The fact that you're feeling things deeply right now (coupled with your rather intense dreams), even if some of that are negative emotions, is evidence enough that you're certainly NOT emotionally dead" and "perverted". I think it's more to do with emotional blockages and negative programming instilled in you (and in most of us) during your childhood, regarding "sex" and relationships.
I was brought up as a Catholic, where sex is frowned upon and regarded as dirty and almost unnatural. Hence, my view of physical desire has been coloured by that belief that it was something shameful and evil. That sex doesn't mix well with emotions and loving - that these 2 things are antagonistic and must be separated. The idea of separating sexual desire from love is completely schizophrenic, and may lead to pathology, or at least pathological behaviour. To thinking patterns like: "I love that person – hence wanting them sexually is dirty and shameful, "unpure". Or the reverse: "I want that person, hence I don't/can't love them". I know it's a bit more complicated than that, but that's the general idea.
It's exactly the type of thought I have, and I think my dad played a part of it because he said two things that hurt me when I was a kid " the place you came from wasn't very clean either (no details needed of course..) and I would have been better off cutting my balls off than having a kid like you " I should remove my father's thoughts that are not mine but how to forget that and move on ? it's like a loop in my head
Keep in mind that those are novels/fictions, and not necessarily realistic – though, from other members' accounts (for ie,
MK Scarlett), and from reading some real life testimonies on the Internet, that kind of "love at first sight" phenomenon does exist. Of course, it's not the be all and end all. It's what you do with those feelings of attraction that counts: say the attraction is mutual. OK: but what is your intent? And what is the other person's intent? I'm not sure just "riding out into the sunset" is gonna lead to something productive for either of you.
Anyway, in the novels, the author kind of "speeds up" the process in order to get to the heart of the matter as quickly as possible: which is, as Laura said, strong physical attraction which leads to immediate intimacy between the characters, which leads to a breaking down of the barriers which prevent them from expressing their true self and true emotions. Direct, raw physical contact is a springboard, it lays the ground, so to say, for inner transformation.
I have never had love at first sight or an intense physical desire for someone, although it can happen (and I would like to find an explanation other than an unconscious program that is triggered for that person). It seems to me (purely subjective so not the truth) healthier to get to know someone in the mind first, rather than give in to the sexual allure of the body and get to know each other afterwards. Well, I don't know, but the question I ask myself is "is there a sequence that is perhaps more noble, more romantic than another? "Perhaps I am too much of a perfectionist and don't let myself "go" to what my body dictates? You see all these questions are like missiles in my head. Maybe I am trying so hard to do the right thing (as little STS as possible) that I completely miss the naturalness of things.
I don't see "seduction" in the novel we're talking about. The interactions between Beth and Ian are anything but a game: Ian is completely honest regarding his intentions. Even blunt. He's not hiding anything (his "autistic" condition makes him incapable of lying), except for his wounding (because of fear). He falsely believes that he's unable to love. But then, Beth happens and shatters that belief. In the end, truth prevails.
In this case my perception of seduction is twisted and needs to be reviewed, you may be pointing out that I am over-analyzing the book too intellectually (perhaps this is a way to protect myself from the appearance of emotions that are too intense..
What's wrong about that, if both are perfectly honest about what they want/need, and if the wife is perfectly willing and wanting - needing – to satisfy her husband? The husband wants to be "fed", and the wife feeds him willingly. In the end, everyone is happy.
Well I don't know but I can't think there's anything wrong with that... probably some program here that's lying around or an instilled belief that I don't know how to get rid of.
Ian has been deeply hurt, and traumatised (SPOILERS) by 1/ seeing his own father murder his mother 2/ being sent to a lunatic asylum where he was tortured. No wonder he "hides" and believes he's unable to love anyone. But his actions prove otherwise. Regarding the scene in the hotel, I don't see it as mechanical and emotionless at all. There's a very strong emotional connection between the 2 characters, and though there's still inner considering, conflict, hiding, and false beliefs, Ian comes close to completely baring his soul to Beth by offering himself up to her, at last being able to look her in the eyes - something he was never capable of before.
And that's exactly the point of this/those books, I think. As said, it's a process, and the sexual union is a means to that end: inner transformation, getting rid of programs, becoming able to give all to one person, and then to more and more people (those who ask).
If the books are doing all this, then it means you're on the right track. It's not supposed to be a walk in the park
I sometimes alternate between anger, deep sadness, frustration, shame, feelings of loneliness, conflicting thoughts, and pure joy and peace/serenity. My advice would be: keep reading (and stick to the MacKenzie series), and you'll see how the journey will take you deeper into unexplored territories, as you uncover layers and layers of buried emotional stuff. Laura is right, you really need to read a bunch of those books in order to grasp what they are really about: unlocking your creative potential and your capacity to love/accept someone/people as they really are (including yourself) and give. Well, that's how I see it right now, after a breakthrough experienced from reading the 3rd book. There's probably more, much more to uncover.
I've been experiencing the same, and most probably other people too. It is an emotional roller coaster alright, but it's worth it. Keep going!
It requires me to finish the book before I can answer, because I think that with what you just said, my thoughts/beliefs will better understand what was at stake from the start, it may allow me to better accept the why of the initial attraction? (it's just a possibility). By reading you I know I'm wrong and you show me a royal way of understanding what these books are. I'd love to get rid of them but how to reshape what I believe on relationship ? keep reading those books ? This is really painful of course but no free meal...
Thank you very much Adaryn for pointing all those things, this is not a walk in the park but we are on the same boat ^^ !
Hi abats thank you for sharing through what you are going through. Don't know but from what you wrote I get the feeling that you are undergoing an internal change, the false personality beginning to disintegrate in a positive way thus giving room to your true self to manifest itself more strongly in your life maybe?
As regarding the longing for someone to love, to walk with through this life, it's normal and understandable. I've gone through what you are going right now, in my case though, I've wasted a lot of time and energy searching for a friend/companion in this life to no avail.
Finally I came to realize with the help of our community and after deeply thinking on what i was really looking for until I got it, or so I think. That is, what I really was looking for was a reconciliation of my female energy with my male energy, of my right hemisphere with my left hemisphere of the brain, of the integration of the two halves of myself into one. So i stopped looking and searching outwardly and began searching inwardly and it's unbelievable even to me while writing this but i've reached a sort of inner peace regarding this matter.
Though what I wrote above may be only my delusions, or wishful thinking, a way to dissociate myself from loneliness, but to be honest I don't think that this is the case.
The point I'm trying to make is that everybody is different as regarding the lessons we have to learn in order to go forward. Keep reading the recommended novels and pay attention critically to what you feel, observe yourself for enough time in order to be ready to ask yourself what are you really looking for? And where you can find what you are looking for: outwardly or inwardly?
Thank you Andrian for your words and kindness
I think that the biggest consequence of those book (and what this is most painful) is because I was living only with my intellect and I kept a lot of emotion far away from me in order to "survive" and keep my mind sane when I couldn't express what I was feeling when I was a child.
I do not invest myself in the search for a partner even if I have a feeling of loneliness that invades me at times (well, even more so with reading). As you said, it's a waste of time and energy, a partner has to come or not, I don't think we choose, it happens when we are ready. I remember Pierre who wrote that and it make me think a lot about love and the universe
I think that a proper relation (i.e. the kind of beautiful love story a lot of us dream about sometimes) is something that happens not because you want it but because you are ready.
A necessary but not sufficient condition to be ready is to stop wanting a relation.
Did you ever notice that some things that you wished for only materialized after you had stopped demanding for them?
It might sound paradoxical but imagine you are a father and your kid is insistently demanding this toy car. You might refuse to buy it because you don't want to reinforce this capricious streak in your kid. But once your kid stops demanding, once he's more reasonable and behaves well, you decide to reward him and offer him this beautiful toy car he likes so much.
I don't know, maybe the Universe is this kind of Daddy!
I had sort of a natural inclination or intuition to step up E E while reading these books. I think I understand where you're coming from because I had such intense emotions along the lines you describe back in the early 2010's. So, I think I know the soul aching of which you speak. But like you said (in so many words) it's a mess of emotions. Back then I practice E E sometimes five days a week. I wouldn't necessarily advise that. I have a tendency to overdo things as I was beginning to recover from addiction at the time. I figured I had a lot to process. It was a rollercoaster but along with all of that emotion was catharsis and reaching for a part of myself beyond the turmoil. As I looked back on it afterwards, it was like passing through the fire even though there were still trials to come.
I see others have chimed in as I have written this. Bottom line is it's a very personal journey but I don't think you should feel like there's something 'wrong' with you as a soul in struggle. Only that it's a struggle with a purpose and you can get to the other side of it in time.
Thank you genero81, I practiced EE for several months but nothing came up emotionally except in a dream or rather a nightmare. This is a good reason to practice right now with this reading and thank you for pointing out this program to me again. It will surely accompany the process of transformation that seems to be taking place here.
I haven't read the books, but I feel ya, been feeling like this lately too.
Take care of yourself, this isn't easy as I could expect, I wish you a lot of courage
My take on Ian is that it is his perception of himself that he cannot love. The story gives examples of the complete opposite though.
There is exquisite symbology in the opening chapters where Lyndon Maher is selling a Ming bowl.
There is nothing wrong with desiring a woman, and buying her flowers in hope that a relationship with her can go further. Where things can go astray is if she indicates that she does not wish to pursue a relationship - how is the rejection handled? Do you allow her a free will choice? Are you prepared to accept and deal with the hurt and rejection without blaming or pressuring her? Do you frighten her in your pursuit of her? Do you persist to the degree that she is going to extraordinary ends to avoid you? It's in the ability to perceive those differences and make a choice rather than be totally led by one's own desire or agenda without consideration for the well being of or choices of the one that you are attracted to that makes the difference.
I think that if the potential or desire wasn't there to have such relationships and recognise our own shortcomings in the reading, then the novels wouldn't be having the effect that you describe. I mean, Ian could have been just like Lyndon Maher. Take heart Abats
it does hurt and tap into a longing for something that is maybe a part of genetic memory but that is difficult to find in this world as it is. I think all the negative programs we have around sex are learned, and so there's a possibility that they can be unlearned if that's what is wanted and yeah, it's a rollercoaster. Best we can do is strive and use what comes up for us to prepare for the kind of relationship we are yearning.
You have underlined something important with the example of flowers from a man to his wife and which I hadn't thought of! It's respect for the other's choice! It completely changes my vision, there is no harm in making an act that hides a request if in all cases the free will of the other is respected. This has just shown me that I don't have this triangle view in the dynamic of exchanges between the man who asks and the woman who gives his answer. It is as you said it so well there that lies all the difference between a beautiful and authentic approach of another with manipulative intentions or whatever happens.
You are right to say that the effect of these books sucks in me a real desire to have a relationship (maybe the emotions generated from these readings activate this particular desire in me) but I prefer a million times to be alone, than to be with someone in a lie and / or to be in a relationship that does not allow to evolve and leads nowhere. When I see my friends who are married, who have children etc... I try to put myself in their place but as they are quite in the matrix despite everything, it doesn't suck the desire to have the kind of relationship they have, at least not anymore!
thank you for your encouragement, the last novel I read was 10 years ago and it wasn't really about love, so it's a total novelty and the first time I read this kind of books.
At some point everybody ask himself/herself the question: What's the point of working on myself, if I am so alone? And it's horrible when you don't have an answer to that. Or when you get one that says something along the line of: "to find my soulmate, to be saved, to be secure etc", you realize you wanted something in return for your efforts, and well, you're not happy with yourself.
The thing I am trying to convey is, that it's a natural, albeit painful process to identify all the lies we told ourselves, all the lies we gulped down as children, teens and adults, because we needed to belong to the group to survive and thrive... We made allowances where none were due, we belittled ourselves and others, shut our "little voice" away from us... until we would grow strong enough to face all those lies and crappy beliefs. What's important is, what you decide to do with those beliefs once you saw them?
I went through a similar phase when i was 25 years old, I realised the dissonance of what I truly wanted in my heart of hearts in term of my relationship with men and others in general, and all the programms and beliefs I held that were in complete contradiction. I felt hollow inside for a long good while, and I felt I was digging and digging with no end in sight. I felt the world was gray, there weren't enough joy, laughter, love...Along the way, I decided to continue searching for answers because I felt that I had nothing better to do and it felt like it was the right thing to do, I owed it to myself. After a while (several years, but I don't want to depress you even more), I began to feel whole on the inside, I felt secure, grounded, at peace, complete. I still don't manage to always feel this way, but I am working on it. All I can say is that it was worth all the depression and the tears.
Regarding Ian in the Mackenzie series, I thought "oh well, he's being honest, she knows what she wants, no problem here". There is a subtle yet defining nuance between: 1) wanting to bed someone while at the same time being aware that you have a human being that doesn't nor will ever belong to you, an equal so to say. 2) wanting to bed someone and seeing, instead of a person, a piece of beddable meat, a walking wallet, etc,etc... The problem is that it's very difficult to differenciate the two scenarios, because people lie to themselves, to others, so of course being honest on a subject such as sexuality, when you desire someone... well you see how well it goes.
Since you seem keen on reading, I warmly recommand you two books on the Holy masculine, courteous love and Love from Jacqueline Kelen (it's only in french though). They are in the same vein of our romance book list, I doubt they will disturb your healing process. Here they are: "L'Eternel masculin" and "Amour, invicible amour". I found those read very healing.
And I am joining the others in saying: take heart Abats! You are on the right path, and also, it takes some guts to share what you shared, so I trust you will be fine.
Thank you Ryu for sharing what you went through. It seems to have been very difficult for you. I had this phase that you describe a few years ago with all these issues that you illustrate very well. One day I took the bull by the horns as they say and changed what was wrong so that I could feel whole with myself already. No need to be saved, no need to find the chosen one of your heart, no need to envy other couples etc... Better to be alone than badly accompanied! What makes me alive today is to learn who I am, what I need to change / treat to be in harmony with others and see them as they are, to love them as they are without judging them. It has been a real joy since I read the wave and better understood the multidimensional reality of our world. All these beliefs have jumped! A bit depressing but every fall precedes a rise! As you say, what do you do with these beliefs when you see them? With these books on romance it's going to be bull by the horns again, maybe I'm a bit brutal with myself but the idea of having been perverted by a bunch of programs and beliefs somehow makes me sick in a way. At this time of transition, what we do for ourselves, we also do for others, that's kind of how I understand work!
You underline the point in the mackenzie series of the intention behind an act and its nuances, and above all to clearly identify the primary motivation! This helps me to better understand the dynamics of the characters in their sexuality, which shows me the more positive side of the act in question. Thank you for your encouragement and the books you recommend. I'm already going to finish the first Mackenzie series and try to identify the process I'm going through!
My internship supervisor used to say to me often : The world takes the shape of our gaze.
I sincerely hope that you will reach your goals of peace, completeness and security, I wish you in turn good luck in your journey.
Thank you everyone for all those precious insight and reflection, there is a lot of work for me to do, and I hope that this little testimony on what I feel / felt on those reading will help others !
. How you get hooked each book is better than the previous.
