On physical issues, a couple of weeks ago I suffered from something that caused me high fatigue and tiredness. It only lasted for a couple of days and it seemed like I caught it from some of my family who suffered it for closer to a week and a half. I only thought it strange because some of our extended family and friends some of whom live quite far away from us seemed to all be suffering a similar thing at roughly the same time.

I went to my local supermarket today and it was full of empty shelves and limits on how much you could buy. At the time I found it kind of funny how crazy the situation is. I am feeling a bit more flustered now. The smaller stores seem to be better stocked in my area for the time being. Earlier in the year I started setting up the garden for some planting, now all of a sudden the rest of my family seems interested in helping.

I'm interested to see what this April will have in store for us.
 
Alternate hypothesis: perception management run amok.

COVID-19 is marginally worse than seasonal flu, which happens to be the tipping point for a lot of medical logistics. Embarrassing that a wimpy little virus, maybe with some peculiar characteristics like a steep infection curve but not such a troubling CFR, flushes all these well made plans down the drain. Can't have that. Gotta pull out all the stops to foll the public into thinking, "but this was different."

Plus, all the hype about the need for flu shots, then along comes a marginally worse pandemic. Makes all the chicken-little talk about flu look silly. Embarrassing. Even worse, maybe points directly to the possibility that the flu risk is also overhyped. Can't have that. This needs to be manipulated to make people think it's worse than flu, so the peculiar feature of this bug, a steep infection curve, is being used to divert attention away from the otherwise wimpiness of the disease.
 
That's strange, I've been having the hot spells as well. I thought it was just me. Someone else mentioned a tingling sensation around the head. I've had this for years. All kinds of tingling. Usually one side or the other but sometimes all over or moving. In my case it seems to be related to picking up thoughts/emotions. It took me a LONG time to figure out what it was.
 
Check out this hysterical BS. I mean, are they doing this on purpose? A long line of military vehicles moving "corpses" because the crematoriums are "overflowing". Then you read that it is coffins and then you read that so far, IN TOTAL (i.e. not today, not yesterday, but in the past few weeks), 93 people have died in Bergamo, a city of 122,000.

Here's some math:

Found statistics from 2015: 57M people died that year out of say, around 7B is 0.8% of population.

0.8% of Bergamo's 122k is about a thousand people per year, or about 20 per week.
2.5 weeks into March, but that math, would be 50 people. I don't know if more people die or less on average in Bergamo per year than the rest of the world. I also don't know if more people die in March than a typical month in Bergamo. The thing to look at will be end-of-year statistics.

The point here is not to prove or disprove one or the other side of the case. It's that speculation can backfire when someone throws numbers at you. As I've mentioned before, I do engineering forensic work where the numbers and models are almost never consensus-based, and if a case is to be made, it has to be made only with data that can't be questioned.

It's still why I think Italy is key to understanding this.

It seems very plausible to consider Laura's direct experience with the Italian health care system, that it always seems like it's about to be overwhelmed. We shall see soon enough.

If total deaths are minimal but we do experience this strange spike in hospitalizations, that says something about this virus, that maybe it's not at all deadly, it just scares the crap out of people whose jobs it is to demand money from an increasingly incredulous public.
 
Trump, Macron, Gov. DeWine and I believe one other official has referenced war in regards to this coronavirus. I'm not sure what exactly to make of this - intentional bio-warfare?
Maybe because they know, even if only subconsciously, that a population fed a steady diet of violent programming responds to those Pavlovian triggers.
 
Hey all. Thanks for the updates! This is sadly still very interesting eh?

Spring has come to Zagreb. 20C and three clear sunny days. I think this weather is not allowing panic to be greater than it is. Only people who seem to not see the beauty of nature but blindly believe in msm and the government are the ones that panic for no sensible reason. Ive had a few encounters when going to my local shops for food and some are scratching their heads and wondering why all the hubub about a flu? While others have their minds firmly set on a catastrophic projection that they got from the news outlets. Organic store I go to has a rule : no more than 2 people in it and a meter of distance! Right beside it is a coffee/drinks house and there people have coffee "orgies" and no one seems to mind ( that was yesterday). Touching each other, laughing and drinking various beverages in the sun.

Today Ive seen Croatia is put on a 30 day lockdown (havent been out today except for some D vitamin to the local hill with my bike... people act like its a Sunday and time for a picnic there) and heres the rules:
The decision of the National Civil Protection Headquarters, which canceled all public events for a month, and closed most shops in Croatia as a measure to prevent the spread of the coronavirus epidemic, which radically changed social life in the country, came into force after midnight on Thursday.

Grocery stores and those selling hygiene products, including those in large shopping centers, remain open.

Strict measures will be valid for 30 days
Gas stations, kiosks, bakeries and specialized stores with children's equipment, animal feeds and specialized orthopedic supplies will also be opened. Shops that remain open will not be cut short to counteract the effect of gathering large numbers of people in one place in a shorter period of time.

Strict social distance measures are being introduced to mitigate the possibility of a coronavirus epidemic spreading, and will be valid for 30 days.

In Croatia, all public events and gatherings are canceled from Thursday, and all service activities that are not strictly necessary for the functioning of the community are suspended. Museums, theaters and cinemas are closing.

The operation of catering establishments of all categories is suspended, with the exception of the preparation and delivery of food and the operation of public kitchens.

The work of gyms, sports centers, fitness and recreation centers, all organized trainings, dance schools, children's and other workshops is suspended. Religious gatherings are also suspended.

Markets remain open
Head of govt. emergency agancy Davor Bozinovic said at a news conference on Wednesday that, according to the epidemiologist's recommendation, the markets remain open.

The facilities to be operated must ensure the greatest possible distance of workers and measures of social distance. They must provide space ventilation, measures of increased hygiene and daily cleaning of the area, as well as checkpoints with disinfectants, as well as posters on proper hand washing and protection.

Employers are required to organize work from home, organize teleconferences, cancel business trips and prohibit workers with acute respiratory illness from coming to work.

Local civil protection headquarters are responsible for implementing these unprecedented measures in Croatian history.

Temporary prohibition on cross-border movement

A temporary ban on the movement of persons through border crossings will also come into force, allowing Croatian nationals to return to Croatia and returning to EU countries of origin.

The exceptions apply to healthcare professionals, senior care professionals, cross-border workers, police officers, civil protection teams, military personnel, international military personnel and travelers in transit.

All shops that will operate must comply with the measures of the Croatian Institute of Public Health, which will issue transport recommendations that will be valid at the national level.

The staff recalls the need to adhere to the individual hygiene and social distance measures of each individual - a distance of two meters should be kept indoors, one meter outdoors.

People in self-isolation must adhere strictly to the instructions given.

In Croatia, a total of 89 cases of coronavirus infection were confirmed on Wednesday. Another case of infection of doctors in hospitals has also been detected, with a total of nine so far.
89? Can you believe this?
In the 90s thousands were stranded and died while TONNES of DRUGS, OIL and WEAPONS moved like they were buttered from Macedonia to Austria, across borders of countries that were not in the war!! Ive witnessed one such closing of the highway from the town Rijeka's military barracks Klana and harbor in Rijeka to Austrian border. Anybody that had some brains could have connected the dots.

And one more thing!! Im being bombarded with these thoughts!

Now is the time to sow the seeds of a new reality! Now is the time to start to manifest! Now is the time to push for change!

Be safe all.... and good luck to us and our mother Earth!

Regards

Agron
 
I keep thinking about how joyless life has been for most people and how everyone is afraid of what could happen during this period of change. My parents taught me a saying when I was a little kid: "when the going gets tough the tough get going". I have been getting chills and goosebumps multiple times per day (I have them right now as I write this post :lol:)

Hi Séamas

The above struck a deep cord in me. I think its at the very essence of things. People are WILLING disaster upon them and going meekly to the slaughter because they can no longer accept the lie of life they have been sold and bought by.

This brings up a very important topic DISENCHANTMENT that was first pointed out by highly influential German Sociologist
Max Weber Wiki Link as being perversely at the core of Western civilization's self identity - maybe its connected to what the traditional peoples call Wetiko - a soul sickness. Disenchantment is a 4D STS 'charm' in action.

Ive recently finished reading a remarkable book called THE TRICKSTER AND THE PARANORMAL by parapsychology scientist George Hansen.
Amazon

the topics he covers are too vast in scope and importance to summarize here (indeed I think it would make a great subject/source for a Mind Matters show...!)

But here's some of the sections referring to Disenchantment and its consequences:

95
Anthropologist Michael Winkelman produced a monograph entitled Shamans, Priests and Witches in 1992. He described his extensive cross-cultural study of the status of magico-religious practitioners, i.e., people who use supernatural power. He showed that as cultures become more complex, those who most immediately engage the supernatural lose status. Their positions are marginalized. Issues of status and marginality are central to understanding the paranormal, and they are also directly relevant to the trickster and anti-structure.

Max Weber was one of the giants of sociology. His concept of rationalization describes the rise of modern civilization. Part of rationalization entails disenchantment, i.e., the suppression of magic, miracles, and supernatural phenomena. Weber was eminently clear on this, but very little attention has been given to his ideas in regard to the paranormal. This is altogether astounding because his theory of rationalization has proven to be one of the grandest and most comprehensive visions in sociology. It describes cultural trends over thousands of years. It is widely known not only within sociology, but also in other academic disciplines. It crucial for understanding the structure of society.

96
Weber’s concept of charisma was an integral part of this. In its pure form, charisma involves supernatural power, a fact that Weber clearly stated. Again amazingly, scholars almost universally ignore that. If they do acknowledge it, they seem puzzled. For Weber, charisma was central to understanding authority, power, and domination. Authority is required in all societies, and he identified three types: bureaucratic (found in our society today), traditional (found in tribal and feudal cultures), and charismatic authority. Charisma is the primordial base; traditional and bureaucratic authority involve attenuated forms of charisma, and sociologists are more comfortable discussing them.

We will return to Weber’s ideas many times in this book because they have extraordinary applicability.

The third chapter in this Part is devoted to cultural transformation, and it draws upon the work of anthropologist Anthony F. C. Wallace, who was a leading theorist on cultural revitalization movements. Wallace’s description of cultural transformation has remarkable parallels with van Gennep’s ideas in The Rites of Passage. The supernatural played a role in many cultural transformations, and those are illuminated by theories of the trickster, liminality, and anti-structure.


302
Protestantism draws a sharp demarcation between God and man; Gardner wants to uphold that and does not want man to appropriate the role of God. The binary opposition is not to be blurred.

Max Weber’s concept of rationalization helps illuminate this. Weber recognized the crucial differences between an immanent and a transcendent God. An immanent God can be found within the material world. The transcendent God is above and beyond it; He may intervene, but there is a clear distinction between the material and the divine. Weber pointed out that the immanent-transcendent dichotomy is reflected in the Catholic-Protestant split. The divine is closer to the human in Catholicism than in Protestantism. Catholicism is more mystical; it has monastic orders and a priesthood. With transubstantiation in Catholicism, the bread and wine become the body and blood of Christ. Protestants see bread and wine as only symbols. In Protestantism, faith alone is required for salvation. That keeps it strictly mental; the divine is separated from the physical.

Protestantism has an intellectual tradition that critiqued miracles and dismissed them, and Gardner can be considered to fall loosely within that tradition. Attacking miracles is a step in the disenchantment process. Gardner and the Protestants are not full rationalists; they don’t seek full disenchantment of the world. They leave room for mystery, and Gardner does not want to intrude upon it.


358
…This state of affairs should command extended analysis. The problem is severe in academe, and science is particularly antipathetic to the mystical and irrational. But this is found not only among academics. Today the liberal denominations of Protestant Christianity substantially downplay the supernatural and the wrath of God. Responding to secular trends in society, those denominations have become more rationalized, and their conceptions of deity largely lack the mystical and irrational aspects.

All this is part of the rationalization and disenchantment of the world, and as Max Weber recognized, this has been progressing for millennia. Protestant Christianity eliminated priests and largely did away with monastic orders. Unlike priests, Protestant ministers do not serve as mediators between their human congregations and the divine realm. Otto also noted the decline of the miraculous in religion. He commented: on the more enlightened levels, miracle begins to fade away; how Christ is at one with Mohammed and Buddha in declining the role of mere wonder-worker; how Luther dismisses the outward miracles’ disparagingly as ‘jugglery’ or capples and nuts for children’; and finally how the supernaturalism of miracle is purged from religion as something that is only an imperfect analogue and no genuine ‘schema’ of the numinous.” Here Otto himself contributes to the rationalizing trend whether he recognizes it or not, equating the decline of the miraculous with progress toward enlightenment. This is not fully compatible with his other statements.

Rationalization strengthens the boundary between the human and the divine. God is pushed ever further into heaven. Supernatural contact between humans and gods is minimized and repressed. The irrational is shunted from consciousness. Otto referred to ghosts and miracles as aspects of the numinous, though as degenerate forms of it. Both are now embarrassments in academe; they seem superstitious. Nevertheless, ghosts and miracles continue to be reported. They have not been cleansed from the world. Max Weber was perceptive regarding rationalization, but his formulation needed a slight elaboration. Rationalization did not really entail the elimination of magic from the world, but rather the elimination of the conscious awareness of it among cultural elites. Even with liberal Protestant churchmen, there is often an embarrassed silence regarding the efficacy of petitionary prayer, which is a magical practice by any reasonable definition (such

359
embarrassment is not seen among conservatives). Although magic has not been expunged from the Western world, it has been forced to the margins, repressed, and although individuals are well aware of it, it has no place in our major bureaucratic institutions of government, industry, and academe.



364

Rationalization and the Disenchantment of the World

The intellectual history of totemism includes: charges of irrationality and erroneous thinking hurled at the primitive, the acknowledge incomprehensibility of totemism to academicians, unresolved debates, and ambiguous scholarly theories. The muddle-headedness occurred because the scholars failed to comprehend the inherent limitations of Western rationality.

All this needs to be seen in light of rationalization (in Max Weber’s sense), which has been a dominant process in the development of Western civilization. Totemism must be understood in opposition to rationalization. Totemism incorporates magical interconnections. Rationalization entails the elimination of magic and severs magical interconnections (in reality, only the conscious aware of them).

365
Just because totemism is “irrational” does not mean that it was maladaptive. On the contrary, it survived for thousands of years. Most cultures did not rely upon our science and logic. Their success should make us examine our prejudices regarding the rational. Western logic requires entities to be discrete, separate, distinct, differentiated. We assume a clear distinction between subject and object. The primitives did not; they understood themselves as mystically connected to the cosmos. They participated in it. (The issue of participation also arises in conjunction with reflexivity, a source of paradox for Western logic.)

For social life, there must be shared assumptions, symbols, and meanings. Rationalists assume an objective reality exists and that it provides the required foundation. It is assumed that the objective world is independent of our representations of it - that representations (e.g., thoughts) do not affect it directly. The scientific enterprise accepts and upholds these ideas. Admittedly they usually produce a good, first-order approximation of reality. But they don’t always apply. The practice of magic and the data of parapsychology demonstrate that fact.

The agenda of rationalization faces an almost insurmountable problem - the serious study of magic has a magical influence. Thus the disenchantment process must eliminate not only magic, but also serious consideration of it. A number of techniques have been developed to assure that it remains marginalized and outside the awareness of academe. Freud linked magic to the infantile and the neurotic, and his followers aggressively promoted that view. In our society, “magical thinking” is disparaged, and it is now used as an epithet by debunkers to discredit those who show an interest in the paranormal. Such belittling discourages use of magic by status-conscious persons.

Anthropologists writing about early cultures face a problematic situation. Without a doubt, totemism can justifiably be called irrational. But to make that explicit leaves one open to charges of ethnocentrism or even racism. Today the designation “irrational” is considered derogatory, and those who wish to instil a neutral or positive attitude toward primitive societies find it is easier to ignore the problems posed by totemism and magic. Those are seen as remnants from a superstitious past, embarrassments, and best forgotten in the effort to increase the respect for earlier peoples. However, scholars who ignore the issue come to believe that they hold an unbiased view of the primitives, but they are blinded by their own beliefs. At least the ethnocentrism of Frazer was overt.

366
A vast number of academics who write on magic today are not only unable to grasp it, but unlike the earlier commentators, they do not realize their failure. They almost universally ignore or deny the intrinsic efficacy of magic (i.e., psi). It is problematic, and merely thinking about it raises their anxieties. Making this explicit is, of course, not welcomed by those who have devoted their careers to fostering rationality. As such, it is unreasonable to expect academe to explore totemism much further. Nevertheless, some progress can be made with structuralist methods.

I do not wish to make academic science a scapegoat for the sins of rationalization, and it would be wrong to attribute the problems solely to that quarter. As I explained earlier, similar trends are seen in much of religion. Mainline liberal Protestant Christians may profess a belief in miracles, but ones that happened long ago and far away. The miraculous is placed at a distance. Even Rudolf Otto’s writings show some leeriness toward supernatural phenomena. Both establishment science and orthodox exoteric religion display the same trend. One can only conclude that the roots of rationalization, the downplaying of miracles and mysticism, must be far deeper than just ideology and belief. They are inherent in the structure of our society.

The primitives’ taboos against contact with supernatural forces are with us still, though in veiled form.


There are many valuable things that stand out here - but in particular the erasing of the understanding of the part played by the 'supernatural' by the so called elites. Whilst we here know that there are some very dark entities in that body who know full well, the 1,000s of useful idiots that we get to see visibly succumbing to this rational-madness are just like the rest of the population - they just have better suits on! Their ignorance makes them act out this disenchantment and wilful self-immolation as well as inducing a perpetual fear in them and terror at the unknown.

I know from years of painful but vital schooling (i.e. meeting continual head on blocking, resistance and 'fear'... as well as face to face opposition by a full blown Psychopath in power!) that the rationalists hate the 'IRRATIONAL' nature of true creativity i.e. life itself.
 
I don't think it's a test, they are actually doing stuff.

I‘m strongly inclined to think that way now too. They are pushing hard and relentlessly globally (whatever „they“ means). We have another type of 9/11 scenario on our hands right now it seem to me with the difference being that what is happing now seems to be orders of magnitude more extreme.
 
I have been thinking that we could perhaps in a small way make a positive contribution. The thought was partly inspired by hearing that Pornhub was giving free access to Italy, Spain and France as they are in quarantine. Being appalled how Pornhub uses the situation to distract people even more and dragging them even more into the lower, I came up with the following:

As many now have a lot more time on their hands as they are laid off, forced to work from home or in quarantine, then they have a lot of time on their hands. Why don't we put a permanent banner up on the Front page of Sott with links to key articles on Sott in different topics which have helped us a lot. I am thinking of:
  • Links to articles on psychopathy. 10+ years ago, that was a hot topic on Sott with articles about "The psychopaths who rule us". This subject is very topical I think and for people to understand how psychopaths think and act.
  • Tied to the above is of course articles on Political Ponerology.
  • Links to articles on Evolution. That could be the Behe articles and videos, the articles by Intellectomy, episodes from Mindmatters.
  • Key articles about finding meaning, growing up, taking responsibility. Links to Sott articles about Jordan Peterson comes to mind.
  • Links to Articles on Stoicism such as what the MindMatters crew have discussed and links to articles bringing hope like selected ones from the category "Science of the Spirit".
  • Links to articles on dying, the afterlife, in between life, Near Death Experiences etc.
This is just a few items that comes to mind. As I am currently at work until late tonight, I prefer to just throw the "ball" out there. This crisis might also be a little opportunity before the initial Shock that is currently happening in people get filled up with porn and the normalcy bias sets in. Some new people are asking and looking and whereas before they didn't have time to read, now suddenly there is a gap!

So much good work has been done over the years in the weekly broadcasts by the Sott team and by the various writers of Sott Focus or BOW, many of which have not been read or listened to by many due to time restraints. With a little ordering and prefacing perhaps these could be on permanent display.
As the C's said recently:
Soon things in your realm will become very chaotic and strange. It will give chills to many. Be not alarmed! It will pass and there will be a new reality to explore. Cosmic forces will be displayed and there will be many searching for answers.
I think that in re-ordering a lot of the past material in the Sott treasure trove of articles, many quotes and extracts will also be found by Forumites, which can be shared on Facebook, Twitter, VK etc.

What do you think? A way to make lemonade from the lemons handed to us?
 
I was out at the stores today, well, the stores that are open, which isn't many, mainly the food stores. I went to intermarche (food supermarket) and there were maybe 20 other people in the store, all of them with serious/depressed looks on their faces. The Frenchies tend to be a bit dour at the best of times, and this situation definitely hasn't helped! But rather than catch the depressing mind virus I was actually feeling the opposite. I found myself walking (kind of 80's dancing actually) down the pasta aisle with mostly empty shelves (the rest were full) as the store music played the 80s song 'I'm so excited', and suddenly realized that I think I've watched that scene before in an 80's disaster movie. :lol: On the way back I saw several people IN THEIR CARS ALONE with windows up and face masks on. :shock:

I would like to say something about this which I've been meaning to put up on the forum for years and felt it to be abstract. But since the group here contains thinkers with a hammer..

There is no such thing as BEING dead.
No such thing as having the experience of not having any experience.
Only in "hindsight". Never while you are not there.

We can sure see a body that has ceased to function, but the consciousness associated with it can only operate INSIDE the scope of being aware.

You cannot ever be consciouss of not being.
(In the moment of course).
While in deep sleep or during fainting there is no consciousness, but afterwards we simply say: I was not aware.

This means that your consciousness is self contained. Think about this.

I've given the concept of death yearsss of thought and this realisation has allowed me to be unafraid of death.

Indeed as you say, everything that is currently happening could only work with a population that has feared the subject of "death" to the point of burying it deep down and denying its existence.
 
I‘m strongly inclined to think that way now too. They are pushing hard and relentlessly globally (whatever „they“ means). We have another type of 9/11 scenario on our hands right now it seem to me with the difference being that what is happing now seems to be orders of magnitude more extreme.
Unfortunately, yes. It is.
And I also think that it is gonna be worst. Until yesterday people were screaming for declaring emergency situation and they got it. Now I can see on social media they are asking for a curfew because some older people don't care what those fear lords and warlords are doing and went for a short walk in the near park on the sun. Zombies all over are screaming and asking authorities to declare a complete curfew on the whole territory, and it looks that they will get it.
What a hell is going on with those people? It is unbelievable.
 
I had at least two sweat attacks the last weeks. In one I woke up soaking wet. Normally something like that only happens for me when it is summer and really hot. Nothing of that sort was the case.

This is what is was like for my partner and myself during the whole of january and february.
 
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