Was Julius Caesar the real Jesus Christ?

So, I think it must mean "Along with Alexander the Great and Charlemagne, he stands (is regarded) as one of the eternal images; for Napoleon and Bismarck, he is an ever-present force. ... "

Although I'm not a native German speaker, my knowledge of the language is firm enough to endorse this translation as completely on the mark and quite correct.

The second part would translate as: "He's not antiquated by (or: for) his roman past, nor has it diminished his presence now."

EDIT: minor grammar
 
Palinurus said:
So, I think it must mean "Along with Alexander the Great and Charlemagne, he stands (is regarded) as one of the eternal images; for Napoleon and Bismarck, he is an ever-present force. ... "

Although I'm not a native German speaker, my knowledge of the language is firm enough to endorse this translation as completely on the mark and quite correct.

The second part would translate as: "He's not antiquated by (or: for) his roman past, nor has his presence diminished now."

Thanks, Palinurus, that's what I thought.

When I was reading Christian Meiers' bio of Caesar, I found a number of really awkward parts that must be translation errors. In one instance, I found the exact reversal of what the author must have said. I think I noted it in my review on amazon. It's a great book, but the translator SHOULD have been more familiar with the history and then he would not have made such a silly error.

I'm noticing a similar thing with this "Mantle of Caesar" which is, IMO, unreservedly a great book. There are some oddities of translation. I think that this is often due to "un-translatable-ness". Data recently translated an older German thesis for me which we prepared for publication since it was so interesting. Anyway, I went over it to edit the almost literal, word for word translation, and in some cases, Data had to make notes about the fact that there was no short way to translate something. So, the text actually became a bit longer than it was in the original because I wanted to take care to get it right.

The same text contained a lot of quotes from the ancient sources in Greek and Latin. I was able to get quite a number of them in translation via Loeb, but there were some that had never been translated. Approaching Infinity helped me on those, and some I translated myself with him reviewing; the Greek quotes that are not avaialbe elsewhere were translated by Alana. So, it took 4 of us, Data doing the lion's share of the work, to get this piece ready. It's a marvelous bit of detective work and I think I've discussed it further back in this thread. Anyway, it demonstrates that Valerius Antias re-wrote ancient Roman History to include an "oath" that never actually took place, designed to free Brutus and the assassins of Caesar from the blood guilt of their violation of an oath made to protect Caesar with their lives. And, in the process, Antias added a number of other things to the ancient history that were then picked up and reproduced by Livy and became, more or less, the "standard Roman History." This little book we just translated proves that this happened (circumstantially, of course, but strongly), when, and by whom, i.e. Antias. It was published before the deaths of Brutus et al, but Cicero was unaware of it, so may have been published immediately after his death. It was also probably published before Cicero's letters, which make no mention of any such oath from the past which he would have, had it existed.

Anyway, all of this research has made me keenly aware of the problems of translations and I'm getting pretty good at spotting when there IS such a problem, and when I need to take care and check the original.

In the case of "The Mantle of Caesar", the author's erudition - wide and deep - is so evident that even IF it was a "misstatement", I would forgive it. But, as it turns out, it is a failure of the translator. So be aware of that as you read the text.
 
Data recently translated an older German thesis for me which we prepared for publication since it was so interesting. Anyway, I went over it to edit the almost literal, word for word translation, and in some cases, Data had to make notes about the fact that there was no short way to translate something. So, the text actually became a bit longer than it was in the original because I wanted to take care to get it right.

The same text contained a lot of quotes from the ancient sources in Greek and Latin. I was able to get quite a number of them in translation via Loeb, but there were some that had never been translated. Approaching Infinity helped me on those, and some I translated myself with him reviewing; the Greek quotes that are not avaialbe elsewhere were translated by Alana. So, it took 4 of us, Data doing the lion's share of the work, to get this piece ready. It's a marvelous bit of detective work and I think I've discussed it further back in this thread.

Yes, you mentioned it for the first time here. I just recently was wondering whether that project was proceeding as planned. Glad to hear now it is forthcoming.

I suppose you are also familiar with this article?

May I take the opportunity to state I'm still reading your latest batch of posts with parts of your argument about Cicero, Catiline, Caesar, Fulvia and so on? It takes a while to digest it all, but I want to say up front that I'm very grateful to have a look into the kitchen as it were and read a sneak preview of your approach and an outline of the overall background. It's much appreciated to already have access to that now.
 
I found an Italian translation here, with Latin on the facing page: https://archive.org/details/levitedegliuomi00razzgoog

And here's another version of the Latin: http://books.google.ca/books?id=YhpBAAAAMAAJ&printsec=frontcover&hl=en#v=onepage&q&f=false

Both are downloadable from google. It's LONG! I took a few years of Latin in high school and university, but I'm afraid I'm a tad rusty (as in I'd pretty much need to re-teach myself everything). It would take me ages to even try to translate!

While looking, I found this extensive bibliography on Caesar from "A Companion to Julius Caesar": http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/9781444308440.biblio/pdf

Looks like there's a more recent version (Latin/Italian) of Petrarch: De gestis Cesaris, edited by Giuliana Crevatin (2003). http://searchworks.stanford.edu/view/5725574 (Can't find it online.)
 
Palinurus said:
I suppose you are also familiar with this article?

Yes, it's trash, IMO. The guy goes along with the "Ancient testimony establishes c. 80–60 BC as the date of composition" which is demolished in Antias and Caesar.
 
Laura said:
Palinurus said:
I suppose you are also familiar with this article?

Yes, it's trash, IMO. The guy goes along with the "Ancient testimony establishes c. 80–60 BC as the date of composition" which is demolished in Antias and Caesar.

Thanks for answering. Not worth the money then they are asking for it to view. Better to wait for your Carl Zohren booklet, I suppose.
 
Palinurus said:
Laura said:
Palinurus said:
I suppose you are also familiar with this article?

Yes, it's trash, IMO. The guy goes along with the "Ancient testimony establishes c. 80–60 BC as the date of composition" which is demolished in Antias and Caesar.

Thanks for answering. Not worth the money then they are asking for it to view. Better to wait for your Carl Zohren booklet, I suppose.

Won't be long.
 
Approaching Infinity said:
I found an Italian translation here, with Latin on the facing page: https://archive.org/details/levitedegliuomi00razzgoog

And here's another version of the Latin: http://books.google.ca/books?id=YhpBAAAAMAAJ&printsec=frontcover&hl=en#v=onepage&q&f=false

Both are downloadable from google. It's LONG! I took a few years of Latin in high school and university, but I'm afraid I'm a tad rusty (as in I'd pretty much need to re-teach myself everything). It would take me ages to even try to translate!

While looking, I found this extensive bibliography on Caesar from "A Companion to Julius Caesar": http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/9781444308440.biblio/pdf

Looks like there's a more recent version (Latin/Italian) of Petrarch: De gestis Cesaris, edited by Giuliana Crevatin (2003). http://searchworks.stanford.edu/view/5725574 (Can't find it online.)

I don't speak Italian but if there's a native Italian here, or someone who's fluent in Italian and speaks some English I'll be happy to work on a translation with them.
 
Laura said:
Meanwhile, disconcerting discovery. Petrarch who more or less got the whole "looking into the past, reading ancient writings to recover history" thing going, apparently utilized all the available ancient sources to write a bio of Caesar. It's apparently highly regarded as a work. However, it has NEVER been translated into English!!!

Laura, this may be interesting as a preview of what you'll find in Petrarch's books. Martin McLaughlin comments on the opinion Petrarch had of Caesar (Empire, Eloquence, and Military Genius: Renaissance Italy, in Companion to Julius Caesar, p. 338-339):

Petrarch too was initially critical of the great general. It was probably his early
reading of Lucan and parts of Suetonius that caused his early hostility to Caesar. His
Latin epic, Africa (1338—64), has as its hero Scipio Africanus, and when in a dream
vision Scipio’s father prophesies to his son the future of Rome, he warns that Julius
Caesar will conquer Gaul, Britain, and Germany, but adds that he would have been
even greater had he only possessed a sense of moderation (Africa 2.219—28 in
Petrarca 1926). Instead Julius will turn his victorious hands on the state in a civil
war, and here Scipio senior condemns the ambition which leads one man to seize
complete power for himsell to raid the treasury, enslave the senate, and drench the
Capitol in blood (2.229—39). Such anri-Caesarian views were consistent with Pet-
rarch’s enthusiasm for Scipio and with his support in mid-century for Cola di
Rienzo’s ill-fated attempt to revive a Roman republic (1347—54), the poet at one
stage even hailing Cola as a new Brutus, as well as a new Romulus and a new Camillus
(Petrarca 1994: 64; Ferraù 2006b). However, despite his interest in Scipio and
initially in Cola, the great humanist never explicitly states his support for a republican
form of government (Ferraù 2006b), and in the end his reading of Suetonius (in his
most heavily annotated copy of the Roman biographer Petrarch writes most annota
tions on the lives of Julius and Augustus: Billanovich 1960), of Caesar’s Commen-
taries (which he attributed to Julius Celsus), and of the text he himself discovered in
Verona in 1345, Cicero’s Letters to Atticus, led to a revaluation of Caesar’s achieve-
ments (Fenzi 2003). Political factors too, such as the poet’s disillusionment with
Cola’s failure, and the humanist’s subsequent patronage by single rulers such as the
Visconti in Milan and the Carrara in Padua, account for his later pro-Caesar attitudes:
in fact for Petrarch Caesar is a prototype more of a contemporary Signore than of a
Roman Emperor, a private citizen who takes power to resolve a situation of civic
discord. In his declining years, the humanist knew that it was local rulers such as the
Visconti and Carrara families rather than the superpowers of the Church and the
Empire that offered a valid model for political recovery in Italy at the end of
the Trecento (Ferraù 2006c: 98—101).

Petrarch perhaps started the De gestis Cesaris as just another in the series of lives he
had written for his De viris illustribus (1338—43), amongst which he had included an
extended Vita Scipionis (c. 1 357), but the length of his biography of Caesar out-
stripped even that of his life of Scipio, and it was in the end intended to be a free-
standing biography. It circulated anonymously in rare editions of Caesar and ‘was only
reattributed to Petrarch in 1827 (Blanc 1985). Its medieval title at first glance seems
to place it close to vernacular compilations such as the anonymous I fatti di Cesare, a
farrago of legends based on Sallust, Lucan, and Suetonius, but translated from a
French original; however, in reality Petrarch’s work stands at the beginning of a new
source-based historiography. In chapter 20, which comes after the account of the
Gallic wars and before the civil war, the author interrupts the narrative to quote letters
by Caesar in Cicero’s Letters to Atticus (discovered by Petrarch himself, as we saw) to
prove his real desire for peace, and to show that even Cicero, although anti-Caesar,
was also highly critical of Pompei. Petrarch was proud of the novelty of his approach
here, in eliciting evidence from the protagonist’s own letters and from “a rather remote
source,” namely Cicero’s letters (Petrarca 1827: 211; 2003: 209 Ferraù 2006d: 199).

The Letters to Atticus (esp. 9.7c, 9.13a, 1O.8b) are exploited elsewhere by Petrarch
(Seniles 16.5; Petrarch 1992: II, 622—3) to show that, contrary to medieval lore,
Caesar did nor introduce the royal plural (nos instead of ego): once again the humanist
is concerned to produce the most accurate version even of linguistic history. The final
chapter of the De gestis, before dealing with the assassination, offers a description of
Caesar’s appearance and mores, largely based on Suetonius, concluding that although
Caesar had been at times rather impetuous and keen to seize power, as well as
being adulterous, nevertheless no victor ever showed more clemency or munificence,
and for this Petrarch can cite the evidence of “maximi auctores” (Petrarca 1827:
3 14—17; 2003: 302—4).

Petrarch’s vernacular poetry evinces a similar movement from an anti- to a pro-
Caesar stance: in two early sonnets from the 1330s, he says that Caesar’s hands were
more than ready to turn Thessaly vermilion with blood (Petrarca 2004: 44), and he
recalls Julius’s simulated tears on seeing the severed head of Pompey (Petrarca 2004:
102; Hainsworth 1988: 24—9). Yet the poet praises Julius as slaughterer of the
barbarians in the great political canzone “Italia mia” (Petrarca 2004: 128.49—51)
of 1345. This oscillation between his two heroes, Scipio and Caesar, continues in the
Triumphs, though in the Triumph of Fame the movement appears to be in the
opposite direction. In his first redaction of this text (c. 1351), he places as the front
marchers in Fame’s cohorts first Julius Caesar then Augustus and Drusus, and only
after these Caesars come the two Scipios (Triumph of Fame Ia. 23—7: Petrarca 1996).
However, in the later redaction (c. 1 364), he places Scipio side by side with Caesar
and is unable to say which is nearer the goddess Fame, though he does add that Scipio
was a slave only to virtue, not ro Love, whereas Caesar was in thrall to both, thus
suggesting Scipio’s superiority (Petrarca, Triumph of Fame 1. 22—4: Petrarca 1996;
Martellotti 1947, 1975, 1976; Baron 1962).

Despite these oscillations Petrarch's mature views are to be found in the De gestis
and in a late letter-treatise on the wise ruler (Seniles 14.1), written about the same
time (1373) and dedicated to his patron, Francesco da Carrara, ruler of Padua. There
he puts Caesar forward several times as a model for rulers to follow, including a whole
page which claims that he epitomizes all the princely virtues: even Cicero said Julius
forgot nothing except past injuries (Petrarch 1992: II, 527). However much he had
admired Scipio and Cola in his earlier years, the mature Petrarch saw in Julius Caesar
the prototype of the great general, the model ruler, and a complex human being.
 
Thanks, CIS. I have the Companion, but haven't looked into it yet. I find it odd that Petrarch has not been translated and the description you have provided probably explains why. Still, I would like to read it. I've ordered an Italian copy and will extract the Caesar portion and run it through google translate or something and then, possibly, go to work on it with a dictionary.

Another thing that interests me is Gundolf's references to John of Salisbury who apparently had access to the ancient texts (being in the church) and cited them somewhat liberally in his writings some 200 years before Petrarch "discovered" them and revealed them to the secular world. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_of_Salisbury Then: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petrarch for dates, etc. Salisbury has been translated and I've ordered his Metalogicon and Policraticus, but his letters are EXTREMELY pricey. I found one volume online as a PDF, but the other is just not available without big bux. See:
http://www.amazon.com/Letters-John-Salisbury-1163-1180-Medieval/dp/0198222408/ref=sr_1_11?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1390550377&sr=1-11&keywords=john+of+salisbury

In general, Gundolf's scan of how ideas and attitudes changed and developed is extremely plausible and helpful. I've still got to deal with that 325 year gap at some point and I'm not sure what the answer is going to be - whether there WAS a gap, or whether it was created and filled in with nonsense AKA Historiae Augusta and other things.

In any event, my idea that the Franks more or less "created" the Catholic Church as the powerful organization it became in order to legitimate their assumption of the ancient Imperial rights turns out to be not too far off according to Gundolf. That period around Otto is very mysterious and somewhere in there, texts were manipulated and the "History of the Franks" according to Gregory of Tours was created using parts of histories of the Eastern Empire, particularly the "prodigies and portents" that disappear from the Eastern record and magically reappear in Gregory.
 
Laura said:
Palinurus said:
So, I think it must mean "Along with Alexander the Great and Charlemagne, he stands (is regarded) as one of the eternal images; for Napoleon and Bismarck, he is an ever-present force. ... "

Although I'm not a native German speaker, my knowledge of the language is firm enough to endorse this translation as completely on the mark and quite correct.

The second part would translate as: "He's not antiquated by (or: for) his roman past, nor has his presence diminished now."

Thanks, Palinurus, that's what I thought.

When I was reading Christian Meiers' bio of Caesar, I found a number of really awkward parts that must be translation errors. In one instance, I found the exact reversal of what the author must have said. I think I noted it in my review on amazon. It's a great book, but the translator SHOULD have been more familiar with the history and then he would not have made such a silly error.

I'm noticing a similar thing with this "Mantle of Caesar" which is, IMO, unreservedly a great book. There are some oddities of translation. I think that this is often due to "un-translatable-ness". Data recently translated an older German thesis for me which we prepared for publication since it was so interesting. Anyway, I went over it to edit the almost literal, word for word translation, and in some cases, Data had to make notes about the fact that there was no short way to translate something. So, the text actually became a bit longer than it was in the original because I wanted to take care to get it right.

The same text contained a lot of quotes from the ancient sources in Greek and Latin. I was able to get quite a number of them in translation via Loeb, but there were some that had never been translated. Approaching Infinity helped me on those, and some I translated myself with him reviewing; the Greek quotes that are not avaialbe elsewhere were translated by Alana. So, it took 4 of us, Data doing the lion's share of the work, to get this piece ready. It's a marvelous bit of detective work and I think I've discussed it further back in this thread. Anyway, it demonstrates that Valerius Antias re-wrote ancient Roman History to include an "oath" that never actually took place, designed to free Brutus and the assassins of Caesar from the blood guilt of their violation of an oath made to protect Caesar with their lives. And, in the process, Antias added a number of other things to the ancient history that were then picked up and reproduced by Livy and became, more or less, the "standard Roman History." This little book we just translated proves that this happened (circumstantially, of course, but strongly), when, and by whom, i.e. Antias. It was published before the deaths of Brutus et al, but Cicero was unaware of it, so may have been published immediately after his death. It was also probably published before Cicero's letters, which make no mention of any such oath from the past which he would have, had it existed.

Anyway, all of this research has made me keenly aware of the problems of translations and I'm getting pretty good at spotting when there IS such a problem, and when I need to take care and check the original.

In the case of "The Mantle of Caesar", the author's erudition - wide and deep - is so evident that even IF it was a "misstatement", I would forgive it. But, as it turns out, it is a failure of the translator. So be aware of that as you read the text.

Yeah, when I read that about Alexander the Great at the very beginning of the book, I was scratching my head and thought it HAS to be a mistranslation or something. And I agree that Gundolf's erudition is huge in "The Mantle of Caesar," almost overwhelmingly so for me. It's a really interesting read so far -- only up to page 57 currently. I'll be getting back to it as soon as I'm caught up on the forum and get offline. I'm looking forward to the new Zohren booklet too.
 
Don Genaro said:
I don't speak Italian but if there's a native Italian here, or someone who's fluent in Italian and speaks some English I'll be happy to work on a translation with them.

Laura said:
I've ordered an Italian copy and will extract the Caesar portion and run it through google translate or something and then, possibly, go to work on it with a dictionary.

I know Italian and I think at least a couple of other members do too. Dantem comes to mind, and he also likes reading about history. Perhaps once the texts are run through google translator, we can go through the text for accuracy and then English speakers give it the final touch for fluency.

I don't know how much text we are talking about, but google translator does a pretty good job. It is the sense of some sentences that sometimes gets messed up which we could then check.

Molto facile! :P
 
Gaby said:
I don't know how much text we are talking about, but google translator does a pretty good job. It is the sense of some sentences that sometimes gets messed up which we could then check.

Molto facile! :P

Hi Gaby,

if you got a draft already I can do a check!
Just saw the thread..

Oops.. edited

[quote author=Laura]I've ordered an Italian copy and will extract the Caesar portion and run it through google translate or something and then, possibly, go to work on it with a dictionary. [/quote]

You can send me the extract when you're done, Laura!
 
Just found a 10 pages pdf draft from Petrarca's De Viris Illustribus, Caesar's Chapter or 'De Gestis Caesaris'.
Here it is, google translated, not checked. I'll do a better job when I got it all.


III, De Gestis Caesaris

C. Julius Caesar the dictator began, as is the case for almost all
men , with difficulty , then proceeded in a splendid way , ended precipitously.
2 teenager was not rich , though noble lineage ,
if it is true , as I find that since the same origin of Rome and
before the foundation of the city the name of the people Giulia was well
known . 3 The difficulties of his family joined the untimely death
of his father, who died when he was sixteen. 4 Recall that a
time and by others and also it was doubted by my name
father , 5 and it was believed that , like the sun, the stars , so the reputation of the
son had obscured the name of the father . 6 However, I found by reading ,
and I say to those who do not know, that his father was Lucius Julius
Caesar. 7 But back to his son, also joined the quartan fever ,
inertia annoying and a prolonged malaise , and more dangerous
any fever hatred of the dictator Sulla, 8 which won the war
civil , though a man of so much cruelty and plenty of power , numbered
Already , however, among his opponents Caesar, and talking about him warned
often with these words is that the noble Pompey : 9 "Take care
this guy with the robe knotted evil. " 10 Caesar fact, although
was accurate in clothing of the body, however, he knotted the
loosely as a way of making improper for that age 11
and from here is born the saying of Cicero , who, when asked
after the Civil War because it was so wrong in choosing
preferring to Pompey to Caesar , he replied: 12 " mistaken ways of knotting
". 13 Caesar, oppressed by all these problems together, changed
almost always caches, 14 and often got rid of those who
hunted with money, he future lord of kings and kingdoms, and lived 15
long under these conditions , until Marco Emilio and Aurelio Cotta,
noble men and his relatives , but also very good friends of Sulla , and
together with the Vestal Virgins , whose authority was then very high , not asked
forgiveness for him with many prayers effective . 16 And here is worthy of
memory at the end of the sentence that Silla, after he had very long opposed and no prayer was effective , won uttered , or later to divine inspiration or just to human intuition : 17 " Vincetela
you too - he said - and keep this gift harmful for you and for all
the nobles . 18 But I now declare that this man , whom you so insistently
you want to save , will one day be the ruin of the party of the nobles , who
you have defended with me ; 18 Caesar in fact there are many Marii
". 19 These details may be too meticulous about this character
perhaps be useful to those who spend a difficult youth ,
because , learning that a man of singular greatness has been hampered
from such impediments young age , do not despair of power
rise to the highest levels.
20 Still a teenager , he served in the military and in Greece and Asia
in Cilicia , sometimes with good reputation at other times without any notoriety.
21 When he learned of the death of Sulla, attracted by the
hope placed in the political upheavals , he returned to Rome, 22 but,
Once suffocated beyond the expectations of the political movements , just to
something accused of extortion Cornelius Dolabella , a former consul who
had already achieved the triumph . 23 By this process he acquired great
reputation in the art of eloquence , but also a lot of hatred . 24 To overcome
this hostility with the distance, after which the defendant was acquitted
and the situation evolved in every aspect in the opposite direction to its
wishes, decided to go to the island of Rhodes to live in peace and
devote the same time to literary studies at the school of Apollonius
Milone , then the celebrated master of eloquence , 25 under which it is said
I've also studied Cicero, the Roman prince of eloquence . 26
While sailing towards Rhodes was captured by pirates ; 27 postponed
Back then all the friends and servants , with the exception of three, because the
procure the money for the ransom, and remained for about forty days
with the pirates , not without great pain and anger . 28 And when
they asked him , being now born out of togetherness
some confidence , what he would do if they were in his
power , he replied , with the air of one who jokes that he would
crucifixes, and confirmed with an oath within themselves so that
would happen. 29 When, returning from Rome 's friends and servants
and paid fifty talents as ransom , he was set free,
immediately procured a fleet , reached the pirates and made them prisoners.
30 But to them already then gave a proof of his future
mildness and clemency . 31 In fact, having a fixed plan to punish the guilty and to keep the oath , he devised an expedient for accomplish with a lighter sentence the one and the other thing . 32 And thus made ​​them
before strangling and then once lifeless hang on the cross. 33
Not , however, he stood with his hands in his hand instead of the activity
Politics: 34 since Mithridates was raging in Asia , passed on the continent
and collections of auxiliary troops , drove away from Asia , the prefect of the king
and maintained except in the province .
At the end of these operations returned to Rome and had as its first
commissioned the military tribune , during which he worked with great
commitment to restore the power of the tribunes weakened by Sulla .
2 Later he obtained fate as superintendent in the Hither Spain , and seeing
for the case in Cadiz in the temple of Hercules a statue of Alexander
Macedon burst into tears at the thought that Alexander ,
age that he had now, had extended the fame of his name until the
ends of the earth , while on the contrary he had not committed any
enterprise worthy of glory. 3 Churches , therefore, to leave the Senate , wishing
to be there for a matter where he might find fame more
big . 4 Returning to Rome, he was immediately troubled by a horrible dream : 5
it seemed to him as he slept with his mother to join . 6 It is this
Unfortunately, one of the misfortunes of men : 7 which, while it is true that
them, as Cicero says and writes Ennio about Homer,
see things in his sleep which are very often used to think or
talk about when they are awake , it is very true , however, is the fact that
men are wont show up horrible visions during sleep and murky
and unrelated to the soul who dreams , so much so that they have the impression
to perform actions in sleep awake never would have thought
to do and for which they would have preferred to die rather than perform them .
8 The vision was related to the magicians , and they, as holders of persons
cunning and devious art , given the nature and the nature of man ,
said with an explanation suited to them that the dream alluded to
extraordinary feats and world domination because she certainly
that he had possessed was nothing more than the common mother earth . 9
So, as it is said , urged him to conceive hopes ambiziosissime .
10 I report these facts because I find it so written by others , not
because I believe that a true man of such great spirit and so
great intelligence has been incited by an idle dream or a vision
night or even untruthful stories of charlatans to conceive
high hopes for the realization of which who does not see how much luck as talent , how many military arts and much fatigue , as short and well would take more than a dream ? 11 Next
was designated building , and in this period fell into great suspicion. not 12
once but many times it is believed that he conspired with men
outstanding to subvert the entire team of the State; 13 but now or in the
Following repentance or fear , now for the death of the conspirators
plan had no effect . 14 In its charge of construction performed many wonderful
works for the beautification of the city, and of all these he alone ,
excluding the connection , if they took credit with the people ; 15 and hoping
that he would not be denied at all , tried to get the province
Egypt with extraordinary task , since the Alexandrians
had deposed their king. 16 But impeditone by the nobles ,
in order to avenge them as he could, he restored to their defiance
the trophies of Marius, new man : that the trophies for victories over Jugurtha
and the Cimbri and the Teutons , who had been felled by pride
Silla his enemy. 17 And again, when he did play against the process
the killers , including in the category of killers , though they were excluded in
under the law Cornelia , who had received money by the Treasury
for denouncing Roman citizens during the proscription of
Silla. 18 Although it did for hatred of opponents, however, acted rightly ,
in my opinion, in regard to himself. 19 In fact, the human law
can not destroy the law of nature .
20 Having lost hope of getting Egypt , he sought to achieve the
maximum papacy , not without a great profusion of gifts, so 21
even then the ambition had invaded the city of Rome , formerly the pontificates
you could buy with the money : a lesser evil because they belonged to
gods ! 22 On this occasion, they do not have enough of its own resources,
contracted an enormous debt ; 23 then on reflection to himself ,
as he went down in the morning in the Campo in toga candida, to the mother who
gave him a kiss he said : 24 "I will return home if not by the pope ."
25 And he returned to the pope, after passing two illustrious competitors,
distinguished by age and dignity. 26 He was then appointed magistrate .
27 At that time had broken the conspiracy of Catiline , and accomplices
the crimes were kept in prison, while all of the 28 Senate
was ready to declare the death penalty against them , he only dared
argued that it was not convenient that they were sentenced to death,
but that may be distributed among the municipalities and kept in state
stop , after they had been confiscated their goods . 29 And perhaps it would be
managed to persuade the senators had created so much terror in all and a lot of concern about the future hatred that would have weighed on them, if they killed those citizens against the law Porcia , which
Decimus Silanus , consul -designate, was not ashamed to adjust its
opinion and bend it with a statement in a milder way . 30
Finally, one after another , among them also the brother of Cicero console ,
conquered by the eloquence of speech supported his opinion, 31
and those most wicked people could have avoided , thanks to the help
the word of one person , the penalty of death sacrosanct, if
Marcus Cato , a man of great authority , had not rectified the
minds geared toward the worst. 32 remain in both speeches
Crispus Sallust , historian of this period. 33 However, he did not give up
to what he had undertaken , until the Roman knights places
arms in defense of the senate not threatened with drawn swords
death, 34 so that the closest fled for fear of punishment
all and few escaped the danger of death by protecting it with
their arms and covering him with the folds of the robe . Troubled by 35
This fact not only desisted initiative undertaken , but omitted
for some time to show up in the same curia . 36 And yet there
the rest had to sit in for a long time , without jump in the storms
the tribune . 37 And so he offered not only as a supporter Cecilio
Metellus , then tribune of the people , who sought to subvert with
the introduction of new laws is the college of tribunes both the State , but
became the instigator , going everywhere on the hunt for political upheavals ,
until the orders of the senate were not removed either by
public . 38 But neither so desist from staying in
charge and dall'amministrare justice, until you realized that they were
ready armed men who forced him to obey the senate .
39 So, certainly dismissed the lictors , put it aside and decided to
sit at rest for the moment, considering the time and manner
the situation. 40 And as many in the days following vied
to present to him and offer him help and willingness to support against
removal from office, he was modesty was distrust, and refused
calmed with a speech balanced their insistence too uncompounded .
41 This behavior turned out much more pleasing to everyone how
most of all was far from expectation . 42 The result was that the senate
gave his thanks to the mouth of famous people , invited him to
come in the curia and after having lauded with the highest praise restored his
toltagli charge previously.
43 Not long after a suspect ran into even more serious. 44
He was accused before the magistrate by Lucius Vettius Nonius Nigro to be
was one of the accomplices of Catiline , slander great quant'altra ever ; 45
in the Senate and was denounced by the Fifth Curio , who seemed destined to enjoy much more credit because he was the one to reveal Be the first to conspiracy and that was why he deserved that were
decreed premiums with public money : 46 he claimed to have
learned from Catiline , while others claimed that he was ready to show
a statement of Caesar written in his own hand . 47 Caesar , believing
not have to endure in any way such a serious slander
and so sharp barbs of envy , he turned to Cicero as a witness
of his innocence and show that he had exposed to him, then the console,
some details of the same conspiracy of which we speak ; 48 refuted
so his opponents , he obtained that Curio was deprived of awards
decretatigli and that Vettius was taken to the security and plundered the furnishings
of the house and then , struck by a heavy fine , it was almost
torn to pieces by the crowd at the rally in front of the Rostra and thrown into prison.
49 With equal tenacity took revenge as well as superintendent because of Nonius
allowed that he was accused before him a magistrate , the magistrate grade
higher.
50 He went still praetor in Spain, and such was the poverty of this man
distinguished that his departure would have been prevented by creditors ,
if they had been quieted by recourse to the guarantors. 51 Accomplished then
his tenure in that region and pacified the province , quickly and without
wait for the successor returned to ask whether the consulate that the triumph ;
52 but they can not legally get them both together , put
aside for the moment the triumph , preferred , wanting to continue to
policy , the consulate . 53 In the rallies , however, found no consular colleague
he wanted, for the opposition party of the nobles , and was
elected consul with Marcus Bibulus . Built in 54 followed by a discussion
on a proposal for agrarian law , Caesar drove with the weapons away from the
hole Bibulus who disagreed , and 55 because they dared to complain
in the Senate , but without someone to get up to propose a punishment
or at least to bring his witness of the illegal act , the incusse
such a fear that what he preferred to do anything rather
that the consul ; 56 and all the time the consulate remained hidden in
home for fear , and if he had to make some decisions he took it
for edicts, while Caesar administered by the State alone , without
minimally someone oppose ; 57 then if someone had the opposite
was forced to give up not only terrified by threats but with
facts. 58 One of them , Marcus Cato , a man of much wisdom and virtue,
attempted to challenge his behavior ; 59 but he did take away
by the Curia at the hands of lictors and put in jail. 60 While there is
went , accompanied him around the Senate , and it seemed that the
one person only they were all imprisoned . 61 There are those who
Senators say that they have changed the dress as if it were a public mourning . 62 And this really so great veneration and affection was rewarded , if I'm not mistaken , the outrage of the prison , so that
Cato seems to have been preferable to be taken to prison for
be drawn out immediately , if it is true that the great solidarity of the Senate
shock and Caesar himself , as he says Valerio , " bent the obstinacy
of that worthy of the gods . " 63 Caesar, then , at the beginning of the Consulate
he realized that feelings of hostility were working against him and that the
Senate had been decreed to the consuls provinces and no weight
glory , 64 and considering that this was directed only against its
and giving person , as was in fact, the thing will be damaged ,
not because it was clearly touched his colleague , on
by the desire for revenge is studied to win with any condescension
sympathy for Pompey, 65 which had it with the Senate because , after the defeat of Mithridates , it had behaved
so too warm in the funeral grant.
66 And so the relationship was more solid , tried to mend the friendship of Marcus Crassus and
Pompey, interrottasi for inveterate hatred following the consulate
they had run together with great suspicion, and made ​​sure
with a skillful and ingenious stratagem that all three constitute a
thing in the State , believing that no one would be turned against
any decision they had taken . 67 And the hope was not in vain .
68 In order to consolidate the friendship with the relationship he gave in marriage to Pompey
their daughter Julia , 69 and then tried to accumulate for himself
support from all sides , he contracted marriage with Calpurnia , the daughter of
Lucius Piso , who would succeed him in the consulate ; 70 with the support
of the votes of the son and the father chose in preference , among all the
provinces , Gaul and Illyricum , as a means of inexhaustible resources and
copious source of triumphs : 71 is not that the Senate gave him the Gaul
Transalpine willingly , but he took it for fear that , if she denied him ,
would have given him the people, and so the gift that it did not want
do would have been done by others.
72 And as the hostility not quieted down , having been
accused by their opponents soon after the start for the province is
that worked , absent for reasons of state , could not be submitted
in judicial proceedings , 73 and he began to make friends with everyone in mind
those who were going to cover public office, and not
no more help from then on , rather than prevent it , with all its
forces , except those who had promised to defend him during the
his absence , 74 and did not hesitate to give the matter a lot to the oath and a written statement of his own hand . 75 Hearing then say that Domitius , a candidate for the office of consul , who
magistrate had wanted osteggiarlo the previous year , he used to boast
that what by the magistrate had failed to do he would have done from the console
and would have removed the army , he devised a means to prevent the arrival
this man at the consulate , and facts come in the name of the new
Pompey and Crassus friends with him for an interview in Lucca , drove them
to ask the consulate for the following year so that Domitius in
presence of influential competitors so did not do . Wanting to 76
then do so in the future that the hatred of the opponents could not
nothing against him , he got even with the help of so influential supporters ,
the military command that he be extended by the Senate for a
five-year period , 77 but this was the cause of great upheavals and Gaul
and in Italy and around the world. 78 However, since they were second
his desires , feeling safer now not held in any account
opponents and new laws promulgated in his discretion undertaken every
kind of war , of any danger and gravity, making those businesses
of which from now on will begin to treat . As I prepare to write the exploits of Julius Caesar in
Gallie , I thought I should first describe the position
geographical Gaul , where companies have been accomplished ; topic 2
that has been treated by some authors so confused that
same description has misled the reader's mind from the knowledge
of the facts. 3 This argument should be much easier for me
since almost all the territories of those distant regions, I have them
paths now to spend your free time and only for the desire to
see and know now because of work commitments , even though 4
the change of the names in these lands , as in almost all others,
adversely , and the writer and the reader many new difficulties . 5 But to me
how can I manage it . 6 Entire Gaul therefore , in the first place that
extended to a large area of ​​land occupies a large part of Europe, is
divided into two parts . 7 And the names that have been given by the Romans appears
clear from the fact that they called the part that is closer to
Rome Cisalpine because they too were on the side of the Alps ;
the other hand, the most distant , Transalpine , 8 , and this distinction was observed
also in the name of the Spains , so that for this reason
Hither came closer than that , the further away instead .
9 From that easily and without a doubt the intelligent reader will understand that the authors of these names were those who were holders of power . 10 And that which was once the Gaul or
Hither and had as its boundaries from one side to the west , and south
the Apennines , across the Alps to the north and east of the Gulf of
Adriatic sea and the little river Rubicon, which comes from the Apennines
and pour in the same Adriatic Sea not far from Rimini - a region
distinguished by numerous big cities and famous for many rivers and
lakes - is divided in two by the Po river Eridanus regal which the Greeks call :
11 this expanse of land , I say, is no longer Gaul, but part of Italy.
12 With regard to Gaul o Further , geographers and
historians have divided in various ways , but the question , because it is already quite
dark with them and would require to be clarified speech
too long, the omit. 13 I might mention that on which all
I agree and I think that 's true: 14 the whole territory of Gaul
extended in length from the Italian Alps to the ocean British
and Pyrenees Mountains , which separate the Gauls by the Spaniards , and in width
between the rivers Rhine and the Rhone and the two seas , that is, the ocean and the Tyrrhenian Sea,
in which these rivers flow , to a perimeter , as Suetonius says
Quiet, about three thousand two hundred miles. 15 Among all these
parts and regions stands out with its own name only
Gallia Belgica . 16 Although the authors have different opinions
on its territory, it can be said that, that the Gauls lived belgici
to the left bank of the Rhine, where it is closest to the ocean ; 17
In fact, those who live on the right side were not Gauls but Germans.
18 Therefore, the region of the Belgians began from the ocean, between the north
west and separates the island of Britain from the continent , and
stretched between the north and the east side of the river bed ; 19
Today these lands are situated Flanders , the Brabanza and Annonia and many
other regions, and is the glory of all the neighboring regions, the noble
Colonia Agrippina and famous , founded later by Marcus Agrippa ,
that even today retains the name of its founder. 20 And of these
Belgians had read that , and now we know directly , in excess of
all the inhabitants of Gaul in physical force, use of weapons and
every aspect of the art of war. 21 All this , however, population
he ended up little by little , nor prevented the Rhine , under the name and
Germany language , so that they do not know his name Galli and , if
hear him say , s'indignerebbero . 22 For the Belgians were very close to
Helvetians , who enjoyed roughly the same fame and their value in
war. 23 The highest mountain in the west of Jura separates their territory from Sequani ; 24 the Rhine river then , when it is still close to the source ,
separates this territory to the north by the Germans , 25 but also
Helvetians , as we have said of the Belgians, with the passage of time are
passed under the name of Germany. 26 And so Germany
claimed for itself large parts of Gaul , such as Italy
has claimed for itself the entire Gaul . 27 From the east the barrier
Alpine separates the Helvetii from Itali with mountains that rise up to
sky and glaciers . 28 At midday, the Lake Geneva and the Rhone ,
that crosses the lake , marked the boundary between them and the Allobrogi . 29
length of this territory , as stated by Julius Celsus, was two hundred and forty
miles , the width of one hundred and eighty ; 30 and however for
amount of the population and the desire to fight seemed
them to be delimited and locked in prisons very cramped. From 31
the above description, if I'm not mistaken , it is clear that in their territory
in the southern part were those who now call
Burgundians from " villages " ; 32 north then was that stretch of
land along the Rhine where there are now the cities of Argentina , Basel and
Constance. 33 On this side of the Rhone Allobrogi the occupied part
left side of the river ; 34 at the tract of land which they occupy , as
says the quoted Julius Celsus, the far corner and bordering the
Helvetii was once occupied by the town of Genava , 35 now occupies
the small town of Geneva overlooking Lake Geneva and the Rhone , 36 the
which comes here from the lake richer than water as he had entered it .
37 There is now a bridge is not great and there was already before the time
Julius Caesar ; 38 This part of the wall of the city and ends in
territory of the Helvetii : 39 very nature had not yet placed
no barrier between populations at that time hostile to each other if
not that of a small river. 40 But I shall come back later , and now I am looking for
to proceed quickly with the description begun. 41 I therefore Sequani
were closer to the western and further away from the Rhine; 42
I do not know if they have derived its name from the river of their land or
Instead they were to give it to the river. 43 On their right were the
Belgians , behind the Helvetii , left the province of Lyon , belonging
Moreover, the Helvetians , and also that Arelatese and Narbonne , 44 front
then the western ocean and the Garonne River , on whose right
 
Having a quick look at the Google translation, I'd say that it would probably be easier to translate from Italian to English than it would be from Google's translation to English! If you want to start Dantem and see how it goes it sounds great. I'm off all week next week so I was thinking that we could work through Google hangouts - it might make it faster? I can work together with both you and Gaby, depending on your free time. Just let me know if you think it might work.
 
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