Session 24 October 2009

Iconoclast said:
seems like you'll be making this part of the SOTT-journey without me, as i won't be able (or willing) to overcome my rejection of concepts like church or religion.

Hi Iconoclast. I'm not intending to persuade you of anything, but, just out of curiosity, are sure you actually rejected thos concepts you refer to? Or perhaps you just repressed some things related to them?

If G is correct when he states that "religion is a relative concept; it corresponds to
the level of a man's being;" and if The C's are correct that Life is religion and that we get out of it what we put into it, then isn't there a possibility that you are simply rejecting a part of yourself?

To me, the words 'church' and 'religion' mainly just refer to a category or class of human activity and are neutral in themselves. Let's not confuse hateful, murderous, criminal behavior (done in the name of religions) with the umbrella it hides under. Doing so allows the identifications and camouflage to continue and goes against the very Work we have always done, in my estimation.

Just a few thoughts that may or may not be worth much.
 
Iconoclast said:
while the whole thing smells like a gigantic trap to my paranoid mind, i wish all participants that i'm totally and utterly OFF - and best of luck and success!!

seems like you'll be making this part of the SOTT-journey without me, as i won't be able (or willing) to overcome my rejection of concepts like church or religion.


not trying to start an argument or produce noise, just feedback.

Sounds like a good swamp topic! Kind of like meditation/breathing moving in on the territory of The Work, it's certainly a change with Church moving in on the 4th Way. But seriously, we've always thought of the hunter-gatherer circle people with their goddesses and meditation and dancing as being a good thing; this just puts it into practice instead of just talking about it. As soon as Laura got that harp, we were probably on the path to circle peoplesville already.

For my family, the only source of income is my wife's job as a Catholic school teacher; I'm probably staying Catholic, but for a long time I've called myself a Jungian Catholic and as soon as that session with Paleochristian showed up, I've been calling myself that on other forums too. My 8th grade deacon religious education teacher said to the class that for all he knew, Adam and Eve came to earth on a UFO. It can only take a little horizon expanding comment like that, even in the overall disinformation environment of Catholicism, to make a little difference (I still remember it more than thirty years later). Imagine what Cass/SOTT/FOTCM could do with a bigger stage!
 
neema said:
I can only imagine how difficult it must be for yourself and others whom are having difficulty with the idea of "churches". Believe me I had a rather intense conversation with my better half recently as you might have guessed. The brutal coldness of the mind trap is paralyzing.

Yes, it's terrible to witness what is being done, to learn what HAS been done, and to speculate with data about what is GOING to happen to humanity. And what is so discouraging is to see how steely that mind-trap really is.

neema said:
But I do know as time goes by, and some of the results of the efforts of the church are seen and felt, we all will have different filings and attitudes towards the idea of "churches".
Like the old saying goes, "By their fruits ye shall know them"

Exactly. We've been trying to do so much with so little for so long with no real platform or ability to protect ourselves. Now a whole vista of ways to serve others opens up.... with a single decision taken after literally weeks of soul searching, discussing, thinking, and wrestling with my own emotions about the whole thing. In the end, I realized that there was literally nothing against the idea except my own self-importance: "what will people think?!" And then, I knew it had to be done... I had to get over myself and bite the bullet. At this point, I can't care what anyone thinks. Every terrible thing in the book has been said about me with NO basis in fact, so let them rant and rave. I will do what I think is right (with a lot of counsel from others, of course) and that's it. There are people being destroyed for lack of knowledge and shepherding. And this isn't only about protection for QFS and what WE do... it's about being able to DO those things that others so desperately need.


neema said:
I for one have no problems with the name church and have already completed my application. One question if I were to send a small donation along with my application, could I assume a check could be written to the name "The Fellowship of the Cosmic Mind " or should the whole name be included "The Fellowship of the Cosmic Mind, Institute of Paleo Christianity"?

For now, checks should still be made out to QFG until we go through the hoops to open a bank account in the name of FOTCM.
 
Bluestar said:
Joining for me is the spreading of the good will of the programs offered here. Becoming part of this community that I have allowed into my heart. I have been spreading through other various communities I know by making them aware of the websites & forum. What they do with the info is their choice.

Sent in my application and let me know how I can be of service.

And that IS the point: having a vehicle/platform from which we can DO MORE.

We've spent years writing, researching, publishing, making things available for free to everyone (and trying to stay alive while doing it via donations and book sales). Now, there is so much more we need to do that nobody else seems to be doing. We have waited and waited and waited for someone "in authority" to come along and say what needed to be said and do what needed to be done, but it just hasn't happened. It's up to us, now. So, let's get on with it and do it.
 
Pete02 said:
Silly question but...

Laura said:
We have fixed up an application form that you can print, fill out and send in. Go here:

http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=14418.0

On the application, at the end, you list signature, date and place signed. Am I supposed to just write home or my home town or something?

Yes, it should be just the place written down, where are you living (where you signed it: the home town/city you are living in).

I also wondered for a short moment what to write there.

Hope it clarifies.
 
Yes it does Gawan :) Thank you kindly. I'll be mailing my application shortly!

PS: For the people at QFG, I had mailed out a request for the application yesterday and now saw Laura's post of the online app today. Please disregard my previous letter or if you like, still send me the app and I can pass it on to my brother who is very interested also. Thanks again!

Edit: to Moderators, maybe this question should be moved to the application thread? I didn't post there originally because I thought it was just for the application and not discussion. :-[
 
alphonse said:
An appeal to any one else, especially long standing members of the forum, thinking of "walking" away over this!

Why not voice concerns first? raise questions you may have, perhaps in the swamp if you need to?

oh, i'm certainly not thinking of 'walking away' from sott. aside from the topic of discussion, it is still a fantastic, invaluable source for news, analysis and information.
i hold the work done by the sott team in the highest regard. it has been truly invaluable.


and yes, i will most likely post to the swamp about this within the next few days.


i'll try to post the link here once i've written it (for anyone following this thread, who might be interested)
 
Laura said:
And that IS the point: having a vehicle/platform from which we can DO MORE.

We've spent years writing, researching, publishing, making things available for free to everyone (and trying to stay alive while doing it via donations and book sales). Now, there is so much more we need to do that nobody else seems to be doing. We have waited and waited and waited for someone "in authority" to come along and say what needed to be said and do what needed to be done, but it just hasn't happened. It's up to us, now. So, let's get on with it and do it.

Oh! No need to fear Laura, even if this someone is not here, together we are going to do what is needed to be done. :rockon:
I have some ideas that will be posting tomorrow.
Don't lose your faith and count on me!
 
Laura said:
Last night I was thinking about setting up places where the homeless can get decent food. And I mean DECENT food, not crap. Good whole brown rice, dried beans, veggies, etc. We could make videos to teach people the basic principles of a good, detoxing diet and show them how to cook food that is nutritious and make it tasty, too.

Then, I was thinking about buying land where the homeless and disenfranchised could come and create communities, help each other build homes...

Recently, my principal family members agreed to come together from across the nation to a farm to begin operations involving organic/biodynamic crops/garden, and animal rotation in such a way that a diverse, healthy environment is maintained for all, including the wildlife (see Polyfacefarms.com for Joel Salatin's example). The following is a portion of the Mission Statement I wrote that all family members have agreed to:
Mission Statement
It is understood to varying degrees among the Family members that collapse of the Western affluent life as we have know it in the US is imminent – only the time frame being uncertain . It will be a result of a well-controlled plan by the PTB (with the help of an army of psychopaths) to institute draconian measures of fascist control and manipulation to bring about a slavery of both the physical and the spiritual – no matter the destruction, no matter the suffering, and no matter the cost to human decency at the lowest common denominator. It is likely that economic collapse will be one of the tools used by the PTB to implement the plan. Furthermore this will likely be accompanied or followed by another “9-11” type event precipitating massive government take-over and institutionalized martial law. When this happens, many folk will find themselves in great need of much help with the collapse of elements of the economic infrastructure – possibly including the monetary system. To be in dire need at this point for food, water, energy, etc, is to be set up and played directly into the controlling arms of those that brought about the condition in the first place. Those same arms are likely to offer “relief” for a price, and accepting that situation will be the first step down the road to slavery. It is imperative that the Family members not be found in need of such “help”, but rather, be in such a position to provide true help to those that can, in turn, help others. These may be extended family members, but more importantly, they are likely to be members of the local community since any hope of sanity and cooperation will have to begin at the smallest local community level (ie families). These pockets of “self-help” will form the basis of independent communities that can easily thrive without handouts that come with a “price”. It is therefore imperative that the Family seek a position that is only loosely attached to the current infrastructure, and capable of being cut off from it without undue discomfort. This includes the financial infrastructure in that the members must strive to become debt-free (debt has been/is/will be used as a control mechanism). To this end, it is desirable for the members to consolidate their efforts to make a single property as liveably independent as possible in terms of food, water, energy, etc. This does not mean isolation. In fact it means the opposite. By fostering cooperation with the local community and barter of goods/ trades, independence at the local community level is supported. This may be essential for longer term survival of not only the Family but the local community. At this point, an extended quote from William Bramley’s book The Gods of Eden (1989) is appropriate:

On a smaller scale, the inflatable paper money system causes farmers to lose farms. Most farmers do not lose their way of life because they fail to work hard or because they do not produce something of great value. They lose because they cannot meet the demands of the paper money system. This allows large agribusinesses to step in and buy up the farmland, resulting in the concentration of food production in an ever-dwindling number on hands.
As we can see, the modern monetary system has had the effect of destroying many benefits that mass production and advances in science and technology would have offered the human race. By now, the need for all-consuming toil for physical existence should be largely ended; but the inflatable paper money system has helped to preserve that need by creating massive debt, chronic inflation, and general economic instability. The vast majority of people in all nations today must still continue to spend the major portion of their prime waking hours working to meet their financial needs [as dictated by a social/monetary system gone mad – LQB]. The Custodial [unseen Forces - LQB] goal expressed in the Biblical Adam and Eve story of making people toil from birth until death is still being fulfilled.


From the standpoint of the PTB/Controller/Unseen Forces, the need for “all-consuming toil” for the human race is self-evident – to focus attention/effort/toil in the material world and thereby direct attention away from Truth and the development of the spiritual might to escape the material world and the Controller’s manipulation to eternally “farm” the human race for their particular brands of “food”.

Family members must recognize that the over-arching mission is to create an environment (physical and otherwise – for ourselves and others) in which escape can be effected from these unseen Forces and from the self-constructed prisons fostered/cultivated in us by the same said Forces. Members must be willing to do battle with (unseen) internal belief constructs which form the prisons (individual and collective) that we inhabit. These statements reflect something closer to the Truth of the meaning of our existence here and a higher level purpose to physical Life in general. Having a “happy life” is an imposed/accepted goal/concept much akin to the “American Dream” – and for good reason, it is called a “dream”. Attempting to live a “dream” is not the mission of this group. The above will have little meaning to those self-satisfied with an eternal existence as “farm-cultivated” food. And the term “eternal” is being kind because the end of this “self-satisfaction” is spiritual annihilation.

Until all Family members fully understand/recognize/sense the higher level Forces in this world which are capable of coopting the unconscious actions/intent of others for the purpose of infiltration and destruction of small groups dedicated to the Truth and helping others – a loosely bound set of rules/operating guidelines must be agreed to in full by all members. Some of these are “common sense” guidelines – others derive more specifically from the above discussion: ....

Our family has recognized that trying to "fix" things from the top down is not feasible due to the stranglehold that psychopathic institutions now hold. We have agreed that the bottoms up local approach through community is the only viable method to bring about lasting change (in other words, the change begins with you and the like-minded). It addresses the human element directly - not the institutions.

We are now on the farm (some still to arrive) and are forging community contacts and links to help get to production of nutrient-dense foods for local consumption - and support a thriving environment on the farm - from microbe in the soil to human in the pasture. No CAFOs (confined animal farm Ops) here - as Salatin says about his farm animals: "The animals here have only one bad day".

We also recognize that part of this service to community must involve education - folks must recognize that the choice in food is a major cause of chronic disease and poisoning of the body and the mind. Last week I got my haircut in a local salon in "Bumpkin", USA, where the salon-talk is focused on who has cancer and what their chemo schedule is. With the programs running in these folk, alternative treatments do not even register on the radar screen. But then the girl cutting my hair began to think and said that "it must be in the food ... all those chemicals and things". This gave me a huge shot of HOPE - that maybe there is a way through this with some specially targeted education. Anyway, we recognize that a key element of change is education - gently getting folks to begin to understand the nature of this reality.

Why did I post all of this? Because we would be happy and honored to associate our goals and operations with FOTCM.

Larry
 
Thanks for another great session, Laura.

I must admit I was worried with the prospect of turning all this into a religion/church...
in a way I still am, since it is known what these terms are associated with.

However, I think it is a rather skillful way to help the people from the USA (and probably the EU) to protect their fundamental rights, and that is something I can understand.
 
Freelancer said:
Thanks for another great session, Laura.

I must admit I was worried with the prospect of turning all this into a religion/church...
in a way I still am, since it is known what these terms are associated with.

However, I think it is a rather skillful way to help the people from the USA (and probably the EU) to protect their fundamental rights, and that is something I can understand.

I see that a number of forumites are commenting on the wisdom (or not) of the FOTCM as a tool to protect our rights. That is one aspect of it, but as Laura has been trying to explain in her recent posts, there is another more important aspect, which is helping others out there! Many of us may feel uncomfortable with the idea of religion, but ultimately this is not about what we like or dislike, but about what is actually going to help the largest number of people.

If you read Schumaker's "The Corruption of Reality" you will see that people need religion, of one sort or another. So far they have got only lies and manipulation. Many are dissatisfied, and as a result they have replaced religion with negative dissociation, like all sorts of addictions or even mental illnesses. But if we could offer the knowledge we now have - and I think all of us here value the information that Laura and related sources have made available to us - as a true religion which also provides a genuine sense of community - wouldn't that be externally considerate for the masses of people who desperately need it?

Furthermore, Schumaker makes clear that when societies' religions are in crisis - as they are now - people will join new religions easily, because they need it. Think about it: if we don't offer a positive alternative, someone else will fill the void with something even nastier! Think of the Orwellian nightmare with religious connotations, or an "aliens are angels" type of thing!
 
Windmill knight said:
Furthermore, Schumaker makes clear that when societies' religions are in crisis - as they are now - people will join new religions easily, because they need it. Think about it: if we don't offer a positive alternative, someone else will fill the void with something even nastier! Think of the Orwellian nightmare with religious connotations, or an "aliens are angels" type of thing!

Something even nastier??? Are you implying we're nasty? ;) :lol:
 
anart said:
Windmill knight said:
Furthermore, Schumaker makes clear that when societies' religions are in crisis - as they are now - people will join new religions easily, because they need it. Think about it: if we don't offer a positive alternative, someone else will fill the void with something even nastier! Think of the Orwellian nightmare with religious connotations, or an "aliens are angels" type of thing!

Something even nastier??? Are you implying we're nasty? ;) :lol:

Haha! No, I meant nastier than the religions people have already.
 
Windmill knight said:
Freelancer said:
Thanks for another great session, Laura.

I must admit I was worried with the prospect of turning all this into a religion/church...
in a way I still am, since it is known what these terms are associated with.

However, I think it is a rather skillful way to help the people from the USA (and probably the EU) to protect their fundamental rights, and that is something I can understand.

I see that a number of forumites are commenting on the wisdom (or not) of the FOTCM as a tool to protect our rights. That is one aspect of it, but as Laura has been trying to explain in her recent posts, there is another more important aspect, which is helping others out there! Many of us may feel uncomfortable with the idea of religion, but ultimately this is not about what we like or dislike, but about what is actually going to help the largest number of people.

If you read Schumaker's "The Corruption of Reality" you will see that people need religion, of one sort or another. So far they have got only lies and manipulation. Many are dissatisfied, and as a result they have replaced religion with negative dissociation, like all sorts of addictions or even mental illnesses. But if we could offer the knowledge we now have - and I think all of us here value the information that Laura and related sources have made available to us - as a true religion which also provides a genuine sense of community - wouldn't that be externally considerate for the masses of people who desperately need it?

Furthermore, Schumaker makes clear that when societies' religions are in crisis - as they are now - people will join new religions easily, because they need it. Think about it: if we don't offer a positive alternative, someone else will fill the void with something even nastier! Think of the Orwellian nightmare with religious connotations, or an "aliens are angels" type of thing!


Thank you Windmill knight, these are really good points. IMO the FOTCM gives somehow a name which defines what we are doing, it's like that -the work- we are doing is going into a form/something that is touchable/real, where people can hold on. And if people see that we are living what we are preaching, that's the best thing what could happen! As well as WK said, that there is something what the world has not seen for a long time. (Sorry if that sounds a little bit strange.)
And simply where it is possibly to get to people, because the church is presented in the public, has a legal status, maybe a symbol (where I think that is something to identify with, Laura mentioned that it is in work, this comes to my mind: a modified triskelion, a form of a lighthouse with a triskelion on top as a light, cocentric rings (as oposite of pyramids, hyrachies,), a crop circle...)


anart said:
Windmill knight said:
Furthermore, Schumaker makes clear that when societies' religions are in crisis - as they are now - people will join new religions easily, because they need it. Think about it: if we don't offer a positive alternative, someone else will fill the void with something even nastier! Think of the Orwellian nightmare with religious connotations, or an "aliens are angels" type of thing!

Something even nastier??? Are you implying we're nasty? ;) :lol:

Thank you anart, that gave me the chuckles. ;D
 
Laura said:
A: You have already taken the steps for QFS, so now you must open the door for the forum and more.

[...]

Q: (L) So you're saying that we should open this to everyone? Right now? Launch it as a religion right now and offer memberships to not just QFS, but to forum members? Well, we had planned to include some forum members who were interested in teaching the breathing program - for their own protection - but, open the doors for anybody and everybody?

A: Pretty much!

At times before, I've thought of what might eventually happen in the future - things going much worse with the global situation of the times, the Internet collapsing, and people becoming cut off from communication, the wider network shattered. Then the "inner networks" such as QFS would still be able to keep in touch, I guess, but everyone else including me and most people on the forum would be left out.

This turn of events means, I think, that a more resilient network can grow in the wider circles of people involved - and this means that it could be possible to keep the connections alive, that fewer would risk being "left in the dust" (as my false personality put it - I recognize that its feelings are not valid) in the face of such a situation. This is quite significant.

And this turn might also open the door to people contributing, committing and so also receiving back in more ways, if offered the opportunity to help with whatever projects might suit them. Something vague is forming in my mind where there previously was a complete "blank" for a vision of my future in this here life except for nowadays barely motivated ongoing ordinary studies; it might finally bring some motivation to dealing with my life outside of myself...
 

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