alex jones and jeff rense
crazy croc said:
... Back to Jones, maybe I can make my point more clear. Ok, the average American is duped, dumbed down, easily hoodwinked, etc. That is true. I can see how if everyone followed Jones that in fact he would indeed become just another leader serving a flawed and selfish agenda. I do however believe that if his rhetoric were the main stream then the world would be a better place than it is.
I think that the main problem that most of us have with Jones - myself included - is that he is absolutely no different from those he rails against - he appeals to and manipulates the emotions, promotes himself shamelessly rather than the issues themselves, and in the end, people like him have historically turned out to be just a straw man set up by the real controllers to make those seeking truth think they are really getting it. If you read Protocol 12, you can see exactly how Jones fits into the picture as a "third rank" press that is seemingly in direct opposition, but is really designed as a tool to keep the PTBs fingers on the pulse of the dissent, and even to vector it.
I hope that you can see that this is actually a lot more dangerous and deceptive than something that is overtly Right Wing and doesn't pretend to be otherwise.
Let me quote a little bit from Lobaczewski's "Political Ponerology" that I think will explain the perspective:
A Pathocracy has nowhere to go but down. Any leadership position, (down to local mayors and community cooperative managers, not to mention the directors of police units, and special-services police personnel, and activists in the pathocratic party in power) must be filled by individuals participation in such a regime is due to psychological deviations, which are inherited as a rule. Such people become more valuable to the regime because they constitute a very small percentage of the population. Due to this factor, their intellectual level or professional skills cannot be taken into account in placing them in positions of power, since those individuals who actually are competent in the specific jobs and are also pathological (and therefore trustworthy to the regime) are even harder to find.
After such a system has lasted several years, one hundred percent of all the cases of essential psychopathy are involved in pathocratic activity; they are considered the most loyal, even though some of them were formerly involved on the other side in some way.
Under such conditions, no area of social life can develop normally, whether in economics, culture, science, technology, administration, etc. Pathocracy progressively paralyzes everything. Pathocracy progressively intrudes everywhere and dulls everything.
If all - or most - of the many managerial positions are assumed by individuals deprived of sufficient abilities to feel and understand normal people, and who also suffer from deficiencies in technical imagination and practical skills - (faculties indispensable for governing economic and political matters) this must result in an exceptionally serious crisis in all areas, both within the country in question and with regard to international relations.
Within, the situation shall become unbearable even for those citizens who were able to feather their nest into a relatively comfortable modus vivendi. Outside, other societies start to feel the pathological quality of the phenomenon quite distinctly. Such a state of affairs cannot last long. One must then be prepared for ever more rapid changes, and also behave with great circumspection.
Goaded by their character, pathological deviants thirst for global power even though it would conflict with their own life interest. They do not understand that a catastrophe will ensue when they are finally exposed for what they are. Germs are not aware that they will be burned alive or buried deep in the ground along with the human body whose death they are causing.
Now, I, myself, am not a psychologist, but we have several professionals in QFG and we observe and discuss everything about these things in private and the general consensus is that Jones very likely is "one of them." He exhibits all the classic signs, and the material we have been able to collect about his background, and from people who have had personal interactions with him over the years. Based on Lobaczewski's observations and analyses, the likelihood is that he is either already part of "the show," or that he will, when the opportunity presents itself, "turn" - even if he continues to pretend to be opposition to the PTB.
So, here's the problem that normal people with the ability to have a developed, objective conscience face: there ARE a statistically small percentage of deviants in ALL societies that have a statistically HUGE effect on those societies because of their extremely active and persistent natures. (Note that this describes Jones, also.)
Robert Hare points out that "The problem for the organization [group, society] is that
only one or two of these people can do enormous damage, particularly if they get very high up in the organization."
Now, looking at a case cited by Babiak, we note that "Dr. Babiak had been brought in to help a major corporation in Colorado. His job was to assess a management team that was underperforming. ... Morale was low, conflict high."
That pretty well describes the so-called 9/11 Truth movement, doesn't it? It is majorly underperforming, and morale is low and conflict is high. So we might guess that there are psychopaths or other deviants in the mix there. Logic compels us to this hypothesis.
We also notice, from the sample case (and, as Cleckley says, if you've seen one, you've seen them all), that "Babiak was charmed by the fast-talking guy at the center of the problem. He came across very sincere, and modest... "
Now, let's consider what Babiak did. He gave out a bunch of assessment forms to ALL people involved. The results were quite interesting because it was only when he was comparing opinions of different people that he realized that there MIGHT be a problem.
Babiak said:
....I only came to realize there was something going on when I got the results of the assessments that were being done, and I found quite a discrepancy. A number of people really, really liked him, and that included some of the higher level people I must say. And a number of people really despised him, really thought he was evil. One person referred to him as a "snake."
Surprise! Surprise! There were people who REALLY liked the guy... and a number of people really despised him.
Well, gee, you could say that about anybody who is in any kind of leadership position. There sure are a few people who actively despise me and spend a LOT of time defaming me.
But Babiak had an additional tool: Hare's PCL-R checklist.
Babiak said:
Bob had sent me the PCL-R, or the Psychopathy Checklist, which he had developed while studying psychopaths in prison samples.
He came out high on the conning and manipulation side of the PCL-R equation and middle-of-the-road on the anti-social behavior side. Thus he was able to hide his manipulations from view of those around him, yet he exerted undue influence, negative influence, on the group.
More than this, Babiak did some additional analysis:
Babiak said:
When I sorted through the data I found that the supporters and the detractors could actually be broken down into four groups, based upon the amount of first-hand experience they had with Dave, and the amount of help they could be to his career. One group, I called them The Patrons, was made up of the President, the Vice-President and some Directors of the firm, effectively the higher levels of the organization. Now, this group of individuals had considerable formal power in the company but they actually knew very little about Dave. What limited interactions they had with Dave were positive but, I learned later, each had been carefully staged by Dave to get the effect he wanted. As a result, these executives protected and defended him from subsequent criticism.
Now, as I previously wrote, it's not hard to imagine large numbers of these types of people being attracted to professions where they can achieve power, money, and other attributes of control over others. It's also not hard to imagine the very same types being drawn into the vacuum of Truth where 9-11 Researchers, Alternative Media Personalities, Historical Revisionists, find a venue to set up a "stock-market of information".
The problem here is the SERIOUSNESS of the situation. If we don't figure this one out, and FAST, it is a flat out certainty that we are all gonna die and our children too, and there is going to be NO FUTURE for humanity.
IT IS THAT SERIOUS.
And if you don't know that, then you are asleep.
We have a situation that is exactly as Babiak described about a corporation above, only bigger and more complex. We also have a situation that is just RIPE for psychological deviants. We also have a situation where, if we have two neurons firing, we KNOW that just about anything and everything that gets any wide play is probably disinformation because we ARE dealing with CRIMINALS here who have committed horrendous, egregious crimes against individuals and humanity. You don't think they aren't going to be johnny-on-the-spot with the cover-up, do you? Or that the 9-11 Truth Movement isn't under their control?
But, assuming that you do really care about your future, the future of your children, the future of humanity, then you will certainly WANT to contribute to the solution, and not the problem.
The same should be true about Jones. And just now, the most important information to be dispensed to everyone in the world is a proper understanding of the types of individuals we are dealing with in positions of power: psychological deviants.
If this information were widely spread, taught, even "preached," as Jones is so fond of doing, then people would begin to understand where to put their focus.
If they really, REALLY understood that they were being bamboozled by true pathological types, that most of the PTB are ABNORMAL, then there would probably be no problem in bringing the different factions of normal people together.
When you think about the psychological deviant problem, when you see that it is behind religions, racism, partisan politics, etc etc, and you see that these deviants use every kind of ploy to pit normal humans against one another so as to keep them off the scent of the real problem, the deviants, then you can begin to understand why we have a problem with Rense, Jones, and quite a few others.
They have all been given opportunities to receive this information and to propagate it; they have all, categorically, by their actions and lack of response to those offers, refused.
In short, they do not even want to touch the one thing that would bring all normal people together in an effort to solve the problems of this world.
Why?
Obviously because they don't want to.
And searching their backgrounds as Babiak did "Dave's", we discover why: because they are probably deviants themselves which indicates to us what they are really doing.
So, what to do? The question has emerged that what we then must deal with is to expose people like "Dave". They are snakes that hide among us and do their damage so covertly that even the most clever and psychologically educated person, such as industrial psychologist, Babiak, was puzzled.
Well, he hooked up with Hare, the psychopath expert and they devised a plan: an 111-point questionnaire they call the 'Business Scan' or 'B-Scan'.
This is actually a formalized structure of the exact thing that we have been doing and teaching large numbers of people in our discussion groups, working groups, and now in public on this forum: a form of networking, sharing inside information not just about information and/or history, but about the PEOPLE disseminating that information.
The thing about the B-Scan is that it is not filled out by the individual in question: his claims or words are not even considered. Instead, it is a questionnaire that is completed by others above and below the 'problem employee' to pinpoint personality traits and behaviors which may be destructive. In short, they have developed a business specific questionnaire (which costs a lot of money, by the way) that imitates what we have long promoted: the idea of
a network that honestly and openly shares information about their experiences with others, and does due diligence about those others the instant any questions arise, and shares that information.
Remember: nearly all of the "rules" that society evaluates people by have been devised and set up by a psychopathic culture that thrives in the darkness that is created by people being afraid to discuss their observations about, and experiences with, others. Additionally, it has to be kept in mind that when you are dealing with psychopaths, about all you are going to get is impressions, opinions, and anecdotal experiences: they are generally that good and don't leave bodies around to be found.
So, here you are receiving the equivalent of the responses on Babiak and Hare's B-Scan about several individuals in the so-called 9/11 Truth Movement including Alex Jones. There are several threads in this forum where many individuals have contributed masses of data and observations that effectively "out" both Rense and Jones (as well as some others) as "Snakes in Suits."
You, on the other hand, are rejecting this information...
crazy croc said:
From my perspective, the world and it's social chess game has seen the check. The game is almost up in my opinion and if the masses will only listen to meglomaniacs with good broadcasting voices, rubber stamped formatting and huge egos then I believe that's what it's going to take to get the masses of zombies to even look past their own eyelashes at what is happening and what is about to happen or could happen.
I can understand your point, the problem is, I am telling you that Jones isn't really waking anybody up to anything, he's just herding them into a different corral with a different label on it and all the corrals empty into the same abbatoir.
crazy croc said:
The fact is, the trap isn't being layed, we are already in it and on the way to extermination.
Sure, and Jones is helping to "git those doggies rolling!" It's all about inflaming passions and creating a revolution. How else you think they are going to manage the annihilation? It's called stirring the indians up against each other so they will kill each other off... an old, tried and true tactic.
crazy croc said:
At this point, I welcome any approach that makes Americans think about something other than nichole smith or the latest game show. Whatever your opinion may be about Jones's agenda, the fact is, he reports many of the same articles that are presented here at Sott. I personally don't feel he spins the facts of what he reports. Now as to how he rants and attempts to persuade perception, that certainly needs to be approached with caution and aptly debated as to it's potential worth and outcome.
Yes, he reports many of the same articles we report. What is most striking, however, is what he does NOT report. And the same with Rense, Michael Rivero, and a host of other gate-keepers for the 9-11 Movement.
As I said, the first and main thing that the masses need to be educated about is TRUE psychology. They need to be "worked up" and "motivated" to read and study!!! If Jones was doing something truly for humanity, THAT is what he would be doing. He wouldn't just be rabble rousing hate against the PTB just because they are "greedy, mean people that want all your money and your life" or to "enslave you" and so on. He needs to teach people how and why such human beings exist, that they are not just ordinary people "gone bad," and that such individuals exist in, and twist and pervert, any movement unless people are aware of the types, the signs and symptoms, and take action to exclude them from their midst.
I hope that this helps you to understand our perspective, that Jones, even if he seems to be doing a "good job," can be seen to be one of the biggest helps to their revolutionary plans going.
Read Douglas Reed's "Controversy of Zion" and you will understand how revolution is exactly what is wanted - to make all the normal people who "believe in something," fight other normal people who also "believe in something," and kill each other off.
