Éiriú-Eolas - Breathing Program
- Thread starter Laura
- Start date
L
LoveAndLight
Guest
I just wanted to check with you guys that the key, is how to learn to breath with diaphragm at all times, right? I have been experimenting with controlling my breath whenever I am conscious of it and trying to breath slowly and deeply(helps me a lot when I am stressed out of my mind). I know that breathing with the diaphragm is the correct way, but are there any dangers if one controls the breath or should we let the subconscious mind do the job?Just want to see what you think.
shijing
The Living Force
Just a couple of things that I have noticed since I started trying to do the breathing program regularly (every evening) --
First, I have also been experiencing short periods of zoning out during the meditation part at the end. I would like to think that these are genuine periods of interaction with my Higher Self, but I did notice that during one of these times last night, my body did that thing where it jerked (the way that your body does as you start to fall asleep), so I think at least some of the zoning may just be me starting to fall asleep. I usually do the meditation at night before bedtime, so its not impossible that I am just ready to go to sleep at that point.
Also, I was wondering if anyone has observed anything interesting about their pets' behavior during the program? The reason I ask is because I have a guinea pig, and for the past several times that I have done the program, when I get up after the end of the meditation I notice my guinea pig is sitting outside of his igloo very relaxed and looking in my general direction, which is not typical behavior. It could just be coincidence, but I can't help but wonder if 2D might derive some benefit from being around when we do the breathing program (or at least the meditation).
First, I have also been experiencing short periods of zoning out during the meditation part at the end. I would like to think that these are genuine periods of interaction with my Higher Self, but I did notice that during one of these times last night, my body did that thing where it jerked (the way that your body does as you start to fall asleep), so I think at least some of the zoning may just be me starting to fall asleep. I usually do the meditation at night before bedtime, so its not impossible that I am just ready to go to sleep at that point.
Also, I was wondering if anyone has observed anything interesting about their pets' behavior during the program? The reason I ask is because I have a guinea pig, and for the past several times that I have done the program, when I get up after the end of the meditation I notice my guinea pig is sitting outside of his igloo very relaxed and looking in my general direction, which is not typical behavior. It could just be coincidence, but I can't help but wonder if 2D might derive some benefit from being around when we do the breathing program (or at least the meditation).
anart
A Disturbance in the Force
shijing said:
Well, I typically do the breathing portion in the room with my parrots, and one of them has taken to swinging and bobbing her head, and making a small vocalization, in time with Laura's breath counts and they all watch me intently throughout. My little dog gets quite insistent on getting my attention when I'm breathing, or licking my face if I'm sitting down during the breathing, so I've taken to standing more, once she starts - they all definitely notice me doing it and I often wonder what it is, exactly, that they see or sense? Who knows, they might just enjoy the sound of it, but it's interesting.
Buddy
The Living Force
LoveAndLight said:
From what I understand, it is both possible and desirable to train yourself to breath with the diaphragm at all times.
I don't think you'll have to worry about controlling the breath all the time, though. With enough deliberate practice, the habit is likely to become permanent - you won't have to think about it. You'll become conscious of it occasionally, such as when you need some stress control.
Another aspect of this breathing control is training our 'will'. Control and use of the will is related to control of our breathing and Gurdjieff states we can do little or nothing until we learn to control our breathing. Listen to Laura's breathing introductory audio for more information.
LoveAndLight said:
Hi LoveAndLight,
yes I think it is the way to relearn the natural way of breathing, through the belly. It maybe takes a longer time, and I think you don't have to worry about it, as Buddy already stated, because your mechanical center is used doing the shallow breathing, with your upper part of the lung. You can also take it as kind of remembering yourself, to remember the prayer and so on, when you are doing belly breathing (when it comes back to your mind to breath with your belly).
Mountain Crown
The Living Force
FWIW-
Daily training of the Chi Kung "Embracing Tree" or "Horse Stance" will result in breathing from the diaphragm at all times.
Daily training of the Chi Kung "Embracing Tree" or "Horse Stance" will result in breathing from the diaphragm at all times.
L
LoveAndLight
Guest
Buddy said:
Thanks for the input. My breathing was very poor in my past, so when I started breathing with my diaphragm I had a hard time at first, but now its getting easier. I will re listen to Laura's audio clip, when I listened to it the first time my mind was distracted, so I must of missed somethings.
abcdefghiJoerg said:
Yes you are right about that, relearning how to breath will take time(funny how we forgot to breath!).Also I think its a good stress reliever if you focus on you breath, then your mind will be focused on the breathing instead of stressful thoughts.
Thanks, Ill look into this.Mountain Crown said:
Mountain Crown said:
Horse stance is a pretty intensive exercise, involving adopting a sitting position with the legs shouler-width or a little more apart and holding for whatever length of time is chosen. I'm not sure I agree with your statement that is "will result in diaphragm breathing at all times". Don't you think thats a little too categoric a statement to make?
shijing said:
On those occasions when I do zone out I have the sensation (not sure if that’s the right word to use) that my awareness is somewhere else when I zone out. It’s as if my awareness shifted to another floor of an ‘awareness elevator’ (as it were) and during the ‘time’ spent there the conscious awareness of myself listening to the prayer at this level was correspondingly shifted into a state of unconsciousness. Then I come back to this level and I’m again conscious of the prayer and I continue to focus on it (and the meaning of it) but then I might zone out again, back and forth, although my intention is not to zone out. My intention is to focus on the prayer and breathing.
Although my sense of linear time is pretty much lost (if I should zone out) there is still a kinda sequence to it all although, I think, its not a temporal sequence. What I mean is that if I ‘zone out’ then my awareness is somewhere else. When I come back to listening to the prayer then I get the impression that something was brought back from wherever my awareness was when it zoned out. Maybe it was a memory, or a feeling, or a thought that was brought back. So that ‘point’ where I was when my awareness zoned out connects up with that point of my awareness when its back listening to the tape. At least that’s they way it seems. Then I might zone out again, and then come back again and so on. So the impression I get is that a sequence of some kind is formed from this back and forth, inner and outer, shifting of my awareness. But its not a temporal sequence. Maybe its more like an eternal sequence or something like that since there is a feeling of great depth and potential to it all.
After listening to the tape at night (and doing the breathing) I always go into a deep sleep afterwards but I get the impression that there is a LOT going on while I’m asleep. I’m usually a deep sleeper and don’t remember my dreams too well but after doing the meditation and falling asleep I get the (vague) impression that there was a lot of dreaming going on but just can’t remember it after waking up. It just seems that a whole lot was going on when I was sleeping and sometimes I get the feeling that there are a bunch of conversations going on at some level, or perhaps many levels at the same time. Heck, maybe, at some level, I can even hear the conversations going on in this forum? I don’t know, but it sure seems that way sometimes.
shijing
The Living Force
Thanks for describing your experience, kenlee. Mine are similar in that when the zoning thing happens, it is like there is a blank spot in my memory, but I know time has passed because I usually pay attention to keep my pipe-breathing in sync with the verses of the prayer, but when I 'come back' one of the first things I am aware of right away is that my breathing is all of a sudden out of sync and I don't remember when it happened, so I have to pause to get it back in rhythm again. I don't really experience shifting to another level of awareness (at least not yet) or feel that I bring stuff back with me, but I will try to pay attention to that this evening. I'm also not able to go directly into sleep, since I do the program in my living room, and then have to get up and get ready for bed after that, only after which I eventually go back to sleep. I know what you mean when you talk about waking in the morning and feeling like you have had a busy night -- that happened to me a lot earlier in the summer, although it isn't occurring specifically in coordination with the breathing program right now, at least not that I can tell. This is something I will try to observe as well.
Mountain Crown
The Living Force
Perceval said:
"Embracing Tree," is the "Horce Stance" with the arms raised to form a circle in front of the chest (as if hugging a tree or a ball). These positions are held while attention is rooted at the tan tien (located two inches below the naval) while gently breathing from the diaphragm.
The sitting involves bending the knees and gently rotating the pelvis to the front, eliminating the curve of the lower back. This position, when done properly, allows for only diaphragmatic breathing, one of the primary aims of Chi Kung. It also facilitates the unobstructed flow of chi while shifting the center of gravity to the tan tien.
Emphasis is on correct alignment and instruction from a reliable teacher, as improper practice may lead to possible injury. The intensity is in direct proportion to how low one stands, with the legs farther apart the lower the stance.
It is indeed difficult at first effort. The beginner will feel lucky to be able to hold the position for three minutes. Endurance, flexibility and chi increases dramatically however, especially when adding three to five minutes every week or two.
I can attest to this from my own practice. Of course it must be said that foolish, mechanical living can reverse any benefit and most likely result in abandoning the practice.
