Ketogenic Diet - Powerful Dietary Strategy for Certain Conditions

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

The other night I heard a radio broadcast of a Charlie Rose show on neurodegenerative diseases, esp. Huntington's and Parkinson's but also Alzheimers and Jacob Kreutzfelt disease:

http://www.charlierose.com/view/interview/12517

Very interesting. Apparently they are all caused by similar processes involving the multiplication of CAG sequences in genes that then produce glutamines beyond what are functional and that makes the resulting proteins toxic leading to cell death and aggregation. Essentially it leads to folding of proteins like in prion-based diseases like Kreutzfeld-Jakob disease. This causes six different brain diseases, including Alzheimers and ALS. The good news from this show is that apparently they have developed some treatments for mice that have not only halted the damage but have reversed it.

I am still working my way through this thread but I was wondering if some of the epigenetic features of the Ketogenic diet might mitigate this.

Looking into this and the relation of neurodegenerative diseases to mitochondria, I ran across this:

http://www.ninds.nih.gov/news_and_events/news_articles/Parkin_PINK1_clean_up_mitos.htm

Researchers Firm up Evidence for Role of Mitochondria in Parkinson’s Disease

For release: Tuesday, February 23, 2010

New studies supported by the National Institutes of Health shed light on the functions of two genes related to Parkinson’s disease called parkin and PINK1.

The studies connect parkin and PINK1 in a pathway that assures quality control over mitochondria – subcellular factories that are the main source of energy for neurons and most other cells in the body.

One study was led by Richard Youle, Ph.D., a senior investigator at NIH’s National Institute of Neurological Disorders and Stroke (NINDS). The other study was led by Serge Przedborski, M.D., Ph.D., a professor of neurology and pathology at Columbia University Medical Center in New York. This study was funded by NINDS, the National Institute on Aging (NIA), the National Institute of Environmental Health Sciences (NIEHS), the Department of Defense and non-profit foundations.

Parkinson’s disease attacks neurons in the substantia nigra, a part of the brain that helps control movement. The most common symptoms of the disease are involuntary shaking, slow movement, stiffened muscle tone, and impaired balance.

The vast majority of cases of Parkinson’s disease are sporadic, meaning the cause is unknown. About 5-10 percent of cases are caused by mutations in single genes, including parkin, PINK1, SNCA and others. Researchers believe that studying these genes will not only benefit patients with genetic Parkinson’s, but also will yield insights into what causes the sporadic disease. (Indeed, a recent study shows that SNCA is a risk factor for sporadic Parkinson’s.)

One theory holds that sporadic Parkinson’s involves a breakdown of the mitochondria, hammering neurons with a depletion of energy and a buildup of harmful byproducts (called oxidative stress). There is evidence of mitochondrial damage in the substantia nigra of patients. Also, the pesticides paraquat and rotenone can induce Parkinson-like symptoms in animal models, and are known to injure mitochondria. Still, many experts question whether mitochondrial damage is a cause or a consequence of Parkinson’s.

“By showing that parkin and PINK1 are involved in quality control of mitochondria, our data support the idea that mitochondrial damage can play a causative role in Parkinson’s disease,” said Dr. Youle.

Dr. Przedborski noted that “a similar dysfunction of mitochondria could occur even in the absence of a genetic defect. You can imagine that environmental factors or other non-genetic factors could cause mitochondrial damage over time and lead to Parkinson’s disease.”

Prior research had hinted that parkin and PINK1 are important for keeping mitochondria in working order. Cells deficient in either protein have abnormal mitochondria, but the reasons for this were not clear. Last year, Dr. Youle and his team reported that parkin is recruited to damaged mitochondria and that it stimulates their destruction.

The two new studies show that PINK1 is the signal for recruiting parkin. These data came in part from experiments in which the researchers exposed cells to mitochondrial toxins, and tracked the responses of fluorescent-tagged parkin. Parkin moved to the mitochondria damaged by the toxins, and this movement was dependent on PINK1. If the cells lacked PINK1, parkin failed to move to the mitochondria. Giving the cells extra PINK1 or (in Dr. Youle’s study) a version of PINK1 that sticks tightly to all mitochondria – even healthy ones – increased recruitment of parkin to the mitochondria and led to their destruction.

Both research teams confirmed that this pathway is relevant to Parkinson’s disease by showing that several PINK1 and parkin mutations found in patients have adverse effects on parkin recruitment and/or mitochondrial turnover.

One goal of future research is to determine exactly how PINK1 and parkin work together to target mitochondria for destruction. Not all the steps in this process are understood, and there may be other proteins that help PINK1 and parkin interact, the researchers said. A complete understanding of the PINK1-parkin pathway could lead to drug therapies that tip the balance toward healthy mitochondria.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

I’m just caught up with the Thread, I must catch up with some of the articles, Thanks Ailen and Laura for all this information, :D It takes time to me to read it, I started to read this thread that goes so fast 5 days before and finished now. :cry: :P

I´ve restricted my carbs down as much as possible as I posted before I´ve been eating some “ green platanos” and some veggies, for the last 6 months my mainly food intake is pork, pork chop, and other parts made it with much lard, now I know that the protein is converted in glucose :cry: :O, so now Im looking the right balance between my protein and fat.


I tell ya, that bone broth is becoming the mainstay of my existence. Nothing but good soup bones with salt and pepper, either pressure cooked for a few hours or simmered in the crock pot all day. Add more lard to make the fat on top a smooth covering, not just dotted globules, and a cup here and there during the day and you are right as rain


Here's a simple way that doesn't require you to count mgs or kgs or anything else. Every time you eat from now on, have a little more fat than you used to, which will mean you'll probably have a little less protein, since you'll be full quicker with the fat. So to start off, just have your pork chop or sausage or whatever, but add more fat while you are eating it. Keep that up for a while and make sure you can digest ok, then try and increase the amount of fat and reduce protein a little more. The goal is to be able to make fat the main thing you eat and therefore main energy source. We don't know if it will work out that way, but that's what we're trying, because this is a diet experiment.



I have been made bone broth with lard and onion and sea salt, when it is finished threw out the onion and drink the soup, the last Friday I was with a little flu after eat all day bone broth Friday and Saturday with some pork chop in the lunch yesterday I wake up without any symptoms!!!
Today I made some new bone broth but not in a pressure cooker so it last like 3 hours to be ready but what a flavor nothing more than a bone broth so delicious!!!!


Laura said:
c.a., let me run through it ONE MORE TIME here.

When you get up in the morning, you can - and probably should - have a nice protein breakfast such as bacon, maybe eggs if you tolerate them. Add a cup of broth if you like. This should be every single day even on the "protein restriction/semi-fasting" days.

Then, on normal days, have a bit of meat AND broth for lunch, a bit of meat and maybe a bit of lettuce if you like, for dinner. Or just broth, or just meat. This meat should be the amount that is right for your weight. If you like, you can go a few grams over, but not more than that. Try to make sure you get the ratio of fat with this meat that is correct.

On the restriction/semi-fast days, have the breakfast and then just bone broth for lunch and dinner and a snack if needed. That, right there, gives you your fat, your nutrients, but restricts your protein.

It really is that simple.

It IS important to have protein for breakfast every day.

thanks Laura very clear to understand!!! ;D


Ailén said:
Apologies if I misunderstood some of you, but it seems to me that a few members are planning on fasting every second day or so. As I understand it, this is not necessary if you are doing the protein restriction, 0 or almost 0 carbs every day, and more fat. Fasting is only needed for some, to reduce the time it takes to get into ketosis. Just FYI, in case some of you are being too strict. No need. If you want to do some fasting, you can eat your last meal of the day at around 5 or 6 pm, and then not eat anything until breakfast. That is more than enough IMO, if you stick to the diet the rest of the time.

Fasting once a week might be ok, but I still don't really see any need for that if one is sticking to the diet every day. And working out every second day seems to help a lot in the process.

After been 0 carbs I began to feel some pain in my legs and arms in the muscle, 0 energy, very tired so I try to go slow as the body accommodate as I ate a lot of proteins think the body had had too much glucose on it what I need to replace now, making the balance between protein and fat and of course reach the ketosis , the bone broth helped me to feel more energize but don’t think Im in Ketosis yet .

I would like to try tomorrow a fast from lunch tomorrow to the next morning drinking bone broth only around 5 pm ? :huh:
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Cute blog post, Megan. :D I always knew you were a cat pretending to be a person. My two concerns with slow cookers are: lead-based ceramic glazes and exploding glass lids, both of which are quite common, apparently. When I get a slow cooker I plan to foil-wrap the lid. (I'm paranoid about broken glass.)
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

dugdeep said:
I just listened to a really interesting talk by Dr. Ron Rosedale (you can find it here http://www.meandmydiabetes.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Ron-Rosedale-MTOR-Protein-Part-2.mp3, text is here http://drrosedale.com/blog/2011/11/21/ron-rosedale-%E2%80%93-protein-the-good-the-bad-and-the-ugly/). Dr. Rosedale is the guy who talks about protein restriction and is where Nora Gedgaudas got her information about mTOR.

I read that article and downloaded the PDF and got a hold of over half of his cited references. It strikes me that it is really guessing how much protein will activate the mTOR pathway. From a longevity point of view, it might not be the main key player. The lowest references of protein intake come from people who still eat some amount of carbs in their diets and I think that animal models are less than ideal when it comes to figure out quantities required for humans.

But it does seem to be obvious that protein should be moderated. If insulin gets too stimulated by protein, it will activate genes related with insulin that are related to anti-longevity.

Turning down the gene that controls insulin, switches another gene –DAF 16 - which acts like an elixir of life with all the anti-aging benefits. It sends a whole set of instructions for repair and renovation of genes. Our supply of natural anti­oxidants goes up, damping down damaging free radicals. The elixir gene also boosts compounds that make sure the skin and muscle-building ­proteins are working properly, the immune system becomes more active to fight infection and genes that are active in cancer get turned off. See Cinthya Kenyon and her research. She has published some jaw dropping stuff which has prompt her to go totally low carb. Well, she actually still eats a lot of carbs from our perspective. Here is an overview: _http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-1323758/Can-cutting-Carbohydrates-diet-make-live-longer.html

When it comes to protein, another thing to keep in mind is that a person, who is used to burn sugar as a primary source of fuel, will have the tendency to more efficiently convert protein intake into sugar.

Perhaps it isn't a good idea to exceed roughly 25g of actual protein in a meal since this has been estimated to be the mTOR-stimulating threshold by Rosedale and pals.

As you guys have quoted, some say that it is on an average between 1.5 and 2.0 grams per kilogram of ideal body weight (0.7 to 1.0 grams per pound of ideal body weight). Keep in mind that when we’re talking about grams of protein, we’re not saying grams of meat or fish. Protein is only a part of what makes up meat or fish. Fat, water, are other components.

It is estimated that a person needs about 0.5 gram of protein per pound of ideal weight to maintain “structure” and healthy body composition. If you are even moderately active, you need closer to 0.7 gram per pound, and if you work out regularly or are under a fair amount of stress, you need as much as 1 gram per pound of ideal body weight.

Daily current USDA’s recommended daily allowance (RDA) for protein is 0.8 grams of protein for every kilogram (1 kg = 2.2 pounds) of ideal body weight. The number came from the thought that higher intakes were thought to impact negatively bone metabolism. But we now know that this is not the case and that diets richer in protein are associated with healthier bones as people age.

But the audio/article that dugdeep quoted, has Ron Rosedale saying the following (the talk took place at the American Society of Bariatric Physicians (ASBP) meeting Oct 31, 2006):

But if I’ve got a diabetic, and I really want to reverse their aging, which means reverse their diabetes, because diabetes is a model of aging, I’ll put them down to .5 or .6 grams per kilogram of lean body mass per day.

So what’s left to eat?

We know that sugar, foods that turn into sugar, raise insulin, IGF accelerate aging, worsens diabetes. It’s horrible for you. Now I’m telling you that extra protein isn’t good for you either. It appears to accelerate the MTOR pathway and has all kinds of debilitating effect, not the least of which is stimulating cancer.

Fat. Eat fat.

Fat appears not to stimulate insulin. It does not stimulate the MTOR pathway. It does not cause an increase of leptin and in fact it keeps it down. And our health is going to be dependent on what our hormones tell our brains to do, whether to be hungry or not. If you keep leptin down and your hypothalamus can listen to leptin, you are not going to over-eat. When leptin is down it stimulates fat burning. It helps diabetes. It helps all sorts of things. I’ve been doing this for over two decades now, and I can tell you for sure it happens.

You have to regulate the hormones that regulate your brain, and you do this by diet, and then you can affect the rate of aging and the incidence of the diseases associated with aging.

Even when carbs are restricted, we do not start losing muscle mass or have less ability to do exercise. As Jeff Volek, and Stephen D. Phinney report in “The Art of Low Carbohydrate Living”, muscle mass is preserved when there is an appropriate period of ketosis adaptation and that properly formulated ketogenic diets have a remarkable ability to protect muscle and exercise performance during periods of caloric restriction or intermittent fasting when there are sufficient minerals provided.

They report on their own studies and those of many others to conclude that resistance training is a potent stimulus to protect lean body mass in men consuming a low carb ketogenic diet and allowing for better insulin and leptin signaling. They recommend between 1.5 and 2.0 gram per day per kg of reference or ideal weight. They say that higher intakes reduce or suppresses entirely one’s keto-adaptation. This typically translates to somewhere between 15% and 25% of your daily energy intake coming from protein, that is, something between 90 and 150 grams per day. This is probably a good reference and already what we all used to eat before we ever started embarking on the diet.

Volek and Phinney say,

In short term studies, taking away dietary carbohydrate and replacing it with fat reduces our body's efficiency in using protein. Put another way, when you first take away dietary carbs, you need more protein to maintain muscle and other protein-containing tissues. But when you observe a human over a number of weeks of adaptation to a low, carbohydrate diet most of this initial inefficiency in protein use goes away. Thus, once you are keto-adapted, your body's need for protein isn't much higher than during a "balanced diet".

If you eat lots of fats or drink lots of broth, you’ll find it hard to reach the amount of protein in the higher range and will tend to stay on the lower range.

Anyway, it can get very complicated. I think the bottom line is: let’s not get worked-up with detailed numbers. A rough estimation will do because even when you fast a day or two occasionally and, restrict carbs and don’t overexercise on fasting days, you can easily preserve muscle using the body’s tendency to retain protein stores in the short term. If you are eating plenty of fat, it is likely that the protein you consume will go first toward the repair or building of cells or enzymes. On the other hand, if you have a high protein intake one day, it will convert to glucose and if you are carb restricted or having no carbs at all, then it is not a big issue at all, especially if you do resistance training.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

For those who haven't had a chance to read the Mitochondrial Energetics and Therapeutics paper, here is a synthesis from the paper. It still reads too technical, but good highlights nonetheless:

*Mitochondrial disorders are a heterogeneous group of multisystem diseases. They can result from mutations in hundreds of genes distributed across all of the chromosomes as well as the mitochondrial (mtDNA).

*Mitochondrial dysfunction is a common factor in a wide spectrum of metabolic and generative diseases, cancers, and aging.

*Progress is being made in developing genetic therapies for mitochondrial disease, although efforts to develop effective metabolic and pharmacological therapies have been surprisingly disappointing. A primary reason for difficulties in developing metabolic and pharmacological therapies is our lack of understanding of the complex bioenergetic and redox networks of the mitochondrion and the cell.

“Mitochondrial dysfunction has been linked to a wide range of modern age degenerative and metabolic diseases, cancer, and aging. All these clinical manifestations arise from the central role that energy sources have in our cells. Modern day therapies have been inadequate (to say the least) to solve disease. This failure results from the limited appreciation of the role of energetic sources in the cell as the interface between the environment and the cell. A systems approach, which, ironically, was first successfully applied over 80 years ago with the introduction of the ketogenic diet, is required. Analysis of the many ways that a shift from carbohydrate metabolism to a fat and ketone metabolism may modulate metabolism, signal transduction pathways, and the epigenome gives us an appreciation of the ketogenic diet and the potential for bioenergetic therapeutics.

“At present, our knowledge of energetic diseases stems from the past 20 years of studies on mitochondrial bioenergetics and diseases. Mitochondrial diseases are heterogeneous and often multisystemic. Because the mitochondrion provides much of the energy for the cell, mitochondrial disorders preferentially affect tissues with high-energy demands such as the brain, muscle, heart, and endocrine system, although any organ can be affected. Thus, energetic defects have been implicated in forms of blindness, deafness, movement disorders, dementias, cardiomyopathy, myopathy, renal dysfunction, and aging. Moreover, because the mitochondria lie at the interface between environmental calories and organ energetic demands, the mitochondrion is the likely mediator of the common metabolic disorders. As a consequence, mitochondrial dysfunction is probably central to diabetes, obesity, cardiovascular disease, and cancer.

“Although mitochondrial diseases had been assumed to be rare, epidemiological studies have concluded that the frequency of mtDNA diseases alone is on the order of 1 in 5000, and known pathogenic mtDNA mutations have been detected in the cord blood of 1 in 200 live births. Furthermore,nuclear DNA (nDNA) mutations affecting mitochondrial genes may be even more common than mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA) mutations. Thus, the genetic burden of energy dysfunction is likely to be enormous. Because the mitochondria are believed to generate the majority of our energy, understanding the pathophysiology of rare and common mitochondrial diseases and the development of energetic therapies must start with the mitochondrion.

“Each mammalian cell contains hundreds of mitochondria and thousands of mtDNA. When a mu-tation arises in a mtDNA, it creates a mixed population of normal and mutant mtDNAs [...] As the percentage of mutant mtDNAs increases, mitochondrial energetic function declines. When energy output is insufficient for normal tissue function, a threshold is crossed, symptoms appear, and apoptosis or necrosis [cell death] may be initiated.

“Current pharmacological or metabolic therapeutics have focused on increasing mitochondrial ATP [energy] production, reducing the mitochondrial reactive oxygen species (ROS) [inflammatory end products] produced, modifying Ca2+ uptake and toxicity, stabilizing the mitochondrial permeability transition pore (mtPTP), and inducing mitochondrial biogenesis.

“Ironically, one of the oldest therapeutic approaches—fasting and the ketogenic diet— remains the most promising treatment for mitochondrial defects. Hence, understanding the manifold potential actions of fasting and the ketogenic diet may point the way toward more comprehensive mitochondrial therapies.

“several of the affected pathways appear to be activated by the ketogenic diet. Therefore, in acquiring an understanding of the mechanisms of action of the ketogenic diet, we could obtain insights into how to design a more systematic approach to treating bioenergetic disease.

“Since the 1920s, fasting and the ketogenic diet have been known to be one of the most effective approaches for treatment of intractable seizures in children. Ketone bodies (beta-hydroxybutyrate and acetoacetate) are generated by the liver during fasting by beta oxidation of fatty acids [burning of fat]. Generally, the brain uses glucose as its main energy source, with a ratio of glucose to ketones of approximately 97:3. However, during short-term fasting this ratio can shift to ~70:30, and during starvation it can shift to ~30:70. Caloric restriction has also been shown to prolong life span in several organisms in association with reduced oxidative stress and increased antioxidant enzymes. This is the result of shifting metabolism from a more glucose-based glycolytic metabolism [carbohydrate metabolism] to a more fatty acid oxidation–based [fat burning metabolism] mitochondrial metabolism.

“In addition to preventing seizures in children, ketone treatment in adults has been found to (a) prevent symptoms of experimental hypoglycemia, including anxiety, fainting, hunger, irritability, and tremor, and (b) inhibit astrocytoma tumor [brain tumor] growth and vascularization. Beta-hydroxybutyrate also protects cultured mesencephalic neurons from MPP+ (1-methyl-4-phenylpyridinium) toxicity and hippocampal neurons from amyloid beta 42 toxicity.

“In addition to enhancing GABA production, the increased acetyl-CoA generated from betahy-droxybutyrate and acetoacetate [ketone bodies] also drives the tricarboxylic acid cycle [the Krebs cycle, to generate energy]. This increases mitochondrial reduced nicotinamide adenine nucleotide (NADH) [...] Because beta-hydroxybutyrate is more energy rich than pyruvate (the former has a 31% high caloric density per C2 unit), it produces more ATP. Moreover, in the heart, ketone metabolism increases the acetyl-CoA content 9- to 18-fold and citrate levels two- to fivefold; decreases succinate, oxaloacetate, and aspartate two- to threefold; increases the reduction status of NAD+ together with the oxidation status of CoQ; and increases heart hydraulic efficiency by 25% relative to pyruvate. [...] In the hippocampus, the ketogenic diet also results in the coordinated induction of energy metabolism gene transcripts, inducing 33 of the 34 energy metabolism genes (including 21 genes involved in oxidative phosphorylation) and 39 of the 42 genes encoding mitochondrial proteins. A ketogenic diet also results in a 46% increase in the mitochondrial density in the hippocampus of animals and increases the phosphocreatine-to-creatine ratio.

“Ketones have also been reported to reduce cellular and mitochondrial oxidative stress, to in-crease antioxidant scavenging molecules, and to stabilize the mitochondrial permeability transition pore (mtPTP). Studies on cultured rat neonatal cortical neurons revealed that beta-hydroxybutyrate and acetoacetate prevented neuronal cell death induced by glutamate. Ketones also significantly reduced mitochondrial production of reactive oxygen species (ROS) and associated cytotoxic effects in association with increased electron transport chain oxidation of NADH. Rats maintained on a ketogenic diet were found to have a twofold increase in hippocampal mitochondrial reduced glutathione levels[...] Mitochondria purified from the hippocampus of ketogenic diet–fed rats also showed a reduction in hydrogen peroxide production and were resistant to the hydrogen peroxide-induced mtDNA damage.

“Rat neocortical brain slices and neurons exposed to hydrogen peroxide showed protection against electrophysiological changes, loss of cell viability, and quenching of DCF (2′,7′-dichlorofluorescin) fluorescence when incubated with beta-hydroxybutyrate and acetoacetate, which were also protective against diamide thiol oxidation–induced electrophysiological changes and neuronal cell death. Ketones also directly increased the Ca2+ threshold of the mtPTP. [...] Therefore, ketone bodies reduce mitochondrial ROS production, increase antioxidant defenses, and stabilize the mtPTP.

“The reduction in mitochondrial ROS production and the stabilization of the mtPTP could also arise from increased mitochondrial oxidative phosphorylation [energetic output]. [...] The increased reduced glutathione/oxidized glutathione ratio could be the result of increased mitochondrial NADPH levels [...] Similarly, the antioxidant defenses in the cytosol [cell soup]could be enhanced by the export of the excess mitochondrial citrate into the cytosol, where it can be cleaved by ATP-citrate lyase into oxaloacetate and acetyl-CoA. The oxaloacetate could then be reduced by malate dehydrogenase, and the malate could be oxidized to pyruvate by malic enzyme, thereby reducing NADP+ to NADPH. The increased cytosolic NADPH could then reduce the cytosolic oxidized glutathione to reduced glutathione.

“The induction of mitochondrial bioenergetic genes could be explained by the increased generation of cytosolic acetyl-CoA produced from the mitochondrial citrate cleaved by ATP-citrate lyase. Elevated acetyl-CoA could then drive nuclear histone acetyltransferases to acetylate histones. This process would open the chromatin and increase the expression of the nDNA-encoded mitochondrial genes [...] [epigenetic changes]

“These speculations suggest that the ketogenic diet may act at multiple levels: It may decrease excitatory neuronal activity, increase the expression of bioenergetic genes, increase mitochon-drial biogenesis and oxidative energy production, and increase mitochondrial NADPH produc-tion, thus decreasing mitochondrial oxidative stress.

“Although it is becoming increasingly clear that mitochondrial dysfunction is a common factor in a wide range of complex diseases, effective therapeutic interventions are still not readily available. New approaches for genetic therapies for nDNA-encoded mitochondrial diseases as well as for mtDNA diseases are beginning to offer alternatives for individuals suffering from these devastating disorders. However, these approaches are not as likely to relieve the devastating symptoms suffered by individuals with bioenergetic diseases. Current metabolic interventions have been consistently disappointing, but new insights into the integrated energetic network of the cell are providing fresh insight into the mode of action of the older therapeutic approaches, such as fasting and the ketogenic diet, and suggesting more integrated approaches for restoring cellular energetics to homeostasis.

So we have seen that a big issue in autism spectrum disorders, but also Parkinson's and ADHD spectrum disorders is mitochondrial dysfunction. But how many chronic and autoimmune diseases have an energy deficit component? ALL of them!! Mitochondria are very sensitive to environmental stress, and if there is no energy output in brain cell mitochondria, there would be no energy output for paying full attention or using your full cognitive functions. Same could apply for the rest of the body. Other than the known factors involved: gluten, sugar, mercury, deficiencies in zinc, vit D, omega 3s and so forth, latent infections from evil bugs is also a key component in mitochondrial dysfunction. There is also a strong genetic component as different populations around the world are predisposed to different diseases which can be tracked down to mitochondrial DNA.

Mark Hyman wrote about it in The Ultra Mind Solution. Not much can be done about the evil bugs except do the diet and do not eat plant-based foods with evil lectins that behave like viruses. Remember that most, if not all of your "junk" DNA has viral-like properties and if a pathogenic virus takes hold of our DNA or RNA, it could lead to disease or cancer.

Mitochondria are not only essential for energy output, but may also play an important role in organ regeneration and the creating of new bodies itself. There are some guys who wrote an article about it 3 years ago. They said that new research is starting to elucidate the key role of our mitochondria in the regulation of the cell cycle – the vital process by which a single-celled fertilized egg develops into a mature organism, as well as the process by which hair, skin, blood cells, and some internal organs are renewed. In the complicated and highly choreographed events surrounding cell-cycle progression, mitochondria are not simple bystanders merely producing energy but instead are full-fledged participants. Given the significant amount of energy needed to make all the nutrients required for cell division, it makes sense that some coordination existed. This long ignored and overlooked connection between the mitochondria and the cell cycle is something that is worthy of considerable more attention and it has been overlooked until recently. The article is availabe for free here:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2715508/

The ketogenic diet does seem to be very important in more ways than one if it cranks up our mitochondria in a positive way. And it does.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Wow Psyche, thank you so much for sharing!

Psyche said:
Remember that most, if not all of your "junk" DNA has viral-like properties and if a pathogenic virus takes hold of our DNA or RNA, it could lead to disease or cancer.

The herpes simplex virus (which I think what it is) in my right eye does exactly that. Here's an article on it: Herpes simplex virus eliminates host mitochondrial DNA

Mitochondria have crucial roles in the life and death of mammalian cells, and help to orchestrate host antiviral defences. Here, we show that the ubiquitous human pathogen herpes simplex virus (HSV) induces rapid and complete degradation of host mitochondrial DNA during productive infection of cultured mammalian cells. The depletion of mitochondrial DNA requires the viral UL12 gene, which encodes a conserved nuclease with orthologues in all herpesviruses. We show that an amino-terminally truncated UL12 isoform—UL12.5—localizes to mitochondria and triggers mitochondrial DNA depletion in the absence of other HSV gene products. By contrast, full-length UL12, a nuclear protein, has little or no effect on mitochondrial DNA levels. Our data document that HSV inflicts massive genetic damage to a crucial host organelle and show a novel mechanism of virus-induced shutoff of host functions, which is likely to contribute to the cell death and tissue damage caused by this widespread human pathogen.

Now with the ketogenic diet, I am seeing small changes, however I'm going to wait it out until I have my eye checked by the eyedoc at the hospital, and hopefully I'll be able to bring any pictures of the progress with me. One thing I have noticed is that my eye can take on more stress than before. I also can see things in the distance better. I'm just going to have to continue to be careful and take care of it, so it won't get worse, but so far it's going well.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Oxajil said:
Now with the ketogenic diet, I am seeing small changes, however I'm going to wait it out until I have my eye checked by the eyedoc at the hospital, and hopefully I'll be able to bring any pictures of the progress with me. One thing I have noticed is that my eye can take on more stress than before. I also can see things in the distance better. I'm just going to have to continue to be careful and take care of it, so it won't get worse, but so far it's going well.

That is a very important paper, IMO. As it says, it is a widespread human pathogen and it goes right after our mitochondrial DNA. Evil! Right there could be the trigger of autoimmune diseases and other conditions.

I'm glad your eye is getting better. Herpes is so incredibly problematical in the eye, that if the diet helps to deal with this virus by say stabilizing mitochondrial DNA, then the implications are far-ranging for other bugs and other mutations. Or so it seems to me.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Oxajil said:
The herpes simplex virus (which I think what it is) in my right eye does exactly that. Here's an article on it: Herpes simplex virus eliminates host mitochondrial DNA

Yeap, look at what they say:

Herpes simplex virus (HSV) is a ubiquitous viral pathogen capable of both productive and latent infections in its human host.[...]

In addition, these data raise the possibility that HSV or other herpesviruses might contribute to somatic mt DNA damage or loss—conditions that have been linked to a increasing list of progressive degenerative diseases in humans [...]

Mitochondria have key roles in orchestrating cellular antiviral defences, ... in addition to their crucial respiratory function.
[...]

Mt DNA depletion has been linked to a wide range of inherited and acquired degenerative disorders in humans, illustrating the profound impact of impaired mitochondrial function in vivo.[...]

HSV establishes latency in sensory neurons, a type of cell that is highly sensitive to the pathological effects of mt DNA damage[...]

Evil bugs as a cause of mitochondrial dysfunction and leading to all kinds of diseases. The ketogenic diet looks increasingly better every day.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Alzheimer's disease is the one condition where a ketogenic diet has a profound positive effect. And as it happens, some speculate that a latent viral infection is driving the brain cell loss in neurodegenerative diseases such as Alzheimer's disease (AD). It has to do with herpes virus including citomegalovirus, Epstein-Barr virus which we ALL have. If this viruses go after our mitochondrial DNA, then they can cause neurodegenartive diseases by mitochondrial dysfunction. Meaning that the ketogenic diet is the one thing that would help stabilize mDNA since mitochondria runs the best on fat fuel. Here is the relevant paper:

Alzheimer's disease gene signature says: beware of brain viral infections

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3019140/

The genetic signature [in Alzheimer's disease - AD] here discussed is suggestive of individual susceptibility to pathogen infection of the brain, particularly Herpes Simplex Virus and related viruses. [...]

These independent findings appear to reinforce the new notion that individual brain susceptibility to virus infection and/or reactivation may be one complex genetic trait influencing the risk of neurodegeneration leading to clinical AD in old age. [...]

Reactivation of HSV-1 in the brain was also found in patients with familial AD who showed increased viral DNA and protein expression in cortical neurons [24]. HSV-1 has been also related to Down's syndrome, a condition at high risk for AD type dementia [25]. It is of interest that mothers of children with Down's syndrome showed increased serum HSV-2 antibody levels [26]. Viruses of the HSV family are among the most probable pathogen candidates for brain reactivation in old age, since their possess a well known ability to escape peripheral immune responses by invading neurons. It is of interest that during aging a substantial proportion of peripheral CD8 T cytotoxic cells [immune cells] have been found to be directed against Epstein-Barr virus (EBV) and cytomegalovirus (CMV), which belong to the HSV family. Moreover, it has been suggested that aged immune system is no longer able to control EBV or CMV reactivation [27] and virus infection might become chronic in a large proportion of the elderly. Therefore, we speculate that with advancing age an impaired immune system might facilitate virus reactivation in the brain, especially in those subjects showing the above suggested genetic signature. Latent or chronic viral infection by CMV has been indeed found to correlate with the rate of cognitive decline in the Sacramento Area Latino Study on Aging [28]. Another study, focused on elderly with cardiovascular disease, showed that HSV and CMV burden was associated with cognitive impairment [29].[...]

In conclusion, present findings suggest that during ageing virus reactivation may be more frequent in the elderly showing a genetic signature predisposing to an increased susceptibility for HSV and other virus infections of the brain. In these subjects the microorganisms are more likely to induce a limited, segmental and chronic sub-clinical pseudo-encephalitis resulting in progressive neurodegeneration.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Psyche said:
That is a very important paper, IMO. As it says, it is a widespread human pathogen and it goes right after our mitochondrial DNA. Evil! Right there could be the trigger of autoimmune diseases and other conditions.

I wonder if that is the reason why some alternative health care providers have found it useful to use ozone therapy in autoimmune diseases, but also Parkinson's, Alzheimer's and other degenerative diseases including cancer. Ozone therapy is supposed to kill bugs, i.e. viruses. Says here:

With viruses, the [ozone] damages the viral capsid and upsets the reproductive cycle by disrupting the virus-to-cell contact with peroxidation. The weak enzyme coatings on cells which make them vulnerable to invasion by viruses make them susceptible to oxidation and elimination from the body, which then replaces them with healthy cells.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Psyche said:
That is a very important paper, IMO. As it says, it is a widespread human pathogen and it goes right after our mitochondrial DNA. Evil! Right there could be the trigger of autoimmune diseases and other conditions.

I'm glad your eye is getting better. Herpes is so incredibly problematical in the eye, that if the diet helps to deal with this virus by say stabilizing mitochondrial DNA, then the implications are far-ranging for other bugs and other mutations. Or so it seems to me.

Thanks Psyche, that gives me hope. Yes it is pretty evil, and I remember back in the days when I ate something with gluten in it, it felt like the inflammation caused by gluten gave an enormous boost to the virus' activity; my vision became totally blurred within seconds, and it was a bit painful too. Perhaps the intake of grains or other inflammatory foods accelerate the destructive activities of viruses. Needless to say, I never touched gluten since!

Here is an interesting blog article in which the author shares her thoughts on the role of gluten and the herpes virus: _http://www.zombieinstitute.net/General.htm

She writes (fwiw):

[...] If those nerve cells are infected with a herpes virus, they produce receptors which capture [gluten] antibodies and suck them into the cell where they can clog things up easily.

In addition:

This is a Class level interaction. Several gluten antibodies seem to be capable of binding to synapsin, and all three alpha-herpes viruses can catalyze the reaction.

The combination of antibodies and viruses you have determines not only which cells are affected but how fast your rate of degeneration is.

It is also cumulative. The effects are further compounded by the aggregation of damage over time.

Here's my current model:

Parkinson's disease is IgG gluten antibodies and Herpes 1. Herpes starts in the cells of the mouth and travels backwards through the neurons to the brainstem to the dopamine cells in the substantia nigra. Also from the stomach to the vagus nerve and from the intestines directly to the orexin cells in the hypothalamus. The gluten antibodies infiltrate and kill the cells at a slow but steady rate.

Lewy Body Dementia usually appears later than PD and damages the cortex. I suspect this is due to better viral immunity and lower levels of gluten antibodies. These people probably get a case of encephalitis when first infected. This affects the cortex and stimulates a strong immune response. The viruses are well suppressed and don't travel far, the antibodies aren't overwhelming, and the cells accumulate Lewy bodies very slowly.

Narcolepsy is similar to PD, a combination of antibodies and HSV1, but everything is more vigorous. There is lower viral immunity and higher levels of antibodies. The orexin cells are more active in these people so they are affected more strongly and die sooner. Over time this results in extra sensitive glucose sensors and panic reactions.

Multiple Sclerosis is caused by HSV3 and antigliadin in the motor neurons of the brain. It requires another pathogen though, probably a virus that invades the oligodendrocytes and strips the myelin off the neurons, and then the varicella and antibodies that infiltrate the neuron while it's stripped. The damage accumulates as the viruses activate and go latent - thus the recurring symptoms and remissions.

Fibromyalgia is also HSV3, but in the peripheral spinal nerves. It probably also involves orexin system dysfunction.

Obesity and Diabetes are caused indirectly by orexin neurotransmitter deficits and possibly by direct action by the antibodies. Pancreatic cells are also dependent on Synapsin to release insulin from the cell.

Multiple System Atrophy is a rare disease where Lewy Bodies form in the astrocytes that surround the neurons. It's possible that this pathology is caused by some entirely different process, but astrocytes do contain synapsin. I'm guessing right now that those people have a virus or gene variant that makes their astrocytes more susceptible. Still looking for it.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Hi Psyche! Good to hear from you :)

Psyche said:
Perhaps it isn't a good idea to exceed roughly 25g of actual protein in a meal since this has been estimated to be the mTOR-stimulating threshold by Rosedale and pals.
[quote author=Psyche]
They report on their own studies and those of many others to conclude that resistance training is a potent stimulus to protect lean body mass in men consuming a low carb ketogenic diet and allowing for better insulin and leptin signaling. They recommend between 1.5 and 2.0 gram per day per kg of reference or ideal weight. They say that higher intakes reduce or suppresses entirely one’s keto-adaptation. This typically translates to somewhere between 15% and 25% of your daily energy intake coming from protein, that is, something between 90 and 150 grams per day. This is probably a good reference and already what we all used to eat before we ever started embarking on the diet. [/quote]

It seems we have to either choose to go with what Rosedale is saying OR what V&P are saying. If we're keeping our protein to 25 grams per meal, for anyone eating three meals per day that's 75 grams of protein per day. That's the ideal for someone who is 75 kg assuming 1 gram of protein per kilo. Going down to 0.8 g/kg of protein, as Nora and Rosedale advise, a 75 kilo person wouldn't want to go over 60 grams of protein.

BUT, Volek and Phinney say 1.5 to 2 g/kg of protein per day. That would mean that same 75 kg person would be eating 112.5 to 150 grams of protein per day. To keep it down below 25 grams per meal would mean this person would need to eat 5 to 7 meals per day!

So it seems like we're either keeping our protein below 25 grams per meal OR we're going as high as 1.5g/kg/day. Unless a person is very light, I don't see how you could do both. Even a 60 kilo person (132 pounds) would go over the 25 g per meal limit if they went as high as 1.5g/kg/day, assuming 3 meals per day (60*1.5=90/3= 30g of protein per meal).

[quote author=Psyche]
Anyway, it can get very complicated. I think the bottom line is: let’s not get worked-up with detailed numbers.
[/quote]

I think you're right, and I'm trying not to be rigid in my thinking here. The way I see it, if we can get the numbers approximately right, get a good feel for how much protein we should be getting per meal, then we can forget about the numbers and never think about them again :). I don't want to confuse anyone, but for me at least, I find it helpful to use the numbers as a guide to figure out the ideal and then wing it from there.

But the issue is whether to go with Rosedale or Volek and Phinney. When I fasted and started protein restricting last week, I felt an energy surge that lasted for about a day. Now, it might just have been a cortisol release (stress response) because my body thought it was starving, but it may have been my body jumping into fat burning. That would indicate I wasn't in fat burning mode previous to that, even though I'd been essentially zero carb for over a year and I estimate I was eating 150 grams or so of protein per day (although that obviously depended on the day).

My point is that I feel like I was already doing what V&P recommend, although it was probably the higher end of their recommendations. So I'm more inclined to go with what Rosedale is saying to ensure that I'm actually in ketosis and am engaged in a certain degree of protein restriction to suppress mTOR and insulin. Or at least go a happy medium between the two camps and do 1g/kg/day, which just happens to be 25g of protein per meal for me (how convenient!). The fact is, my breakfast is usually 6 pieces of bacon with extra lard (my coworkers nearly pooped their pants when I told them that the other day!), so I'm only getting about 12 grams of protein at that meal anyway. It's just a matter of keeping my other meals down below 25g and I'm set :)

Anyway, I know there were a lot of numbers in that post, and as I said, I'm really not trying to confuse anyone so let me know if any parts of my reasoning need clarification.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

dugdeep said:
...But the issue is whether to go with Rosedale or Volek and Phinney...

This is why I like to learn as much as I can about the basic science. But I also use other inputs. In particular, I have been listening and viewing the various "personalities" when an opportunity arises. In Rosedale I see a potential fellow Aspie, complete with "obsession" issues. He's smart, but he may have issues with obsession and rigid thinking. So I am inclined to be cautious about his claims, and to look for further supporting evidence. One Rosedale claim that seems to bother a lot of people is that "we are all diabetic."

None of these three are "paleo/primal" per se, although they are all low-carbers. You wouldn't want to eat some of the items in the Rosedale diet. But we can learn from all of them, and that seems to be what Nora was doing in citing Rosedale & Phinney in PBPM.

I found it interesting that Phinney, in his "Ask the Low Carb Experts" appearance last Thursday, emphasized the need for dietary consistency. My experience is pointing in a different direction, to a possible need for at least occasional disruptions of the routine. My tendency is to become tightly locked in to my routines, and that may be part of why my weight loss stalled for some months (the subject of Phinney's show).

All of us tend to learn "rules" that we then want to avoid violating, but I am finding that sometimes you really need to stir things up, to make progress after you stall. There are precedents elsewhere -- like tossing comets at the Earth from time to time to make things more interesting. I am not advocating doing anything stupid, but if you know what you are doing then you can break the rules occasionally just to see what happens. It might not be what the rule says will happen.

One last comment. Our distant ancestors did not, and all the other remaining species on earth do not rely upon scientific research as a guide to nutrition. I believe that we still have built-in ability to find our way, although we need help from transmitted information -- traditions -- to avoid repeating things that lead to fatal or otherwise really bad outcomes. So while we are sifting through all this scientific evidence I think it is also a good idea to look within, to see what else we might have to work with.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

dugdeep said:
Hi Psyche! Good to hear from you :)

:)


dugdeep said:
BUT, Volek and Phinney say 1.5 to 2 g/kg of protein per day. That would mean that same 75 kg person would be eating 112.5 to 150 grams of protein per day. To keep it down below 25 grams per meal would mean this person would need to eat 5 to 7 meals per day!

That doesn't sound very ketogenic to me. A bigger person should have the right to eat more. Perhaps Rosedale is particularly attached to mTOR pathway since he has researched it so much. Then he gets particularly restrictive on protein. At least we have the reassurance of other research where ketosis was maintained with higher intakes, around 1.5.

I eyeball it. When I'm satisfied I'm done, and I leave the rest for later. My meat cuts are very fatty and I'm certainly eating more fish now that we know that if fish contains more selenium than mercury it is safe and all of them do except for whale, shark, swordfish, marlin, tarpon. Not exactly what people have in mind when they go to get some fish for dinner ;) My brain says it likes tuna a lot.

Anyway, I know there were a lot of numbers in that post, and as I said, I'm really not trying to confuse anyone so let me know if any parts of my reasoning need clarification.

Oh no, I thought it was cool. I was just trying to figure out what would constitute practical advice for the average person. Most people don't want anything to do with calculations. Perhaps a picture of a fatty pork chop will do with around 25g of protein and a measurement reference so there would be no confusion. Rough calculations can be according to body weight, and people can add or take depending on their ideal weight.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

One thing I'd like to ask: If your personal weight
changes while going through the diet, should one
recalculate the ratio? Seems like a no-brainer, but
I just needed to ask! :-[
 

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