Session 28 March 2010

Juba

Dagobah Resident
FOTCM Member
Nienna Eluch said:
Bluebird said:
(L) Okay, we've got some questions here that people have assembled. The first question is: "Do genetically modified foods affect human DNA?"

A: Yes! Very bad.
I remember reading somewhere that scientists found that genetically modified food altered the DNA of lab animals. Even more diabolical they ensure genetically modified food is not labelled so its very difficult to know what you are eating.

Cheers
I remember reading this also on SOTT. And I looked at the time this was brought up in another thread, and was unable to find it. More than likely because of not using the right key words in the search function. So it is good to know that others have also read something similar.
Hello,

GMO are indeed treat to all of us, more worse even in my own garden, although I use old low productivity sorts of vegetables and fruits and farming them in simple organic way, my plants are in high risk zone of cross pollination with GMO, because my neighbours are using latest seeds from laboratories in order to have biggest potatoes, earliest strawberries, whole year tomatoes......,.... What an unnatural choice, not only they toxify themself but surrounding families as well again via cross pollination.

I found these interesting article related to GMO and health issues:

(NaturalNews) A report published in the International Journal of Microbiology has verified once again that Monsanto's genetically modified (GM) crops are causing severe health problems. A legal challenge issued against Monsanto forced the multi-national agriculture giant to release raw data revealing that animals fed its patented GM corn suffered liver and kidney damage within just three months.

Adding to the mounting evidence that GM crops are dangerous all around, this information provides a damning indictment against Monsanto which continually insists that its GM products are safe. Not only are GM crops proving disastrous for the environment, but study after study, including those conducted by Monsanto itself, is showing that GM foods are detrimental to health.

Monsanto's data indicated that the company had conducted tests on three varieties of its GM corn, two of which contain the dangerous Bt protein, and one designed specifically to resist Monsanto's Roundup herbicide. All three are widely grown in the United States while only one is currently grown in Europe.

Dr. Gilles-Eric Seralini, a French researcher from the University of Caen, was tasked with examining the data and providing a review. While stopping short of declaring GM crops to be toxic, he did emphasize that chronic negative effects were apparent and that there were "statistically significant" indications of kidney and liver damage.

The specific effects observed in test rats included a buildup of hormones in the blood, indicating that their liver and kidneys were not functioning properly. One variety of the corn led to elevated blood sugar levels and increased triglyceride levels in female rats given it.

Dr. Seralini concluded that, because GM crops are foreign substances that have never been a part of a normal diet, there is no telling what the long-term effects of consumption will be on people. In animals, significant disruption of normal bodily function has been observed even in the short term.

Genetically manipulated food crops are not fit for human consumption and should not be classified as food. No legitimate study has ever proven them to be safe or nutritious. The burden of proof is on the producers of such crops to verify their safety and, to date, all data has revealed that they are unsafe. Claims that GM foods will end world hunger are baseless, propagated only by those that have a financial interest in converting the world's food supply to their own patented varieties in order to control it.

more on: http://www.naturalnews.com/028388_GM_crops_kidney_damage.html


Lower you can see differences in Kirilian photos of organic and industrially grown plants, I wonder how big difference would be betwen KP of GM food and organic food, probably much bigger?? :(
 

Attachments

Woodsman

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
anart said:
Bud said:
Woodsman said:
I've been comparing notes with some of the people I know who have been dealing with the high-anxiety fuzzies everybody seems to have been dealing with over the past few weeks. I suspect that the HAARP behavior modification attacks have been on-going for years but that this last episode was an example of the knob being turned up to the point where it was much more easily noticeable than usual.

Anyway, I'd like to offer a couple of observations including some solutions I've experimented with. . .
That sounds like some good ideas. I've a technique that I like to experiment with to shake up rigid or uncomfortable thought patterns whether they seem to come in response to external or internal stimuli.

At a certain time, I'll do an 'energy dump', leaving just enough tension in the body to maintain current posture and/or position, and breath deeply using the belly. The mind has to focus on what the body is doing so that the right balance can be found between tension and relaxation. This can last for as long as you want it too.

I've got this idea that there are times when certain thoughts, feelings and physical states of tension go together to create a particular energetic framework, and with this approach, one is simply using inconspicuous body work to influence the mind, just like the mind influences the body.

It has worked fine for me so far, when I remember to do it. :)
I think it might be worthwhile to consider the idea that 'dumping energy' or 'dancing it out' might be the equivalent of opening the furnace door to release the heat that can fuel transformation. If negative energy - even pent up energy - can be consciously transformed through conscious suffering and effort, it serves a purpose with results that tend to be much 'higher' than releasing it into the aether (or as food).

I'm not saying that physical exercise or activity cannot be very beneficial to disperse energy that can't currently be utilized in any other way - it is a fantastic tool in those instances - but imagine if one could utilize this energy as fuel to transform, not just dumping or releasing it through mechanical means.

It would take enormous effort, but it is - at the very least - another option to consider, if only in 'baby steps' at first. In the meantime, motor center release can be very effective and helpful in releasing tension and stress.
That's a very interesting observation which makes something inside me nod. Regarding Dance as a means of gaining control over the manner in which my energy was resonating, (away from anxiety and anger and depression), I can see how the mechanic might have worked. . .

Channeling that energy out through physical activity was in part exactly an energy dump. -An easy and reliable mode of self-calming. Just throw out everything and start again. It certainly worked, and with conscious effort, I was able to re-build my energies over the next day according to my own standards rather than those of the HAARP guys. But it strikes me now that it might well have been a missed opportunity to exercise control over one's frequency and thus change the energy from within without dumping any of it. That would have taken far greater skill and would have taught a lot more. Even while reading through Gurdjief I didn't make the connection, but it seems obvious now.

In previous cases where I've been hit with overwhelming anxiety, (and I can only think of really a couple times where this happened beyond a point where I could manage in the last ten years), where it reached a point where it felt like my heart would burst, outside help made itself available when I asked for it; I felt in both cases as though a plug were pulled and the hurricane inside my chest and head flew up and away, leaving me calm and very grateful. In both cases I was asking for help from historically benevolent beings, (Christ in one case and in another, from an Asian god I'd been reading about in a book I'd had open in my hands, but whose name and story I've since forgotten). But this latest bout of anxiety was NOT beyond my ability to cope; it was just really long, a two-month grind felt by many people. But in my case, my heart wasn't racing and I wasn't falling off my feet at any point. I feel now that the dance experiment, while instructive, was an example of spending idly an opportunity to have increased my frequency awareness and modulation skills. A side-step. Self-calming without spiritual growth.

-Not that I think exercise is a bad thing at all. The mind needs the body to be in good shape, and dance is certainly a fun way to strain the body in useful ways and to sweat out toxins, etc. I also think that a "moving meditation" is well worth exploring. But intention shapes all things.

Here's another observation. . .

It strikes me in review now that working to pull oneself out of anxiety, (even when it is resulting from an outside attack specifically designed to darken the planet and make it resonate with fear), that using internal techniques of any kind to oppose the dark side is just another example of Self-Calming.

So what does one do? Is fighting outside control the wrong thing to do? Should one just go limp and let the dark side have its way? Paradox! (As with all big learning experiences, I've found it often comes down to solving a paradox. Which makes sense, really. Nothing is truly paradoxical if it can be solved; it's simply that a problem seems paradoxical because the solution is invisible to our current state of awareness.)

I'm beginning to think that the subjects brought up in this last session might have been more connected than I previously thought. It seemed while reading through the Q and A as though there was a significant gulf between the topic of child rearing and HAARP. -And that very little attention had been given to a subject which seemed to be of immediate concern. (And which seemed deliberately so I thought). But this thought occurs to me now. . .

As with babies benefiting from having to face adversity in order to grow powerful and aware, a HAARP attack bears a similarity in that regard. A child weaned from breast milk and suffering from this must learn new techniques for coping, and this is a form, (when done in a certain way), of the Alchemical Fire. It can teach self-awareness.

Neat!
 

Nienna

SuperModerator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
jubazo said:
Genetically manipulated food crops are not fit for human consumption and should not be classified as food. No legitimate study has ever proven them to be safe or nutritious. The burden of proof is on the producers of such crops to verify their safety and, to date, all data has revealed that they are unsafe. Claims that GM foods will end world hunger are baseless, propagated only by those that have a financial interest in converting the world's food supply to their own patented varieties in order to control it.

more on: http://www.naturalnews.com/028388_GM_crops_kidney_damage.html
This article was carried on SOTT here.

It is really maddening how Monsanto's GMO crops can contaminate organic farmers' crops and "that's okay." Or they can even come and claim that you are steeling their seeds.

Monsanto is evil.
 

Mona

Jedi Master
anart said:
gertrudes said:
These divertions are valid and will allow us to get through in life, but for a real transformation, one should learn how not to divert this energy, or in other words, learn how to really feel.
Would my understanding be correct?
That pretty much sums it up. One cannot suffer without feeling. The heat needs to be felt, it needs to burn, internally; in the alchemical furnace. There have been times when I thought that heat, that suffering, would consume me. It did consume parts of me, but not the Real me.

With that said, there are times when it's really wisest to release some of that heat (energy) to not 'shatter' - to be able to work on it again after cooling a bit - that's why a network is so important. We can never tell which is best, at any particular moment, on our own. There are people who push themselves too hard and lose the battle that way, there are people who give up too quickly because they dislike even moderate amounts of heat. The devil is in the details! If a person can just take the smallest steps toward 'sitting in that suffering' and not running from it, buffering it, releasing it, explaining it away, then larger steps can then be taken. One step a time.
Thanks Anart, Ana and Gertrude. This really opened my eyes to the reality of suffering and how to face it the next time it comes around. I do agree that people have to network with others when being in that dark place that seems to paralyze most of us and makes us feel guilty talking about the experience. Hopefully the next time we will find the strength to come here to share our darkness before letting someone else pull the trigger for us. Don Elkins did not have the opportunity to learn about how to face the darkness, instead it consumed him because he did not understand what its true identity was. And I wish he and many others had the opportunity to be here with us today as he and those who fell victims to suicide had so much to contribute to this world.
 

anart

The Living Force
Woodsman said:
Here's another observation. . .

It strikes me in review now that working to pull oneself out of anxiety, (even when it is resulting from an outside attack specifically designed to darken the planet and make it resonate with fear), that using internal techniques of any kind to oppose the dark side is just another example of Self-Calming.

So what does one do? Is fighting outside control the wrong thing to do? Should one just go limp and let the dark side have its way? Paradox! (As with all big learning experiences, I've found it often comes down to solving a paradox. Which makes sense, really. Nothing is truly paradoxical if it can be solved; it's simply that a problem seems paradoxical because the solution is invisible to our current state of awareness.)
I think you might be confusing a few things here. First, it's not about anyone 'going limp and letting the dark side have its way' - nor is it, necessarily, about 'pulling oneself out of anxiety'. It is about attempting to be Conscious, feeling the negative emotions fully and completely, fighting the mechanical impulse to buffer, deflect or avoid (run from) them - while understanding their source and their fuel (how we, ourselves are feeding them and from where) - all this with a slowly dawning visceral realization that we are not our negative emotions!

Then - after burning in that fire for a long enough time, understanding - which results in transmutation or 'rewiring' the brain so that it no longer works in the old way. It is conscious suffering.

That probably doesn't really clarify, but, hopefully it at least introduces another way to look at it - and this process can happen in small steps, over time, involving many different instances of suffering. fwiw.
 

kawika

Jedi
FOTCM Member
Nienna Eluch said:
This article was carried on SOTT here.

It is really maddening how Monsanto's GMO crops can contaminate organic farmers' crops and "that's okay." Or they can even come and claim that you are steeling their seeds.

Monsanto is evil.
I have a organic farm just down the the road from where Monsonto and Syngenta grow their maze seed crops for export, we have year round growing conditions so it's ideal for them terrible for us! They are doing a lot of experimental crops also which is very concerning. One thing that I've learned that is alarming is that GMO pollen can cross pollinate between different species of vegetables, for example GMO maze can mix it's genes into an organic heirloom tomato variety thus contaminating the tomato's genes. Another big problem is that GM bacteria can enter the soil and contaminate it, once the GM bacteria enters the soil it can mutate making it resilient to natural bacteria's that would neutralize them, I heard one expert say that after about 10 yrs. of growing GMO crops in the same soil the bacteria would become so strong that it would be near impossible to eradicate the mutating GM bacteria and would poison any other non GMO crops for many years or longer.

Another problem with GM bacteria is that it can enter into the human gut, studies are showing that it can cause serious health issues one being antibiotic resistant bacteria. There's just so many bad and unknown things about GMO and the C's confirm how "very bad" it is for our DNA. Lots of food for thought. (pun intended)

Edit=Quotes
 

Woodsman

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
anart said:
Woodsman said:
Here's another observation. . .

It strikes me in review now that working to pull oneself out of anxiety, (even when it is resulting from an outside attack specifically designed to darken the planet and make it resonate with fear), that using internal techniques of any kind to oppose the dark side is just another example of Self-Calming.

So what does one do? Is fighting outside control the wrong thing to do? Should one just go limp and let the dark side have its way? Paradox! (As with all big learning experiences, I've found it often comes down to solving a paradox. Which makes sense, really. Nothing is truly paradoxical if it can be solved; it's simply that a problem seems paradoxical because the solution is invisible to our current state of awareness.)
I think you might be confusing a few things here. First, it's not about anyone 'going limp and letting the dark side have its way' - nor is it, necessarily, about 'pulling oneself out of anxiety'. It is about attempting to be Conscious, feeling the negative emotions fully and completely, fighting the mechanical impulse to buffer, deflect or avoid (run from) them - while understanding their source and their fuel (how we, ourselves are feeding them and from where) - all this with a slowly dawning visceral realization that we are not our negative emotions!

Then - after burning in that fire for a long enough time, understanding - which results in transmutation or 'rewiring' the brain so that it no longer works in the old way. It is conscious suffering.

That probably doesn't really clarify, but, hopefully it at least introduces another way to look at it - and this process can happen in small steps, over time, involving many different instances of suffering. fwiw.
No, that makes a lot of sense. -I'd skimmed earlier the last page of posts and didn't give the piece you reproduced of Perceval's (here: http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=17052.msg150876#msg150876) proper attention. My question was fully answered in that. I apologize for making idle speculation when a closer reading of this discussion would have sufficed.
 

Biomiast

Jedi Master
Nienna Eluch said:
It is really maddening how Monsanto's GMO crops can contaminate organic farmers' crops and "that's okay." Or they can even come and claim that you are steeling their seeds.
That's exactly what they are claiming!

I have a proffesor in GMO business and he told us that generally those plants are designed as infertile to prevent this contamination and "stealing". Also it is useful in the sense that you can't produce them, so you are entirely dependent on those companies to buy their product again.

I don't know if they do this in every product or only for some plants though. Yet, in the case of bacteria kawika mentioned, it IS a scary thought and very dangerous, imho.

Now, biochemical industry giants are making seeds themselves infertile. You sow them this year, and that's it. For next year's crop, you need brand new seeds - you would have to buy them, of course.
http://ipsnews.net/news.asp?idnews=42468
 

Mrs.Tigersoap

The Living Force
Gertrudes said:
I understand that in order to achieve results of an "higher" order when handling suffering, one could use all of his/her energy for the process of transmutation.
I was wondering if the following quote from Needleman's Lost Christianity is another way of explaining it?:

Lost Christianity p. 138 said:
In short, thoughts, impulses, associations appear within the psyche, but as such they are not yet emotions. It is only when these "thoughts" are given something by ourselves, some energy, some specific psychic force, that they take on the nature of emtion - passion -and assume their overwhelming power in our inner and outer lives. The struggle against egoistic emotions is thus precisely located at that exact interval or "space" before a thought, impulse or association becomes an emotion. But this is immensely difficult and supremely subtle work
 

c.a.

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
In short, thoughts, impulses, associations appear within the psyche, but as such they are not yet emotions. It is only when these "thoughts" are given something by ourselves, some energy, some specific psychic force, that they take on the nature of emtion - passion -and assume their overwhelming power in our inner and outer lives. The struggle against egoistic emotions is thus precisely located at that exact interval or "space" before a thought, impulse or association becomes an emotion. But this is immensely difficult and supremely subtle work
Hi Mrs.Tigersoap, Would you have an example of this manifestation in life, as comparison? From your prospective. And or anyone?
 

Christian

The Force is Strong With This One
Hi all,
Many Thanks for this Session, I have really a strange experience: A lot of pain and really tired all the times this week. :(
best regards,
 

Mrs.Tigersoap

The Living Force
M.A.O. said:
Hi Mrs.Tigersoap, Would you have an example of this manifestation in life, as comparison? From your prospective. And or anyone?
Hi M.A.O.,

OK, fair enough! :) You're right, I just drop that quote without much else, sorry. Here is what I think (I may be way off, of course):
Sometimes I get a 'nagging' feeling, like a pit in my stomach and I don't even know why (or maybe a feeling of sadness, of frustration, whatever). What I usually do is I try and find a reason for this. I review the events of the day, my thoughts, my readings, my conversations until I find what caused this feeling. Then, when I've managed to find it, I think about it. A lot. I try not to, but I can't help myself. I review the whole scene, find alternative endings, think of what I've should have said, etc.


But what if I managed to simply accept and observe this feeling without absolutely trying to find its cause, without identifying to it, without trying to label it, to intellectualize it, to dissect it, to feed it? Maybe then it would not turn into a full-blown emotion, maybe it would not take a life of its own, not gain momentum? Maybe then I would be able to begin to transform it into something else, something useful for the Work? (or maybe not, maybe it's not the way it works?)

I'm just trying to understand all this correctly, because to me it's still very much wishful thinking. I (think) I understand the theory, but putting it in practice in another story.

edit: quote
 

anart

The Living Force
Mrs.Tigersoap said:
M.A.O. said:
Hi Mrs.Tigersoap, Would you have an example of this manifestation in life, as comparison? From your prospective. And or anyone?
Hi M.A.O.,

OK, fair enough! :) You're right, I just drop that quote without much else, sorry. Here is what I think (I may be way off, of course):
Sometimes I get a 'nagging' feeling, like a pit in my stomach and I don't even know why (or maybe a feeling of sadness, of frustration, whatever). What I usually do is I try and find a reason for this. I review the events of the day, my thoughts, my readings, my conversations until I find what caused this feeling. Then, when I've managed to find it, I think about it. A lot. I try not to, but I can't help myself. I review the whole scene, find alternative endings, think of what I've should have said, etc.


But what if I managed to simply accept and observe this feeling without absolutely trying to find its cause, without identifying to it, without trying to label it, to intellectualize it, to dissect it, to feed it? Maybe then it would not turn into a full-blown emotion, maybe it would not take a life of its own, not gain momentum? Maybe then I would be able to begin to transform it into something else, something useful for the Work? (or maybe not, maybe it's not the way it works?)

I'm just trying to understand all this correctly, because to me it's still very much wishful thinking. I (think) I understand the theory, but putting it in practice in another story.

edit: quote
I think that's actually quite useful to an extent Mrs. Tigersoap.

To MAO's question, a real-life manifestation of this is what we do here every day - it's the basis of self-observation. It's stopping the mechanical mind and emotions for that split second between the thought (usually self-referencing) and the lightening-fast emotion that follows it and develops into a drain because it is not based on reality; it is illusion and programs running.

At it's simplest level, it is self-observation that leads to control over ones horses - something that should be, at least, a very familiar concept at this point, MAO. Taking it from the conceptual, theoretical level to practice is key.
 

c.a.

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
OK, fair enough! You're right, I just drop that quote without much else, sorry. Here is what I think (I may be way off, of course):
Sometimes I get a 'nagging' feeling, like a pit in my stomach and I don't even know why (or maybe a feeling of sadness, of frustration, whatever). What I usually do is I try and find a reason for this. I review the events of the day, my thoughts, my readings, my conversations until I find what caused this feeling. Then, when I've managed to find it, I think about it. A lot. I try not to, but I can't help myself. I review the whole scene, find alternative endings, think of what I've should have said, etc.
Mrs.Tigersoap "Thanks" for taking a moment to elaborate your thoughts. Interesting about the feelings in the stomach. This sensation was that I've found was present during times of change. That a realization when I sensed a environmental, as job, emotional, in thoughts about relations, that being good or bad. Thing's that would have a major impact in my life.

Decisions that seemed to work out well when I headed the feeling and listened to as I married visual clues by watching sutulties happening in and around my and sphere so to speak the little things in life. It was when I didn't heed that pit feeling and perhaps let cation go to the wind that I found trouble, and at times life and death situations moving into my life by not heeding to to the voice of the stomach.

I would come compare it to and like green and red light with yellow mixed in for caution. I also found that more listened the voice in the pit of my stomach the stronger I became in the decision making processes in trusting instincts. As if to say being able make a decision standing on 2 feet, like a strength in figuring things out.

Perhaps I could say that the better chess player plays a stronger opponent to gain insight in his weakness and in the process becomes a better chess player.and a stronger opponent. Now correct me if wrong but I have heard this expressed as gift of the higher self.
 

c.a.

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
To MAO's question, a real-life manifestation of this is what we do here every day - it's the basis of self-observation. It's stopping the mechanical mind and emotions for that split second between the thought (usually self-referencing) and the lightening-fast emotion that follows it and develops into a drain because it is not based on reality; it is illusion and programs running.

At it's simplest level, it is self-observation that leads to control over ones horses - something that should be, at least, a very familiar concept at this point, MAO. Taking it from the conceptual, theoretical level to practice is key.
"Thanks" anart for the perspective and direction to this question. I believe that it might have some value to express that when caution was ignored that the snakes come a knocking. As this is there arena when the ego manifest as thoughts as one thinking of being tricked to think that one being smarter than them on negative venues. This idea makes for trouble as to say the letting go of the horse's bridal and letting them run amuck not knowing the consequence's until it's to late and the feeding is over. And the collateral damage can be catastrophic if one has no knowledge of the possible self deception and deception. :curse:
 
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