The Vegetarian Myth
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Vic
Jedi Council Member
Megan said:
Megan, I am a quarter of the way through The Vegetarian Myth It's such a strange phenomenon when you think you know everything and have it all under control, yet there is a constant pain or irritation digging away at you. Right now I have a feeling - more of a suggestion of a feeling really - that i want to collapse to the floor and have a gentle sob. It's a combination of sadness at the situation, and happiness with relief at having eyes opened (and the potential for freedom that brings)
Last night as TVM took hold of me, shaking me by the shoulders, and shouting in my face, words like 'ignorant' and 'anthropocentric' and 'juvenile' kept flashing up. I am embarrassed by myself.
Time to return to the book. I'll report back later.
Vic said:
Don't worry, Vic, we all have gone through this stage - and I am going through this again and again - it's "the unplugging from the Matrix". It's a painful process, where your world view gets destroyed, your eyes opened and you let your ears hear. I have had pretty much everything I believed to be true turned on its head! But - as you have stated - it is also liberating and exhilerating at the same time. And it will happen to you again, after one sacred cow after the next is slaughtered ...
Vic said:
VM is a painful but enlightening book. It's all the more heartbreaking that the abuses committed by our elites have pushed us far behind the carrying capacity of our planet and the point of no-return. There's no way to feed 7 or 8 billions human beings without destroying the planet whatever diets we adopt. From this perspective the pro VS anti vegetarian debate is a moot point. Actually a title like "the agricultural disaster" would have reflected better the content than "The Vegetarian Myth".
From what I see ethics (becoming an STO candidate), nutrition (having fully functioning brain and body) and knowledge (acquiring and discerning information) go hand in hand.
To become a STO candidate you have to make the proper decisions. To make those decisions you have to know what is true. To know the truth you have to acquire data (true and false one) and exert discernment, separate the wheat (true information) from the chaff (false infromation), which can only occur if your brain is functioning optimally, therefore a proper nutrition providing what our neurons need is a necessary (but not sufficient) condition to become STO candidates.
Very true and very well put, Belibaste. Don't know how it could have been said better. :)
mcb
The Living Force
"Log Rolling"
While researching my ancestors I came across a little story that was intended to give the reader a flavor of pioneer life in what became the USA. The majority of my ancestors arrived from Europe in the late 17th and early 18th centuries, some seeking opportunity, some escaping poverty, and some escaping religious persecution. I haven't studied the reasons for this migration closely, but I suspect that they were fleeing an earlier way of life that was in collapse.
They established their farms and, while there were many hardships, they began producing children. Many, many children. A few died, but most survived. The farms, of necessity, were ever expanding.
I have misplaced the actual text of the story, but it told about having a "log rolling." Today you might think of that as a competitive sport, but this was no game. To clear the land, first the landowner would chop down the trees. The neighbors would then come together and roll the logs into piles to be burned.
This is how my ancestors advanced across the land, chopping, rolling, burning, plowing, and planting. Working together, destroying the natural landscape as they multiplied, until one day there was no more arable land to clear. The extra children began to crowd into cities (if my grade school history is at all accurate), which might very well have been a reenactment of what happened in the "old country" generations before, except that this time there was no "new world" to flee to. Family size shrunk greatly between my great grandparents and my grandparents, no doubt in response.
I can see that these people were manipulated by the elite in any number of ways into doing what they did. It's one thing to talk about the psychopaths in power but it's another thing to realize that it is people like us -- our own ancestors -- that have been tricked into doing much of the dirty work. And we are told how brave they were, not mentioning the genocide that made it possible for them to have the land to use and abuse this way in the first place.
I didn't come to see all of this just from reading The Vegetarian Myth, but it was the turning point. It is certainly a different way of looking at agriculture than what I was taught.
While researching my ancestors I came across a little story that was intended to give the reader a flavor of pioneer life in what became the USA. The majority of my ancestors arrived from Europe in the late 17th and early 18th centuries, some seeking opportunity, some escaping poverty, and some escaping religious persecution. I haven't studied the reasons for this migration closely, but I suspect that they were fleeing an earlier way of life that was in collapse.
They established their farms and, while there were many hardships, they began producing children. Many, many children. A few died, but most survived. The farms, of necessity, were ever expanding.
I have misplaced the actual text of the story, but it told about having a "log rolling." Today you might think of that as a competitive sport, but this was no game. To clear the land, first the landowner would chop down the trees. The neighbors would then come together and roll the logs into piles to be burned.
This is how my ancestors advanced across the land, chopping, rolling, burning, plowing, and planting. Working together, destroying the natural landscape as they multiplied, until one day there was no more arable land to clear. The extra children began to crowd into cities (if my grade school history is at all accurate), which might very well have been a reenactment of what happened in the "old country" generations before, except that this time there was no "new world" to flee to. Family size shrunk greatly between my great grandparents and my grandparents, no doubt in response.
I can see that these people were manipulated by the elite in any number of ways into doing what they did. It's one thing to talk about the psychopaths in power but it's another thing to realize that it is people like us -- our own ancestors -- that have been tricked into doing much of the dirty work. And we are told how brave they were, not mentioning the genocide that made it possible for them to have the land to use and abuse this way in the first place.
I didn't come to see all of this just from reading The Vegetarian Myth, but it was the turning point. It is certainly a different way of looking at agriculture than what I was taught.
Vic
Jedi Council Member
Laura said:
I've never read a book so powerfully written. The passion behind the knowledge that Lierre Keith delivers guides it home.
One of the many things she says that spoke to me came in her recollection of when she mentioned the Breatharians to her partner. Anyone who has read the book can recall her partners reply, and the effect it had on Lierre:
"Lierre," replied my beloved, in that tone of patiently suppressed exasperation that I've forced her to perfect ... if you try it, I'm leaving."
The voice of reason can be such a relief to people like me.
I hear the voice of reason here, in this forum. And it is a relief.
Vic
Jedi Council Member
Re: "Log Rolling"
I know what you mean, Megan. I am just a few pages from the end of the book. In terms of the history of, and strategy used to destroy us through agriculture, I feel that I have been reminded rather than told for the first time. Perhaps we, I'm sure I, deny it like I imagine children deny horror. But then we grow up. In fact Lierre Keith mentions more than once the concept of 'adulthood' and 'adult knowledge' - I understand what she means by that. At least in terms of my current growth.
Megan said:
I know what you mean, Megan. I am just a few pages from the end of the book. In terms of the history of, and strategy used to destroy us through agriculture, I feel that I have been reminded rather than told for the first time. Perhaps we, I'm sure I, deny it like I imagine children deny horror. But then we grow up. In fact Lierre Keith mentions more than once the concept of 'adulthood' and 'adult knowledge' - I understand what she means by that. At least in terms of my current growth.
Vic
Jedi Council Member
Alana said:
Hi Alana, just a brief bit of feedback on The Vegetarian Myth as requested. As I mentioned earlier it's certainly one of, if not the most powerfully written book I've read. A third of the way through I knew I had been deprogrammed from the myth. I've been eating oily fish for the last few days, and later today I will be eating organic chicken. I was a vegetarian, and intermittently a vegan, for twelve years.
There's no getting away from the facts as presented by Lierre Keith. Some of them you already know - some of them don't need studies and research to prove themselves. What a book! Her passion carries you along in her desperate crusade to help vegetarians/vegans to grow up - to open their eyes to the fairy tale that they/we believed for so long. Her explanation of liberalism and radicalism highlights, in all its embarrassing glory, the truth that vegetarians/vegans do nothing to help animals by not eating them, because the only people we comfort are ourselves in a delusion of self-righteousness and superiority.
One thing Lierre ensures that we know though, is that the meat we eat must be from animals that have been allowed to live 'good' lives. I think that anybody that claims to be striving for STO candidacy, yet eats animals that have been through the hell of factory farming, is worse than those ignorant of the truth.
I have been tired for twelve years. I've started reading the Ketogenic Diet thread, have not had a single carb for two days, and am looking forward to getting my energy back. Maybe its too early to place credit, but today I ran my best three mile run since I returned to running two years ago. I do know that I have been wolfing down the fish, and I'm looking forward to the chicken, to say the least.
Thanks to everyone who has helped me on this first stage with you.
Vic said:
Thank you for your feedback. Yes, Lierre's book had a very strong effect on me also, it changed how I viewed the world. I cried with her for all the species of animals we lost, all the rivers, all the forests, the top soil, how much we destroyed our Earth so far. I have been recommending this book to everyone I know since, vegetarian or not, because it is a matter that affects us collectively. The more of us stop supporting the psychos and their corporations that destroy our planet and ecosystem, the more hope there is for our collective future, OSIT.
Vic said:
Exactly. My family and I went around our area and met with all the local farmers who give a good life to their animals, and apply earth-friendly practices to their farming. We saw how their animals live and support their efforts by getting our meat from them. This is sometimes hard to do if you live in a big city and away from small farmers, but you can do the best you can when buying meat from the supermarket, by asking and learning where the product you buy comes from.
Vic said:
Awesome!
Vic said:
Vic, just be aware and be careful that you don't go too fast in your transition. Read the entire Ketogenic Diet thread (and it would be good to read the Life Without Bread thread too, that's where it all started) so you know what you're doing and what to expect. Going from 12 years of vegetarian/vegan diet to no carbs is probably too drastic to undertake in such a short time.
This is just a short overview/basic guideline, but maybe just drop all grains and then all dairy (except butter/ghee if you tolerate) over a few weeks. Then start lowering your carbs slowly until you are below 50 grams of net carbs (meaning not counting fiber which is not digestible by humans, so doesn't get converted to glucose).
Especially with the veg background, you need to give yourself a chance to adapt, so don't rush into things. Give your body a chance to recover from the wrong diet and then adapt to keto if that's your ultimate destination. Your digestion and enzymes are probably out of wack too to be able to do a proper ketogenic diet right away - which is about 75% of daily calories in animal fat and the rest pretty much animal protein.
Good luck on your new adventure. :)
Vic said:
It's exactly that. It's all the more frustrating that a lot of vegetarians have good intentions. They really make efforts to try to save the planet and alleviate animal's suffering.
But, like in many other domains the good will and good intentions of people is being channeled by lies and manipulations towards detrimental or, at best, illusory ends. The vegetarian myth is doubly detrimental: it destroys the planet (agriculture) and it destroys the individual (carbs, gluten, pseudo opioids, lectins, ...)
