely beautiful woman; the relationship is not sexual, its based on embracing affection and close companionship. The partner is very gentle, affectionate, playful, happy, and there is a anarchic sense of viewing the world together. Very strange, but whenever I have one of these dreams, I wake up really happy and thank the universe. Its as if the astral realm is compensating for the relationship that is not available in the real world. That's the feeling I get about it.
 
wanderer33 said:
Hi SolarMother, it's nice to meet you (in text and thought).

Its coincidental (synchronistic) that you mentioned dreams. For about 6 months I've been having dreams related to relationships. I've had about four of these dreams. They are similar in the following regard; the partner is always a different exquisitely beautiful woman; the relationship is not sexual, its based on embracing affection and close companionship. The partner is very gentle, affectionate, playful, happy, and there is a anarchic sense of viewing the world together. Very strange, but whenever I have one of these dreams, I wake up really happy and thank the universe. Its as if the astral realm is compensating for the relationship that is not available in the real world. That's the feeling I get about it.


Nice to meet you too, Wanderer33--
:wow: 4 dreams about the same lady? What is the 'relationship' like with her? What do you do together? Is she your age or young? What age are you in the dreams? Does it feel like a different density (a 4D bleedthrough for instance or a concurrent lifetime?) Just curious! Take care.
 
Losing your sex drive has nothing to do with age. I went through the same experience and I was only 22. It lasted for three years. My Doctor blamed it on depression, and that is true, being depressed does cause loss of sex drive, however, most conventional Doctors just want to write you some prescription and say "problem solved". That does not solve anything, it only masks the problem, and actually makes it worse. It's a rollercoaster ride from there, taking one pill to stop the side effects of the former pill, and so on, it's a vicious cycle.

I wanted so bad for there to be a magic pill that would make me feel normal again, I wanted the easy way out, and I think most people feel the same way for any ailment. The truth is, there is no easy way. It's all hard work and dedication, that's how we heal.

Once I changed my diet, and added some supplements, my sex drive came back. I also noticed that there had been several things wrong with me, it just had become normal for me to feel awful all the time, I had no idea how bad of shape I was actually in!

Now, this is just my personal experience. Just remember to treat your body as a whole. Do the work on all areas and see what happens.
 
SolarMother, no it was four DIFFERENT women, but they all had this similar basic nature. They are young. It is always in slightly different circumstances and places. I don't know what age I am, I think about that when I've awoken, but I can't get a clue about that. They don't feel like past life connections, they may be concurrent life times or as you say 4D bleed throughs. Whatever is the case they are wonderful dreams. The last one was last week. I look forward to them.LOL

Prior to these dreams about two years ago, I had a vivid lucid dream, awake, it just happened. It was like a very clear movie. I was not human and neither was the partner I was with. We existed on another planet, a very large planet, much larger than the earth. Our race had wings and could fly like birds, but they were not feathered wings, more like membranes. These membranes were coloured like opals, with unique scintillating colours. Our bodies were humanoid, but much stronger and to me more beautiful, our faces were humanoid but quite angular with large eyes. We were engaged in a complex mating ritual very high up in the sky, thousands of feet. It began with the female, my partner, holding me in her arms in a foetus position while she hovered. She then tumbled me out of her arms and I fell like a stone for thousands of feet. At some point I spread my wings and glided to break my fall. I then beat my wings and soared up to where she was hovering, waiting. I began to hover with her, beating wings and facing each other. We then commenced an aerial dance, around and around in complex movements. I knew instinctively that this was a precursor to mating. The vision ended soon after. The images remain clear in my memory. I had the impression that this was a future life.
 
jen1221 said:
Losing your sex drive has nothing to do with age. I went through the same experience and I was only 22. It lasted for three years. My Doctor blamed it on depression, and that is true, being depressed does cause loss of sex drive, however, most conventional Doctors just want to write you some prescription and say "problem solved". That does not solve anything, it only masks the problem, and actually makes it worse. It's a rollercoaster ride from there, taking one pill to stop the side effects of the former pill, and so on, it's a vicious cycle.

I wanted so bad for there to be a magic pill that would make me feel normal again, I wanted the easy way out, and I think most people feel the same way for any ailment. The truth is, there is no easy way. It's all hard work and dedication, that's how we heal.

Once I changed my diet, and added some supplements, my sex drive came back. I also noticed that there had been several things wrong with me, it just had become normal for me to feel awful all the time, I had no idea how bad of shape I was actually in!

Now, this is just my personal experience. Just remember to treat your body as a whole. Do the work on all areas and see what happens.

I think there are many possible causes of loss of sex drive, depression and age are only two. Depression does not always cause loss of sex drive (I have suffered from depression on and off my entire life and never lost my sex drive until now), nor apparently does aging (many people continue to have drive well into old age). There are also possible other health issues (illnesses, nutrition, etc) that can cause loss of sex drive - it is a complex issue! There seems to be spiritual (just moving past it, sort of outgrowing it) as well as emotional reasons (previous abuse for example) to lose drive as well.

I am in full agreement as to whether or not to take anti-depressants - NONE for me, thank you. I did try them a few times in the past, but could not bear the nausea and dizziness. I ended up quitting after only a few days each time. I am glad as I have witnessed (in a friend and my mother) the results. Weight gain, leading to diabetes...other symptoms requiring even more medications...etc - seems a vicious cycle to me.

I also agree that one must treat the whole person - body, mind, and spirit.

I still struggle with my diet. I am pretty good about not having any processed foods (no MSG or aspartame!) and have cut sugar way down, but am having trouble letting go of wheat and dairy. I finally ordered "Detoxify or Die" and "The Fat Resistance Diet" today (as recommended by Laura). I also ordered a bottle of DMSO and a bottle (edit: oops, that should be book). I have on my shopping list to get a few supplements - vit C, E, B-complex and some magnesium. I may even try some of that progesterone cream everyone talks about.

I am working on a "work around" my deprivation program, mostly I try making small changes that won't trigger it. It would sure be nice to "crack" that program, but years of effort have not yet resulted in success. Until then, the "work-around" is my only option that I can see. I am hoping I can get to a "critical mass" where I get to a point of cutting enough stuff out that I no longer want those "bad" foods. I noticed that this may be a possibility based on reviews of the two books I ordered...(fingers crossed).
 
FireShadow,

Have you had a chance to look at the revised Detox Diet? If you have the will to get healthier, this is an amazing way to do it. The reason you have problems with dairy and gluten is because they are addictive. Knowing that, and not liking being addicted to things, really helped me to stick to the diet and get off of these evil foods.

I'm hoping that you will do so, too. :)
 
You are not alone.

At almost 58 sex is not as important to me as it once was.

When I was younger I was so charged up (can I say the word horny?) that I would have put a cat in heat to shame :-[

But now, it's really not big deal................there is so much more to concentrate on.

Like what sam heck is going on all over the planet.

With Oil Gushers (it was never a spill), birds dropping dead out of the sky by the thousands, fish dying in the hundreds of thousands, we're going to start re-drilling, we're still at war with now several countries, so many people are dying from lack of food and clean water, the weird weather and the ever present (I suspect) alien presence - it's like that movie, "They Live", with the signs, "Obey", "Consume", "Populate", "Don't question authority" (Body scanners, pat downs and cameras on every street corner.................sex is the least of our concerns.

And yet, it's promoted on TV and all forms of media like crazy.

Another distraction.

Since I have awaken and figured out (took me long enough) that homosapiens aren't at the top of the food chain here on this third rock from the sun - sex has become like just not important.

The thirst for knowledge has over taken my drive for sex.

Somethings major is going on all over the planet and I don't want to be recycled............I want ascension, out of the box and I'm trying my darnedest in the twenty/thirty (or if I'm like my great aunt Margaret 45) years left trying to figure out my way out of the box.

(See the Twilight Episode of the dolls in the Christmas donation box)..........Seems TPTB are trying to dumb us down and keep us distracted.
 
Nienna Eluch said:
FireShadow,

Have you had a chance to look at the revised Detox Diet? If you have the will to get healthier, this is an amazing way to do it. The reason you have problems with dairy and gluten is because they are addictive. Knowing that, and not liking being addicted to things, really helped me to stick to the diet and get off of these evil foods.

I'm hoping that you will do so, too. :)

I have been following the threads on this. And, I agree that not wanting to be addicted is motivation for eliminating these foods. It is one of the reasons I continue to try - that and wanting to have a clearer head and more energy.

My problem is a "deprivation program". Through psychotherapy (back in the 1990's), my mother telling me about my first year, along with some other relatives telling me things, I found the source of it.

Apparently, in my pre-verbal stage of life, I did not get enough to eat. My mother says the doctor told her to feed me a certain quantity, a certain number of times per day (she does not remember the specifics). She said she did that, but I would cry and cry. She said she would then leave the house for hours to let me cry alone as she could not stand the crying. She was only 17 years old, suffering from depression and was living with me and my father in New Mexico - far from her family in Texas (who would have been her support system). Finally her mother came for a visit and saw what was happening and told my mother "You gotta feed that baby more, no matter what the doctor said!". From all reports, I was very malnourished by this time. I have a photo of myself from that time and I can say that I look like I was starving - my eyes look "dead" as well.

In the 1990's, I quit drugs and alcohol for 5 years (did not go back to the drugs, but do drink on rare occasions now). That was way easier than attempting to give up even one food item! Whenever I trigger this program, I end up binging and eating way too much.

Back in the 80's, I used to try dieting to lose weight (not many fad diets, mostly healthy eating plans), but with the "deprivation program" (unbeknownst to me at the time), I would binge and in the long run, kept gaining weight. I gave up dieting because it seemed more harmful to me than helpful. My weight has been pretty stable (with a few exceptions) since then.

I was just reading another thread about gluten and dairy and this quote had resonance for me:
Stranger said:
In my opinion, the consuming of milk and cereals is metaphoric for the breast milk and closeness to the mother most people don't get enough for developing properly. So, deported into the unconscious mind, this desire to get love and milk from the mother, begins to operate subliminal. This desire shows itself in the search for vicarious satisfactions. So we begin to drink milk and eat smooth puree with milk and cereals which both act the same as breast milk (it is docking on the opiate receptors). We try to get this feeling we had when being near to our mother/parents...

Perhaps not relevant for everyone, but it may have relevance for me. When I was in psychotherapy, I would sometimes activate that early part of me and milk was the only food I could swallow during those episodes...hmmm.

But it is all inter-related is it not? I mean, the book "Cupid's Poisoned Arrow" says that orgasm-based sex also triggers cravings and hunger for "fixes". The review of the book "The Fat Resistance Diet" talks of eliminating cravings with knowledge of lectins (I think)... Which is what got me thinking of this multi-faceted approach. One thing feeds another (addictions, programs, etc) and one thing helps another (detox, bonding-based sex, etc). This thread and the line of inquiry related to sex is what has actually helped me move (at least a little) past my initial resistance to changing my diet. Previously, I could not even get that far. Networking works! And non-linear thinking helps as well, I think. Things seem to be loosening up inside me.

By the way, I am also getting a lot more insight as I go through this process and follow the path. I finally ordered and received "The Wave - books 5, 6, & 7" and was reading book 5 last night. Just the introduction brought a lot of things together! Even though I have read "Adventures with the Cassiopaeans", the organization of the material in book 5 and perhaps the timing really brought some things together.

I had a flash of insight into how when I have been "getting myself in the mood" for intimacy, I have been "binding the strong man" and "raping the maiden of the well". I also realized that a part of me knew this all along, but I silenced that voice. I have done this part to myself. I think because I have not had the hunger, but Hubby has; I have tried to please him. But, engaging in the same dynamic when I was not in the "same place" as he, there was no longer an "exchange". I was just feeding his hunger and draining myself. When we were in the "same place", there was more of an exchange (STS though it may be) - we were both feeding. It became unbalanced when I lost my "hunger".

In spite of all this, I am rarely sick except for bouts of depression and low energy. I am hoping that by approaching this from several angles and chipping away a little here, a little there, I may finally succeed...one can always hope.

Edit: I want to add my thanks to everyone for all the support, tips, feedback, etc. As always, this network is a great gift.

Edit: typos
 
I just remembered that another thing I had to do to get beyond the binging was to give myself permission to eat anything I wanted. At first, I did go overboard, but once I internalized that I really could have what I wanted, some of my intense cravings dissipated. I began to crave less chocolate - for example, instead of eating two big slices of cake, I only wanted a small piece and less often - instead of everyday, once a week was fine. I began to want more healthy choices like vegetables, etc. It seems that whenever I think in terms that I "can't have" something, it triggers that "scarcity" thinking (common to the predator mind) exacerbated by my "deprivation program". Now to ponder how to incorporate this insight into the overall plan...
 
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