The Gay "Germ" Hypothesis

[H-KQGE]

Here we go again on the merry-go-round of "it's all in your genes".

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2559021/Being-gay-DNA-researchers-claim-controversial-new-study.html

Being gay IS in your genes, say scientists in controversial new DNA study

·Two stretches of DNA linked to homosexuality in men discovered
·Strengthens claims homosexuality is decided by biology, not choice
·Fears breakthrough could be used to develop tests for expecting mothers
·Reignites debate over whether a 'gay gene' exists

By FIONA MACRAE SCIENCE CORRESPONDENT IN CHICAGO
PUBLISHED: 03:16, 14 February 2014 | UPDATED: 03:17, 14 February 2014

Being gay could be in the DNA.
Scientists have found two stretches of DNA linked to homosexuality in men.
The confirmation of the existence of a ‘gay gene’ or genes will strengthen arguments that homosexuality is a matter of biology, rather than choice.

However, it also raises the prospect of a genetic test that could be used by insurance companies to discriminate against clients or by pregnant women to abort gay babies.
In the study, Chicago University researchers analysed the DNA of more than 400 pairs of gay brothers, recruited at Gay Pride festivals at marches over several years.

WHAT MAKES A HOMOSEXUAL?
Other studies suggests that conditions in the womb also influence sexual orientation.
For instance, the more older male siblings a man has, the greater chance he will be gay.
Scientists say the phenomenon cannot be explained by the youngest boy being babied and mollycoddled or other differences in the way they are brought up.
It is thought that carrying a male baby in the womb triggers an immune response in the mother, creating antibodies that attack part of the unborn child's brain linked to sexual orientation.
This response gets stronger the more boys a woman carries, raising the odds of homosexuality.
Exposure to hormones in the womb is also likely to be important and some argue that upbringing plays a role in sexuality.

This revealed flagged up two pieces of DNA that seem to be linked to homosexuality.
It is not known which of the many genes they contain are key or how they affect the development of sexual orientation.
However, the result, revealed at the American Association for the Advancement of Science’s prestigious annual conference, backs up a contentious 1993 study.
That research, the first to find evidence of a ‘gay gene’, created a storm of controversy, which was further fuelled when other scientists failed to find a genetic link.

Dr Michael Bailey from Northwestern University in Illinois, who contributed to the latest study, said it is the biggest of its kind.
He added: ‘Sexual orientation has nothing to do with choice. Our findings suggest there may be genes at play – we found evidence for two sets that affect whether a man is gay or straight.
‘Although this could one day lead to a pre-natal test for male sexual orientation, it would not be very accurate, as there are other factors that can influence the outcome.’
Despite this, he would not would not object to a prenatal test being developed.
He said: ‘Clearly parents should not be allowed to torture or kill babies. But they can currently choose to terminate a pregnancy early on, so they should be allowed to have as much information on the future child as possible.’

Qazi Rhaman, a King’s College London psychologist, said that genes are thought account for up to 40 per cent of a person’s sexual orientation is governed by genes, and that it is likely that many genes are involved.

This would make developing a genetic test incredibly difficult.
He said: ‘There is no real risk of anyone finding a 'genetic test' for sexual orientation based on these or any of the scientific findings about the genetics of sexuality from the past 20 years.
‘The reason is that there is no gay gene. You are not going to be able to develop a test to find them all.’
Dr Rhaman, who has written a book about sexual orientation, added that all psychological traits involve genetics and people should not be afraid about link homosexuality to genes.
Richard Lane, of gay rights organisation, Stonewall, said that while studies into the origins of homosexuality have yet to produce convincing evidence, they do to point to a biological root.
He said: ‘The thing that’s consistent across all of them is that they all point to sexual orientation being something fundamental to a person rather than the lifestyle choice some opponents of equality repeatedly suggest.’

Other studies suggests that conditions in the womb also influence sexual orientation.
For instance, the more older male siblings a man has, the greater chance he will be gay.
Scientists say the phenomenon cannot be explained by the youngest boy being babied and mollycoddled or other differences in the way they are brought up.
It is thought that carrying a male baby in the womb triggers an immune response in the mother, creating antibodies that attack part of the unborn child's brain linked to sexual orientation.
This response gets stronger the more boys a woman carries, raising the odds of homosexuality.
Exposure to hormones in the womb is also likely to be important and some argue that upbringing plays a role in sexuality.

Parts of that sounded dodgy to me but it's to be expected I suppose. I think that you can choose orientation to a degree. Some people try the same gender typically in adolescence, sometimes later in their teens perhaps due to the chemical mix at the initial stages of puberty creating an urge, & trying to suppress that because of social conventions. So some might do this, decide "not for me" & feel the urge/need/drive for the opposite sex.

Then again those same could lie to themselves & try to force the issue. A sad state of affairs, & yet another damming indictment on our global culture. Anyway, parts of that article makes me think of a dystopian sci-fi narrative, I doubt that scanning for "gay babies" (feel ridiculous just quoting that) will happen... planetary weather problems, famine & disease should occupy minds but you never know with a thoroughly ponerized world.

I'm thinking of the transcripts & the talk about the "imprinting window" for children, the interaction between the little girl/boy with the opposite gender (attraction or something) in a non-sexual way. Can anyone quote that for this thread? I get lost in a sea of session transcripts when I search for anything.

 

[Laura]

As I mentioned in the "Abion's Seed" thread I started today, that has led to a few interesting finds and this is one of them:

Greg Cochran's 'Gay Germ' Hypothesis – An Exercise in the Power of Germs

Updated, 10/17/15. See below! In this post, I will review Gregory Cochran's 'gay germ' hypothesis. I wanted to make an index of Cochran's posts from his and Henry Harpending's blog West Hunter that discuss it. These posts don't seem to all show up under the 'Homosexuality' category there, and I...

www.unz.com

The case for the gay germ is somewhat indirect, but very strong. Critics often level the charge that there is “no evidence” for Cochran’s hypothesis – i.e., that the offending pathogen has yet to be identified. But the claim that there is “no evidence” isn’t really true; there is in fact plenty of evidence. The facts are certainly consistent with a pathogenic explanation, even if we don’t have the pathogen itself nailed down. But, the most compelling evidence comes in the form of ruling out potential alternative explanations. This itself is a form of evidence. The Sherlock Holmes quote, “when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth,” is an excellent guiding principle, and is certainly valid here. As I’ve said before, there is something to be said for explanations, that, while maybe not conclusively proven, have the virtue in that they lack meaningful competition. This perhaps one of the clearest examples.

Further down, he says something funny:

Irony comes in because (obligate homosexual men, who what most are concerned with) were not “born that way” at all, since male homosexuality almost certainly is the result of a childhood infection.

Worse still, homophobia (or homoaversion, as it should properly called, according to Greg Cochran) is itself heritable, at least 54% so. Yes, homophobes were much more “born that way” than homosexuals themselves!

It doesn’t get much more ironic than that.

But the “born that way” meme does speak towards the prevailing attitude towards genetics. Nothing undesirable can be much heritable, for if it is so, it is seen as (not exactly accurately) being immutable. Hence, this is why sexual orientation can be inborn, but IQ, sex, or racial differences cannot.

And then, this interesting bit:

The diseases that afflict man, from homosexuality to cancer and heart disease, could be the result of nasty organisms that infiltrate our bodies and minds and attack from within. That pathogens could affect so much shouldn’t seem so bewildering, considering that our world is utterly awash in microorganisms. But no, researchers have been instead been generally wasting their time pursuing “lifestyle” as the main explanation for these illnesses (except in the case of homosexuality, as noted above). For some, mostly liberals, the belief that lifestyle is the root of our ills serves to give hope – hope that the things that ail us can be vanquished if we just get people to “eat better and exercise”. For others, mostly conservatives, the belief that the diseases of civilization are self-inflicted justifies haughtiness – giving one license to look down on the sick for their supposedly inferior lifestyles. It’s a tragic state of affairs.

The above perspective along with what we are witnessing in the current times, reminds me of this from the Cs:

A: You should know that these bloodlines become parasitically infected, harassed and tinkered with whenever a quantum leap of awareness is imminent. .... Such as "now".

Here is something for you to digest: Why is it that your scientists have overlooked the obvious when they insist that alien beings cannot travel to earth from a distant system???

Even if speed of light travel, or "faster," were not possible, and it is, of course, there is no reason why an alien race could not construct a space "ark," living for many generations on it. They could travel great distances through time and space, looking for a suitable world for conquest. Upon finding such, they could then install this ark in a distant orbit, build bases upon various solid planes in that solar system, and proceed to patiently manipulate the chosen civilizations to develop a suitable technological infrastructure. And then, after the instituting of a long, slow, and grand mind programming project, simply step in and take it over once the situation was suitable.

Q: (L) So... Are you suggesting that, for example, if there are people who get infectious diseases that cause atherosclerosis, heart disease, cancer, rheumatoid arthritis, multiple sclerosis, lupus, or any of these so-called autoimmune diseases, that these diseases are not genetically caused as they have been saying for the last 50 or 60 years, but that perhaps they were designed for people who carry certain genetic markers in their DNA, which then get labeled as the causative gene? Is that what we're getting at here?

A: Very close indeed. There is also the "tinkering" that can take place.

 

[Laura]

Depths of Madness

I’ve said it before, but it’s probably time to say it again. The most likely explanation for human homosexuality is that it is caused by some pathogen. It’s too common to be mut…

westhunt.wordpress.com

The most likely explanation for human homosexuality is that it is caused by some pathogen. It’s too common to be mutational pressure (and we don’t see syndromic versions, as we would in that case), it’s not new, identical twins are usually discordant (~75% of the time), and it’s hell on reproductive fitness. There is no way it is adaptive: the helpful gay uncle notion, group selection, compensating advantage in females, etc: these range from impossible to bloody unlikely. It doesn’t exist in most hunter-gatherers: you have to explain what it is you’re even talking about when you ask them. Presumably with diagrams.

Here is the "Gay Germ Hypothesis" more or less in a nutshell:

My model – not the only possible model based on a pathogen, but reasonable – leans on a couple of natural examples. One is narcolepsy. We now know that narcolepsy happens when a particular kind of neuron, concentrated in a little region in the hypothalamus, somehow gets zapped. 99% of narcolepsy cases happen in the 25% of the population that has a particular HLA type – which suggests that something, probably a virus, triggers an overenthusiastic immune response that zaps a neuron subpopulation that produce a particular neurotransmitter (called hypocretin or orexin) that regulates appetite and sleep patterns. And it doesn’t do anything else: narcoleptics aren’t stupid. You can compare narcolepsy to type I diabetes or Parkinson’s disease. Suppose there’s a neuron subpopulation that performs a key function in male sexual desire: wipe out that subpopulation, and Bob’s your uncle.

Another is toxoplasma, which we now know changes mouse behavior in ways that increase a mouse’s chance of being devoured by a cat, the definitive host for toxo. Infected mice are attracted to cat urine, while uninfected mice avoid it. In fact, in infected mice, cat urine apparently triggers activity in neural pathways involved in sexual arousal. Microorganisms can reprogram sexual attraction in mammals.

I have had people complain that I’m neglecting the social aspects of homosexuality, what it means, how people think of it. Let me tell you a story. In certain parts of west Africa, boys are expected to start menstruating around age 14. And they do, sort of: you start seeing blood in their urine. When that happens, there’s a big ceremony, everyone says ‘today you are a man’. Whatever. The thing is, that’s about the time they put the boys into the flooded rice fields, where they’re exposed to schistosoma haematobium, which causes urinary schistosomiasis. It’s bad for you: it can impair growth and cognitive development in children, reduces productivity, and is a potent cause of bladder cancer over the long term.

Our explanation of male menstruation as urinary schistosomiasis must undermine these people’s traditional culture. Eliminating schistosomiasis would undermine it even further, just as the rubella vaccine dealt a heavy blow to deaf culture by cutting the number of congenitally deaf children in half.

Isn’t that just too damn bad.

 

[Yozilla]

Oh yes very interesting stuff this homo plague thingy, almost feels like pandemics. I've also noticed some weird sensations while some homosexuals are walkin' and talkin' behind or towards me - like some strong entity/beast is trying to convert me to there side - excuse me, but than my butts began to shiver (in lack of better term ) like those already infected are radiating some strong homo force of some sort. So maybe this ain't only physical issue (bugs&co) but psychic phenomenon also. What a strange urge that is!

 

[Carl]

This dude has some courage to say such things in the modern environment, but I'm glad he did because it's very plausible even on the surface.

But if this is true then there is likely a lot more going on than just a pathogen leading to homosexuality. It makes one think of the weird sexual fetishes some people tend to have, and various "kinks" that are much celebrated in popular culture through the likes of Cosmopolitan etc.

Then going deeper, what if our choices in potential partners are entirely dictated by a pathogen? I mean if its powerful enough to cause somebody to be attracted to only men and not women, it stands to reason that there's a bunch of other baddies out there capable of producing similarly striking effects. Maybe it caused you to ignore your perfect match and be attracted to a totally different partner, and you would never even know?

And if a pathogen can change your sexual tastes, or candida can make you crave sugar, what else is possible? Can they only affect crude primal desires, or are there more sophisticated ones we have no clue about? How about virii that affect different emotions, make you believe lies, even construct their own narratives in your mind? God that's pretty awful to think about.

 

[Jones]

I wonder what happens to those homosexuals that do the ketogenic diet, take high dose vitamin C and do the iodine protocol etc? What if they kill off the pathogen, do they go through a change in attractions? I note that so far the topic is talking about male homosexuals, what about female homosexuals?

 

[Laura]

I wonder what happens to those homosexuals that do the ketogenic diet, take high dose vitamin C and do the iodine protocol etc? What if they kill off the pathogen, do they go through a change in attractions? I note that so far the topic is talking about male homosexuals, what about female homosexuals?

Yes, he comments on female homosexuality in the article. Go read it; it's not long.

 

[Laura]

An article devoted to female SSAs.

Female Same-Sex Attraction Revisited

An enduring mystery (among many mysteries) is the existence of women exhibiting sexual attraction to other women. Unlike male homosexuality, where a likely explanation has been put forth (see Greg Cochran’s “Gay Germ” Hypothesis – An Exercise in the Power of Germs), female same-sex attraction...

www.unz.com

Now, is all of this compatible with a pathogenic source for female SSA? Absolutely, especially if the true heritability turns out to be truly low. See Peter Frost (Yes, Demons Do Exist). Perhaps the recent trend towards more women displaying SSA is due to the spread of a new pathogen. Time will tell. However, unlike male homosexuality, I don’t think we can retire the pure genetic explanation, yet.

 

[Jones]

I was just reading that too - amending my post to remove the quote already posted.

There seems to be a bit of wiggle room in the gay germ theory with female homosexuals.

Edited to add: I don't identify with promiscuity and have had a fairly low sex drive.

Rather, if it is actually genetic in nature, then the most likely explanation appears to be that it is some sort of side effect of something else. I suspect that it may be due to sexual antagonistic selection. That is, its existence may be driven by selection on alleles that have positive effects in men.

The other article linked in the second quote above is also interesting. It covers germ theory in relationship to promiscuity, unfaithfulness, masturbation, and homosexuality and ends with the following:

This is a fun subject when it concerns silly mice or zombie ants. But now it concerns us. And that’s not so funny. Can microbes really develop such demonic abilities to change our private thoughts and feelings?

It does seem hard to believe. Perhaps this is an argument for intelligent design. After all, only an all-knowing designer could have made creatures that are so small and yet capable of so much … things like inducing abortion, breaking up marriages, and altering normal sexual desires. Yes, such an argument could be made.

But I don’t think anyone will bother.

emphasis, mine.

Yes, Demons Do Exist

Are we being manipulated by microbes? The idea is not so whacky. We know that a wide range of microscopic parasites have evolved the ability to manipulate their hosts, even to the point of making the host behave in strange ways. A well-known example is Toxoplasma gondii, a protozoan whose life...

www.unz.com

 

[Laura]

The other article linked in the second quote above is also interesting. It covers germ theory in relationship to promiscuity, unfaithfulness, masturbation, and homosexuality and ends with the following:

This is a fun subject when it concerns silly mice or zombie ants. But now it concerns us. And that’s not so funny. Can microbes really develop such demonic abilities to change our private thoughts and feelings?

It does seem hard to believe. Perhaps this is an argument for intelligent design. After all, only an all-knowing designer could have made creatures that are so small and yet capable of so much … things like inducing abortion, breaking up marriages, and altering normal sexual desires. Yes, such an argument could be made.

But I don’t think anyone will bother.

emphasis, mine.

Well, that is going where the data leads, isn't it?

And that's pretty much what the Cs said.

 

[bianca etezete]

Thank you, Laura, for bringng this up. This is mind boggling and caught me with a question: Do you think that the germs alone can do this, or do you think that an aware person, infested with these germs, can counter that draught to homosexuality, promiscuity whatsoever. Through awareness. And that this person could take action and get rid of the germs and be "normal" again. Or do you think that if you have these germs then there is no getting out of this? Does that sound stupid? I hope not.

 

[Laura]

Thank you, Laura, for bringng this up. This is mind boggling and caught me with a question: Do you think that the germs alone can do this, or do you think that an aware person, infested with these germs, can counter that draught to homosexuality, promiscuity whatsoever. Through awareness. And that this person could take action and get rid of the germs and be "normal" again. Or do you think that if you have these germs then there is no getting out of this? Does that sound stupid? I hope not.

I have no clue. Reading what some of these researchers are writing about this, it seems they don't either. I believe I read that they thought that once infected, no cure. Maybe that's because the pathogen has not been identified.

Having said that, I suppose that the body's ability to heal itself with the right support could be unlimited. But if you don't know the pathogen, you don't know exactly what to do.

Perhaps some general thing would do it, like high doses of Vit C with DMSO in IV drips on some given schedule??? Just dunno.

 

[JGeropoulas]

Oh yes very interesting stuff this homo plague thingy, almost feels like pandemics. I've also noticed some weird sensations while some homosexuals are walkin' and talkin' behind or towards me - like some strong entity/beast is trying to convert me to there side - excuse me, but than my butts began to shiver (in lack of better term ) like those already infected are radiating some strong homo force of some sort. So maybe this ain't only physical issue (bugs&co) but psychic phenomenon also. What a strange urge that is!

Your comment seems to reflect a shocking degree of homophobia and inconsideration for gay members of this forum (i.e. "homo plague thingy," "strong homo force"), which is hard to excuse even if you were born that way: "Worse still, homophobia (or homoaversion, as it should properly called, according to Greg Cochran) is itself heritable, at least 54% so. Yes, homophobes were much more “born that way” than homosexuals themselves!"

 

[JGeropoulas]

Here are some comments from the C's to add context to this intriguing discussion:

MARCH 18, 1995 SESSION:
Q: (L) Here's another of the kid's questions: When and why did homosexuality originate?
A: It originated when sexuality did.

MARCH 28, 2010 SESSION:
Q: (L) So say a female infant is hardwired to be triggered by the presence of the pheromone of a male, and the interaction is pleasant, then what is supposed to get written to the circuit gets written, and everything is fine. If the pheromone opens the window and what happens in the interaction is extremely unpleasant, then everything gets screwed up. And possibly it could be that if there is some genetic difference in the infant, then maybe they are set up so that the pheromones of a female will open the window. So, there are a number of possibilities here. It's obviously an interactive thing that triggers it, writes the circuit, and whatever. (Ailén) So the way that some homosexuals are overidentified with being gay, like gay bars and that stuff, that has to be just cultural then...?
A: The gay "movement" is a CIA program incepted by 4D STS designed to set up antipathy, differences, and to identify individuals for purposes of inflicting further suffering.
Q: (L) Huh.
A: It is the soul that counts.

DECEMBER 29, 2018 SESSION:
(Joe) At present, kind of the whole radical feminist agenda is simply a means to that end?
A: Yes
Q: (L) And I would say it has been from the beginning. We're talking about long, slow, patient manipulation. The C's said it years ago. It's to get everybody programmed to be the way they want them to be when they come to take over so that we'll all be "worthy" subjects. It's creepy.
(Joe) Is that in any way connected to homosexuality?
A: Yes
Q: (Joe) Is homosexuality a deliberate tinkering with humanity that is a reflection of a 4D STS mindset?
A: Yes
Q: (Niall) Is 4D STS gay?
A: No. It is about power not sex.
Q: (Pierre) We see this in the human world in pedophile rings. It's not about sex at all, it's not about love pleasure at all. It's about power.
(Joe) And domination.
A: There is a small percentage of "normal" homosexuality. [see this post for some important distinctions Session 14 October 2017 ]
Q: (L) So it is a normal variation like other variations in different human traits, most often due to things like karma or a difference in the order of imprinting, delivery of hormones, or whatever.

 

[bianca etezete]

I agree on the self healing possibilities a human has, besides that it is funny that you mention DMSO here. You know, i have two cats and a dog. I mostly (only when I am sure I cannot make anything worse) treat my pets myself. With globuli or whatever. My miracle healing potion is DMSO. When I do not know what to do, DMSO is the way. And it works all the time. My dog had strange holes in the skin of his groin some weeks ago. Quite deep. I knew it will cost me at least 400 Euro to have a vet fix it. So I poured DMSO over the wounds, two times a day, three to five drops. After two days the holes were closed. After four days you couldn't see anything there. Amazing stuff.