Ketogenic Diet - Powerful Dietary Strategy for Certain Conditions

[Aliana]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

All I can say is me too!!! Thank you so much for posting this - you may have helped me solve some issues that have been plaguing me for months! I have had a persistent rash all over my stomach and back for many months and nothing has been working. I have tried eliminating all the obvious things, but it never occurred to me that bacon and bone broth could be part of the problem!! Not to mention avocados and chocolate and black tea (all favorites of mine) I have also tried using the french green clay - drinkable as well as using it on my body, taking supplements to help my liver, liposomal C and glutathione as well as using the FIR blanket. I have been growing frustrated b/c nothing was working!

So - while I am not looking forward to getting rid of many more of my favorite foods, it will be well worth it if this finally works! ;)

Hi aleana,
I'm glad you found Psyche's article as useful and eye-opening as I did! I just wanted to note I was quoting Psyche and the bit about secondary common symptoms was taken from that same article.
I'm sure you were already aware of that but the way I posted that quote could be misguiding.
I hope tweaking your diet a tiny bit will help you with all the symptoms you described.

Yes, I read the article you linked to - it was very informative! Lots to take in and changes to make.

So - while I am not looking forward to getting rid of many more of my favorite foods, it will be well worth it if this finally works! ;)

I think it is a worthwhile experiment. It is doable and with some modifications, perhaps you'll hardly notice. Stock instead of broth and fresh bacon (pork belly) instead of cured bacon, stuff like that. That you find it hard to drop tea or cocoa (just to give a couple of examples), might be a sign that it could be interesting to eliminate it for awhile as a test. Perhaps this histamine vicious cycle reinforces addictions and brain inflammation conditions. There goes my dopamine fix-coffee! Ouch!

I am going to make some stock and freeze the bone broth I have now. I do have some bacon that I believe is uncured, but will check on that and get something else if that is not. One other issue is that according to that article smoked meats are also a problem and most of the BBQ here in Texas is smoked - and that is what I eat when not at home. :(

The chocolate is proving to be a real issue - I am super-busy at work right now and usually about 3PM I grab for chocolate because of nervous exhaustion - just about the time my cortisol levels are heading south! I started taking 5mg of hydro-cortisone about a month ago, but so far have not noticed a big change. It may not be enough, but since I am only 110lbs, have been worried about upping the dose. Started recently to half the dose, once in the morning and once right after lunch, but have not noticed any change yet. Am doing this on my own b/c don't have the ~$500 to spend on doctor and hormone testing again right now.

Also have a question about the tea - is it the caffeine in the tea or the black tea itself? I only drink one pot (with only one teabag) in the morning. I don't have a problem switching to decaf - have a whole box of decaf Irish breakfast. Would decaf work or do I need to switch to White or Green tea? Not my favourites, but could manage if necessary. But giving up chocolate is going to prove interesting... I am afraid of my limp body being found crashed on my desk at 4PM!

 

[Nancy2feathers]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Hi aleana. When I`m feeling that need for energy at mid end work day, I eat a spoonful of organic cold pressed coconut oil. The fat gives me a good feeling( not quite like chocolate),but it satisfies the hunger and need for energy if I`m unable to drink bone broth. I know not everyone can tolerate coconut, but it works for me.

As far as decaf tea goes... I would be careful as to how the company decaffeinates the tea. Sometimes harmful chemicals are used in the process. There are lots of tasty herbal teas and if you can tolerate coconut oil, you can put it in your tea for extra energy. :)

 

[herondancer]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

The chocolate is proving to be a real issue - I am super-busy at work right now and usually about 3PM I grab for chocolate because of nervous exhaustion - just about the time my cortisol levels are heading south! I started taking 5mg of hydro-cortisone about a month ago, but so far have not noticed a big change. It may not be enough, but since I am only 110lbs, have been worried about upping the dose. Started recently to half the dose, once in the morning and once right after lunch, but have not noticed any change yet. Am doing this on my own b/c don't have the ~$500 to spend on doctor and hormone testing again right now.

Also have a question about the tea - is it the caffeine in the tea or the black tea itself? I only drink one pot (with only one teabag) in the morning. I don't have a problem switching to decaf - have a whole box of decaf Irish breakfast. Would decaf work or do I need to switch to White or Green tea? Not my favourites, but could manage if necessary. But giving up chocolate is going to prove interesting... I am afraid of my limp body being found crashed on my desk at 4PM!

Hi Aleana,

Are you still able to tolerate a high intake of fat? That's the fuel your body needs, whether you have it in broth or stock. I have that same crash about 3-4 pm. A nice high-fat breakfast takes me all the way up till then and then it's like a car running out of gas. I keep some half-litre jars of canned bone broth in the fridge at work to eat when I feel the crash is looming. Half the jar with half the fat that collected at the top is enough to get me home, and keeps me from getting cranky.

I don't have the adrenal issues you describe, but stock/fat intake when your energy drops might not hurt.

 

[Naturalden]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

I've read through the thread. Maybe I missed it but I was wondering if there has been a discussion of the Optimal Diet?

"In contrast to other low-carbate dietary regimens, this nutritional model dictates the exact proportion between the three main food components, protein, fat and carbate (1:2.5-3:0.8, respectively), which has to be achieved on a daily basis in order to obtain claimed health benefits.

Therefore, unlike all other ad-hoc dietary low-carbate models, OD strictly controls daily intake of not only the "offending" sugars but also the intake of protein. Most importantly, both fats and proteins should be biochemically as close as possible to those found in the human body, i.e., they have to be obtained from animal products.

They should also contain a full complement of micronutrients, with products such as eggs, fatty bone broths, organ meats and pork fat being the most prominent examples."

 

[mcb]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

I've read through the thread. Maybe I missed it but I was wondering if there has been a discussion of the Optimal Diet?...

I don't think we have discussed it here, but Paul Jaminet has. When you eliminate nearly all carbs you need to consume enough protein to be able to make all the glucose you need. The OD cuts it close. Of course Jaminet also argues against other very low carb diets as well, including what we are doing here. But in any case I don't know of any reason to restrict protein that much, or to observe those particular ratios. Do you?

 

[nicklebleu]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

I've read through the thread. Maybe I missed it but I was wondering if there has been a discussion of the Optimal Diet?

Funny you should mention OD ... that is what ultimately lead me to this forum. It very briefly mentioned that when I joined, but at that stage diet wasn't very high on the agenda. I have followed the OD for a while, with mixed success. As farmasmI remember Kwasniewski doesn't really tell you to leave out gluten and other grains, as long as you stick to the recommended ratio of nutrients - and for me that was the first milestone to better health. He is also very heavy into dairy products, which is poorly toleratd by many, if not most. And the amount of crbs he recommends is still too high for me, gets me out of ketosis double quick. of course, Kwasniewski doesn't talk about ketosis, I don't think that this is his aim to get to.

But as Megan said, it was a step into thenright direction, but I think (or hope) that we have progressed from there ...

 

[monotonic]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

I discovered today that I can make ghee in the pan before cooking the meat. All I have to do is melt the butter, tilt the pan so it pools on the side, and then slowly return the pan to level. The caseins stick together and adhere to the side of the pan. After they drain for a bit on the side I can easily scrape them off with the spatula. This is using my Lodge cast-iron pan.

We've finally found a source of marrow bones, and we have broth cooking at the moment This time, it tastes good. When we've done it before it always ended up off-tasting. It may have been the quality and condition of the bones used.

 

[Naturalden]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Megan

“But in any case I don't know of any reason to restrict protein that much, or to observe those particular ratios. Do you?”

In answer to your question: no. May I ask if your diet has a particular ratio in a general sense?

It's interesting you mention Paul Jaminet. Have you read his series on the dangers of very low carb diets? Do you see any validity in his views?

 

[Josi]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

It's interesting you mention Paul Jaminet. Have you read his series on the dangers of very low carb diets? Do you see any validity in his views?

I listened to a podcast from Underground Wellness with Paul Jaminet, and I was not very impressed. One of his suggestions on losing weight was to "eat less fat". My jaw dropped on that one. :O

He also advocated (if I remember correctly) 100 grams of carbs per day, and potatoes being OK.

Sorry, but I am not listening to that guy.


_http://undergroundwellness.com/podcasts/the-perfect-health-diet/

Edit: deactivated link

 

[mcb]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Megan

“But in any case I don't know of any reason to restrict protein that much, or to observe those particular ratios. Do you?”

In answer to your question: no. May I ask if your diet has a particular ratio in a general sense?

It's interesting you mention Paul Jaminet. Have you read his series on the dangers of very low carb diets? Do you see any validity in his views?

I have mentioned his book here in this topic, and the "dangers" series of blog posts as well (I think). I have found some of his research to be very useful, although not that part. I suspect that his hypothetical "glucose deficiency" issue is really a composite of other unexplored issues (because he gave up on extremely low carb), or it may be a personal health problem that he has. I have worked through the issues myself, for now, by limiting (but not eliminating) prebiotic foods and adding probiotic (fermented) ones. If I develop the symptoms of his "glucose deficiency" syndrome later on then it may be time for another look.

Jaminet's macronutrient ratio (as well as the one for the OD, as far as I know) is based on assumptions. It reportedly works well for him and his wife, and for his self-selected followers. It's not ketogenic, although he offers a ketogenic variation with higher carbs than what we use here. We are trying to elevate ketone levels, so his recommendations don't really apply.

Interestingly, one of the AHS 2012 presenters (I can't remember her name) discussed treatment of epilepsy in children using ketogenic diet, and she had a variation that was higher in carbs but still effective at preventing seizures. So he is not entirely off-base there (with higher-carb ketogenic diets), although whether any of that applies to what we are doing here -- which is not preventing seizures -- remains to be seen.

 

[Gaby]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

It's interesting you mention Paul Jaminet. Have you read his series on the dangers of very low carb diets? Do you see any validity in his views?

We have discussed it in "Life Without Bread" thread. Doing a search with his name might return something.

 

[mcb]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

It's interesting you mention Paul Jaminet. Have you read his series on the dangers of very low carb diets? Do you see any validity in his views?

I listened to a podcast from Underground Wellness with Paul Jaminet, and I was not very impressed. One of his suggestions on losing weight was to "eat less fat". My jaw dropped on that one. :O

He also advocated (if I remember correctly) 100 grams of carbs per day, and potatoes being OK.

Sorry, but I am not listening to that guy.


_http://undergroundwellness.com/podcasts/the-perfect-health-diet/

Edit: deactivated link

Limiting fat intake is a basic part of an Atkins-style ketogenic weight loss diet as discussed in the "Life Without Bread" topic.

If you can lose weight while eating unlimited fat, more power to you, but I can't and I do limit fat without out-and-out restricting it. It means, for instance, using one tablespoon of duck fat in the frying pan instead of two or more, and not otherwise supplementing with extra fat. If you supply all of your fat needs externally then your body doesn't need to consume its excess internal stores although, as always, this may vary from one individual to the next.

 

[Gaby]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Also have a question about the tea - is it the caffeine in the tea or the black tea itself? I only drink one pot (with only one teabag) in the morning. I don't have a problem switching to decaf - have a whole box of decaf Irish breakfast. Would decaf work or do I need to switch to White or Green tea? Not my favourites, but could manage if necessary. But giving up chocolate is going to prove interesting... I am afraid of my limp body being found crashed on my desk at 4PM!

If I remember correctly, green tea was worse for some reason. I usually keep a thermos with either vitamin C or stock with butter to refill my tank. Since I started doing vitamin C throughout the day (haven't done the liposomal form yet), my hair stopped falling in big chunks. I'm still inflamed and just yesterday, I had some stock that was not fresh and I gained 2 Kg overnight and had itchy skin. The same batch when it was fresh actually helped me to lose inflammatory fluids and didn't gave me any itchiness.

I'm still having coffee, but will switch it to liposomal vitamin C next week. A little bit of L-phenylalanine might help you to decrease chocolate carvings. That is what The Mood Cure book said, but I don't know if it really works.

I was a huge chocolate addict, but the craving has stopped ever since I'm drinking coffee :/ I'm going to take some cortisol in two doses as well to see if it helps.

 

[WIN 52]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

It seems during times where my physical manifestation becomes in danger of being extinguished, the promptings come through loud and clear. In fact right after my stroke is when I had several experiences which caused/encouraged me to begin a search that eventually led me here. This is the group I was told about in the 1980's, by my guide. Yet, why do I hesitate? Is the programming that heavy?

I would question who or what your "guide" is. That sounds pretty New Age-ish...

Definitely not, new age ish!
This is a term I have used for this contact since 1980 where I received a warning about an impending accident which crushed my left foot.
I didn't heed the warning till it was almost too late!
The warning came three times.
I have called this contact, "My Guide" since then.
I have questioned this many times since, but it always remains a reliable source of information.
This source informed me about a woman who was taking up the work(1985) and to search out this group(2005), after my stroke.
I trust my guide based on results and the nature of the interactions.( one of the few things in this life that I have trust in)

 

[WIN 52]

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

I would question who or what your "guide" is. That sounds pretty New Age-ish...

It sounds downright deadly as a means of knowing when to pass when driving.

How else do you learn trust?
This was a way I chose, in that if it wasn't true, I would not survive or there would be dire consequences.
I put my life on the line, trusting my guide.
That is how trust was built, working with this through the 90's.
I had done this many times, but the most recent was initiated by my guide where I merely followed instructions to pass.
I did not ask if the road was clear.
The instructions were so clear that I acted out in faith, not knowing the outcome but trusting the source.

Oh Megan, the C0Q10 has made a significant improvement, over night, it seems...Thanks for helping me make this choice!