Malaysian Airlines Flight 17 Crashes in Ukraine

[Palinurus]

Source: _http://www.nltimes.nl/2016/01/13/mh17-families-call-on-pm-rutte-to-get-to-the-bottom-of-attack/

MH17 families call on PM Rutte to “get to the bottom” of attack

Posted on Jan 13, 2016 by Zack Newmark

A group of 18 families, frustrated by the Netherlands’ slow pace at investigating the crash of flight MH17, are calling on Prime Minister Mark Rutte to pressure Russia, Ukraine, and the United States into releasing raw radar images taken on the day of the crash. They are angered that Russia vetoed a proposal last July to try suspects in the MH17 explosion at the International Criminal Court, and that it will still take another six months before the Netherlands decides how to proceed with a prosecution, if any is to take place.

“Our question to you is, why are all these things taking so long, and why is there not more pressure applied to get to the bottom [of the case],” the families write in the letter, as published by RTL Nieuws. “Are you not of our position that the patience of all surviving family members are being so strongly tested?”

The families are especially angered at the apparent lack of influence the prime minister and the Dutch Safety Board have on Russia, Ukraine and the U.S. The three countries have not delivered any such images, despite their obligation to do so, the families claim.

“We believe that these radar images are extremely important for the investigation, and the truth,” the letter states. They find the Ukraine government’s excuse that civilian radar was unavailable that day as being implausible. They also find Russia’s claim that data related to the crash was not stored as “strange,” and unlikely.

They also cite a quote from US Secretary of State John Kerry as reason to believe the United States had images that could help investigators. “We saw the take-off. We saw the trajectory, we saw the hit. We saw this airplane disappear from the radar screens. So there is really no mystery about where it came from and where these weapons have come from.”

Kerry made his remarks on August 12, 2014, during the Australia-United States Ministerial Consultations, less than one month after the crash.

“We can not therefore accept that crucial information and data be withheld,” the letter states. “If we wait until the criminal investigation is completed, we fear that it is too late to claim this essential information in accordance with [International Civil Aviation Organization] rules,” the families say.

Malaysia Airlines MH17 left Schiphol Airport in Amsterdam for Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia. A Dutch Safety Board investigation concluded it was shot down with a Russian-made Buk 9M38M1 surface-to-air missile. The final report would not point fingers at either the Ukrainian army, Russian military, or Russian-backed Ukrainian separatists, and the report did not pinpoint the location from where the missile was fired, calling on criminal investigators to take on that responsibility.

All 283 passengers on the aircraft, and the 15 crew members, died in the incident. Of the victims, 193 were Dutch citizens.

 

[Palinurus]

Source: _http://www.nltimes.nl/2016/01/14/51038/

Dutch PM says he understands MH17 families’ frustrations

Posted on Jan 14, 2016 by Janene Pieters

Prime Minister Mark Rutte speaking to reporters after an emergency cabinet meeting
on the Paris Attacks. Nov. 14, 2015 (photo: Rijksoverheid)

Prime Minister Mark Rutte understands that the relatives of flight MH17 victims are frustrated that the criminal investigation into the disaster is taking so long, he said in response to a letter the relatives sent him calling for more effort to get hold of radar images of the plane crash, the Telegraaf reports.

“I understand very well what the families write. The criminal investigation requires much time and thus much patience from them. We continue to do our utmost to ensure that the culprits will not go unpunished. It is difficult, but in this phase my responsibility lies in being hesitant”, the Prime Minister said on Wednesday, according to the newspaper.

“The tension between precision and speed and between openness and confidentiality is frustrating. I realize that very well”

The relatives asked Rutte to get radar images of the disaster from the Ukraine, Russia and the United States. “We think that these radar images are extremely important for the investigation, and the truth”, they wrote. They find Russia’s claim that data related to the crash was not stored unlikely and the Ukraine’s excuse that no images were made due to maintenance unbelievable.

Rutte pointed out that the Dutch Safety Board concluded that “Russia did not save the radar images and that the Ukraine’s radar systems were not turned on due to maintenance”. “The countries report that there are no radar images”, he said. In the case of the United States, the Public Prosecutor is in “constant close contact” with the country on the radar images.

During the course of this week, the foundation representing the MH17 survivors received three anonymous emails containing stationary radar images of the disaster and texts in Ukrainian and Russian. Experts concluded that the images are authentic. The information was handed over to the Public Prosecutor, who will determine whether they can be used in the criminal investigation.

Flight MH17 was shot down over eastern Ukraine on July 17th, 2014. All 298 people on board were killed, 196 of them were Dutch.

MH17 radar images anonymously emailed to survivors foundation

Posted on Jan 14, 2016 by Janene Pieters

The foundation representing the relatives of the victims of flight MH17, Stichting Vliegramp MH17, received three anonymous emails containing stationary radar images of the airline disaster, broadcaster NOS reports.

The origin of the emails is unclear. They contain texts in Russian and Ukrainian. The foundation had experts look at the images and they determined them authentic. The emails will be given to the Public Prosecutor, who will determine whether they can be used in the criminal investigation into the disaster.

On Wednesday the survivors sent a letter to Prime Minister Mark Rutte, calling on him to do more to get hold of Russian, Ukrainian and American radar images of the downing of the flight. The relatives believe that Rutte should take the matter United Nations and the International Civil Aviation Organization, whose conventions state that in the event of a plane crash, countries must make radar images available for the investigation.

They find the Ukraine government’s excuse that civilian radar was unavailable that day as being implausible. They also find Russia’s claim that data related to the crash was not stored as “strange,” and unlikely.

The relatives believe that the US is in possession of radar images, based on a 2014 statement by US Secretary of State John Kerry in which he says that they saw the take-off, trajectory and hit. According to NOS, the American images were not made available, because the country does not want to make known how it came into possession of the images.

Source: _http://www.nltimes.nl/2016/01/14/mh17-radar-images-anonymously-emailed-to-survivors-foundation/

 

[Palinurus]

Renewed criticism from the Russian side in a letter to the Dutch Safety board by Oleg Storchevoy, deputy head of Rosaviatsiya here:

http://www.sott.net/article/310365-Russian-investigation-characterizes-final-MH17-crash-report-as-unsubstantiated-inaccurate

 

[Palinurus]

Substantial in depth analysis by Robert Parry concerning the continuing silence on the American side about their radar and satellite images (with several interesting hyperlinks included):

_https://consortiumnews.com/2016/01/15/mh-17s-unnecessary-mystery

[...]
So, with the firing location a key point in dispute, why would the U.S. government withhold from a NATO ally (and investigators into a major airline disaster) the launch point for the missile? Presumably, if the Obama administration had solid evidence showing that the launch came from rebel territory, which was Kerry’s insinuation, U.S. officials would have been only too happy to provide the data.

A reasonable conclusion from the failure to share this information with the Dutch investigators is that the data does not support the preferred U.S. government narrative. If there’s a different explanation for the silence, the Obama administration has failed to provide it.

Amid the curious U.S. silence, the most significant public finding by Western intelligence is that the only powerful and operational anti-aircraft-missile systems in eastern Ukraine on July 17, 2014, belonged to the Ukrainian military.

Nevertheless, the mainstream “conventional wisdom” remains that either the ethnic Russian rebels or the Russians themselves shot down MH-17 and have sought to cover up their guilt.
[...]

(bold, mine)

 

[Palinurus]

Source: _http://www.nltimes.nl/2016/01/25/malaysia-airlines-flying-last-plane-from-schiphol-today/

Malaysia Airlines flying last plane from Schiphol today

Posted on Jan 25, 2016 by Janene Pieters

The last Malaysia Airlines flight from Schiphol Airport is departing at 11:40 a.m. on Monday. The airline is withdrawing from several European markets, ANP reports.

Malaysia Airlines CEO Huib Gorter told Het Parool that this was an emotional weekend. The airline was active on Schiphol for 35 years. The Schiphol-based staff will present gifts to the last passengers at the gate on Monday morning.

The airline has to cut back on routes and destinations due to financial troubles caused by two major aircraft disasters in March and July of 2014 with 537 combined victims: the downing of flight MH17 over eastern Ukraine and the disappearance of flight MH370.

Monday is also the last day the airline will fly from Paris. A partnership with the Emirates airline will help serve Malaysia Airlines passengers in those cities, Malaysia Airlines announced in December.

 

[Palinurus]

Source: _http://www.nltimes.nl/2016/02/03/ukraine-dutch-never-asked-for-mh17-radar-images/

Ukraine: Dutch never asked for MH17 radar images

Posted on Feb 3, 2016 by Janene Pieters

The Ukrainian government never received a request from the Dutch Safety Board for radar images of the MH17 aircraft disaster, the then First Deputy Minister of Transport Vladimir Shulmeister said in an interview with Dutch newspaper AD.

These radar images have been the topic of some controversy since the Dutch Safety Board said in its report on the disaster in October that it did not receive radar information from the Ukraine. According to the Safety Board, the Ukraine does not have radar images of the disaster because its station was shut down for maintenance.

“I was stunned when I read the final report of the Safety Board”, Shulmeister, who was First Deputy Minister of Transport in Ukraine at the time of the disaster, said to the newspaper. “I am one hundred percent sure that we did not receive a request. I sat on the committee that dealt with all matters concerning MH17 on behalf of the government. We got all requests for information across our table. There was never a request for raw radar data.”

Shulmeister is not sure where the misunderstanding occurred. According to him, it may be that the Safety Board only requested data from the military, which their committee did not handle.

The response the Safety Board gave AD seems to indicate that this was the case. “At the end of March 2015 a team went to Ukraine. The aim was to obtain the primary radar data and documents from the military authorities”, a spokesperson for the Safety Board said. He could not say if this explicitly included a request to the civilian government. “I can not tell you more than what is stated in our investigation report, and it clearly states that the board requested images.”

It is unclear whether the Ukraine still has these radar images, but according to Shulmeister the Safety Board can always submit a request for it. “If the data is out there, the Netherlands can of course have it.”

In mid-January the foundation representing the relatives of the MH17 victims, Stichting Vliegramp MH17, received three anonymous emails containing radar images of the disaster. The emails contained text in both Russian and Ukrainian. It is unclear who sent them.

 

[Palinurus]

Source: _http://www.nltimes.nl/2016/02/04/ukraine-ambassador-dutch-did-in-fact-request-mh17-radar-images/

Ukraine ambassador: Dutch did in fact request MH17 radar images

Posted on Feb 4, 2016 by Janene Pieters

The Dutch Safety Board did in fact request raw radar images of the flight MH17 disaster from the Ukrainian government, Ukraine ambassador Olexander Horin said to RTL Nieuws

This is in response to former First Deputy Minister of Transport Vladimir Shulmeister statements on Wednesday that the Ukrainian government never received a request for radar images from the Safety Board. According to him, it may be that the Safety Board only asked the Ukraine military for these images.

“The radar images were absolutely requested by the Safety Board, the researchers also wrote that in their report”, Horin said to RTL, adding that the reason the Ukraine did not provide any images, is because none are available. “The first radar was destroyed, the second was in maintenance and the third had no range. Schulmeister’s statements are not true. There may be a misunderstanding.”

 

[Palinurus]

Source: _http://www.nltimes.nl/2016/02/05/netherlands-wont-protest-ukraine-over-missing-mh17-radar-pics/

Netherlands won’t protest Ukraine over missing MH17 radar pics

Posted on Feb 5, 2016 by Janene Pieters

The Dutch government will not be filing an international protest for the missing radar images of the flight MH17 disaster, despite parties in the lower house of parliament insisting on it. The government believes that there is enough information for the criminal investigation into the crash, was revealed during a parliamentary debate on the matter, RTL Nieuws reports.

The United States confidentially showed the investigators what satellite images they have. Russia sent a video recording of their radar, but that data has since been deleted. The Ukraine says it does not have any radar images because their station was down for maintenance. This last fact was recently questioned by former First Deputy Minister of Transport Vladimir Shulmeister saying that the Ukrainian government never received a request for data. Ukraine Ambassador Olexander Horin responded that the data was requested, but that the Ukraine does not have any.

According to the government, the Public Prosecutor has enough information for the criminal investigation.

The opposition parties asked Justice Minister Ard van der Steur where he heard that the radar images are not necessary, but he could not remember. Something the opposition found “painful”.

 

[Oxajil]

This last fact was recently questioned by former First Deputy Minister of Transport Vladimir Shulmeister saying that the Ukrainian government never received a request for data. Ukraine Ambassador Olexander Horin responded that the data was requested, but that the Ukraine does not have any. [...] The opposition parties asked Justice Minister Ard van der Steur where he heard that the radar images are not necessary, but he could not remember. Something the opposition found “painful”.

Thanks for posting these Palinurus. That all shows how unprofessional the investigation was, and that the goal never really was to find out the true cause of the incident.

 

[Palinurus]

Source: _http://www.nltimes.nl/2016/02/09/demands-for-mh17-transparency-reach-dutch-court/

News outlets take MH17 transparency demands to court

Posted on Feb 9, 2016 by Janene Pieters

Three Dutch news agencies are taking the Ministry of Security and Justice to court, demanding that the government release more information about the Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 disaster. On Tuesday the Administrative Court in Utrecht will address arguments in the case, jointly filed by the Volkskrant newspaper, and broadcasters NOS and RTL Nieuws.

Shortly after the downing of the Malaysia Airlines flight different news organizations independently filed Freedom of Information procedures in order to reconstruct the government’s actions following the disaster on July 17th, 2014, according to the Volkskrant.

In February and April 2015 the Ministry of Security and Justice released a number of ministerial and official committee reports, but large parts of the texts were blacked out. The Ministry gave two reasons for the blacked out text. Firstly that releasing all the information would make contact with “other countries and international organization more difficult” and secondly that it would “hinder the free exchange of arguments” between employees.

The intent behind the Freedom of Information Act is that government information should be accessible. There are exceptional situations in which the government may decide not to release certain information, such as officials’ “personal opinions on policy” may be blacked out. But all facts must be disclosed.

The three news organizations state that the Ministry of Security and Justice denied them information on false grounds and used its “black marker” way too freely. “Given the social impact of the disaster with MH17, it is very important that the government is transparent about its efforts in the aftermath of this disaster”, said Philippe Remarque, chief editor of the Volkskrant. “For journalists this openness is essential for monitoring the government’s activities.” According to Pieter Klein, deputy editor of RTL Nieuws, the “politics of the black marker” frustrates journalistic work. “That seems to me to be unworthy of an open, democratic society.”

According to Jan van der Grinten, the lawyer acting on behalf of the three news organizations, the government is misusing the exceptional conditions clause in the Freedom of Information Act to not disclose information. “Facts are, by definition, not personal opinions on policy”, the lawyer said in the Volkskrant. According to him, in the MH17 freedom of information procedures, information was blacked out that fall under the headings “facts”, “description of the situation”, “fact sheet” and planning”. He feels that this case exemplifies the problem with this Act. “You do not know exactly what we can not know, because that information is blacked out. But you get the feeling that the government does its very best to prevent the sharing of information. And that while the principle should be: transparency, unless.”

 

[Palinurus]

For archiving purposes -- SOTT carries a new article from today about the Russian radar data in response to the questions of victims' relatives:

http://www.sott.net/article/311877-Russian-aviation-official-Moscow-provided-Dutch-Safety-Board-with-MH17-radar-data-but-evidence-was-ignored

 

[Palinurus]

Again for archiving purposes -- SOTT now carries the first part of an overview article about what is known and what is not (yet):

http://www.sott.net/article/312221-MH17-19-months-later-What-we-know

As the article itself breaks off rather early with a direct reference to the original, I will do the same here:

_http://www.whathappenedtoflightmh17.com/mh17-19-months-later-what-do-we-know/

EDIT: spelling

 

[angelburst29]

I happened upon a piece of information and an article written in Russian. I would like to kindly ask, if someone fluent in Russian would consider looking over the article, to determine if the information is noteworthy and the source - valid?

#Russian expert: #MH17 not hit by Buk, but air-2-air missile http://www.vesti.ru/doc.html?id=2720372 … …
Highpoints..
https://twitter.com/mkj1951/status/699303097764597760/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

(Content)

https://twitter.com/mkj1951/status/699303097764597760/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

(Article)

Расследование крушения Boeing-777 под Донецком

15 февраля 201610:19

Российский эксперт: малайзийский Boeing сбит не "Буком", а ракетой "воздух-воздух
http://www.vesti.ru/doc.html?id=2720372

 

[Palinurus]

Thank you angelburst29 for relaying this info.

I'm not able to read Russian so we'll have to wait for somebody to pick this up and respond.

 

[Palinurus]

Source: _http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2016/02/mh17-missile-evidence-likely-within-months/

MH17 missile evidence likely ‘within months’ say investigators

February 19, 2016

Dutch criminal prosecutors will have evidence ‘within months’ on the type of missile that shot down Malaysian Airways flight MH17 and where it was fired from, Nos reports on Friday.

The broadcaster bases its claims on a letter sent to relatives of the victims by the public prosecution department, giving an update on the investigation.

In the letter, Fred Westerbeke writes that efforts to determine the precise location of the launch site are complicated by a lack of radar information from the Ukrainian authorities, and by cloud cover which prevented accurate satellite imaging of the area.

Investigators have received some radar information from American intelligence agencies, and are in talks with Russian authorities about accessing Russian radar information, he said.

Using the available American information, as well as evidence gathered from phone tapping, witness statements and calculations from the National Air and Space Travel Laboratory, investigators are confident they can establish a precise launch location in the second half of this year, Westerbeke said.

Perpetrators

‘Once the launch site has been established…concrete and irrefutable evidence is needed to establish who the perpetrators are and what were their roles,’ Westerbeke said.

‘Internet and phone data, and witness statements are important to this investigation,’ he said. Currently, investigators are going through five billion web pages, and half a million photo, video, and audio files.

Westerbeke, however, reminded the MH17 relatives that in cases like this prosecution can take a long time. He cited the example of the Lockerbie bombing, in which it took investigators three years to issue any indictments.

Missile

All of MH17’s 298 passengers, including 196 Dutch, were killed when the flight was shot down over eastern Ukraine in July 2014.

The plane was shot down with a Russian-made BUK surface-to-air missile, concluded the Dutch Safety Board in their preliminary investigation. The forward section of the aircraft was penetrated by hundreds of high-energy projectiles, causing the plane to break apart in mid-air.

The Dutch safety board concluded that the missile was fired from somewhere within a 320-square kilometer area in the eastern part of Ukraine. Narrowing the area down further was beyond the safety board’s mandate.

Source: _http://www.nltimes.nl/2016/02/19/mh17-criminal-investigation-drags-on-missile-evidence-presented-by-july/

MH17 criminal investigation drags on; Missile evidence presented by July

Posted on Feb 19, 2016 by Janene Pieters

The international judiciary team working on the MH17 criminal investigation is currently investigating remains of the missile that shot down the plane and expects to have evidence about the type of missile and where it was fired from “before the second half of the year”, Chief Prosecutor, Fred Westerbeke wrote in a letter to the victims’ relatives, RTL Nieuws reports.

Westerbeke writes that there is no video footage of the missile launch. There is also no satellite images due to the cloud cover on the day of the disaster. The Public Prosecutor does, however, have radar data showing whether there was other air traffic at the time of the disaster.

The letter further answers the questions surrounding radar images of the disaster. According to Westerbeke, the Ukraine does not have any radar images. The United States made their data available through secret service MIVD, and the prosecutor will be able to use it as evidence if necessary. Russia has not supplied the requested radar images, the Public Prosecutor is discussing it with Moscow. The Prosecutor does not believe that those images are vitally important, stating that tere are many more sources for evidence – tapped telephone conversations, footage, witness statements and 5 billion websites.

According to Westerbeke, the investigators have an eye on “a large group of people” who may be responsible for the attack. Only once their role in the attack is clear, and depending on where they are, will a decision be made on the most promising form of prosecution. He warns the survivors that the investigation and prosecution can still take a very long time, referring to the Lockerbie crash which took three years before arrest warrants were issued.