Ketogenic Diet - Powerful Dietary Strategy for Certain Conditions

Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Gertrudes said:
Another thing to consider is that apparently the ketones shown on the ketostix when you first enter ketosis won't be the the same type of ketones your body will end up using when fully adapted. I tried to dig up the relevant quotes from the Life without bread thread, but haven't yet manage to find them. I will keep digging though.

In any case, and if I remember correctly, it should work more or less like this: as you first enter ketosis you produce a certain type of ketones which are the ones accused in your ketostix. As your body becomes increasingly adapted to being in a state of ketosis, not only will it use ketones more efficiently, therefore less waist in urine, but it will also convert those initial ketones into a different type, and these later ketones won't show on your ketostix since the test isn't prepared to sense them. In short, a body fully accustomed to being in ketosis will stop accusing ketones on the ketostix.

[...]

I have been in ketosis for well over a year and initially I accused strong levels of ketones, this has gradually faded until I could barely distinguish the difference in colour between being in mild ketosis or no ketosis at all, so my experience seems to confirm the above.

I had forgotten all about this little detail. I didn't really understand it before, but now it makes much more sense.

Perhaps the shift occurs slowly over time, as interior remodeling nears completion. Then again, there do seem to be a number of other factors that can contribute to low ketone levels in the urine.

I guess we'll find out as more of us carry on with KD experiment!
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Laura said:
I drink a cup of mint tea every night, too.

From reading, it seems that "mint" is a generic name and there are many different variations (spearmint, peppermint, etc.). I prefer the peppermint, so I don't suppose one is any better than the other?
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Megan said:
That's about all I know at this point, apart from the fact that my gut bacteria have been able to adapt to any level of carb intake right down to more or less zero, and that some of them are still fermenting up a storm even though I am hardly producing any stool, resulting in the usual gas, gurgling, and gas pain. It eases when I have a bowel movement, but eating so little vegetable material prolongs the time between those, and seems to make matters worse.

I suppose you tried HCl, digestive enzymes and/or the sluggish liver protocol? Sometimes I get the impression that you have a lack of stomach acidity or not enough digestive enzymes. Like having a slow digestive system.

I used to get bloated all the time and still do if I eat more than my fair share. But resistance training and intermittent fasting seems to be the ticket to reset my digestive system.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Thank you Psyche for the information! ALA just arrived today and I'll be doing some experimenting with that and see how it goes. Also thank you monotonic for sharing that, I have noticed that bone broth makes a great boost. Having read about how it can affect angiogenesis, I may eat/drink more of it!
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Mrs. Peel said:
Laura said:
I drink a cup of mint tea every night, too.

From reading, it seems that "mint" is a generic name and there are many different variations (spearmint, peppermint, etc.). I prefer the peppermint, so I don't suppose one is any better than the other?
The two plants have distinct tastes, with spearmint's coming mainly from a compound called carvone, which is relatively light and sweet in flavor.

Peppermint owes most of its taste to another substance, menthol, which has a mild anesthetic and cooling effect, making it especially valuable in medicines. Peppermint oil can also be topically applied to help ease tension headaches, can be consumed to help ease altitude sickness, and can act as a decongestant.

Spearmint oil is of some use in repelling mosquitoes and is often used for its taste rather than for its medical properties, although it can reduce gastric gas.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Speaking of mint, I've recently been making home made mint (peppermint, since we're being specific :) ) gello from the grass fed gelatin I mentioned earlier, with a little bit of stevia, and it's really good! I also add some salt (Real Salt brand) and it's jiggly and refreshing and also seems to be helping my digestion (which is still not perfect with reflux happening at times to varying degrees). I tried making some mint chocolate gello and it turned out ok--though the chocolate mostly sank to the bottom (this was 100% baking chocolate with cocoa fat). Maybe cocoa powder would do better, but it's also not high on my list of things to invest time and energy in and definitely want to avoid anything that causes me any reflux.

I also started some weight lifting yesterday and it was nice to get back into it (I lifted through most of high school and one college semester), though my body is still hurting. I took some bone broth shortly after it, but was thinking about protein a lot before going to bed so I think I went a little too light on the protein in that bowl. The diarrhea I had for about a week to a week and a half seems to have calmed down for now as well and I'm hoping I'm on the upswing with integrating the high intensity weight lifting with the bone broth and lots of gelatin. I take about two bowls of bone broth a day and had some eggs the other day as I was really craving them and wanted a bit of a break from the one-meal diet, but still am not sure about them (except about them being tasty). I'm looking forward to more weight lifting and I think the results will be rapid and significant based on other reports and my own past experience, but we'll see how it shapes up.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Foxx said:
Speaking of mint, I've recently been making home made mint (peppermint, since we're being specific :) ) gello from the grass fed gelatin I mentioned earlier, with a little bit of stevia, and it's really good! I also add some salt (Real Salt brand) and it's jiggly and refreshing and also seems to be helping my digestion (which is still not perfect with reflux happening at times to varying degrees). I tried making some mint chocolate gello and it turned out ok--though the chocolate mostly sank to the bottom (this was 100% baking chocolate with cocoa fat). Maybe cocoa powder would do better, but it's also not high on my list of things to invest time and energy in and definitely want to avoid anything that causes me any reflux.
Your experiment reminded me of an idea I've been tossing around. I was wondering if the bone broth itself couldn't be used by itself as gelatin in desserts and whether it would taste good. Perhaps if it were made without salt and then some cocoa and stevia were added, it might come out alright when served cold.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Laura said:
...I found that having any carbs at all just kept the critters alive so it is way better to go zero for a few weeks and get past it. Yeah, your movements will back off to about once every few days, or even less, but if you feel uncomfortable, you can have a plain salt-water enema.

Yesterday morning I suddenly came down with a cold, complete with a sinus headache that lasted all night. This is unusual, especially the headache, and is the second cold this year, although I am not going to give it too much weight just yet. For the first two years or so of going wheat-free (and eventually grain-free) I didn't come down with anything.

I am staying very low on carbs (I don't want to have to readapt), but not zero at the moment. I will go back down there when I feel well again. The cold really clobbered me.

...It may be that not doing the resistance part of the protocol is enabling all this to persist. Since that is the method to activate the "wild mtDNA" that is supposed to get in there and "clean house" and do the transformations.

That's what I am thinking too. I am ready to start, although I don't think it would be a good idea while I am feeling this weak.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Psyche said:
Megan said:
That's about all I know at this point, apart from the fact that my gut bacteria have been able to adapt to any level of carb intake right down to more or less zero, and that some of them are still fermenting up a storm even though I am hardly producing any stool, resulting in the usual gas, gurgling, and gas pain. It eases when I have a bowel movement, but eating so little vegetable material prolongs the time between those, and seems to make matters worse.

I suppose you tried HCl, digestive enzymes and/or the sluggish liver protocol? Sometimes I get the impression that you have a lack of stomach acidity or not enough digestive enzymes. Like having a slow digestive system.

I used to get bloated all the time and still do if I eat more than my fair share. But resistance training and intermittent fasting seems to be the ticket to reset my digestive system.

I used all those things when I was first adapting, last summer. That was a different "gurgle," higher up. The symptoms now seem to be coming from my colon.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Megan said:
Laura said:
...It may be that not doing the resistance part of the protocol is enabling all this to persist. Since that is the method to activate the "wild mtDNA" that is supposed to get in there and "clean house" and do the transformations.

That's what I am thinking too. I am ready to start, although I don't think it would be a good idea while I am feeling this weak.

The General Law comes to mind.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

I've been on ketogenic diet for 6 weeks now. I have much more energy and i've noticed that my sleeping routine has normalized for the first time in many years. I sleep 8 hours and wake up without alarm clock and that's really major improvement for me. I've been eating bone broth and liver pate every day but some days bit of veggies too. Daily carbs below 10g.
One thing that's been bugging me for a week now is eczema in my back. I've never had it before. I've oiled it with coconut oil and it's getting better but i've been thinking if i should show it to doctor :/
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Seppo Ilmarinen said:
I've been on ketogenic diet for 6 weeks now. I have much more energy and i've noticed that my sleeping routine has normalized for the first time in many years. I sleep 8 hours and wake up without alarm clock and that's really major improvement for me. I've been eating bone broth and liver pate every day but some days bit of veggies too. Daily carbs below 10g.
One thing that's been bugging me for a week now is eczema in my back. I've never had it before. I've oiled it with coconut oil and it's getting better but i've been thinking if i should show it to doctor :/

It could be a detoxing symptom. One thing is certain, when you get your liver up and running on meat and fat, the body starts clearing out. I've had a few odd skin symptoms too. I'm just going to wait them out.
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Megan said:
I used all those things when I was first adapting, last summer. That was a different "gurgle," higher up. The symptoms now seem to be coming from my colon.

Prolly 'cause you're not at zero. You really do have to go zero for a few weeks to kill the buggers off and then you have to be darned careful not to re-introduce them for awhile. And I can tell you, if you give them a lettuce leaf once a day, they will hang on...
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

Laura said:
Seppo Ilmarinen said:
I've been on ketogenic diet for 6 weeks now. I have much more energy and i've noticed that my sleeping routine has normalized for the first time in many years. I sleep 8 hours and wake up without alarm clock and that's really major improvement for me. I've been eating bone broth and liver pate every day but some days bit of veggies too. Daily carbs below 10g.
One thing that's been bugging me for a week now is eczema in my back. I've never had it before. I've oiled it with coconut oil and it's getting better but i've been thinking if i should show it to doctor :/

It could be a detoxing symptom. One thing is certain, when you get your liver up and running on meat and fat, the body starts clearing out. I've had a few odd skin symptoms too. I'm just going to wait them out.

Thanks, that's what i've also been thinking. I'll keep on following the situation!
 
Re: Ketogenic Diet - Path To Transformation?

An interesting item on SOTT that may or may not have implications vis a vis the Ketogenic Diet:

Nutrient in eggs and meat may influence gene expression from infancy to adulthood


Emily Boynton
University of Rochester Medical Center
Thu, 20 Sep 2012 01:43 CDT
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/251488-Nutrient-in-eggs-and-meat-may-influence-gene-expression-from-infancy-to-adulthood

Implications for wide range of disorders - - hypertension to mental health problems.

Just as women are advised to get plenty of folic acid around the time of conception and throughout early pregnancy, new research suggests another very similar nutrient may one day deserve a spot on the obstetrician's list of recommendations.

Consuming greater amounts of choline - a nutrient found in eggs and meat - during pregnancy may lower an infant's vulnerability to stress-related illnesses, such as mental health disturbances, and chronic conditions, like hypertension, later in life.

In an early study in The FASEB Journal, nutrition scientists and obstetricians at Cornell University and the University of Rochester Medical Center found that higher-than-normal amounts of choline in the diet during pregnancy changed epigenetic markers - modifications on our DNA that tell our genes to switch on or off, to go gangbusters or keep a low profile - in the fetus. While epigenetic markers don't change our genes, they make a permanent imprint by dictating their fate: If a gene is not expressed - turned on - it's as if it didn't exist.

The finding became particularly exciting when researchers discovered that the affected markers were those that regulated the hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal or HPA axis, which controls virtually all hormone activity in the body, including the production of the hormone cortisol that reflects our response to stress and regulates our metabolism, among other

More choline in the mother's diet led to a more stable HPA axis and consequently less cortisol in the fetus. As with many aspects of our health, stability is a very good thing: Past research has shown that early exposure to high levels of cortisol, often a result of a mother's anxiety or depression, can increase a baby's lifelong risk of stress-related and metabolic disorders.

"The study is important because it shows that a relatively simple nutrient can have significant effects in prenatal life, and that these effects likely continue to have a long-lasting influence on adult life," said Eva K. Pressman, M.D., study author and director of the high-risk pregnancy program at the University of Rochester Medical Center. "While our results won't change practice at this point, the idea that maternal choline intake could essentially change fetal genetic expression into adulthood is quite novel."

Pressman, who advises pregnant women every day, says choline isn't something people think a lot about because it is already present in many things we eat and there is usually no concern of choline deficiency. Though much more research has focused on folate - functionally very similar to choline and used to decrease the risk of neural tube defects like spina bifida - a few very compelling studies sparked her interest, including animal studies on the role of choline in mitigating fetal alcohol syndrome and changing outcomes in Down syndrome.

A long-time collaborator with researchers at Cornell, Pressman joined a team led by Marie Caudill, Ph.D., R.D., professor in the Division of Nutritional Sciences at Cornell, in studying 26 pregnant women in their third trimester who were assigned to take 480 mg per day, an amount slightly above the standard recommendation of 450 mg per day, or about double that amount, 930 mg per day. The choline was derived from the diet and from supplements and was consumed up until delivery.

The team found that higher maternal choline intake led to a greater amount of DNA methylation, a process in which methyl groups - one carbon atom linked to three hydrogen atoms - are added to our DNA. Choline is one of a handful of nutrients that provides methyl groups for this process. The addition of a single methyl group is all it takes to change an individual's epigenome.

Measurements of cord blood and samples from the placenta showed that increased choline, via the addition of methyl groups, altered epigenetic markers that govern cortisol-regulating genes. Higher choline lessened the expression of these genes, leading to 33 percent lower cortisol in the blood of babies whose mom's consumed 930 mg per day.

Study authors say the findings raise the exciting possibility that choline may be used therapeutically in cases where excess maternal stress from anxiety, depression or other prenatal conditions might make the fetal HPA axis more reactive and more likely to release greater-than-expected amounts of cortisol.

While more research is needed, Caudill says that her message to pregnant women would be to consume a diet that includes choline rich foods such as eggs, lean meat, beans and cruciferous vegetables like broccoli. For women who limit their consumption of animal products, which are richer sources of choline than plant foods, she adds that supplemental choline may be warranted as choline is generally absent in prenatal vitamin supplements.

"One day we might prescribe choline in the same way we prescribe folate to all pregnant women," notes Pressman, the James R. Woods Professor in the Department of Obstetrics and Gynecology. "It is cheap and has virtually no side effects at the doses provided in this study. In the future, we could use choline to do even more good than we are doing right now."

In addition to Pressman and Caudill, several scientists and clinicians from the Division of Nutritional Science and the Statistical Consulting Unit at Cornell and the Cayuga Medical Center in Ithaca, N. Y., participated in the research. The study was funded by the Egg Nutrition Center, the National Cattlemen's Beef Association, the Nebraska Beef Council, the U.S. Department of Agriculture and the President's Council of Cornell Women. The funding sources had no role in the study design, interpretation of the data, or publication of the results.
 

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