The thing is, when Jung coined the term "archetypes", he meant it as a mask for something altogether different and I think that a lot of people understand it in a certain way that is neither bad nor good per se, but simply wrong. Jung MEANT "the old German gods" that could take possession of a person. The truth probably is that there are more "gods" that can take control of a person, or that exist, than just the "Old German" ones. I'm not sure that such an idea ever occurred to Jung as far as I can see from this text. So, in a sense, the concept of archetypes is a good way to think about 4D and higher. Ra referred to them as "social memory complexes."
In my limited understanding of the idea, I did ask some questions about archetypes over the years and interestingly, it seems to have been most recently in respect of Zoroastrianism which so much attracted Jung:
14 Aug 2016
Q: (L) I see. Well, maybe we should begin with some of the questions that are from that abstract level since that's where we are. In the course of my recent research, I keep going deeper and deeper and further back following one thread after another. While I have touched on the topic of Zoroastrianism in the past, I had never gone into it as deeply as I recently decided to do. As a consequence, I ended up reading several scholarly tomes on the topic. It seems there are two schools. One school thinks that Zoroaster was a fairly late phenomenon, probably 7th century BC. The other school relies on the linguistics - the philology I guess they'd call it - and they claim that the language of Zoroaster must date back to the second millennium BC - that is, somewhere between 1600 and 1200 BC. That would put Zoroaster in the timeframe of, say, Akhenaten. In brief, Zoroaster claimed to have had a vision, or so the story goes, that revealed to him the One God, Ahura Mazda, and he promoted a religion of almost pure monotheism as well as being more or less the originator of the idea that human beings have the free will to choose good or evil. He also was the first to come up with ideas of messianism, eschatology. It was an apocalyptic religion in the sense of being revealed, but also that there were to be revelations about the end of time - time of course being a very important concept in his religion as it developed. So, I guess the first question I want to know is: Is there any possibility that Akhenaten was influenced by Zoroastrianism? Is that a possibility?
A: Not just a possibility, but a certainty.
Q: (L) If that's the case, how was that possible?
A: The ancient world was quite "well connected".
Q: (L) Okay... Can you get me any closer to a clue here?
A: Check the Hurrian connection.
Q: (L) I thought I had checked that pretty deeply. I guess I could read some more. Now, there are those who say that Zurvanism was an attempt to deal with some of the dangling problems that Zoroaster left in terms of his dualism. One of his hymns describes Ahura Mazda and Ahriman as twins, so, they came up with Zurvanism, the ultimate god of space/time as father to the twins to explain this. Is that in fact the case?
A: No. Zurvan was the ancient god of the steppes and the Indo-Aryan peoples.
Q: (L) Okay, I've got a paper here... It seems that Zurvan was perceived as the god of infinite time and space, and was described as, "One Alone, a transcendental neutral god, and without passion. One for whom there was no distinction between good and evil. So, Zurvan had a varied history... So, the problem I want to get to right now is the idea that Zurvan was represented as the lion-headed god. There was a lion man figure found in Hohlenstein-Stadel, which is a German cave. It's carved out of ivory, and it's THE oldest known zoomorphic animal sculpture in the world, and the oldest known uncontested example of figurative art. It has been determined to be about - ready? 40,000 years old!! That was by carbon dating the material which was in the same layer where the figure was found. It was associated with the Aurignacian culture and it was 29cm in height, carved out of mammoth ivory using a flint stone knife. Seven parallel, transverse, carved gouges are on the left arm. The figure of Zurvan is often represented with a serpent coiled around him seven time. It is said that the sculpture shares certain similarities with French cave wall paintings which also show hybrid creatures. The Lion man is several thousand years older. Anyhow, this artifact seems to resemble very closely the lion man figure that was described as being the representation of Zurvan. So, I guess my question is: Are we talking about the same religion or religious ideas or perceptions that were common to the cultures that produced the cave art in Western Europe?
A: Yes
Q: (L) And they came up with these ideas of infinite time and space that far back?
A: And so much more. They were "connected".
Q: (L) So in other words, what we are looking at here through a probably distorted survival via Zoroaster or Zarathushtra is that the Aryan religion was based first of all on a supreme principle of infinite time and infinite space from which was born essentially "good mind" and "evil mind" as Zoroaster put it?
A: Yes. STO and STS duality.
Q: (L) And this same religion, either in its older form or its later elaboration by Zarathushtra, was the origin of the ideas of free will?
A: Yes
Q: (L) Of savior gods?
A: Yes
Q: (L) The Six Bounteous Immortals, or I guess what we could say archetypes or sixth density?
A: Yes
Q: (L) Basically, it almost seemed as though it was a religion about information. Everything emerges from information, but there are some other very particular things about it that are very advanced. They were talking about things that physicists talk about nowadays.
A: Yes
Q: (L) It also seems to be the closest religious exposition of anything that I've come across to what we have received via these transmissions.
A: Yes
Q: (L) I'm just saying "close", because obviously there are some distortions and so forth. So did Zarathushtra modify this original religion because he had a vision, or...?
A: The ideas had already been corrupted, and Zarathushtra sought to recover the truth.
Q: (L) So it had already been corrupted, and he was trying to bring it back in line. He got close, but didn't quite make it. Is that it?
A: Yes
Q: (L) And what had it been corrupted to?
A: The Indian Vedas will give clues.
Q: (L) Maybe he wasn't wrong when he said that the divas were demons. Where the divas like STS beings?
A: Close
Q: (L) Were they like 4th density STS?
A: Yes
Q: (L) Okay. Well... I guess that tells me what I wanted to know on that topic. I’ll keep digging.
An earlier discussion from 17 Aug 2000
Q: Our little egroup discussion list is growing. Everyone is talking about the Wave:
what does it mean, what is it, when is it coming, how are we going to be able to tell, and
so on. I have been collecting the material and getting it in shape. I have been learning a
lot as I go along as well. It isn't finished, but as I go along, I do have some questions.
We would like to have a little bit of a clue about the progress of the wave. I would also
like to know if this Wave is sort of like the recompiling of a computer program, with the
universe as the program? What is the progress, and is it going the recompile the program
of our universe?
A: So many questions rolled up into one. But, one way it might go is that all of a
sudden, everything that ever was is new, everything that IS is new, and everything that
will be is new. Programs change, oh we suppose, what an awesome event indeed!
Q: Is it important for the information about the potential making new of everything and
the awareness of the state of the planet as it is now, or the state of the universe, be shared
and spread so that as many people as possible will be aware at the point of the arrival of
the wave so that it makes it more likely that beneficial changes will occur, that the
universe will change in a positive way? Or is that simply not even important. It will
change the way it is going to change no matter what anybody does?
A: Closer to 2nd criterion.
Q: In other words, we are doing what we are doing, and it doesn't really matter what we
are doing. The Wave will happen, everything will change, become new, and that's that?
A: What matters most is what others are doing, have done and will do.
Q: Who are these others that it matters most what they have done, are doing and will do?
A: Program rewriters, i.e. you and us in the future.
Q: So, what we have done, what we are doing, what we will do - WE - is important? I
think that I missed something. I thought you said that what we were doing simply didn't
matter.
A: You are/will be others.
Q: Okay, how is what we are doing now helping or hindering this process?
A: No help/hinder, just is.
Q: So, this has all been done before? It's a foregone conclusion how it is going to turn
out? It's a done deal?
A: No Laura, stop your linearishness!
Q: I don't understand. Is what we are doing making a difference?
A: What is "time?"
Q: Time is an illusion. (A) Is doing also an illusion?
A: If you are thinking in linear "time" terms.
Q: In other words, the best way for an STO future to manifest is for us not to anticipate
that ANYTHING we do will matter. Because, if we are anticipating that what we do will
make a difference, it won't. It is wanting. (A) I can't stop thinking that my working is
going to be useful! (L) I can't stop what I am doing either because it is what I DO. It is
being ME. We have to stop anticipating. We do what is in us to do without expecting it
to matter.
A: And you do it because you are directing you to do it from another plane of existence
where you know the score. Where you are on your present awareness plane, you are
largely, though not completely, scoreless and clueless.
Q: So, it is from another level of reality that we create THIS reality?
A: Close.
Q: How much input do we have from this level of reality regarding the creation of a
future reality, and I use the term "future" loosely, but meaning "future" as we perceive it
from this reality? How much input?
A: About as much awareness as a small child does when contemplating how to fly the
plane they are riding on.
Q: Well, you have talked about the Wave before, and I complained that we did not have
time to do certain things that you had suggested that we do. You said that, yes we would,
and that these things were suggested to "prepare" us for this event. Just trying to deal
with it from a linear point of view, we still have to build this pool with the columns, get a
Nobel prize, supposedly, work with people on the crop circles, and all that. Are we still
looking at doing these things in this linear time progression that we exist in; that we are
aware of as small children on a very large plane?
A: If you let it flow, it will flow.
Q: So, you are us in the future, we are you in the past - when you say this, are you "us"
in the future in the sense of ALL mankind, or in the sense of any particular group of
mankind?
A: In between those limited options.
Q: Could you be more explicit?
A: No, because you wold not "get it."
Q: When I post material on the website, those people who resonate to the material
believe that this refers to them also. I have been of the opinion that Unified Thought
Form being must mean a very large group as represented in this density. I know that we
are dealing with limiting terms. But, is this applied to people who CHOOSE the
Cassiopaean option?
A: Maybe it is best to say it applies to those who recognize the application.
Q: So, if they recognize it, if they know it is them, they are part of it. (A) But, thinking
in nonlinear terms, its up to us to work to make this precise. You are asking this question
which implies that the answer exists. But, exactly what the answer is may be it is not yet
chosen, and it is up to us to make it this way.
A: Lodestar is a clue for you.
Q: I guess that means a guiding star of some sort. Something that attracts... a lodestone
is magnetic, it is where the compass points. In the myth, Cassiopaea, Danae, and Athena
work together to enable Perseus to cut off the head of the Gorgon and kill the sea monster
and rescue Andromeda. Of all the mythical heroes, Perseus stands out because he was
SUCCESSFUL. He went on the quest, he succeeded in the mission, he freed the maiden
in distress, killed a slew of Lizzie types, balanced the situation in his environment, and
then even lived happily ever after. He didn't lose his reason, he didn't fail... it is about the
only really successful myth. He DID it. And did it well. Is that...
A: A quest is successfully followed one step at a time. No need to gauge the staircase.
Q: The only point I was trying to make was that maybe the only reason for the
Cassiopaean connection, maybe even for the term "Cassiopaea," is that it is the archetype
of the function...
A: That is good, planning book fairs? Maybe not so good. We shall see!
Q: You guys, just basically, from the whole start of this thing about a book, have
basically hinted that there is something else in store, and that we should not even try to do
that...
A: We have not said that that is not the way. We have hinted that the way will become
clear when it is necessary.
Q: (A) I think that it is good to have an external pressure to make things happen.
Composers, like Mozart, had to be under pressure to produce. There should be pressure.
We need to have income to build this pool and other things. So, if we put it into the
indefinite future... (L) But they said money will come from unexpected sources. I don't
know where or how that can possibly be. But YOU were certainly unexpected! I would
have dreamed of YOU! (A) Well, there may be another unexpected millionaire may
come to replace me! (L) Nobody could replace YOU! (A) How else shall we explain
this unexpected money?
A: No need to explain, or expect either, silly! You should know that the one time that
Mozart wrote music under external pressure he quickly transited to 5th density.
Q: (A) Well I know that I work best under standard external pressure.
A: No, because you only sometimes think it is external, but it is not really. When you
have been "treated" to external pressure, you have rebelled.
Even earlier on 14 July 1996
Q: (L) You told us before that stars and planets are portals,
or openings into other densities. Is it possible that
this oncoming wave, this Realm Border Crossing will be
accessed through these types of portals, that it is not
something that is actually in our 'space,' but that it
would emanate through stars and planets? Am I onto
something here?
A: You may be starting down a long path.
Q: (L) So, it is complex. When I was re-reading Noah...
A: Just remember: All prophecies attached to calendar dates
are useless unless you wish to be sucked up by the 4th
density STS forces!
Q: (L) Speaking of being sucked up by 4th density STS forces,
MM was told by her local Hindu gathering that she was
vacuuming up their energies. What kind of an interaction
was this? Why were they so uncomfortable?
A: Because they wished to be worshipped.
Q: (L) They wished to suck her energy, because being
worshipped is the equivalent of sucking energy?
A: Close.
Q: (L) Now, I am curious about the doggie image that was on
the aura photo that MM took?
A: In these times, 2nd density creatures will collect more
and more attachments.
Q: (L) Are these attachments like other entities?
A: Yes, and others.
Q: (L) When they are collecting these attachments, are they
collecting them from us, as in protecting?
A: No.
Q: (L) Are they being used to collect attachments to be
detrimental to us?
A: Yes.
Q: (L) You mean we are gonna have to do depossessions on our
dogs, too? (V) Holy Toledo!
A: That won't work.
Q: (L) Why are our animals picking up attachments?
A: Because of vibrational frequency intensifications.
Q: (L) Is there something we could do? I mean, are we
supposed to get rid of pets?
A: We would never suggest something as harsh as this.
However, beware: 3rd density STS orientation includes the
thought of "dominion" over 2nd density, and this is merely
a continuation of the energy buildups of the approach of
the wave... Some of the lessons are interesting indeed.
When you assume that capture and imprisonment of those of
lesser capacity than you is for "the good," why should not
you expect those of greater capacity than you to assume
the same regarding you?!?
Q: (MM) Well, I want to know what is the deal with this
portal in my house?
A: Before we discuss that, we would like you to ponder
further the previously given responses. We suspect there
is much to be gained from insights lurking there. Now:
Portals... ionic column... hmmm...
Q: (V) Are portals archetypal?
A: Are they? Hmmm....
Q: (MM) So, my column is an ionic column? (L) I don't think
that is exactly what they mean. I think that they are
saying that an ionic column represents a portal into the
next density. It is an archetype.
A: Third density facsimile.
Q: (V) So, this is how we choose to see it with our eyes?
(L) I think they mean that it is a representation, that it
follows in its form the 4th density form, only it is
material here.
A: And 5th density, etc...
That shouldn't even be possible and I don't know where they get the idea that it is.
Works for me.
Well, not saying that it's impossible, but reading it with this idea of "hybridization" in mind, some parts make a little more sense:
