Do-it-yourself liposomal nutrients

Aqua Man said:
Nienna

Thank you for your reply.

Concerning tobacco: I do not agree with you, because:
1.) Medical statistics shows that hundreds of thousands of people dying each year from tobacco.
2.) Tobacco industry made a big research, many years ago, which concluded that tobacco is a killer.
Then they hide research result for many years, until an journalist discovered it and made a big affair.
3.) Smoking which you are talking about (recreational, marihuana type) is related to a small %, probably
about 1% of smokers. Majority of rest of 99% of smokers is a "industrial tobacco smoker" and heavy
- chain smokers, who are definitely killing themself with tobacco. I know, as I was one of them, until 5 years.

Laura's "recipe" is not what I was looking for- Sodium Ascorbate , as a starting row material instead
of AC + Natrium-bicarbonate (I know that SA=AC+NatriumBicarbonate).

Richard wrote that he did use Sodium Ascorbate , so I asked him, and others who did too.

PS: As others, I found this forum during my research for Liposomal C.
About myself - I do not like giving any more informations other then what I already have.

No, I am not talking about smoking weed. That is not supported on this forum.

Those who die from commercial tobacco are dying from the humongous amount of chemicals that are in the cigarettes, plus the tobacco is cut with other ingredients.

I want to mention that there really is a lot of medical researchers who have found the benefits of additive-free tobacco.

I see that Richard has given you his recipe so that's a good thing. I hope that you have success in making it. It's really good stuff. :)
 
I think it is a good idea to use a big enough ultrasonic cleaner to fit a glass container inside, so the solution is not poured directly into the stainless steel tank. I started out using a small Brookstone and poured the solution directly into the stainless steel tank. I could taste metallic flavor in the resulting vitamin C. At first I ignored the metallic flavor and pretended it was fine. Then I returned the Brookstone and got a bigger iSonic P4810 Ultrasonic Cleaner. This iSonic does not fit a regular 600ml beaker because the beaker is too tall, so I used a glass food storage container that fit inside the stainless steel tank. I poured the solution into the glass container. I wasn't sure if I was supposed to add water into the stainless steel tank outside the glass container, so I added the water to be on the safe side. The resulting vitamin C does not have any metallic flavor.
 
Although I have felt the benefits of using Liposomal vitamin c for over a year, in fact its become integrated as part of daily life which is why I voice this concern in relation to Soy lecithin granules. Realising I had not done research on the substance, a quick search on the internet led me to find this article:



"Soy Lecithin has been lingering around our food supply for over a century. It is an ingredient in literally hundreds of processed foods, and also sold as an over the counter health food supplement. Scientists claim it benefits our cardiovascular health, metabolism, memory, cognitive function, liver function, and even physical and athletic performance. However, most people don’t realize what soy lecithin actually is, and why the dangers of ingesting this additive far exceed its benefits.
Lecithin is an emulsifying substance that is found in the cells of all living organisms. The French scientist Maurice Gobley discovered lecithin in 1805 and named it “lekithos” after the Greek word for “egg yolk.” Until it was recovered from the waste products of soybean processing in the 1930s, eggs were the primary source of commercial lecithin. Today lecithin is the generic name given to a whole class of fat-and-water soluble compounds called phospholipids. Levels of phospholipids in soybean oils range from 1.48 to 3.08 percent, which is considerably higher than the 0.5 percent typically found in vegetable oils, but far less than the 30 percent found in egg yolks.
Out of the Dumps
Soybean lecithin comes from sludge left after crude soy oil goes through a “de-gumming” process. It is a waste product containing solvents and pesticides and has a consistency ranging from a gummy fluid to a plastic solid. Before being bleached to a more appealing light yellow, the color of lecithin ranges from a dirty tan to reddish brown. The hexane extraction process commonly used in soybean oil manufacture today yields less lecithin than the older ethanol-benzol process, but produces a more marketable lecithin with better color, reduced odor and less bitter flavor.
Historian William Shurtleff reports that the expansion of the soybean crushing and soy oil refining industries in Europe after 1908 led to a problem disposing the increasing amounts of fermenting, foul-smelling sludge. German companies then decided to vacuum dry the sludge, patent the process and sell it as “soybean lecithin.” Scientists hired to find some use for the substance cooked up more than a thousand new uses by 1939.
Today lecithin is ubiquitous in the processed food supply. It is most commonly used as an emulsifier to keep water and fats from separating in foods such as margarine, peanut butter, chocolate candies, ice cream, coffee creamers and infant formulas. Lecithin also helps prevent product spoilage, extending shelf life in the marketplace. In industry kitchens, it is used to improve mixing, speed crystallization, prevent “weeping,” and stop spattering, lumping and sticking. Used in cosmetics, lecithin softens the skin and helps other ingredients penetrate the skin barrier. A more water-loving version known as “deoiled lecithin” reduces the time required to shut down and clean the extruders used in the manufacture of textured vegetable protein and other soy products.
In theory, lecithin manufacture eliminates all soy proteins, making it hypoallergenic. In reality, minute amounts of soy protein always remain in lecithin as well as in soy oil. Three components of soy protein have been identified in soy lecithin, including the Kunitz trypsin inhibitor, which has a track record of triggering severe allergic reactions even in the most minuscule quantities. The presence of lecithin in so many food and cosmetic products poses a special danger for people with soy allergies.
The Making of a Wonder Food
Lecithin has been touted for years as a wonder food capable of combating atherosclerosis, multiple sclerosis, liver cirrhosis, gall stones, psoriasis, eczema, scleroderma, anxiety, tremors and brain aging. Because it is well known that the human body uses phospholipids to build strong, flexible cell membranes and to facilitate nerve transmission, health claims have been made for soy lecithin since the 1920s. Dr. A. A. Horvath, a leading purveyor of soybean health claims at the time, thought it could be used in “nerve tonics” or to help alcoholics reduce the effects of intoxication and withdrawal. In 1934, an article entitled “A Comfortable and Spontaneous Cure for the Opium Habit by Means of Lecithin” was written by Chinese researchers and published in an English language medical journal.
Lecithin, though, did not capture the popular imagination until the 1960s and 1970s when the bestselling health authors Adelle Davis, Linda Clark and Mary Ann Crenshaw hyped lecithin in their many books, including Let’s Get Well, Secrets of Health and Beauty and The Natural Way to Super Beauty: Featuring the Amazing Lecithin, Apple Cider Vinegar, B-6 and Kelp Diet.
Lecithin did not become a star of the health food circuit by accident. Research took off during the early 1930s, right when lecithin production became commercially viable. In 1939, the American Lecithin Company began sponsoring research studies, and published the most promising in a 23-page booklet entitled Soybean Lecithin in 1944. The company, not coincidentally introduced a health food cookie with a lecithin filling known as the “Lexo Wafer” and a lecithin/wheat germ supplement called Granulestin. In the mid 1970s, Natterman, a lecithin marketing company based in Germany, hired scientists at various health clinics to experiment with lecithin and to write scientific articles about it. These “check book” scientists coined the term “essential phospholipids” an inaccurate term since a healthy body can produce its own phospholipids from phosphorous and lipids.
In September 2001, lecithin got a boost when the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) authorized products containing enough of it to bear labels such as “A good source of choline.” Producers of soy lecithin hope to find ways to help the new health claim lift demand for lecithin and increase prices in what has been a soft market. Eggs, milk and soy products are the leading dietary sources of choline, according to recent research conducted at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill and at Duke University.

Genetically Modified
One of the biggest problems associated with soy lecithin comes from the origin of the soy itself. The majority of soy sources in the world are now genetically modified (GM). Researchers have clearly identified GM foods as a threat to the environment, pollution of soils and a long-term threat to human health with links to of the world with unnatural genetic material that may have unknown long-term consequences with links to decreased fertility, immunological alterations in the gut and the exacerbation and creation of allergies.
Genetically engineered soy contains high concentrations of plant toxicants. The presence of high levels of toxicants in the GM soy
represent thousands of plant biochemicals many of which have been shown to have toxic effects on animals.
Unfermented Soy Sources
The manufacture of soy lecithin is also typically confined to unfermented sources because it is quicker and cheaper to make. Unfermented soy products are rich in enzyme inhibitors. Enzymes such as amylase lipase and protease are secreted into the digestive tract to help break down food and free nutrients for assimilation into the body. The high content of enzyme inhibitors in unfermented soybeans interferes with this process and makes carbohydrates and proteins from soybeans impossible to completely digest.
Unfermented soy has been linked to digestive distress, immune system breakdown, PMS, endometriosis, reproductive problems for men and women, allergies, ADD and ADHD, higher risk of heart disease and cancer, malnutrition, and loss of libido.
It is now widely recognized that the only soy fit for human consumption is fermented soy.

Phosphatidyl Choline (PC)
Because many lecithin products sold in health food stores contain less than 30 percent choline, many clinicians prefer to use the more potent Phosphatidylcholine (PC) or its even more powerful derivative drug Glyceryl-phosphorylcholine (GPC). Both are being used to prevent and reverse dementia, improve cognitive function, increase human growth hormone (hGH) release, and to treat brain disorders such as damage from stroke. PC and GPC may help build nerve cell membranes, facilitate electrical transmission in the brain, hold membrane proteins in place, and produce the neurotransmitter acetylcholine. However, studies on soy lecithin, PC, and brain aging have been inconsistent and contradictory ever since the 1920s. Generally, lecithin is regarded as safe except for people who are highly allergic to soy. However, the late Robert Atkins, MD, advised patients not to take large doses of supplemental lecithin without extra vitamin C to protect them from the nitrosamines formed from choline metabolism. Trimethylamine and dimethylamine, which are metabolized by bacteria in the intestines from choline, are important precurors to N-nitrosodimethylamine, a potent carcinogen in a wide variety of animal species.

Phosphatidyl Serine (PS)
Phosphatidyl serine (PS) — another popular phospholipid that improves brain function and mental acuity – nearly always comes from soy oil. Most of the scientific studies proving its efficacy, however, come from bovine sources, which also contain DHA as part of the structure. Plant oils never contain readymade DHA. Indeed, the entire fatty acid structure is different; bovine derived PS is rich in stearic and oleic acids, while soy PS is rich in linoleic and palmitic acids. Complicating matters further, the PS naturally formed in the human body consists of 37.5 percent stearic acid and 24.2 percent arachidonic acid. Yet soy-derived PS seems to help many people."

Read more at http://www.realfarmacy.com/soy-lecithin-how-it-negatively-affects-your-health-and-why-you-need-to-avoid-it/#phlXLYajJOKyeK7u.99
 
Malachi,
Interesting information on Soy Lecithin.

When I was buying the ingredients to do liposomal C, I chose to use sunflower lecithin, which you can get at a comparable price at swanson vitamins website.
They also had non-GMO soy lecithin, but I just wanted to avoid the word SOY (which ironically most people think is healthy, amazing what the media and science can do!)

What do you use instead of soy lecithin?
 
I found an interesting video on making nano-available curcumin from tumeric:


The producer adds curcumin and alcohol to a pestle, which he grinds. (I'm sure a jewely cleaner would be more effective, of course). He adds some pepper as well to make it more bioavailable. The video below gives some details on indigenous food combining of black pepper, tumeric, as well as ghee, and how these all interacted to increase the persistence of curcumin in the body by slowing the liver's metabolism of the bioactive compounds. :)

 
In case anyone in OZ is interested, the Macro brand soy lecithin granules from Woolies are reasonably priced at $6.12 for 250 grams. Reading the packaging didn't provide a lot of info, however a quick call to customer service revealed that the product is GM free and the country of origin is Germany. They do seem to be a bit high in both carbs and protein compared to other products on eBay etc, so not sure if there might be better options.

Hope this helps. :)
 
Does anyone know the difference it makes between using distilled or deionized water in terms of liposome formation? Distillation just produces pure water, but I think even pure water still can retain a variety of electrical charges through its non-neutral pH. Deionized water is what it sounds like: water that is stripped entirely of excess positive and negative charges. Solute impurities I can envision interfering with liposome formation, but do you suppose the odd charges may play some role, or can they be dispensed with altogether?
 
whitecoast said:
I found an interesting video on making nano-available curcumin from tumeric:

Don't think it will be of much use because in order for curcumin to be bioavailable, it must be heat solubilized. You can get some benefits from it if you cook with it, but that's about it. Taking it in capsules or creams or whatever, is a waste of money.
 
Re: Liposomal Vitamin C

Laura said:
It seems to me that the main reason to use liposomal vitamin C is if you have some condition that you are experimenting with the cure of, that would require high blood levels of C for a particular period of time such as some autoimmune condition that you suspect might be triggered by an infective agent, cancer and so forth. I don't think that it is something that you just take long term for no particular reason.
I wonder if the eczema that appeared about a week before getting sick was just the manifestations of a single trigger. I have noticed that I have subjectively felt much better going through this sickness taking liposomal vitamin C and NAC, versus going through a sickness like this in the last 2-3 years when I would have had to eventually go to my doctor when it wouldn't get better. Of course, it is hard to separate the effects of the ketogenic diet and EE from the vitamin C.

Liposomal vitamin C may also just be part of the daily defense in the case of a new black death or ebola epidemic.

Laura said:
Sorry, but that's bad advice. The solution needs direct exposure to the ultrasonic waves and a beaker would reduce the potentials severely.
It looks like I've been doing things wrong using a glass tupperware. I'll try pouring directly into the tank of my current ultrasonic cleaner to see if I get the metallic taste that I used to get with my former ultrasonic cleaner.
 
My conclusion is pouring the solution directly in the ultrasonic cleaner is necessary.

I was experimenting with titrating to reach my vitamin C threshold, and by accident I massively exceeded the threshold.
Laura said:
Our experiences using vitamin C for speeding the cure of a condition is by titration to bowel tolerance. In one case, my 5 foot tall, 100 pound daughter, tolerated 100 grams before she reached the limit; an indication of how sick she was.

In general, when one of us gets sick, we start with 5 grams and keep dosing every half hour until the bubbly feeling in the intestines begins, then stop. That tells you your dose and can also indicate how ill you are.

The liposomal version can boost your blood levels of vitamin C much higher without bowel intolerance showing up so fast, which can be an advantage when that is needed.

See this: http://vitamincfoundation.org/www.orthomed.com/titrate.htm
I had a prior batch that I made using a glass tupperware in the ultrasonic cleaner, so it probably didn't turn into liposomes. I was taking about 45mL/3 Tbsp at a time of this prior batch, so that would've been about 6g of sodium ascorbate per dose. I took a dose about every 30 minutes. After 4 doses, I finished the batch out so I made a new batch. The new batch was made correctly pouring the solution directly in the tank. So the 5th dose I took the new batch, the correct liposomal version, and since then I've been gassy and visiting the toilet all night.
 
In today's titration experiment, I took about 2Tbsp (30mL) every 30 minutes, and reached bowel intolerance on the 7th dose. The batch was made with 16oz liquid and 64g sodium ascorbate, so 2g per Tbsp. 7 x 4g = 28g nominally, but this was liposomal form, so maybe it was effectively over 100g.

Laura said:
As I wrote earlier in this thread, I weighed a legal TBSP of vitamin C (level) and it was 10.67 grams. So that would be 32 actual grams of vitamin C per cup of water which is around 130 EFFECTIVE grams of vitamin C taken up by the liver.

BUT that amount is doubled in the sodium ascorbate variation to 64 actual grams of vitamin C per cup and well over 250 EFFECTIVE grams taken up by the liver. (Obviously, you only need a shot of this about two or three times a day!)
 
This morning my stomach started making sounds on only the 3rd dose, so tolerance seems to have gone down. Hopefully that means my health is getting better.
 
hlat said:
This morning my stomach started making sounds on only the 3rd dose, so tolerance seems to have gone down. Hopefully that means my health is getting better.

That's usually what it means. If you can tolerate 20 grams, you are mildly ill. 50 or so, and you are pretty darn sick.
 
Laura said:
hlat said:
This morning my stomach started making sounds on only the 3rd dose, so tolerance seems to have gone down. Hopefully that means my health is getting better.

That's usually what it means. If you can tolerate 20 grams, you are mildly ill. 50 or so, and you are pretty darn sick.

That was about to be my next question, thanks for the clarification Laura.

Interesting experiment hlat. I've done a bit of experimenting with Liposomal vit C myself over the summer:

My husband who is a PhD specializing in nano tech chemistry has been on board with the liposomal Vit C since the beginning of this thread and happily makes great batches of it for our family which i really appreciate. unfortunately, my kids are SO not on board. It doesn't matter how we disguise the stuff, they will NOT take it which led me to the following experiment. I purchased the LivON labs packets (which do not mix well with any liquid despite directions on the box) and began to think of ways i could mix it with something that it wouldn't separate out from. My thought was fat -isn't more fat always the answer:)- and i went with cocoa butter. I took 1 square of good quality dark chocolate, gently melted it and let it cool and then mixed it with 1 packet of LivOn labs vit C. the result was spectacular! the Vit C mixed right in to produce a very smooth creamy texture and as it cooled to room temp it turned into fudge! You could actually take the mixture out and roll it into a truffle or make a bigger batch and cut it into squares. I was so impressed with myself until my hubby had to be a buzz kill and mention that the liposomes may not have remained intact with addition of the chocolate and he's right but my thought was that if the liposomes were broken, we would be able to taste it in the chocolate- of course that could be just wishful thinking. Anyway, until I'm proven wrong, it can't hurt and has now become the new dessert for my my kids. I'm not sure about maintenance doses of liposomal C for kids so 1g is where I'm aiming if no one is ill….and there it is: chocolate truffles with 1g of lipsomal Vit C each!

The other experiment was actually a lotion. My children and I spend summers in a desert region of Canada with my parents and with constant swimming, our skin dries out terribly. In the past, Ive used shea butter and even mixed it with lanolin for badly chapped areas but I don't find that shea absorbs terribly well. This year I rendered down some organic beef fat and used it as the base of my lotion. i mixed 1/4 cup of melted and cooled beef fat with 4 packets of LivOn labs (4g) and about 6 drops of rose oil (so we didn't smell like steak :D) It still took about 20-30 min to absorb but once it did, it was amazing! My skin actually felt like baby skin! One application would heal dry chapped skin about 85%. I also noticed that I got fewer spots from the sun this summer too which I'm guessing was because of the Vit C. Once again, I can't confirm the liposomes stayed intact but if you suffer from dry skin over the winter, it is definitely worth a try.
 
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