Smoking is... good?

[Arwenn]

Hi everyone,

Im interested in starting smoking, but I am not by nature a smoker (toyed with it as a teen just to fit in). From reading some of the smoking info on this thread, it looks like the options are organic tobacco and ryo, or use a pipe.mI have tried a Shisha when I was in the Middle East, & would like to know if anyone else has researched this method. I know that the tobacco is flavored with sweetener (molasses or honey) and fruit. The brand Nakhla is supposed to have the highest amounts of nicotine. Here is a tobacco information page of a Shisha website http://www.hookahkings.com/shisha-tobacco-information-page.html

So I thought I'd look at the medical research on Shisha/ Hookah smoking, and here is what I came across. Looking at Medscape, I found this very interesting study which can be read at http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/557428_2, which states "Hookah or water-pipe smoking, also known as narghile, shisha, or goza, has been used in the Middle East and Asia for more than 400 years (Rosenow, 2006). The hookah apparatus consists of a base that is filled with water, a bowl, a heating device that contains the tobacco and other products, a pipe... When the smoker inhales through the hose, the smoke from the tobacco passes through the water into a chamber and then is inhaled (Rosenow). According to the World Health Organization, a 1-hour session of hookah smoking exposes the individual to high levels of toxic compounds.....as well as significant levels of nicotine (Rosenow). One 30- to 60-minute session is equivalent to smoking an entire pack of cigarettes at one sitting (Loffredo, 2006) ". "A common misperception is that hookah smoking is less dangerous than cigarette smoking, when, in fact, the use of the hookah may result in a higher concentration of absorbed nicotine (Knishkowy & Amitai, 2005)."

There is an article on Medical News Today titled "Shisha smoking is More harmful than cigarettes", but mainly states this is due to carbon monoxide and does nothing to back that statement with scientific evidence.

I will look into this further, as I don't think I have the 'genetic profile' type to be a full time smoker, but I'd be quite happy to toke on the peace pipe every night (especially if it gives me the same effect as an entire pack of cigs in 1 sitting! I will research the tobacco for shishas more and report back to the forum.

As I am new to posting and forums, please let me know if I should start a new thread for this, or if OK to post here. Many thanks

Arwenn

 

[Beau]

I know that the tobacco is flavored with sweetener (molasses or honey) and fruit.

Not fruit, fruit "flavorings". That's where I've always been suspicious of shisha. I can imagine that the concoction produced to make that flavor is probably not filled with healthy products. So that, plus the molasses in shisha, makes me think it's not the best method for getting nicotine into your system.

 

[Arwenn]

I know that the tobacco is flavored with sweetener (molasses or honey) and fruit.

Not fruit, fruit "flavorings". That's where I've always been suspicious of shisha. I can imagine that the concoction produced to make that flavor is probably not filled with healthy products. So that, plus the molasses in shisha, makes me think it's not the best method for getting nicotine into your system.

I totally agree with you & hence the need to research exactly what is in there. Apparently plain Shisha tobacco is available- some of the brands are: Nakhla Zaghoul, Nakhla Khan el Khalili, Salloum Plain, Desi Murli Plain, and Desi Murli Gold Plain.(I'm just not sure if they're a molasses concoction or just plain tobacco).

 

[Beau]

I know that the tobacco is flavored with sweetener (molasses or honey) and fruit.

Not fruit, fruit "flavorings". That's where I've always been suspicious of shisha. I can imagine that the concoction produced to make that flavor is probably not filled with healthy products. So that, plus the molasses in shisha, makes me think it's not the best method for getting nicotine into your system.

I totally agree with you & hence the need to research exactly what is in there. Apparently plain Shisha tobacco is available- some of the brands are: Nakhla Zaghoul, Nakhla Khan el Khalili, Salloum Plain, Desi Murli Plain, and Desi Murli Gold Plain.(I'm just not sure if they're a molasses concoction or just plain tobacco).

I believe all shisha has molasses in it.

 

[Arwenn]

I believe all shisha has molasses in it.

Heimdallr, why would the molasses be such a bad thing, if the nicotine content is so much higher? Also, could you comment on tar in cigarettes vs water-pipes, as that is something else I need to look into.

Thanks :)

 

[Beau]

Heimdallr, why would the molasses be such a bad thing, if the nicotine content is so much higher?

Molasses has sugar in it, that's why I wonder how healthy it is for you, not to mention the process of how shisha is made is a mystery to me so who knows how healthy the molasses is that is being put into shisha. Even though the burning of the tobacco may render some of the sugar impotent once inhaled, it's not something I'm totally sure of and if not sure, I would err on the side of caution.

Also, could you comment on tar in cigarettes vs water-pipes, as that is something else I need to look into.

The tobacco used in shisha is not organic, so I would think that the tar levels would be similar to cigarettes but I can't say for sure. It may help that the smoke is filtered through water but again, that's just speculation.

 

[Maya]

I was sooooo happy when discovered this topic 2 years ago...
all my life I was attracted to tobacco smell , now I'm finally enjoying it without
any blame ... I roll it with some raw vanilla bits, mmmm.. it smells divine !
And nicotine is real treat for my body

 

[herondancer]

Chaps23, the Forum guidelines are clear about posting references to illegal substances on the Forum. We in no way condone the use of them. Please be aware of this in the future.

 

[Gaby]

This came to my attention via a smoking colleague who happens to be a Chief of the Division of Endocrinology:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22651374

Current smoking is associated with a low prevalence of thyroid autoantibodies. On the other hand, smoking withdrawal enhances thyroid autoantibody level and may be a risk factor for the development of hypothyroidism. The aim of this study was to assess the association between smoking habits (smoking cessation in particular) and development of autoimmune hypothyroidism...

The risk of having overt autoimmune hypothyroidism diagnosed is more than 6-fold increased the first 2 years after cessation of smoking...

Several studies have shown a lower prevalence of circulating thyroid autoantibodies among smokers vs nonsmokers,[17, 18, 21] and recently, it was shown in a Dutch follow-up study that smoking cessation was accompanied by the appearance in serum of thyroid antibodies.[22] From a theoretical point of view, such appearance of thyroid autoantibodies may indicate a higher risk of developing autoimmune thyroid disease...

In this population-based study, we found in all subgroups investigated a strong positive association between recent smoking cessation (within 2 years) and the incidence of overt autoimmune hypothyroidism. No association was found between hypothyroidism and other smoking characteristics such as current and previous smoking (all subgroups combined), type of smoking, years of smoking or the magnitude of tobacco consumption. Cases had a 7·5 kilograms higher body weight compared to controls, which is compatible with the fluid accumulation of untreated hypothyroidism.[32]...

Various mechanisms may be responsible for the development of hypothyroidism in subjects who have recently quit smoking. There is a complex interaction between smoking and the immune system, and our study gives no clues on the specific molecular mechanism involved. Several studies have shown a lower prevalence of circulating thyroid autoantibodies among smokers,[17, 18, 21] and there is an increase in autoantibody levels among recent smoking quitters.[22] Therefore, a rebound of thyroid autoimmunity after smoking cessation seems to take place...

Transition from current to ex-smoker may lead to limitation in activity,[34] to chronic health conditions,[34] to physical and psychological symptoms[35] and to a higher hospital admissions,[34] which may enhance the probability for having a blood test drawn and hypothyroidism diagnosed. However, we found no indication of more thyroid function tests performed in recent smoking quitters. Furthermore, the recent quitters who developed hypothyroidism were biochemically more hypothyroid at the time of diagnoses...

 

[Alana]

This came to my attention via a smoking colleague who happens to be a Chief of the Division of Endocrinology:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22651374

Current smoking is associated with a low prevalence of thyroid autoantibodies. On the other hand, smoking withdrawal enhances thyroid autoantibody level and may be a risk factor for the development of hypothyroidism. The aim of this study was to assess the association between smoking habits (smoking cessation in particular) and development of autoimmune hypothyroidism...

The risk of having overt autoimmune hypothyroidism diagnosed is more than 6-fold increased the first 2 years after cessation of smoking...

That's very interesting, because it was almost 2 years after I quit smoking that I got the hypothyroidism diagnosis. Unfortunately, I became a vegetarian at that time too, so it's hard to know which exactly was the cause (probably a combination of high carbs, gluten-and-soy-full foods with the cessation of smoking). I also recall that during those 3 years of not-smoking-being-vegetarian, I was sick more often, and suffered from severe depressions more often.

 

[Kaigen]

:) My mother want to send package to me from Germany and asking what to put in!
I want to ask her to put some cigars or cigarillos, I have no idea what brand, can you help?
should not be to expensive, I remember from Germany Moods or Dannemanns but they had
filter. Any suggestions? Thanks! I was trying several times with smoking cigarettes but somehow
it is not working

 

[Palinurus]

This came to my attention via a smoking colleague who happens to be a Chief of the Division of Endocrinology:
<snip>

Thanks for sharing, Psyche.

I stopped smoking some 37 years ago and your quoted article describes my experiences afterwards almost to a T.

So I can vouch from personal exposure you're really on to something with this one. :)

 

[chaps23]

Hi Guys,

Chaps23, the Forum guidelines are clear about posting references to illegal substances on the Forum. We in no way condone the use of them. Please be aware of this in the future.

I may need you to be more specific here sorry herondancer,

If you could take a moment, from the intention that it was posted, the question was raised earlier in this thread regarding wheather a Hookah/shisha or any other water pipe filters the carcinogens out of the smoke & whether or not the molassis made it worse ect ect, I showed evidence to support the thoery that a water pipe indeed concerntrates these harmfull added chemicals, and spent hours preparing the post and doing research for the forum, are you saying that all of it was deemed unimportant or that it ALL breached the rules/ guidelines of the forum? The first two post's were strictly related to tobacco use (or so I thought)

I thought that studies, wheather or not on an illegal substance would have been welcomed, it was not as if I was condoning or supporting the inhalation of Marijuanna in any sence merely providing evidence of tobacco/tar being concerntrated by a water pipe. Since no study was found on the direct effect of water pipes on JUST tobacco.

I have Read and Re-Read the forum guidlines just to make sure,

Two: Please don't post messages about your illegal pastimes and habits. Cassiopaea.org does not wish to appear to condone such practices, for reasons that should be pretty obvious if a little common sense is applied. If you do post such stuff, expect it to be deleted immediately. It is also inadvisible to post about illegal pastimes from yesteryear, drug use for example, (unless you are disavowing all such usage). The reason is that by doing so you run the risk of attracting lurker "drug buddies", which you probably don't want to do.

Based on the above quote from the forum guidlines page, I dont think I have over stepped my boundries according to the guidelines since the information was only placed there to assist others in the thread it was posted in which might actually help someone who is using a shisha/hookah instead of rolling there own organic tobacco (let alone chemically treated tobacco!).

The evidence suggests (to the best of my understanding) that an unfiltered cigarette is a far healthier way to smoke tobacco other than the use of a vapourizer.

So if you could please re cap so I know where I went wrong I'd like to obviously be a contributing member to this forum and do not wish to cross any lines. As a quick search on this forum found many results regarding similar use of information regarding illicit substances and ideed none of them condoning the use of such. I am happy to leave that section out but the rest of the information was incredibly useful was it not?

 

[Alada]

Hi Guys,

Chaps23, the Forum guidelines are clear about posting references to illegal substances on the Forum. We in no way condone the use of them. Please be aware of this in the future.

I may need you to be more specific here sorry herondancer,

If you could take a moment, from the intention that it was posted, the question was raised earlier in this thread regarding wheather a Hookah/shisha or any other water pipe filters the carcinogens out of the smoke & whether or not the molassis made it worse ect ect, I showed evidence to support the thoery that a water pipe indeed concerntrates these harmfull added chemicals, and spent hours preparing the post and doing research for the forum.

Understood, I don’t think your intent was in question but have to consider others here when we post, not just ourselves and how a post reflects upon us.

There were sections of the quoted text that did not sit well with "Cassiopaea.org does not wish to appear to condone such practices". Remember, there are always plenty crazies out there that would just love to take any such snippet and then re-post it else where out-of-context in order to support their lies about Laura and the work we do here. Also there are always plenty of users whose addicted brains will grab hold of such snippets and use them as justification to continue pushing the self-pleasuring button.

You could always re-post your own conclusions with links for reference. Condensing down the material will help to keep the signal-to-noise ratio high which would be helpful for other members too.

 

[chaps23]

That makes sense, thanks for clarifying.