Putin Recognizes Donbass Republics, Sends Russian Military to 'Denazify' Ukraine

f1esk said:
Putin does not name names and surnames. I won’t be surprised if the rebel Gerasimov and Shoiguzh are eventually arrested.
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Interesting, I see it as the opposite. Prigozhin made his moves to try and get Shoigu and Gerasimov unseated but it didn't work and now he'll pay the price for treason. Putin not naming him could also be that he doesn't want to give him any kind of personal attention or "glory", cuz he's not worth it.
 
Beau said:
Interesting, I see it as the opposite. Prigozhin made his moves to try and get Shoigu and Gerasimov unseated but it didn't work and now he'll pay the price for treason. Putin not naming him could also be that he doesn't want to give him any kind of personal attention or "glory", cuz he's not worth it.
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I agree Putin very rarely names names people when he speaks in an accusatory tone, this is just his way of speaking.
 
Beau said:
I dunno. He's addressing the nation and calling it internal treason. There's no backing down from that, Prigozhin will either be dead or in cuffs before the MOD stands down now.
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That's my opinion as well. Because it is treason, it needs to be dealt with accordingly. If the administration is too soft, others may join this club. It is similarly with protests in Russia as far as I can see, they get stopped immediate, though they don't get too much momentum. Of course, Wagner does have weapons, and it is a dangerous mission. Hopefully, many from Wagner will drop their weapons as long they do have a chance.

But let's wait and see.
 
Beau said:
A very good run-down of the whole situation here

simplicius76.substack.com

Special Report: Emergency Situation as Prigozhin Goes Nuclear Option

Heavy things are afoot.
simplicius76.substack.com simplicius76.substack.com
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Perhaps I'm mistaken, but this seems like a psyop to me.

In Prigozhin's video, his talking points are word for word every single talking point of the Ukrainian Nazis, including the claim that Ukraine was not aggressively bombing Donbass for 8 years. This seems to me like a psyop that is tailor-made for an already-brainwashed Ukrainian audience. And I think he would be ecstatic to pull such a grandiose theater piece -- he loves doing that. But the most important thing here is that his Nazi talking points confirm everything that the Ukrainian top brass genuinely believe, and might be just enough to fool them into the big counter-offensive push that Russia has been hoping they'd make for weeks now.

Cosmos said:
As far as I know, Prigozhin has repeatedly claimed/complained for months that his Wagner troops "don't get the necessary weapons" "for defending Russia in Ukraine" and that "his troops die because of it".
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Yet in reality he is getting those weapons, to the point where Wagner even seems to get preferential treatment. Prigozhin has a track record of dramatically portraying weakness to lure Ukraine into an attack, only to find out they've been had. For example, during a stalemate in Artemovsk (Bakhmut) he made a lot of noise about not having any ammunition and getting ready to withdraw. They supposedly withdrew, and so the Ukrainian troops seized the opportunity and attacked -- and were completely routed by Wagner (who, lo and behold, weren't supposed to be there). This looks to me like the same trick, but on a larger scale.

Ukraine's counter-offensive has fizzled out to the point of being a non-starter. If they turtle up and withdraw now, before they've even properly started, that's the worst possible scenario for Russia because that will mean Russia going on the offensive again and chipping away slowly and slowly. Russia want Ukraine to keep attacking, and to finally feel confident enough for a proper counter-offensive. It's in Russia's best interest for this offensive to keep going for as long as possible since it incurs very modest losses on their side and catastrophic losses for Ukraine's meat sacrifices. And that's how Russia has been running this SMO: very small margin of tolerance for Russian losses. If I was Russia, I'd be coaxing Ukraine into some small wins so that they believe they might still have a chance to do something. (And so they don't feel desperate and hopeless enough to pull something drastic with the nuclear power plant, as they've been hinting at quite feverishly in recent days.)

Anyway, this is my theory and perhaps it's wishful thinking of my own. In which case, Prigozhin is just a pathological nutcase or a Western marionette. Or both.
 
Tyomodachi said:
I agree Putin very rarely names names people when he speaks in an accusatory tone, this is just his way of speaking.
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Indeed. I also think part of the reason Putin approaches things of this nature in this way is to give himself and his team more time to evaluate a situation in a calm and rational way as objective as possible. Trying not to act on emotions of the moment. It also gives the potential foul parties time to rethink their wrongdoings and maybe back down, before Putin really steps in.
 
Gawan said:
That's my opinion as well. Because it is treason, it needs to be dealt with accordingly. If the administration is too soft, others may join this club. It is similarly with protests in Russia as far as I can see, they get stopped immediate, though they don't get too much momentum. Of course, Wagner does have weapons, and it is a dangerous mission. Hopefully, many from Wagner will drop their weapons as long they do have a chance.

But let's wait and see.
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If all of this is purely a betrayal-uprising on the part of Prihozhin... if he was more deranged or deceived than many of us realized, did he really think he had a chance against the Russian state?... I don't think so, keep going saying that this is not a coup and that he does not want to stop the special operation (Wagner's troops also look relatively calm) , but that he has miscalculated due to the possible pressure for signatures or was too disassociated not to even contemplate a possible serious response from Putin against him.

Kadyrov's statements:
Friends, the night turned out to be difficult and the flights did not give time to voice here my position on the water of this vile betrayal! Everything that happens is a KNIFE IN THE BACK and a real military mutiny! I have repeatedly warned that war is not the time for voicing personal grievances and resolving disputes in our rear. The rear must always be calm and reliable. Imagine what the guys in the trenches feel now, Pred face which the enemy, for sz with pVEy traitors Speech about stability, about the cohesion of the state, about the security of citizens. History shows that such actions can lead to bloody consequences. We have few losses in the NWO? Should we still create problems within the country? We have a Supreme Commander-in-Chief, elected by the people, who knows every situation down to the smallest detail Era el estratega más poderoso y tenía lo mejor de BIZNESMENA, que era obzvanivaet komandirov "na z emle" y polnost yu controls the course of the NWO. And the decisions of the Supreme Commander-in-Chief are taken in a balanced way, scrupulёzno. Each of us sees only one part of the map, and he sees everything at once! And Vladimir Vladimirovich quite rightly noted in his address to the nation - this is a military rebellion! There is no excuse for such actions! I fully support every word of Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin! I appeal to the fighters - the patriotam of our Motherland. Do not fall for provocations. No matter what goals you are given, no matter what promises you are told, the security of the state and the cohesion of Russian society are above all at such a moment! See how our enemies in the West are taking advantage of this situation. How many stuffings, how many lies, how many live appeals that frighten our citizens and create the danger of a destabilizing situation. Y este the expected consequences of Prigogine's treacherous march. What is happening is not an ultimatum to the Ministry of Defense. This is a challenge to the state, and against this challenge it is necessary for everyone to rally around the national leader: the military, Silovikam, gubernatorams, grazdanskomu naseleniya. The fighters of the Ministry of Defense and the Russian Guard in the Chechen Republic have already left for the zones of tension. We will do everything to preserve the unity of Russia and protect its statehood! The rebellion must be crushed, and if this requires harsh measures, then we are ready!
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t.me

Kadyrov_95

Друзья, ночь выдалась сложной и перелёты не дали времени озвучить тут мою позицию по поводу этого гнусного ПРЕДАТЕЛЬСТВА! Все происходящее - НОЖ В СПИНУ и настоящий военный мятеж! Я ни раз предупреждал, что война - не время для озвучивания личных обид и решения споров в нашем тылу. Тыл...
t.me t.me
 
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Cosmos said:
Well, that is kind of an extreme statement. Why would you say that?
See Beaus post above for some of those obvious lies.
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Beau said:
Interesting, I see it as the opposite. Prigozhin made his moves to try and get Shoigu and Gerasimov unseated but it didn't work and now he'll pay the price for treason. Putin not naming him could also be that he doesn't want to give him any kind of personal attention or "glory", cuz he's not worth it.
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Well, I read the first lines, this unique person writes that it looks like Prigozhin initiated an attempted coup d'état. That's funny. It is very strange to start a coup d'etat in the Rostov region, and not in Moscow.

Shoigu could talk to Prigogine on camera, answer all the questions. But it doesn't. At the same time, all the awards of the order and medals for Soledar and Bakhmut were given to the Wagners, having been sold with huge delays.

And now, when the RF Ministry of Defense has decided to suppress PMCs, you are taking the side of the RF Ministry of Defense, and who will fight? Forgotten Syria, Africa?

Many problems would not arise if:
1. In Russia, there was a law on PMCs
2. The open conflict between Prigozhin and the Russian Defense Ministry that arose last autumn was stopped at an early stage.

Now we are reaping the consequences. The main thing now is to avoid bloodshed. It will benefit only the external enemies of Russia's country.

I don't want to stir up hatred here and start wars of truth. Let's watch the situation develop. But I am amazed at how quickly you picked up the idea of a coup d'état. And yes, I also understand that my opinion may be erroneous and my conclusions are not correct.
 
Armagelipsis-matíasmaurán said:
[...]
Kadyrov's statements:

t.me

Kadyrov_95

Друзья, ночь выдалась сложной и перелёты не дали времени озвучить тут мою позицию по поводу этого гнусного ПРЕДАТЕЛЬСТВА! Все происходящее - НОЖ В СПИНУ и настоящий военный мятеж! Я ни раз предупреждал, что война - не время для озвучивания личных обид и решения споров в нашем тылу. Тыл...
t.me t.me
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Well said by Kadyrov IMO.

Regardless if and how much Prihozhin is in on what is happening, the whole thing smells like a typical western attempt for a color revolution to me. I think that might be the "big thing" some have talked about that the west has planned, while Ukraine is about to lose bigly soon. Kind of a desperate act that will lead to nothing IMO.
 
Beau said:
Interesting, I see it as the opposite. Prigozhin made his moves to try and get Shoigu and Gerasimov unseated but it didn't work and now he'll pay the price for treason.
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By the way, I think that Prigozhin will achieve the resignation of Shoigu and possibly Gerasimov. However, will he still be alive at the same time, that's the question, because they will deal with him one way or another now, and the resignations will happen later and will not be connected with it. An honorary pension is possible, or as with Serdyukov - in Rostec by some kind of deputy

Я, кстати думаю, что Пригожин добьется отставки Шойгу и возможно Герасимова. Однако будет ли он при этом еще жив, вот вопрос, потому что с ним разберутся так или иначе сейчас, а отставки произойдут позже и как бы не будут связаны с этим. Возможна почетная пенсия или как с Сердюковым- в "Ростех" каким нибудь заместителем
 
f1esk said:
Well, I read the first lines, this unique person writes that it looks like Prigozhin initiated an attempted coup d'état. That's funny. It is very strange to start a coup d'etat in the Rostov region, and not in Moscow.
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Probably because it's over 1,100 kilometers between the two and would take way too long for Prigozhin to get his troops there.
 
Transcript of the last audio from the Prigozhin channel, he refuses to lay down his arms and says that Putin is wrong in his statements that they are traitors... the Africa thing made me laugh, it sounds in a way like what would be said about the West:
About the betrayal of the motherland. The president was deeply mistaken. We are patriots of our country. We fought and are fighting. All fighters of PMC Wagner. And no one is going to turn himself in at the request of the President of the FSB or anyone else. Because we do not want the country to live on in corruption, deceit and bureaucracy. When we fought in Africa, we were told that we needed Africa, and after that they abandoned it, because they stole all the money that was supposed to go to help. When we were told that we were at war with Ukraine, we went and fought. But it turned out that ammunition, weapons, all the money that was put on them, were also stolen. And bureaucrats are sitting, saving them for themselves just for the case that has come today, when someone goes to Moscow, now they do not save anything. They hit with planes and helicopters on the columns where the market is going on. At the same time, they hit Nick, because they don’t hit. And they hit anywhere. Therefore, we are patriots, And those who oppose us today are those who have gathered around the scum.
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t.me

Кепка Пригожина

Заявление Евгения Пригожина
t.me t.me
 
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