Jordan Peterson: Gender Pronouns and Free Speech War

Pulled this from the web which I think accurately describes Pettersons situation. With strong positives there are also strong negatives. One example of Petersons strong negatives is his cherished beliefs. If he does not question himself (along with being connected to a strong network) it will lead to his own nullification. (Gurdjieff called us 'nullities').

Once his objective 'mental charge' begins to build up it gets neutralized from 'foreign installations' that infect his mind and eats his increasing awareness. Net result is zero if left to only mechanical processes without conscious application of his Will-To-Know.

Fom Castaneda's book The Active Side Of Infinity.

Don Juan speaking:

“Every one of us human beings has two minds. One is totally ours, and it is like a faint voice that always brings us order, directness, purpose. The other mind is a foreign installation. It brings us conflict, self-assertion, doubts, hopelessness.
[…]
“For the present, it will be sufficient that I repeat to you what I have said before about our two minds. One is our true mind, the product of all our life experiences, the one that rarely speaks because it has been defeated and relegated to obscurity. The other, the mind we use daily for everything we do, is a foreign installation.”
[…]

“Sorcerers believe that the predators have given us our systems of beliefs, our ideas of good and evil, our social mores. They are the ones who set up our hopes and expectations and dreams of success or failure. They have given us covetousness, greed, and cowardice. It is the predators who make us complacent, routinary, and egomaniacal.”

“But how can they do this, don Juan?” I asked, somehow angered further by what he was saying. “Do they whisper all that in our ears while we are asleep?”
“No, they don’t do it that way. That’s idiotic!” don Juan said, smiling. “They are infinitely more efficient and organized than that. In order to keep us obedient and meek and weak, the predators engaged themselves in a stupendous maneuver—stupendous, of course, from the point of view of a fighting strategist. A horrendous maneuver from the point of view of those who suffer it. They gave us their mind! Do you hear me? The predators give us their mind, which becomes our mind. The predators’ mind is baroque, contradictory, morose, filled with the fear of being discovered any minute now.

“I know that even though you have never suffered hunger,” he went on, “you have food anxiety, which is none other than the anxiety of the predator who fears that any moment now its maneuver is going to be uncovered and food is going to be denied. Through the mind, which, after all, is their mind, the predators inject into the lives of human beings whatever is convenient for them. And they ensure, in this manner, a degree of security to act as a buffer against their fear.”

“It’s not that I can’t accept all this at face value, don Juan,” I said. “I could, but there’s something so odious about it that it actually repels me. It forces me to take a contradictory stand. If it’s true that they eat us, how do they do it?”

Don Juan had a broad smile on his face. He was as pleased as punch. He explained that sorcerers see infant human beings as strange, luminous balls of energy, covered from the top to the bottom with a glowing coat, something like a plastic cover that is adjusted tightly over their cocoon of energy. He said that that glowing coat of awareness was what the predators consumed, and that when a human being reached adulthood, all that was left of that glowing coat of awareness was a narrow fringe that went from the ground to the top of the toes. That fringe permitted mankind to continue living, but only barely.

As if I had been in a dream, I heard don Juan Matus explaining that to his knowledge, man was the only species that had the glowing coat of awareness outside that luminous cocoon. Therefore, he became easy prey for an awareness of a different order, such as the heavy awareness of the predator.
He then made the most damaging statement he had made so far. He said that this narrow fringe of awareness was the epicenter of self-reflection, where man was irremediably caught. By playing on our self-reflection, which is the only point of awareness left to us, the predators create flares of awareness that they proceed to consume in a ruthless, predatory fashion.

They give us inane problems that force those flares of awareness to rise, and in this manner they keep us alive in order for them to be fed with the energetic flare of our pseudoconcerns.

There must have been something to what don Juan was saying, which was so devastating to me that at that point I actually got sick to my stomach.
After a moment’s pause, long enough for me to recover, I asked don Juan: “But why is it that the sorcerers of ancient Mexico and all sorcerers today, although they see the predators, don’t do anything about it?”

“There’s nothing that you and I can do about it,” don Juan said in a grave, sad voice. “All we can do is discipline ourselves to the point where they will not touch us. How can you ask your fellow men to go through those rigors of discipline? They’ll laugh and make fun of you, and the more aggressive ones will beat the shit out of you. And not so much because they don’t believe it. Down in the depths of every human being, there’s an ancestral, visceral knowledge about the predators’ existence.”
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loreta said:
And I also think that the fact that he went to court to force him to undergo mental rehabilitation treatment must have taken its toll on him.
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No one forced him to undergo mental rehabilitation. He chose to do it. I questioned why he was doing it at the time. He's making bad choice after bad choice.
hlat said:
Why is he submitting himself to reeducation?
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Jebra said:
The C's said he was a great soul so I wonder if he was deliberately targetted for disintergration by 4D sts. It's very sad to watch. He's certainly on a downward spiral. Can he be helped at all now?
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I tend to think about that question in terms of what was meant by "great soul". Maybe that was a relative statement, or maybe a "great soul" does not mean what we think it means. Clearly, if we take him as a "great soul", yet notice his foibles and errors, then "great soul" probably does not mean what we think it means, if we think it means someone who has great knowledge across the board and is devoid of blind spots and wishful thinking.
 
A "Great Soul" may also be someone who awakens many to truth through their personal struggles, IMHO. He started off on the path of objective truth, so many (like us) saw him as a positive force worth following and promoting. Lately, he has very publicly fallen off that wagon to those who continue to pay attention to objective truth. He's teaching us all a lesson to always pay attention to what YOU SEE, instead of following someone blindly down the path to ruin even if they started off on the right foot. The elites often first promote those who share objective truths, only to later see them degrade themselves publicly and lead their followers astray.

The path he and many others I thought worthwhile to follow (such as RFK Jr. and Vivek Ramaswamy and Trump himself) is very illustrative of the folly of blind servitude and they are, in their own way, showing many that the right path is to follow your own inner guidance and always be willing to question even those you may have chosen as mentors.

They have chosen to "teach" us that lesson on the world stage, and that alone does take a form of "Greatness" since if they didn't embody it in a sense they'd never have made it into the public eye in the first place. It is simply that OUR definition of "Greatness" differs greatly from the elite's definition of same (which JP and others must follow to remain in the public eye), and we can spot the difference when one falls off the path of truth. I don't envy their chosen path, but they are teaching and awakening many by doing it so openly.

It would be incredibly uplifting, though, if we could see JP and others on the world stage wake up and share that journey with us. THAT would wake up even more people, and I pray for that to happen.
 
To go biblical, since anyone does nowadays, even angels fall and "great souls" get corrupted too. Many people are insightful about subject X and complete morons about subjects Y and Z. Wisdom is supposedly to shut up about Y and Z but sometimes, especially in the "intellectual" sphere, one doesn't know when he's being moronic about these subjects. The funny (and tragic, don't know which is which) about Peterson, is that he's checking the boxes of irony about what he's been saying. Listen to those you don't agree with so that you can learn? Be careful not to become a concentration camp guardian? Not to listen just to one side of a story? And the biggest of all IMHO, the story of the intellectual ego he interprets from Nietzsche's Thus Spake Zarathustra. He became what he's warned about not becoming, as if someone or something has played a cruel game on him (or he did it to himself, which gives the same result). Not matter the cause, the result is here.
 
On p. 268 of FPtM, I read a passage that, for some reason, made me think of JP and the time line of events for his court ordered rehabilitation and then his subsequent Palestinian/Israeli crash and burn. I could be seeing this through an overly simplistic interpretation, mind you, or even taking it completely out of context to the point of absurdity. I'm certainly not trying to make any parallels between JP and Paul, but, with a grain of perspective salt, for the moment, replace Stephen with JP.

"Stephen, full of grace and power, did wonders and signs among the people. Then some of those who belonged to the synagogue of the Freedmen (as it was called), Cyrenians, Alexandrians, and others of those from Cilicia and Asia, stood up and argued with Stephen. But they could not withstand the wisdom and the Spirit with which he spoke. Then they secretly instigated some men to say, "We have heard him speak blasphemous words against Moses and God." They stirred up the people as well as the elders and the scribes; then suddenly confronted him, seized him, and brought him before the council. They set up false witnesses who said, "This man never stops saying things against this holy place and the law; for we have heard him say that this Jesus of Nazareth will destroy this place and will change the customs that Moses handed on to us."" (Acts 6:8-14)

The above passage sure sounds like it could have been a description of the experiences of Paul in Antioch, as well as being echoed in the accusations against Jesus as depicted in Mark. This makes sense, considering Acts' goal of rehabilitating Paul, whitewashing the Christians' Zealot roots, and creating harmony between the Zealot and Pauline factions where there had been none.
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Voyageur said:
On Piers Morgan, Peterson does some damage control:
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That's no damage control as far as I can tell. By writing "Give them hell, Netanyahu" he is supporting AND inciting a genocidal maniac, while here all he is saying is, "I am sorry I lost my Muslim followers, twitter makes one impulsive, oh well".

The Israeli bombing of hospitals, places of worship, residential areas, schools, parks, united nation facilities, etc etc, the killings of thousands of children - some not even one year old yet! - the unjustifiable, inhumane, cold blooded killing of the unarmed population of Gaza and the West Bank, is he sorry for that? Is he sorry that his pal Netanyahu is acting like a psycho?

I think it was somewhere within the pages of this thread that someone posted a speech by Peterson where he names Israel as the only culture and democracy in that area (paraphrasing). Yeah right! Egypt, Iran, Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Jordan were mere deserted expanses with no people, no civilization, no culture before 1948. I think he actually believes that, and I think he considers the Palestinians as dispensable non-humans as Netanyahu does. I have no respect for JP whatsoever anymore, and I am not holding my breath that he will ever see any sense in this subject. Even if he had it in him, his "intellectual handlers" wouldn't allow him.
 
Alana said:
speech by Peterson where he names Israel as the only culture and democracy in that area (paraphrasing).
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That is pretty much mind-blowing, but I have a friend, who is a MENSA member and does the same: invents a thousand ways to confirm his biases to be safe and comfortable in his bubble. Both he and JP have been experienced by life, thrown out of homeostasis that they are trying now to maintain at any cost. It's really painful to watch how he just discards the whole field of sociology and uses Procruste's bed to judge other methods of organizing social life, mistakenly conflating the aprioristic (sacral) idea of subordination with the Latin ideal of personalistic democracy. Poor mind, imprisioned by idealism :-( Or maybe there's more into that:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1714566907192398033
https://twitter.com/x/status/1715005131182264678
 
Alana said:
I have no respect for JP whatsoever anymore, and I am not holding my breath that he will ever see any sense in this subject. Even if he had it in him, his "intellectual handlers" wouldn't allow him.
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Well said, Alana. I haven't really been following JP's disintegration; there's just too much other stuff that's way more important. If someone posted a video of him doing a complete mea culpa, that might perk my attention, but anything less I don't have time for.

I do wonder if the only reason he's fallen for the Zionist line so willingly is because, on some deep level, he knows how badly this is going to turn out for the Jews, and he simply can't bear to watch them go down without trying to 'help' them, even if that 'help' is really only making their situation worse. If that's true, it's possible he might do a mea culpa at some point, but at that stage he'll have wrecked his reputation so thoroughly that it will take a long time before he re-gathers the sort of goodwill he once had.

A shame. He had the chance to make a real difference and he fell for the victim ploy. Well, that's the nature of this place. As Laura said, there's a disinformation program for everyone, and for JP it appears to be the idea that western civilisation is 'exceptional' and 'indispensable'. He, and a lot of people, are going to learn a very hard lesson regarding this, osit.
 
There are a few videos floating around of speeches by people at the first conference of this new org.

Alliance for Responsible Citizenship - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

Alliance for Responsible Citizenship (ARC) is an international centre-right network who focus on social and cultural issues faced by member nations. Its formation was announced by its founders, Jordan Peterson, John Anderson and Baroness Stroud in June of 2023, with a London conference held in late October of that year. One Australian journalist identified the purpose of ARC as follows:

to replace a sense of division and drift within conservatism, and Western society at large, with a renewed cohesion and purpose
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What I find interesting about this new "Alliance" is that while much of its ethos and aims are well-meaning i.e. basically to "safeguard western civilization and its values", it appears to have been hijacked by the manufactured and geopolitically-inspired, "clash of civilizations", where during many of the talks over the past couple of days, speakers at least touched (while some held forth) on the idea that "we are in the fight of our lives" [to protect Western civilization and its values] from an atavistic hoard of Muslims/immigrants hell-bent on actively or passively destroying our way of life. Not surprisingly, where any speaker mentioned the Gaza situation, they were fully in support of Israel.

What strikes me is that while these people mainly look without (i.e. outside of 'centrist conservativism) for the source of this attack on Western civilization, it is in fact the primary exponents of Western civilization exceptionalism over the past 80 years, that are the main cause of the decline that these people lament. The decline of Western civilization is, more than anything else, MORAL in nature, and that moral decline has been led, first and foremost, by Western govts. and the corporations with whom they are frequently "in bed".

Examples of trends that have led to moral decline include:

Who is behind the rampant and extreme consumerism that has been forced on Western populations?

Who was behind the destruction of the Catholic Church in Western nations and, with it, reverance for the transcendent?

Who promotes extreme materialism, capitalism and money as the highest good, leading to the gradual desctruction of the traditional nuclear family and the sidelining of spiritual values?

Who has promoted a "moral" War on Terror, despite the fact that it primarily involved the murder of civilians for cynical and self-interested geopolitical goals?

Who tried to convince the world that torture was fine?

Who is currently trying to convince the world that slaughtering women and children in Palestine is a core aspect of the process of 'saving Western civilization'?

I could go on, but you get the point.

These people are clueless.
 
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