Bad Boys

[BHelmet]

Sorry if my toe tapping was getting on your nerves. I was hoping you would still post your conjecture and theorizing. (And you did!)

I do agree with what you've written. I think the dynamic of our birth family, relationships with parents, siblings, extended family (if any), all has an effect on who we grow into. These are our first examples/role models. Obviously they have very positive or negative (or both) impact on how we begin to navigate our own relationships throughout our lives. I don't think that certain results are the only results though.

What I mean is that when you are a little kid, and something happens - you are just going to react - you are not going to reason it out, (before the higher level concepts are learned). It is primitive but at some point it is inevitable that "Mom doesn't love who I am, any more" "I am bad" etc, is going to get rammed into the various centers through their various pathways. It just can't be sidestepped. It is a part of the rocky path here on this planet. It is a kind of inevitable generative spark that starts the process going.

I am not offended if you want to describe heinous women.

I am thinking just from a mechanical point of view. Robot machines. No judgements.

I've known a few myself. I'm also not a man-hater, I will make the jokes but I've known some remarkable outstanding men in my life...I even made one myself, lol.

Bravo!

I do think that most people grow up following unhealthy patterns without being aware that this is what they're doing. Deflecting blame, drinking/drugs, temper/abuse, abandoning, being abandoned...I can go on but you know what I mean. A life of strife and they may never understand why or how to change things.

Good girls are attracted to bad boys for many reasons. The same with good boys and bad girls. Do they subconsciously remind you of a stern/abusive father or mother? Is this the dynamic of your parents' relationship? Does the good girl get sick of being in her happy shiny good 'box' and want to take a walk/ride on the wild/free-er side of life? Do many believe that 'love hurts' or they should do anything for love, so they take it and keep trying to love him/her better? So many options, eh? So many reasons, I think.

Yeah

You can open any can of worms you like with me, lol. Worms don't make me queasy. Just no spiders please. Please!?

Aha! you've revealed your vulnerable spot! (a sign of true strength) Mmm, you can trust me not to go there. although some of the worst demons are said to be spider like.

You wanna know what I've noticed with the long term happy marriages that I've known personally...who are still together and happy? In each case, there was no boss. They took turns according to their strengths. Communication. Commitment. But I did notice that, for the most part, the wife was more alpha, in as much as she 'seemed' to run the roost.

Yes, dear.
Plenty of good memes here. If mama ain't happy nobody is happy, etc. Smart guys learn this and joke about it. BTW, my wife of 38 years has plenty of alpha characteristics. The tricky part of the dance is knowing when to take the reigns to instill security versus avoiding getting into unnecessary head butting over dumb insignificant stuff.

But in their homes with them, it became clear that when they were together they worked like a well oiled machine.

So, as we do seem to see eye to eye...I agree that we are both correct. I don't think you can narrow it down to one or two particular causes or reasons. I think the reasons are various and how they manifest in each child/grown up is unique depending on the strength and weaknesses of the child. And on that note, I would like to thank y'all for coming to our Ted Talk!!

LOL with an audience of zero! Be sure to like and subscribe. Next episode of Jacy and Helmet will thankfully be back to taunting, trash talk, repartee and innuendo galore!

 

[jacygirl]

What I mean is that when you are a little kid, and something happens - you are just going to react - you are not going to reason it out, (before the higher level concepts are learned). It is primitive but at some point it is inevitable that "Mom doesn't love who I am, any more" "I am bad" etc, is going to get rammed into the various centers through their various pathways. It just can't be sidestepped. It is a part of the rocky path here on this planet. It is a kind of inevitable generative spark that starts the process going.


I am thinking just from a mechanical point of view. Robot machines. No judgements.

Bravo!



Yeah


Aha! you've revealed your vulnerable spot! (a sign of true strength) Mmm, you can trust me not to go there. although some of the worst demons are said to be spider like.

Yes, dear.
Plenty of good memes here. If mama ain't happy nobody is happy, etc. Smart guys learn this and joke about it. BTW, my wife of 38 years has plenty of alpha characteristics. The tricky part of the dance is knowing when to take the reigns to instill security versus avoiding getting into unnecessary head butting over dumb insignificant stuff.


LOL with an audience of zero! Be sure to like and subscribe. Next episode of Jacy and Helmet will thankfully be back to taunting, trash talk, repartee and innuendo galore!

It's stupid early here so I hope I don't reveal too much, lol. Let's start with what you wrote.

"What I mean is that when you are a little kid, and something happens - you are just going to react - you are not going to reason it out, (before the higher level concepts are learned)." At an early age I realized that my mother gave conditional love. Love was withheld if she didn't 'approve' of my words/behavior. I also became aware that my father used me as a weapon to hurt my mother by saying awful things about me (which I heard from my bed as they fought). I always gave unconditional love to anyone I've loved, and don't regret it even if I didn't get it in return.

"Aha! you've revealed your vulnerable spot! (a sign of true strength) Mmm, you can trust me not to go there. although some of the worst demons are said to be spider like." Yep, I'm an open book! Thank you! I could literally write a thesis on why spiders are evil (I call them Satan's Minions).

"If mama ain't happy nobody is happy, etc". Yeah, yeah, yeah (sorry, channeling The Beatles' there, lol). Well an unhappy dad can be bad (see I rhymed it)...so basically miserable parent(s) can put a real downer on the family atmosphere.

"my wife of 38 years" This makes me happy. Do you two banter? I am just realizing that banter is the common thread in my romantic relationships. I love good funny banter, it's like foreplay. Sure my body will react to the appropriate stimulation...but you stimulate my brain/soul with intelligent humor...and apparently I'll follow you anywhere!

"LOL with an audience of zero! Be sure to like and subscribe." I'll have you know that we have had guests. Yes, I found out how to see how many guests/members are online and also which threads guests are looking at. (Don't ask me how, my skills are Mata Hari level!)

"Next episode of Jacy and Helmet will thankfully be back to taunting, trash talk, repartee and innuendo galore!" Back to our regular program?? I'm laughing, it sounds like a podcast. Probably better than Dax Shepard's 'Armchair Expert'. Obviously.

Closing remarks...As a quiet only child I was privy to a lot of adult conversations. I sat drawing or coloring, and listening...and learning. I had an ability to understand my own situation with my parents and learned a lot about "what not to do". I came to the conclusion that most of these adults were rather clueless...and that opinion has stayed with me (and been proven correct) as I've aged.
On that rather arrogant remark, hehe, I'm needing more coffee. (Feel free to begin a new topic. Not that I'm trying to get the last word in, but if anything is on your mind...I likely have an opinion or two!!)

 

[BHelmet]

"my wife of 38 years" This makes me happy. Do you two banter?

Not exactly. Our mutual emotional co-dependence requires a different approach although if we are out on a date (yes we still go on dates) and have a glass of wine we can banter without triggering.

I am just realizing that banter is the common thread in my romantic relationships. I love good funny banter, it's like foreplay. Sure my body will react to the appropriate stimulation...but you stimulate my brain/soul with intelligent humor...and apparently I'll follow you anywhere!

OK yes, you've revealed too much but I love it. The brain/mind is indeed the most important sexual organ.

"LOL with an audience of zero! Be sure to like and subscribe." I'll have you know that we have had guests. Yes, I found out how to see how many guests/members are online and also which threads guests are looking at. (Don't ask me how, my skills are Mata Hari level!)

So far, I see us as shooting the breeze at the watering hole in a meaningful way?

Closing remarks...As a quiet only child

OK, stop right there! Eureka! This is our connection. (or one of them). I too am an only child. What does this mean? No sibling entanglements and distractions to bounce off of. But too much parental bright light exposure. No one to blame. Nowhere to hide. But more importantly - I think being an only child forces you to develop a relationship with yourself at a very early age because, well, there is nobody else there to interact with! You have to learn how to entertain yourself and play alone. Perhaps this factors into how we can both sound like 2 schizophrenics, at times. Or Tryptophrenics?

I was privy to a lot of adult conversations.

same

I sat drawing or coloring, and listening...and learning. I had an ability to understand my own situation with my parents and learned a lot about "what not to do". I came to the conclusion that most of these adults were rather clueless...and that opinion has stayed with me (and been proven correct) as I've aged.

Does this mean that now that you are an adult (at least age wise) you are officially clueless? There is a valuable lesson about petards here.

On that rather arrogant remark, hehe, I'm needing more coffee. (Feel free to begin a new topic. Not that I'm trying to get the last word in, but if anything is on your mind...I likely have an opinion or two!!)

You?! Taking the last word?! I'll let you have it, for now... until your next comment!

 

[jacygirl]

Not exactly. Our mutual emotional co-dependence requires a different approach although if we are out on a date (yes we still go on dates) and have a glass of wine we can banter without triggering.


OK yes, you've revealed too much but I love it. The brain/mind is indeed the most important sexual organ.

So far, I see us as shooting the breeze at the watering hole in a meaningful way?

OK, stop right there! Eureka! This is our connection. (or one of them). I too am an only child. What does this mean? No sibling entanglements and distractions to bounce off of. But too much parental bright light exposure. No one to blame. Nowhere to hide. But more importantly - I think being an only child forces you to develop a relationship with yourself at a very early age because, well, there is nobody else there to interact with! You have to learn how to entertain yourself and play alone. Perhaps this factors into how we can both sound like 2 schizophrenics, at times. Or Tryptophrenics?


same

Does this mean that now that you are an adult (at least age wise) you are officially clueless? There is a valuable lesson about petards here.

You?! Taking the last word?! I'll let you have it, for now... until your next comment!

Your comments above deserve some thought before I respond. I just finished with...a friend calling needing mothering from me...taking my garbage out...which led to my landlord accidentally locking me outside (thank GOD she had not left yet in her car!!)
So I will take a deep breath and think, so I can give your reply the respect it deserves.

 

[BHelmet]

So I will take a deep breath and think, so I can give your reply the respect it deserves.

So out of character. I must have touched something somewhere. May your finest mothering skills be manifested to the assistance of your friend.

 

[jacygirl]

So out of character. I must have touched something somewhere. May your finest mothering skills be manifested to the assistance of your friend.

I'm waiting for my food to heat. Lo and behold, here's you getting the final word...again.
I swear to God, I literally wrote: "...so I can give your reply the respect it deserves (but likely not!)".
I deleted it because, well...I'm not a complete ass-hat. An incomplete ass-hat...sounds like a good name for something, eh?
lol

 

[BHelmet]

I'm waiting for my food to heat. Lo and behold, here's you getting the final word...again.
I swear to God, I literally wrote: "...so I can give your reply the respect it deserves (but likely not!)".
I deleted it because, well...I'm not a complete ass-hat.

Why go half way? The middle way is hard to argue against, but it has its detractors. Or as a friend of mine used to say, why be mediocre when you can be the worst?

An incomplete ass-hat...sounds like a good name for something, eh?
lol

I like half-baked ass-hat.

 

[jacygirl]

Why go half way? The middle way is hard to argue against, but it has its detractors. Or as a friend of mine used to say, why be mediocre when you can be the worst?

I like half-baked ass-hat.

Aww...half-baked ass-hat like you too.
In a friend way, just to be clear lol. I am no longer a slave to my appreciation of good banter, and prefer to love everyone from afar.
(Said with respect for your wife who must be a saint, or at least a candidate for sainthood after all these years.)
Now I need to concentrate on my reply to our continuing saga.
*waves* to guests and lurkers. Grab a drink, pull up a chair, stay while.

 

[jacygirl]

Not exactly. Our mutual emotional co-dependence requires a different approach although if we are out on a date (yes we still go on dates) and have a glass of wine we can banter without triggering.


OK yes, you've revealed too much but I love it. The brain/mind is indeed the most important sexual organ.

So far, I see us as shooting the breeze at the watering hole in a meaningful way?

OK, stop right there! Eureka! This is our connection. (or one of them). I too am an only child. What does this mean? No sibling entanglements and distractions to bounce off of. But too much parental bright light exposure. No one to blame. Nowhere to hide. But more importantly - I think being an only child forces you to develop a relationship with yourself at a very early age because, well, there is nobody else there to interact with! You have to learn how to entertain yourself and play alone. Perhaps this factors into how we can both sound like 2 schizophrenics, at times. Or Tryptophrenics?


same

Does this mean that now that you are an adult (at least age wise) you are officially clueless? There is a valuable lesson about petards here.

You?! Taking the last word?! I'll let you have it, for now... until your next comment!

"Our mutual emotional co-dependence..." After that many years together I would say "Of course you're mutually emotionally co-dependent!" That can be viewed as a negative but can also be a positive. Going on dates is smart, glad you banter when you're drinking wine. (Are you drinking wine when you write to me here? Or do the tequila shots have to come out?)

"...you've revealed too much..." I suppose this is where I'm supposed to be embarrassed now. I'm not. That was younger me, older me just appreciates a good banter without needing anything more. Pretty mature of me, eh?

"...shooting the breeze at the watering hole in a meaningful way..." So very meaningful. We are dispensing wisdom and how we got it. Real life experiences are easy for people to relate to. Plus we hopefully make them laugh too, so it's a win-win as far as I'm concerned.

Yes, to everything in your first paragraph about being an only child. Do we really sound like schizophrenics? I'm more multiple personality disorder I think cuz I have a dozen conversations going on in my head. I learned from visiting friends who had siblings that you have to get used to random acts of violence, having your stuff stolen or destroyed, fighting over food/treats...I mean it was pure chaos sometimes. Many times I was happy to go home and do my own thing. At this point in my life now, I can enjoy my alone time so much it's obnoxious.

Now that I'm an adult am I clueless? Ahem, I was never clueless. I now have so many clues...more than Colonel Mustard with the candlestick in the library. ("Clue"game reference) Nope, I do not get distracted by something shiny. (reference to Cher character in movie "Clueless"). I do not...wait...what was the question?

Aww, you let me have the last word. I would expect no less from my superior.
Saunters away singing, "Don't dream it's over...". (what I mean is, if you think you're ever getting the last word again you're dreaming!)

 

[BHelmet]

"Our mutual emotional co-dependence..." After that many years together I would say "Of course you're mutually emotionally co-dependent!" That can be viewed as a negative but can also be a positive.

I like that ambivalent, open for interpretation slant.

Going on dates is smart, glad you banter when you're drinking wine. (Are you drinking wine when you write to me here? Or do the tequila shots have to come out?)

100% Organic and natural craziness. No added ingredients.

"...you've revealed too much..." I suppose this is where I'm supposed to be embarrassed now.

No, that's your interpretation. Just being honest. Sort of.

I'm not. That was younger me, older me just appreciates a good banter without needing anything more. Pretty mature of me, eh?

I bow down.

Yes, to everything in your first paragraph about being an only child. Do we really sound like schizophrenics?

Talking to yourself again, hmmmm?
And that is another interpretation. Are we ultimately just talking to ourselves even as we are thinking we are talking to some other? Self-awareness has it's own pitfalls.

I'm more multiple personality disorder I think cuz I have a dozen conversations going on in my head. I learned from visiting friends who had siblings that you have to get used to random acts of violence, having your stuff stolen or destroyed, fighting over food/treats...I mean it was pure chaos sometimes. Many times I was happy to go home and do my own thing. At this point in my life now, I can enjoy my alone time so much it's obnoxious.

100% "Honey, are you going to be alright, alone?" "Oh, yes. Trust me on that"

Now that I'm an adult am I clueless? Ahem, I was never clueless. I now have so many clues...more than Colonel Mustard with the candlestick in the library. ("Clue"game reference) Nope, I do not get distracted by something shiny. (reference to Cher character in movie "Clueless"). I do not...wait...what was the question?

Aww, you let me have the last word. I would expect no less from my superior.
Saunters away singing, "Don't dream it's over...". (what I mean is, if you think you're ever getting the last word again you're dreaming!)

Figured that out a while ago. But still...dreaming. Row your boat gently (?gently?) up the stream. Life is but a dream. That was in Star trek too. IF we don't row, we're going down stream. To where? The vast Ocean? Off Niagra Falls? Slip sliding away?

 

[jacygirl]

Oh! You just touched on something I've been pondering a lot lately!
"Talking to yourself again, hmmmm?
And that is another interpretation. Are we ultimately just talking to ourselves even as we are thinking we are talking to some other? Self-awareness has it's own pitfalls."

There are a lot of articles about how enlightenment and psychosis are pretty much the same experience. Doesn't that alone make you stop in your tracks? They do go on to explain the differences, but it makes me keep asking myself if I'm being psychotic. Of course the answer is always 'no'...then I think well that's what a psychotic person would say. But then I remember that they don't question if they're being psychotic so that's when I start breathing normally again.

I started acknowledging that perhaps I was talking to my 'higher self'. If we can be alive in multiple timelines (can't remember the actual C's wordage)...past present and future...then I thought maybe my 'higher self' was 'future me'. I will think about different theories to explain who I'm talking to, but can't really settle on one that doesn't sound crazy.

To be clear, I do not hear different voices telling me to burn things. It's my own voice in my head, my own songs I love playing randomly, and my own sense of humor. So I suppose I am talking to myself. Thus far that 'higher self' or conscience or consciousness....has guided me well so I don't doubt their loyalty, lol.

As the mother of twins, I do have a really amusing (to me) theory about who I'm talking to. Not sure if I'm ready to expose myself again right now. Need to think about that. (need to decide if it's really as funny as I think it is, lol)

 

[BHelmet]

Aww...half-baked ass-hat like you too.
In a friend way, just to be clear lol. I am no longer a slave to my appreciation of good banter, and prefer to love everyone from afar.
(Said with respect for your wife who must be a saint, or at least a candidate for sainthood after all these years.)

Thank you so much! LOL We are all helping each other on the way to sainthood by thoughtfully and generously providing conveniently heavy crosses to bear!

Now I need to concentrate on my reply to our continuing saga.
*waves* to guests and lurkers. Grab a drink, pull up a chair, stay while.

I have been thinking about this too, as regards to the external consideration of Gurdjieff. More on that later.

 

[BHelmet]

There are a lot of articles about how enlightenment and psychosis are pretty much the same experience.

Aha, I knew it!

Doesn't that alone make you stop in your tracks?

It doesn't stop you, does it?

They do go on to explain the differences, but it makes me keep asking myself if I'm being psychotic.

You say psychotic, I say phsyic, Potaytoe, Potahto... At this age, psiatic, Let's call the whole thing off...

Of course the answer is always 'no'...then I think well that's what a psychotic person would say. But then I remember that they don't question if they're being psychotic so that's when I start breathing normally again.

You are a complex one. My answer is: all of the above, so what?

I started acknowledging that perhaps I was talking to my 'higher self'. If we can be alive in multiple timelines (can't remember the actual C's wordage)...past present and future...then I thought maybe my 'higher self' was 'future me'. I will think about different theories to explain who I'm talking to, but can't really settle on one that doesn't sound crazy.

Nice, I really like it

To be clear, I do not hear different voices telling me to burn things. It's my own voice in my head, my own songs I love playing randomly, and my own sense of humor. So I suppose I am talking to myself. Thus far that 'higher self' or conscience or consciousness....has guided me well so I don't doubt their loyalty, lol.

As the mother of twins, I do have a really amusing (to me) theory about who I'm talking to. Not sure if I'm ready to expose myself again right now. Need to think about that. (need to decide if it's really as funny as I think it is, lol)

Well, if it is funny to you then it is funny. Kids are an amazing wonder. Part me, part my wife, trying to find who they really are. As I approach death, my father's presence comes over me, but I really don't want to be him. I feel like I am losing who I am. It's weird. The stinking cycle of lives - my dad, my dad and me, me, my kids, my kids and me.

I have a two-part soul past-future out-of-time story I'll save for later, or not. Also revealing.

 

[jacygirl]

Aha, I knew it!

It doesn't stop you, does it?

You say psychotic, I say phsyic, Potaytoe, Potahto... At this age, psiatic, Let's call the whole thing off...

You are a complex one. My answer is: all of the above, so what?

Nice, I really like it

Well, if it is funny to you then it is funny. Kids are an amazing wonder. Part me, part my wife, trying to find who they really are. As I approach death, my father's presence comes over me, but I really don't want to be him. I feel like I am losing who I am. It's weird. The stinking cycle of lives - my dad, my dad and me, me, my kids, my kids and me.

I have a two-part soul past-future out-of-time story I'll save for later, or not. Also revealing

I am a complex one. Knowing my entire life, it makes sense to me why I am. Knowing the experiences I've had this last year, it makes sense to me that I worry about psychosis, lol. "Let's call the whole thing off..." You're right. "so what?" So what indeed.

I look forward to your 'two-part soul past-future out-of-time story'. That sounds right down my alley. Revealing? Curiouser and curiouser.

Ok, the silly twin theory. I've done a lot of research on twins. Pre internet it was books from the library, but I've never really stopped reading about them. First, a factoid:
"Vanishing twin syndrome, as the name depicts, is a condition in which one of a set of twins or multiple embryos dies in utero, disappear, or gets resorbed partially or entirely, with an outcome of a spontaneous reduction of a multi-fetus pregnancy to a singleton pregnancy, portraying the image of a vanishing twin."

My mother told me that they thought I was going to be a boy, and they were going to call me Charles. After 'Prince Charles' (at that time), no doubt. Back then there was no ultrasound testing so twins were often an unexpected surprise. So I started thinking (or writing a story in my head if that sounds less weird)...what if I was a fraternal twin to a boy, who died in utero and I absorbed him into my being. What if he already had a soul by then, and he is the inner voice that guides/answers me.

Being pregnant with twins is an experience you cannot imagine without experiencing it. I felt like a walking condominium, housing and feeding 3 of us. I suppose after this, years later, the thought of having an extra soul in me wasn't too freaky because so much of the 'twins experience' is weird and freaky, so I was used to that too.

Anyways, I do not actually think this is a possibility and never seriously did. But apparently nothing about this world, people, life, death, densities, realms...none of it is what we thought it was. Now it seems, anything goes! So it amuses me to think about, "well what if this was real?"

Ok, geez, talk about revealing. And if you call me Chuck or Charlie after this, I will flick you in the forehead in my mind. All of us will flick your forehead in my mind. Me, Chuck, future me...? Yep, we'll flick ya so hard you will feel it.

 

[BHelmet]

Aww, it would suck to call you Chuck. Two Buck Chuck. It would be an honor to get flicked in the forehead by you. Although a psychic flick might knock me on my rear end from afar. Yeah that is stuff that guys will never comprehend, even if they can channel their past lives as femmes carrying and birthing. Why did you assume you had a twin and run with that?