Role of Russia

[Lumiere_du_Code]

just look at this :)

1) house of Alice in Wonderland: inscription on the plate - "STATE BUILDING of Russia".
2) "Department of State-building" !!
3) "Center for Development of beach sports" :D
4) inscription on a billboard - "20 years of attention and care about you."
5) "RUSSIA" :P
6) "Youth of V.Kolyma - You to live here!" (*encouraging and inspiring*) ;D
7) "World of Windows". no comments
8) and it is not the only example... So much to do even lampposts in the suburbs of Moscow at the bus stop - right on the roadway...
9) party "Fair Russia": "We do not sit idly by" (slogan) - and look at hands of man
10) "146 percent! And how many times have you voted?"

 

[Keit]

Ok, I think I understand the confusion, at least with some of the Russian posters. Correct me if I am wrong.

What seems to me, that for a very long time (for the whole time of the Soviet Union, not to mention after) Russian people faced a lot of hardships and suffered them in silence, primarily because they couldn't really speak up without being punished. After the SU collapse, and when the situation became extremely dire, finally they were able to speak up and express all the frustration that accumulated during all this time.

As Siberia said in one of the posts, it's naive and very unrealistic to expect total improvement within 15 years after the "greatest geopolitical catastrophe of our century". Add to this Russian mentality, ever-present corruption, and I really don't envy any leader or leaders that are supposed to deal with so much undeniable crap (no better word to describe it, unfortunately) now and probably for the next 50 years at the minimum.

So I think we need to put things in perspective here. Yes, things in Russia and in other post Soviet-Union countries such as Belarus (not to mention Ukraine) are very dire. Yes, all those joke pictures are very real, especially about the completely horrible roads, absurd construction, stealing mentality, drunks on the streets, even bears! Seriously, I myself for a month already in order to take a shower need to boil water in a teapot and then wash myself with a glass jar over the wash basin. Because they turned off the hot water, either for repairs or to save money, who knows. And that's a second time within several months. How I regret that I didn't bother to do creo adaptation before. But now it's a good opportunity. :)

Yes, life is hard, very hard for most. There is a lot of frustration, heated emotions, etc. But please, don't miss the main point here that was explained rather thoroughly several times already. Ok, so people are sick of waiting and being patient, but on the other hand, isn't it hopeful at least to know that in other seemingly "more prosperous" countries on a spiritual level there is a darkest night, while here there is at least some depth left? Our souls, our future as individuals, if not as a race is at stake. If so, I am willing to heat teapots for much longer. imo. The bottom line is it's not about us and our comforts, it's about the big picture and symbolic representation of it's all. As Atreides said:

The only things that are important when it comes to Putin are: What he says, what he does, and what are the results.

He says: I will help.
He does: Help.
Result: People are happier and better situated. Objectively and by the numbers.

As long as his deeds and results continue to match his promises, then he is a good leader. But he is still a cow, on a cow farm, with all that that entails.

 

[Siberia]

Siberia - my apologies, you are correct. I meant Burnt by the Sun 2. He used his administrative resource and persuaded schools to make pupils all over the country to go and watch it during class time (free will approach obviously).

It's curious how you're twisting your own ideas, Antony.

In the above statement you claim that he (Michalkov, apparently) allegedly "used his administrative resource and persuaded schools to make pupils all over the country to go and watch it during class time". I will not go into details explaining why Michalkov doesn't have the said "administrative resource" and how much doubtful this information is (considering the quality of sources claiming this nonsense). It doesn't matter.

Let's assume for a moment that it is true and all Russian schoolchildren indeed were forced to watch a patriotic film. What is interesting is your attitude: this is a free will violation. Okay.

Here is another statement of yours about Putin and Michalkov along the same line:

During the last elections he was a confide of Putin and persuading the artistic community to vote for him. Those who stood against - were repressed in show business arena.

Although I haven't seen anyone really cast away "from the show business arena," let's assume that some of them are indeed not very welcome today (you name them, because I really don't know any such). What is interesting is that you use the word "repressed" in a clearly negative sense.

So, by these two statements you blame Putin and his supporters for "obvious free will violation" and "repressions". Okay, despite the lack of evidence, your position is yet clear.

But then you say the following about Stalin:

Siberia- yes I do understand the period of 1930s. And Stalin understood that if no extraordinary measures taken fascists would eliminate USSR and the world. There were victims no doubt.

Interesting that when Putin or Michalkov possibly use administrative resources to promote patriotism, those are "repressions" and "free will violation". But when Stalin applies a 100% censorship and really violent repressions, those are "extraordinary measures." Sounds like double standards to me.

 

[SeekinTruth]

I don't think it makes any sense to reply to Antony's carefully selected replies (while ignoring what he doesn't want to acknowledge) and his obvious double or multiple standards, at least for me. It's all the usual PTB talking points.

Everything being brought up is being viewed through a subjective lens, as well. For example the Olympics could certainly be seen as a big waste of money, but it's already made the money back and become profitable in the hundreds of millions of dollars about a month or two ago - the first Olympic Games that's profitable in the last few decades, and quickly. Sochi is a big resort and vacation spot which will benefit for a long time from this event. All the cities that host the Olympics remain in huge debt for many, many years - never understood why any city would want to host one. But again, all this is just another detail without the larger context.

Bottom line for me is that Russia in the Putin era has become MUCH better than before Putin came to power (same with Armenia in the last 10 to 15 years - huge improvements). This can only happen if the leader of the country and his team have good intentions and high competency - there's NO other way it could happen, period. I admit I don't know as much about Belarus, and Keit lives there so I'll take her word for it (it may be closer to post-Soviet Ukraine than Russia after Putin, don't know).

Just since I've been living in Armenia since 2006, the amount of infrastructure of all kinds that's been upgraded is incredible. AND Armenia is forced to still spend quite a lot on military defense against Azerbaijan which has huge resources and spends large amounts on military and the rest are embezzled by the Aliev gang and allied elites. The amount of repression and corruption there is self-evident. But the whole point is that if a leader of a country does nothing at all, good or bad, things will progressively get worse on their own, especially in countries like Russia and Armenia starting from an absolute societal disaster. That's it, I can't say anything more relevant about this. Putin's Russia is the best anyone can hope for in the world we live in for an industrialized technological society - which in my view is a nightmare any way you look at it: the playground of psychopaths.

 

[Keit]

I admit I don't know as much about Belarus, and Keit lives there so I'll take her word for it (it may be closer to post-Soviet Ukraine than Russia after Putin, don't know).

Well, in some aspects it's better than Russia. The roads are better, cities are cleaner (it's the fact that impresses all the tourists that come here), food better (like Belorussian salo, or apparently milk products). Lukashenko also makes sure to make Minsk to resemble other European cities. But Belarus is much smaller than Russia! And there are other things, of course, as I mentioned, that remained since the Soviet Union times. Just like in Russia, there are many in Belarus, especially in Minsk and other big cities that are well off, and there are many, especially elderly, that need to be really creative in order to survive. Some need to survive on a 150$ pension a month. And that isn't much. There are obviously many other problems as well.

As for Ukraine, I heard that they have the best soil in the region (it's actually the region that separatists are fighting over now), the best climate, not to mention pigs! Ukraine could be the richest of all three countries, but even before the crisis they were the poorest. That's when who ever is in the head becomes important.

Here's a humorous take on the situation, and another reason why Putin's food ban is good for Russia. The text says: "Dear customers, we advice you and your children to eat more apples from Russia. Our farmers don't have money for expensive chemicals. Our apples maybe unimpressive, but healthier. Bon appetit."

 

[Nević Nenad]

If I may explain the picture that Lumiere_du_Code posted. Bogue (parody on Vogue of course) is pronounced Bog, which actually means "God". Nice parody :)

 

[Antony]

Returning to Sakhalin (famous deal), I have checked on it today – what I found:
The production sharing contract (СРП) system for Sakhalin 1, 2 and Chariyagisnkoe from Eltsin’s times is still ACTIVE! Yes the government started to receive revenue from it, but there are difficulties. According to the results of the revision by Audit Chamber
"Total costs is $55 billion, including $4,5 billions - in 2012 г. The government compensated companies involved the full price ($49 billions). Government received in revenues $16 billions so far. The main question – is how long it is going to take to cover the costs???
Also according to the deal after the full payment the infrastructure must be handed over to the government. That is not done.

In "Сахалин-1" they still did not regulate what to do with gas from "Chaivo"place. Loss for the government is already $3,6 billions. Etc.

(References: http://top.rbc.ru/economics/14/08/2014/942828.shtml#xtor=AL-[internal_traffic]--[rbc.ru]-[main_body]-[item_3], http://www.minenergo.gov.ru/press/min_news/10423.html, http://expert.ru/2012/03/30/gazovyie-dengi/,
http://www.vestifinance.ru/articles/36243 and http://www.rosbalt.ru/business/2013/12/02/1206101.html
Sorry but I don’t have an opportunity to translate all of them).


Continuing with resources:
In Russia we have one of the smallest resources primary (rent). From selling of the oil the Russia receives only 34%, when UAE – 91 %, Norway– 82 %, USA – 60 %. So basically 2/3 of profit goes to oligarchs. (http://politikus.ru/articles/26855-chastnogo-sobstvennika-v-otstavku-nacionalizaciya-dobyvayuschih-otrasley-yavlyaetsya-zhiznennoy-neobhodimostyu.html)

Another example of (D)effective management: Gazprom boards of management receives a rise of 40 % in income, while the net profit of the company plunged by 36% !! Brilliant - no loose game!
http://lenta.ru/news/2014/08/13/gazprom/


Oh, just as I have mentioned about the wallet in the enemy’s pocket, one parliamentary Nilov decided in the light of sanctions to make a decree in order to ban transferring the Russia’s money abroad! Clever and courageous! How far will he manage to go with that?
http://lenta.ru/news/2014/08/13/money/

Coming to general economic overview.

Industrial Production in Russia in 2011 г.

(in comparison to РСФСР/ Russian Soviet Federative Socialist Republic in 1990 г.)

Electricity - 97%

Coal - 84,6%

Oil - 98%

Gas - 104,4%

Fabrics (cotton) - 21,8%

Fabrics wool - 3,0%

Knitted fabric - 16,6%

Coat - 40,8%

Footwear - 27,7%

Lumber - 32,9%

Mineral fertilizers - 116,2%

Brick - 39,1%

Cement - 66,8%

Reinforced concrete - 28,8%

Steel - 75,6%

Rolled iron - 92,9%

Тurbines - 53,6%

Cranes - 3,6%

Excavators - 6,5%

machinery tools- 3,4% (2,2 thousands against 67,5; another source)

Refrigerators - 107,1%

Vacuum cleaners - 4,8%

Washing machines - 55,5%

TVs - 100%

trolley bus - 10,2%

Trucks - 28,2% (153 000 against 616 000, another source)

Personal auto - 154,1%

Bus - 67,7%.

From the main 50 major types of products only 6 positions we returned to pre-democratic level.

Catastrophe in electronics, pharmacy - 15% of the need.

Aviation – in 2010 – produced 8 civil airplanes, in 2012 – 20 and in 2013 - 32 (http://www.sdelanounas.ru/blogs/45590/) (in Soviet times – 1500 airplanes and helicopters were made per annum, 30% of the world’s market share)

In March 2001 г. station "Мir" was deliberately utilized into the ocean (experts said that it could work at least for another 5 years – but no, “banana/oil republic” should not have an independent space program).

Farming for last 20 years

Village workers - 1,17 mil. people (decreased 5 times).

Villagers unemployed – more than 5 million people (though they are not counted because they have their own gardens to grow life stock,veggies etc).

20 years ago there were 48 thousand collective households in rural area. Now they decreased 5 times, 30% of the left are not profitable).

Closed - 15600 cultural clubs, 4300 libraries, 22000 kindergartens, 14000 schools.
20 thousand villages (not villagers!) disintegrated, 47 thousand left.

Production of farming machinery (vital for food supplies safety, as Fedorov ‘overoptimistically’ said – restored. Nope, does not seem so) in 2010 году

(in comparison to РСФСР/ Russian Soviet Federative Socialist Republic in 1990 г.)

- tractors - 4% (quantity wise from another source – was 178 thousand – now 6,2 thousand, even in 1998 crisis year – 9.8 thousand)

- seeding machines - 14%

- harvesters - 5-7% (depending on type)

Cattle number in 2010 году

(in comparison to РСФСР/ Russian Soviet Federative Socialist Republic in 1990 г.)

- cows - 46%

- pigs - 45%

- lamb - 37%.

Food production в 2010 году

(in comparison to РСФСР/ Russian Soviet Federative Socialist Republic in 1990 г.)

-beef - 40%

- pork - 67%

-milk - 57%

-eggs - 86%.

Land

-from 117 mil. Hectares of agricultural land 41 млн. га (35%) ran wild

(references)
http://www.km.ru/front-projects/belovezhskoe-soglashenie/rzhaveyushchaya-rossiya-na-fone-rsfsr-v-rf-promyshlennosti-p

http://www.infoabad.com/blogs/moi-blog/dostizhenija-rosi-po-sravneniyu-s-periodom-sr.html

http://expert.ru/expert/2012/47/myi-nichego-ne-proizvodim/

http://www.svoim.info/201146/?46_5_1


25.04.2011 Deputy chief of Audit Chamber of Russian Federation said: “Around 0,2% (288 thousand) of families control today about 70% of national wealth. Of course such disproportions cannot stimulate economic growth and pose a threat to national security.

International company Evans made a rating of countries with unaffordable housing prices. Russia is 5th/. To save money for buying home for an average Russian takes 26,1 years. Average price of Moscow’s flat is 303,151 euro with an average family income of 11615 euro. In regions it is 64,102 euro и 3080 euro respectively.
The most affordable real estate is in US. With average price of 95,536 евро, average family income 35,384 евро.

GDP of Russia per person in 2011 according to CIA World Factbook equals 16,700 dollars. It is 70-th place out of 226.

According to Transparency International, in 2011 Russia and Nigeria shared 143 place in the world for corruption out of 182.

Former director of Research institute of Goskomstat (is leading governmental statistical structure) Vasiliy Simchera resigned from duty with words: «Fed up of lying!».
Here are some extracts from his data «Double evaluations of major indexes of development of Russian economy in 2001–2010 гг.»:

Gap between regions in GDP’s volume
Official: 14 times.
Fact: 42 times.

Amortization of capital assets:
Official: 48,8%.
Fact: 75,4%.

Difference between the level of income of 10% most rich и 10% most poor.
Official: 16 times.
Fact: 28–36 раз times.
This is higher than in Europe, US, Japan, Latin America. The limit safety wise is 10 times.


Size of population, belonging to socialy deprived groups, in % from total population.
Officially: 1,5%.
Fact: 45%.
According to the Research statistics Institute, there are 12 millions alcohol addicts, more than 4,5 млн drug addicts, more than 1 million neglected children.


That goes directly to the last part of the movie -
Drug addicts (source Federal service of anti-trafficking)-
1984 – 14 324 people in USSR !!!!
2007 - 6 millions http://ria.ru/spravka/20070626/67829656.html
2014 – 8 millions http://www.gazeta.ru/social/news/2014/02/25/n_5972589.shtml That is a stable progress.

Share of foreign capital in economy, в %.
– overall:
Officially:
20%. Fact: 75%,
в т.ч.:
– assets:
Officially: 25%.
Fact: 60%;
– in profit:
Officially: 21%.
Fact: 70%;
– in shares:
Officially: 18%.
Fact: 90%.
– in grants.
Officially: 14%.
Fact: 90%.
Like in Csar’s time – we had our economy privatized by Anglo-Saxon capital. In spite of being relatives Nikolay II and Kaiser, they managed to draw us to WW1 against each other.

Level of unemployment, in % .
Officially: 2–3%.
Fact: 10–12%.

Reference http://www.km.ru/v-rossii/2011/11/14/ekonomicheskaya-situatsiya-v-rossii/obnarodovana-shokiruyushchaya-pravda-ob-isti (sorry, I don’t have an opportunity to work with office most of the time, can’t insert and translate the table in the article) essay and a table http://www.smolin.ru/read/arcticles_polit/pdf/simchera.pdf

Returning to Khodorkovskiy - he is the only big oligarch that has crossed the road to Putin and his associates. He was actually planning a coup (he bribed the constitutional majority of parlamentarians around 300 of them out of 450), so basically he could start the impeachment procedure. Another his intention of uniting Yukos and Sibneft assets and selling them to American Shell could not be tolerated. Later Abramovich - one of the closest friends of Putin, received for Sibneft from Gazprom - 13 billion dollars! Don't forget that these Soviet giants were stollen basically for a penny in 90s from government - and after some time passed the GOVERNMENT HAD TO PAY A THIEF TO BUY IT BACK! Yes, that is Russia's reality and a staged fight with oligarchs.

Concerning the aspect of saving countries integrity- I would agree. The only thing about Chechnya that is disturbing - we are paying money to locals so they do not pick up rifles again. As soon as the budget shrinks enough (for the last 10 years elite's appetites skyrocketed everywhere of easy-going) - they might resume what they are used to do best.

I might have missed something out from the film - so please do ask.

So summarizing Karaylov's film - it is emotional (especially music :) ! Around ten years ago I used to watch him, but after I stopped as he turned out to be a chameleon. This is understandable when you work for the boss which in this case is Moscow's mayor Sobyanin, a friend and appointed by you know who. Earlier when his boss was Lyjkov - he used to spill garbage on Putin's team. Nothing new under the moon! So the film is mostly for external " consumption " and people not very deeply wrapped in Russia's reality.

Fedorov - is an 'interesting' guy. He started promoting himself through PR, mass media not very long ago (couple of times his was badly "beaten" on public debates with opposition representatives), but I have noticed the difference between his approach towars political reality when the film was made and for example last year - when he stopped naming Putin as an almighty savior. Started to blame for all the faults Ministry of Finance (that keeps money abroad), 5th column (journalists and "intelligencia" that dare to criticize the 'Csar'). So basically he shifts focus when beneficial.

 

[Alana]

I think that Antony you should go live in the USA for a while, for comparisons.

 

[Joe]

Returning to Khodorkovskiy - he is the only big oligarch that has crossed the road to Putin and his associates. He was actually planning a coup (he bribed the constitutional majority of parlamentarians around 300 of them out of 450), so basically he could start the impeachment procedure. Another his intention of uniting Yukos and Sibneft assets and selling them to American Shell could not be tolerated. Later Abramovich - one of the closest friends of Putin, received for Sibneft from Gazprom - 13 billion dollars! Don't forget that these Soviet giants were stollen basically for a penny in 90s from government - and after some time passed the GOVERNMENT HAD TO PAY A THIEF TO BUY IT BACK! Yes, that is Russia's reality and a staged fight with oligarchs.

How is it a 'staged fight' when a large number of those oligarchs fled the country? And what's your problem with preventing Russian assets from being sold to the US? You think it would have been better? You seem completely unaware of the extent to which Russia was destroyed by the West after the 'fall' of the SU.

Concerning the aspect of saving countries integrity- I would agree. The only thing about Chechnya that is disturbing - we are paying money to locals so they do not pick up rifles again. As soon as the budget shrinks enough (for the last 10 years elite's appetites skyrocketed everywhere of easy-going) - they might resume what they are used to do best.

Why is that disturbing? It's good policy. Unless you think they should all be wiped out instead?

 

[Nević Nenad]

Antony, I so envy you for living in Russia. You could try to live in Serbia. Twenty five (25) years of degradation in any aspect of life and ever increasing entropy is so hard and boring . . . .

 

[Joe]

You know who you remind me of Anthony? The rich anti-Chavez clique in Venezuela, all of whom have ties to the pro-US ruling elite and/or big private business interests in the country. So is it possible you are the child of a family with connections to the Russian oligarchs?

 

[Siberia]

I don't think it makes any sense to reply to Antony's carefully selected replies (while ignoring what he doesn't want to acknowledge) and his obvious double or multiple standards, at least for me. It's all the usual PTB talking points.

Indeed, SeekinTruth. No matter how carefully and hard I try to reveal the obvious inconsistency, the only reply is 100x more of same. :(

Antony, all I can tell you is: if you prefer to see only the dark side, that is your choice. But if you just open your mind you will see that no one ever in this country did more for the people than Putin. The driving force of his leadership is not fear and blind obedience, but inspiration. He gives faith and hope to millions of people. He makes mistakes, as any human does, but he always does his best to help people to live better and to develop both domestic and international relations.

And such leaders as Chavez, Assad, Lukashenko, Nazarbaev and many others, although not perfect also, brought stability to their countries. They didn't create powerful empires, but they were and are well-experienced and responsible persons mostly respected by their people.

No one is perfect. Are you maybe? Before judging Putin you'd better ask yourself: what have YOU personally done for the country to criticize him? Let me answer for myself: I didn't do even a 1/1,000,000,000 of what he has done. And for me it is a good motivation to stop complaining and start working. Because he really needs our help. Even if tiny, it will be much more efficient, than continuing this pointless dispute. OSIT

 

[Antony]

"Interesting" discussion indeed, truly "objective". I really hoped for an open minded polemics with elder brothers and sisters with facts and arguments in hand. But what do we have?

Perceval-I liked your grey Russia unconscious doings theory and you are trying to be personal accusing me of being an oligarch. Are oligarch's naturally concerned about the people, country? You are saying that oligarchs left the country - from my memory only a couple of them such as Berezovsky (personally promoted Putin in Washington 2years before the change over- read Strobe Talbot's book "Bill and Boris Diplomatic notes". He knew too much and had to flee when interests collided) Gusinskiy, Chichevarkin. Please give some names or just count with a reference. If you were reading more thoroughly in the beginning there was a number ( nill ) of them provided from Eltsin's period (no billionaires, only some bankers multimillionaires) and now we have around a 100! Definitely people's oriented development. Repeating the link - there is foto there (can be enhanced) with "beautiful" Russian faces and surnames. (I am not in that picture :) http://politikus.ru/articles/26855-chastnogo-sobstvennika-v-otstavku-nacionalizaciya-dobyvayuschih-otrasley-yavlyaetsya-zhiznennoy-neobhodimostyu.html

Siberia- I am not going to argue about Michalkov's artistic "talents", just doubt that the guy who is pushing people to "appreciate" his creations deserves even a little of admiration. (http://www.newsru.com/cinema/13may2010/vladmih.html). Just for the fact he thinks of himself of such an aristocrate, that when buying the whole village-pays pennies to his modern "serfs" http://m.kp.ru/daily/23941.4/70745/, http://kprf-kchr.ru/?q=node/4022

 

[Laura]

You still haven't answered my questions, Antony.

 

[Niall]

You still haven't answered my questions, Antony.

Nor mine. As someone who is "very deeply wrapped in Russia's reality", I'm surprised you have no opinion on why Putin is vilified/demonized in the West.