Session 09 June 2009

rrraven said:
I was wondering if a music/singing teacher can teach correct breathing methods
since there is no new-agey agenda to singing?

In my experience, I'm sorry to say, singers and singing teachers have a very limited knowledge of what REALLY goes on when they breath while singing. Most of us classical singers have learnt by practising for years and years some form of "correct" breathing that seem to work for us selves. But REALLY few singers/teachers can relate to another persons problems in breathing and give useful advice - I'm not kidding! That's why the singing business is so full of con artists and gurus, because know one knows anything, and at the same time everyone thinks THEIR technique is the right one :P

There are exceptional teachers and I'm certainly not claiming to be one. Just telling you my experiences. But even those rare really good singing teachers have gathered their knowledge of breathing from other sources like pilates, yoga, Alexander technique. And much attention is given to the "support muscles" and how to onset the tone (breathing out with "holding back" the pressure on the glottis); I'm not going to bore you with the details, but e.g. some muscle groups like the deep pelvic muscles need to be trained. So, I wouldn't hold my breath in search of "correct breathing" in the singing sector - BUT(!) well functioning and "free" breathing just CRAVES for some singing to be done "with it"! There's nothing more relaxing and satisfying than succeeding breathing "fully" and hitting a beautiful tone - that doesn't happen often, but sometimes ;)
 
Lucas said:
Hi

Best way will be wait to next C'S session and ask about video / music / practice and other stuff That help to make" C's Breathing technik with + ........... " FAQ ;] .At this point better is Read watch and gartering knowledge about this technik .


By Laura : The end result was, of course, that you spend a lot of
time in an altered state under the tutelage of an AoL instructor!!! That's not a good thing,
Then better don't sing up to the AOL


MilkoJanovich : I’ve already written to the teacher who teaches Shudarshan Kriya in Warsaw but I’m not sure if I really should attend her lessons.
It is a five days course. Should it really be so long? Does someone know how fast can people learn that?

IF you are from Poland Warsaw I'm from Olsztyn it is only 250 km then we can make and Practie it together ( we can make Bigger group ) as sitta Wrote ... :

sitta :Yes, I would like to practice "Pranayama" breathing with a group. The probability of making
mistakes that way is far less than when you doing it alone. Moreover from above posts and
given sources it's pretty clear that wrong breathing is dangerous. I agree that we should wait for more guidance.
As it is now, I won't be able to take part in group sessions till end of september
(if any group emerge that is), which give me some time to learn more about it,
and also time to find suitable Reiki master here in Poland.

Hm sitta I fell that we have time to the end of October 2010 . But dont know how long we must practice it to make good progress ? then better start it faster.For me time is not so much problem , then I'm open to metting with group - with C'S + Sott + Laura FAQ about this technik .


Laura : So our experience is a lot different than probably anybody who signs up for the course on the "outside."

Then Sing up to AOL will only help breathing but that is not what we want ...

Laura : We also did not sign any kind of non-disclosure agreements. So that will also be different and ya'll
might want to think about that. If you sign it, you are legally bound by it and you may no longer
be able to discuss it here on the forum without legal ramifications!!!!

And this is important If they are "secret group" etc. They Can Sue Sott and this forum for talking about it , as C'S says they are Separated to stop us and others with us Work.

Thanks for your replies Laura and Lukas!
I didn't know that AoL works in this way but it seemed for me to be an unsavory organization and that's why I wrote an email to that teacher with a couple of questions.

Lukas, why do you think that we have time to October 2010?

Meeting is not a bad idea but is it fully safe to meet with ppl you don't know well enough?
 
MilkoJanovich said:
Thanks for your replies Laura and Lukas!
I didn't know that AoL works in this way but it seemed for me to be an unsavory organization and that's why I wrote an email to that teacher with a couple of questions.

Lukas, why do you think that we have time to October 2010?

Meeting is not a bad idea but is it fully safe to meet with ppl you don't know well enough?

This is a wise question, MilkoJanovich - please see this thread for details . In short, meeting physically with people who you just know from this public forum, no matter how nice they seem, is not something that is encouraged - and vigilance is key. The point being that this is a public forum and that means that one must take the same care with interacting with members of it as they would with interacting with anyone else. I think there is a better past thread that goes into more detail - I'll try to find it a little later.
 
Gimpy said:
Gwelan (too) said:
I wonder if, in a way, we're not actually receiving a lesson like : "are we really to play Simmon says ?" :whistle:

I have a deep respect for Laura and her work, but with what happenned lately, I had the impression to see several bodies, with only one brain! (hers). :huh:

I think we should seriously think about that : can it be right ? When we let someone do the thinking for us, can we get any understanding from that ? Well, she cannot be the only one who works ! :grad:


:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Thanks for the laugh! It was a welcome surprise!

When you're ready to step out of those clown shoes, welcome aboard....

If I remember correctly, Gewlan is a former member of OnNousCacheTout - a now defunct French discussion forum that was run by an idealistic couple we knew here who have since disappeared to live a more "earth friendly" life in the belief that if everybody does this, everything will just automatically fix itself, and if it doesn't, at least they will have had some peace and New Age fun in the meantime. Anyway, Gwelan came with them to visit us here a few years ago.

The chief thing I recall about Gwelan was that he really didn't "like" the idea of OPs.

So, speaking of one head with several bodies, and that one head buried in the sand... it strikes me that we have here the attitude of someone similar to what is evidenced in this thread ... and my comments to and about Amir may be similarly applied. (As well as Amir's opinion of me!)

Anyway, it's worth re-reading this short piece by one of the SOTT editors just to get the flavor of the problem: If The Sociopath Is Next Door - Move Upstairs which begins:

I recently finished reading "The Sociopath Next Door" by Martha Stout Ph.D. and wanted to share with you some realizations. I hope they are helpful.

Before reading the final pages of the book, I was sure that the idea that psychopaths are NOT like most of other people was pretty much "accepted" in my mind. I was sure that I "understood" it intellectually, even if I did not "believe" it 100% yet. Well, somehow, those few final pages organized everything in my mind, and the realization is profound and shocking: psychopaths ARE different. I'll try to explain what I've understood.

First, some words from Laura Knight-Jadczyk about the importance of "believing":

"Today it came to me: The biggest problem most of us have (yours truly included) is BELIEVING that there can be human looking beings that are simply not human inside, or are deviant from normal humans, or cannot be fixed, or whatever.

We keep wanting to try this or that or the other thing because in our heart of hearts, we do not WANT to believe it. We do not want to acknowledge that our reality is that cruel, that human beings are not at the top of the food chain, that there ARE different sub-species of human beings that prey on other sub-species.

It's just too damn far out.

And that is because we have been taught something entirely different from infancy, and so we can't BELIEVE it.

What is so important about understanding it this way?

What I notice is that many of you still do not "believe" it and you have not reached that point where you have nothing to lose to try a different hypothesis of reality. You continue on every day in low-level interactions with teensy tinesy petty tyrants and don't really believe that quite a number of them could, just possibly, be intra-species predators... It's all theoretical and interesting and all that, but not really real. It is not part of your BELIEF.

And your belief about reality which is shaped by psychopaths seeking to conceal their existence and reality and control is still a LIE. And as long as you continue to believe a lie, you are blocked from the cascade of events that can transpire if the "truth" binds to your psychic receptors.

When I first read the above comments, I hadn't yet read the book, and I have to admit that my understanding of psychopaths being "different" was mainly theoretical, even if I had lot of opportunities to observe their nature and experience it in the flesh. But it didn't "click" until I finished "The Sociopath Next Door". {...}
 
If I remember correctly, Gewlan is a former member of OnNousCacheTout - a now defunct French discussion forum that was run by an idealistic couple we knew here who have since disappeared to live a more "earth friendly" life in the belief that if everybody does this, everything will just automatically fix itself, and if it doesn't, at least they will have had some peace and New Age fun in the meantime. Anyway, Gwelan came with them to visit us here a few years ago.

The chief thing I recall about Gwelan was that he really didn't "like" the idea of OPs.

So, speaking of one head with several bodies, and that one head buried in the sand... it strikes me that we have here the attitude of someone similar to what is evidenced in this thread ... and my comments to and about Amir may be similarly applied. (As well as Amir's opinion of me!)


So Gwelan isn't poking fun and reminding people to do their 'homework'.....?
 
I was just curious, instead of breaking down what these people are thinking or where there coming from, why even bother to respond? It seems apparent what this person's agenda was all along. What is the purpose in getting defensive? you just responed exactly as he hoped you would!
 
RyanAM said:
I was just curious, instead of breaking down what these people are thinking or where there coming from, why even bother to respond? It seems apparent what this person's agenda was all along. What is the purpose in getting defensive? you just responed exactly as he hoped you would!

We don't "ignore" anyone on this forum; nor do we make "assumptions" about a possible "agenda" without a certain amount of enquiry and discussion. If the meaning of someone's post is questionable and/or unclear, we take the time to ask them about the meaning/intent of that post. Gwelen has not yet responded to the questions/posts directed at him. He doesn't have a history of not responding to other members, so it is reasonable to expect that he will.

You indicate that you think it is "apparent what this person's agenda was all along". Could you explain what you think that agenda is, and what it is he was "hoping for" in the way of a response?

Oh, and I didn't notice anyone getting "defensive" over Gwelen's comments. What gave you that impression?
 
I am not worried about me so there isn't much to say about this. She seemed to get worked about his post, i call that a defensive approach.
 
RyanAM said:
I am not worried about me so there isn't much to say about this. She seemed to get worked about his post, i call that a defensive approach.

I'm really quite bewildered by your perception of Laura being "worked [up] about his post". What, specifically, gives you that impression? I'd also appreciate it if you could answer the other questions I posed in my last message. You seem to be seriously mis-reading something here, and I think it's important that we try to find out why....


Edit: I realize I'm not 100% sure which posts/posters/threads you were referring to? Were you talking about Laura's response to Gwelen's post... or Laura's response to Amir's messages... or both?
 
I was just bringing up the idea that he wrote what he did to get her worked up, and i believe he was successful. It was just an opinion, i really have nothing to be arguing about, and wish this would end. thank you.
 
RyanAM said:
I was just bringing up the idea that he wrote what he did to get her worked up, and i believe he was successful. It was just an opinion, i really have nothing to be arguing about, and wish this would end. thank you.

You are missing the fact that Amir is not the only one reading the forum, or Laura's reply to him. If anything, Amir was successful in allowing Laura to point out the errors in his, and many others', ideas about this world, and in turn talk about the possibilities for overcoming these errors.

Apparently you did not find any value in what Laura replied to Amir, or else you wouldn't think that it was all a waste of time and energy.
 
RyanAM said:
I was just bringing up the idea that he wrote what he did to get her worked up, and i believe he was successful. It was just an opinion, i really have nothing to be arguing about, and wish this would end. thank you.

RyanAM:

There is no "argument" here. This is an opportunity for you to learn something quite important, and it's not a good idea to try and "brush it off" now that what you posted has been questioned.

First of all, this is not like other "chat" forums, where people just throw out "opinions" for the sake of it. We are not interested in "opinions", this is a place of learning and we are interested in perceiving matters objectively for the purpose of gathering data.

Since you are apparently unable/unwilling to answer questions about what specific data led you to conclude that one or more posters here had an "apparent (to you) agenda", and that Laura's response to him/them was both not worth the "bother" and of a "defensive" and "worked up" nature, are you willing to consider that your perception may have been quite subjective and therefore not accurate? And, since this is an environment in which members endeavour to become more objective in their perceptions, do you not think it would be useful (from a learning perspective) to find out why your "reading" of the posts/posters involved is so "off"?
 
RyanAM said:
I was just bringing up the idea that he wrote what he did to get her worked up, and i believe he was successful. It was just an opinion, i really have nothing to be arguing about, and wish this would end. thank you.

Sorry, I don't get "worked up." I just remember all the other readers who are looking for information and I seek to inform and/or educate them or, at the very least, use each opportunity as a platform for acquiring knowledge of some sort. Sorry that this doesn't meet your needs.
 
I want to apologize, I've gained much knowledge from your work and find much of it to be valid. I wanted to delete that post after i wrote and read again the post before it. This is why I appear to be as confused as i was. I would really enjoy hearing from the C's about our current global situation, i feel it isn't pretty.




""Whithersoever you turn, there is the Face of God"
 
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I have always had a skeptical take on Sri Sri Ravi Shankar but could never find any objective explanation for it until I came across this commentary on him at

http://www.yunusnews.com/node/486.

After reading it many of my feelings about him not being genuine were validated. Likewise, I am very skeptical of many large organizations with a guru like Shankar at the helm. After reading this article, I am even more skeptical of “The Art of Living” movement and the supposedly “new” breathing technique of Sudarshan Kriya.
I sensed that the “C’s” were not impressed by “AOL” or Shankar but seemed to give a thumbs up to Sudarshan Kriya. Since this type of breathing is nothing new and in fact has been previously well documented in “The Hindu Yogi Science of Breath” by Yogi Ramacharaka, maybe some research on the similarities found here as well as others, might be a good path for the QFS to come to some consensus.

For example, I have been rereading Michael Topper’s the Mother book, Life Power and Magnum Organum writings. When I first read the new “C’s” session 09 June and the group’s interaction with Craig, I flashed on “ Whole –charger breathing”. If you can get Topper’s Magnum Organum the breathing technique is described in detail on pages 499-506 of the Matrix IV. What struck me most about this type of breathing was the emphasis on proper technique and allowing abundant time for a smooth natural progression in order to achieve a balanced change in ones energy systems. I then flashed on the “C’s” comment about “AOL” not being balanced and their warning about “eye gazing”.

All throughout the session I connected with the thread of clues the “C’s” were giving, which Laura highlighted. For me, uniting (combining) specific techniques (use the right ingredients, recipies, actions accelerate growth) to connect to “a higher source” (the mother stone) for guidance through the Crown Chakra (the Orion reference) by moving (uniting) energy from a selected lower chakra level in order to communicate with the “source” to acquire knowledge, so as to accelerate growth. The “C’s also said
that as people learn the practice and implement it, their own awareness can grow along with “being”. And if there is parallel growth in knowledge then the Kriya ( Breathing technique) will enhance this knowledge, thus the protection.

Finally, the references to Paleochristianity made me think that possibly these early human groups had successfully combined the physical techniques, we are trying to identify and learn to do, in balance with their knowledge accumulation to be able to connect to a “Higher Source” for guidance.


I found this description of “Whole-Charger” breathing by Michael Topper to be an interesting east-west perspective.


Whole-charger breathing as outlined in past issues of the T-Bird, furnishes an ideal first step since its oxygenation of the system and ionization of the bloodstream generates a very rapid metabolic economy for the overall, mind-body complex; through this deeper more integral economy (spontaneously powering a subtle shift in ratios-of-emphasis across the autonomic systems in favor of the parasympathetic, correspondent with the ideal value ofPhi aligning subconscious current-centers in exact proportional equivalency with the Conscious axis from which they spring), a surplus "charge" may be quickly accumulated at the vital-physical battery of the solar plexus. High negative ionization-potential translates into greater magnitudes of negatively entropic—pattern-building—synergic energies, or subtle "pranas", drawn directly into the economy of the system through electron surplus (electrons are the atomic "void-navels" or points of physical ingress into the transdimensional infrastructures finely coding and "building out" variable nucleon patterns "from the inside"). While the pH factor tends to average-out the ionization potential, the prana drawn in through it doesn 't neutralize but accumulates, each energy surplus reinforcing and adding to the average across the solar voltaic at the manipura. That surplus charge in conjunction with the deeper metabolic economy, means proportionately less bioelectric energy need be invested in the hormonal and neurochemical cycles conventionally claiming the available energy-capital; the surplus may be used to power glandular chemistries of a higher integral order, manufacturing hormonal keys to complex-dimensional "locks" of the plexiform centers only present previously as dormant/pre-coded potential of the biogenetic pattern.

Unlocking of those threshold values of the multidimensional being, generates a progressively deeper (functional) congruence between subconscious systems patterning the mind/body networks, and the Conscious axis itself. Such a deeper, multidimensional alignment and integration doesn't mean a more rigid-inflexible structure; on the contrary, deeper integral harmony of the autonomic with the conscious systems imparts to the former greater available values of the latter, so that the essential indeterminacy belonging to void-consciousness allows for expandingly elastic degrees of freedom in the variable patterning of memory-codes and subconscious circuits.

The resonant harmonics of the sine-wave patterns emerging from this integral alignment are highly non-linear; reflect a deeper ratio of emphasis on gestalt, right/brain perceptual and cognitive patterning; magnify the presence of theta and delta, incorporating the normal beta functions; and express the presence of an operative mind/body complex progressively functioning monitored already, owing to brain/mind access through signature thought-structures, one may avoid punitive pain-center stimulation etc. by varying the intensity, depth, time intervals, locations and accompanying activity relative to performing the exercise. Experimentation is the only means of determining the optimum combination of factors.[/quote
 
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