A
andi
Guest
Mr. Premise said:
Big thanks for the website, just ordered the sampler.
JayMark, I hope things work out for you.
Big thanks for the website, just ordered the sampler.
JayMark, I hope things work out for you.
Just thought to relay some local tobacco growing info I picked up.
I want to grow some tobacco here in Tenn next year so I asked around for any local contacts for good growers - preferably organic. I was given a name and number of someone who has won awards for his leaf. I paid him a visit and we walked out back to his barn for a look at the plants (still in the ground). Bushy nice looking plants for sure.
I noticed some pesticide containers and I asked him about it. Turns out, he said you have to use 2 pesticides in order to get good yield (he has made his living this way for many decades). One is general purpose but the other protects against a certain worm. This second one is the nasty one, and growers are not supposed to use it since detrimental effects are well known. The tobacco buyers supposedly will not buy any leaf that has been treated with it. But they do not test for it and buy it anyway. Nobody says a word, but they all know the truth - it is used by most all growers (and is very expensive). IOW if its not organic, then it most likely has the worm treatment.
I talked with one of the folks at Whole Leaf about this and he agreed - in general all of the non-organic tobaccos will have this pesticide. He said that the important mitigating factor is the aging time. This chemical has a relatively short half-life and the decay products (apparently) are not harmful - (I smell a little BS here, but I don't know). That means the more aging, the better. So that 3/4 y/o stuff is the way to go, if there is no organic to be had.
So I think we need a sott organic brand produced by the members! I'm in ... :)
I want to grow some tobacco here in Tenn next year so I asked around for any local contacts for good growers - preferably organic. I was given a name and number of someone who has won awards for his leaf. I paid him a visit and we walked out back to his barn for a look at the plants (still in the ground). Bushy nice looking plants for sure.
I noticed some pesticide containers and I asked him about it. Turns out, he said you have to use 2 pesticides in order to get good yield (he has made his living this way for many decades). One is general purpose but the other protects against a certain worm. This second one is the nasty one, and growers are not supposed to use it since detrimental effects are well known. The tobacco buyers supposedly will not buy any leaf that has been treated with it. But they do not test for it and buy it anyway. Nobody says a word, but they all know the truth - it is used by most all growers (and is very expensive). IOW if its not organic, then it most likely has the worm treatment.
I talked with one of the folks at Whole Leaf about this and he agreed - in general all of the non-organic tobaccos will have this pesticide. He said that the important mitigating factor is the aging time. This chemical has a relatively short half-life and the decay products (apparently) are not harmful - (I smell a little BS here, but I don't know). That means the more aging, the better. So that 3/4 y/o stuff is the way to go, if there is no organic to be had.
So I think we need a sott organic brand produced by the members! I'm in ... :)
D
Deleted member 8431
Guest
andi said:
Have contacted the guy, said PayPal is indeed fine except he can't receive Mastercard payment (any other card will do).
So right now I'm just waiting for the PayPal process to be done and will deffinately order the sampler as well.
I'm just wondering how tricky it's going to be to grind the leaves. I can't afford a good grinder now. I can only buy those small metal griders people usually use for *other* plant material. That should suffice and in any cases, I'll work with the cissors. Might have to dry them up a bit more as well although I'll see when I get them.
Thanks for the help guys. Another issue soon to be resolved, osit.
Peace.
Foxx
The Living Force
LQB said:I noticed some pesticide containers and I asked him about it. Turns out, he said you have to use 2 pesticides in order to get good yield (he has made his living this way for many decades). One is general purpose but the other protects against a certain worm. This second one is the nasty one, and growers are not supposed to use it since detrimental effects are well known. The tobacco buyers supposedly will not buy any leaf that has been treated with it. But they do not test for it and buy it anyway. Nobody says a word, but they all know the truth - it is used by most all growers (and is very expensive). IOW if its not organic, then it most likely has the worm treatment.
Good to know! Thanks for sharing this info, LQB!
LQB said:
Did he give a ballpark figure for how long it would take to decay? I certainly don't trust any anecdotes on pesticides decaying to become safe, but it might be true so one could try and play it on the safe side.
LQB said:
I suspect that you and any other knowledgeable members on such a venture would have some buyers :)
Foxx
The Living Force
JayMark said:
I don't think those type of grinders will do anything for the leaves--scissors are probably the way to go. There should be a how-to video on cutting the tobacco on the wholeleaf site or on youtube--it's really easy, but it does take some time. I think some people also use food processors as part of the process I think, though I haven't used on myself on tobacco.
Mr. Premise
The Living Force
LQB, do you remember the names of the pesticides? I did some research on the commonly used ones when I started buying whole leaf and the half lives were around three to four weeks. Most tobacco you buy has been aged, sometimes for several years. The Burley sold on the whole leaf site is four years old, so I hunk the risk is for the growers more than the consumers. The quickest you could get tobacco ready to smoke would be three or four months, longer from the last application, but usually farmers store it in barns until the price is good, because the market is not great and it tastes better and tests better for pesticide residues if it's older.
The organic growers use pesticides too but they are natural ones, like BT, which have even shorter half lives.
JayMark, to shred the tobacco, just remove the mid rib then roll the strips into a tight cigar then cut with scissors or a sharp knife diagonally as narrowly as you can.
The organic growers use pesticides too but they are natural ones, like BT, which have even shorter half lives.
JayMark, to shred the tobacco, just remove the mid rib then roll the strips into a tight cigar then cut with scissors or a sharp knife diagonally as narrowly as you can.
D
Deleted member 8431
Guest
Foxx said:
Will check the videos and...
Mr. Premise said:
... will deffinately try it this way.
Seems like the best way to do this manually.
Hummm, can't wait to try this.
Thanks.
Foxx said:
He went through some numbers for 3/4 year-old and how it was down to pretty low value but he had no idea about what a truly safe value might be - neither do I. I would want to know what the safety of the breakdown products is. Anyway, so far I would say the older, the better, if its not organic.
I have another local contact that claims (anyway) to use only compost for fertilizer, no pesticides, and does several acres per year under greenhouses. He has said that he does take some losses due to pests. I haven't met him yet but will soon - I'm anxious to try some of crop.
Mr. Premise said:
I don't remember the names but everyone seemed to recognized the one for worms as being the bad one. And yes, the half life is such that the chemical is very nearly gone after years. But gone just means not detectable in that form. The breakdown products are still there whatever they are. They may be harmless - I don't know.
The growers around here sell under "contract" with the buyers. When the buyer comes to town he buys everything that is under "contract", which means basically everything they have for that year. The local grower I talked to made it very clear that all "contracts" with the buyer are void if that worm pesticide is used. Well, it is used, they all know it, but the biz goes on anyway. There is probably a good reason why this rule was put into contracts in the first place (covering someone's butt I suspect).
Anyway, keep in mind all this info comes from just one local grower here in Tenn (albeit an ancient one), and he (and his group) may not be representative of all growers.
mnmulchi
Jedi
I have recently decided to take up pipe smoking again, after just smoking a corn cob pipe some a couple of years ago. I have smoked cigars in the past too, but none were pure/healthy. I recently ordered some Kentucky Select Organic tobacco and am looking forward to trying it. From the research I have done so far it sounds like Virginia tobaccos store great, and you can age them for years. I would like to eventually buy the KSO in bulk and can up a bunch for storage.
I've been looking around at pipes too and it looks like the best value are estate pipes sold on ebay. It's cool that pipes have been constructed in much the same way for so many years. One I plan on using was my Great Grandmothers and it's still in great shape.
I've been looking around at pipes too and it looks like the best value are estate pipes sold on ebay. It's cool that pipes have been constructed in much the same way for so many years. One I plan on using was my Great Grandmothers and it's still in great shape.
Thomas Alan
The Living Force
JayMark said:
I remove the stems and cut it with scissors as shown in the video. Then grind it finer in a regular food blender. It's a bit of a messy, tedious process but 30 minutes processing yields about 2 weeks of smoking. Whole leaf tobacco is the best smoking ever IMO.
I started with the cigarette tobacco sampler and have ordered several times since. There was a mistake on one of my orders, they sent a different tobacco than I ordered. I agreed to keep it and they doubled my next order at regular price as compensation. Good customer service.
Mac
Thomas Alan
The Living Force
Foxx said:
I find the RAW organic hemp papers make me cough, RAW natural does not. Each of us has different experiences.
Also, you can find good deals on RAW papers on Ebay. Recently, though I mostly use a filtered corn cob pipe.
Mac
dant
The Living Force
Now that I have burned through 5 pipes, I wanted
to mention a few things:
Pipes:
1) Clay / Meershaum pipes seem to accumulate tar - and
after a time, the clay turns into a sticky "tar ball". So
much so that the clay is flammable - i.e. you can set
the pipe on fire and it burns quite well, so much so that
it turns into flaming pipe and burns much like rubber until
it burns out into a crumbable ash heap! Clay pipes are
impossible to clean. I tried several versions of these pipes
(one was $85 US) and so, this type of pipe was not tenable
for me.
2) I tried Briar wood pipes: Many versions of these pipes have
small bowl thickness, esp. where the stem meets the bowl,
they can be very thick at the top of the bowl, but thin at the
lower half of the bowl and these have a tendency to burn a
hole through at the stem or lower half of the bowl itself,
some of the 'fancy ones", pleasing to the eye externally, some
are expensive, but ultimately in the end, does not last long.
Wood pipes are much easier to clean. Make sure you check out
the pipe carefully before you buy it.
3) Check to make sure that that there is less air flow restriction.
The narrow the bore, the easier the pipe plugs up, requiring
more frequent cleaning and make sure that bore allows for
easy bore cleaning.
4) Currently, I have two versions of Dr. Grabow: Duke & Omega,
burl style for better grip (not the smooth ones). You can visit
the official page here.
Omega has a narrow bore, and both support filters (which I do
not use) These pipes cost around $30 - $40 US depending on model.
I got these from Walgreens.
Pipe Lighters:
1) I recommend Xicar - lifetime warranty! Make sure you get
the newest design because the older version piezoelectric
unit broke down frequently. Buy directly from Xicar if possible.
The specific model I have is a slow flame (not a torch) and it
is model 585AB "Resource Lighter Amboina Burl" and you can
get it here but you can choose the pipe style you want!
Disclaimer for products: I am not a seller, just an "experienced" addict! :P
Cheers!
to mention a few things:
Pipes:
1) Clay / Meershaum pipes seem to accumulate tar - and
after a time, the clay turns into a sticky "tar ball". So
much so that the clay is flammable - i.e. you can set
the pipe on fire and it burns quite well, so much so that
it turns into flaming pipe and burns much like rubber until
it burns out into a crumbable ash heap! Clay pipes are
impossible to clean. I tried several versions of these pipes
(one was $85 US) and so, this type of pipe was not tenable
for me.
2) I tried Briar wood pipes: Many versions of these pipes have
small bowl thickness, esp. where the stem meets the bowl,
they can be very thick at the top of the bowl, but thin at the
lower half of the bowl and these have a tendency to burn a
hole through at the stem or lower half of the bowl itself,
some of the 'fancy ones", pleasing to the eye externally, some
are expensive, but ultimately in the end, does not last long.
Wood pipes are much easier to clean. Make sure you check out
the pipe carefully before you buy it.
3) Check to make sure that that there is less air flow restriction.
The narrow the bore, the easier the pipe plugs up, requiring
more frequent cleaning and make sure that bore allows for
easy bore cleaning.
4) Currently, I have two versions of Dr. Grabow: Duke & Omega,
burl style for better grip (not the smooth ones). You can visit
the official page here.
Omega has a narrow bore, and both support filters (which I do
not use) These pipes cost around $30 - $40 US depending on model.
I got these from Walgreens.
Pipe Lighters:
1) I recommend Xicar - lifetime warranty! Make sure you get
the newest design because the older version piezoelectric
unit broke down frequently. Buy directly from Xicar if possible.
The specific model I have is a slow flame (not a torch) and it
is model 585AB "Resource Lighter Amboina Burl" and you can
get it here but you can choose the pipe style you want!
Disclaimer for products: I am not a seller, just an "experienced" addict! :P
Cheers!