AUTOIMMUNE DISEASES CAUSED BY AN INFECTION?

Shijing said:
Thanks, Altair, for finding that information about EDTA -- it seems the biofilm/heavy metal connection might be worth following up on. Here's an interesting interview from Tick Talk Ireland:

http://www.ticktalkireland.org/biofilms.html

Focus: What exactly is your therapy and what sequence do you use?

Cohen: I start with enzymes like nattokinase and lumbrokinase, as well as other mucolytic enzymes, to get the best, broad fibrinolytic effect. Dr. Usman feels nattokinase is particularly good at degrading strep biofilms and I think that strep is a very big player in these childrens’ health. I will run strep titers and they will be extraordinarily high. And these children—and certainly some adults as well—will manifest strep as a comorbid infection that has significant implications for neurological function. They will have very OCD type tendencies, and sometimes almost psychotic outbursts. There isn’t a precise, sudden onset with obvious symptoms.

Focus: How much do you recommend?

Cohen: Remember, these patients are very young; some are just a few years old. So I will recommend half a capsule of each, two times a day. That would be a 50 milligram capsule of nattokinase, and a 20 milligram capsule of lumbrokinase. First do the enzymes along with EDTA, then thirty minutes later, add in an arsenal of antimicrobials. I use formulations containing berberine, artemisinin, citrus seed extract, black walnut hulls, artemisia herb, echinacea, goldenseal, gentian, tea tree oil, fumitory, gentian, galbanum oil, oregano oil, neem, and pharmaceuticals as well when necessary, such as Vancomycin, Diflucan, Gentamycin. I use a different one every day. Then an hour later you come in with the binders to help mop up the debris. I use chitosan, citrus pectin, a special bicarbonate formula, organic germanium, chlorella and others. I also use buffering agents, such as buffered vitamin C, since when the body is destroying bacteria it becomes acidic. Minerals must be assessed, and repleted when necessary. I test bloodwork and “pees and poos” (urine and stool) every two months to monitor the process.

The above sounds like a treatment model that addresses most issues, at least for children with diseases of the autism spectrum. It uses biofilm destroyers/blood circulation enzymes, metal detox, antimicrobial treatment with natural oils and herbs, antifungal & antibiotic meds, detox agents, etc.

I did a search on nattokinase and lumbrokinase:

Nattokinase: Powerful Enzyme Prevents Heart Attack and Stroke
http://www.smart-publications.com/articles/nattokinase-powerful-enzyme-prevents-heart-attack-and-stroke

Cardiovascular disease is the leading cause of death for men and women

According to the U.S. Centers for Disease Control, each year about 700,000 people suffer a stroke, the leading cause of serious, long-term disability in the United States. The American Heart Association estimates that nearly every year, about 1 million Americans will suffer a heart attack. About 700,000 of these will be first-time heart attack sufferers, while approximately 500,000 will be people who have previously had a heart attack. It all adds up to this: contrary to popular belief, heart attack and stroke account for more deaths than all cancers and injuries combined, and one out of every 2.4 deaths is attributable to cardiovascular disease. How is that possible in the richest, most highly educated country on earth?

Most of us all get too little exercise, accumulate too much stress, and eat a poor diet laden with saturated fat, refined sugar and too little fiber. Add to that list the habit of smoking and the answer is quite clear. (Although there is a considerably higher prevalence of cigarette smoking in Japan than in the U.S., mortality from CVD among men in Japan is still less than half of that in the U.S.3) And to make matters worse, a study published in The Journal of the American Medical Association (3/6/2002) indicates that exposure to air pollution can cause some 10,000 fatal heart attacks a year in the U.S.!

Mainstream health care has banded together with the pharmaceutical industry to offer a temporary quick fix for the number one killer of our time. Statin drugs reduce cholesterol. Aspirin and warfarin thin the blood. Anti-hypertension medications reduce blood pressure. Bypass surgery, and angioplasty clear the arteries. Essentially, they all help prolong the life of a patient with cardiovascular disease (CVD). But none of these drugs or procedures is without risk or side effects. Well, we've got good news for you!

CVD risk can be greatly reduced by modifying lifestyle and adding nutritional supplements proven to support cardiovascular health. Most of us are aware that eating a lighter, more balanced diet, quitting tobacco and exercising regularly are enough to head off most cases of heart disease before they ever happen. Now there's something else you can do.

Nattokinase has been shown to support normal blood pressure, dissolve blood clots and prevent them from forming in the first place!

What Is Nattokinase?

Nattokinase is a potent fibrinolytic (anti-clotting) enzyme complex extracted and highly purified from a traditional Japanese food called Natto. Natto is a fermented cheese-like food that has been used in Japanese culture for more than 1,000 years for its popular taste, and as a folk remedy for heart and vascular diseases. Research has shown that Nattokinase supports the body in breaking up and dissolving the unhealthy coagulation of blood. In fact, it has been shown to have four times greater fibrinolytic activity than plasmin.4

How is it made?

Natto is produced by a fermentation process by adding the bacteria Bacillus subtilis to boiled soybeans. The resulting Nattokinase enzyme is produced when Bacillus subtilis acts on the soybeans. While other soy foods contain enzymes, it is only the natto preparation that contains the specific Nattokinase enzyme. How was Nattokinase discovered? Japanese researcher Dr. Hiroyuki Sumi had spent many years searching for a natural thrombolytic agent that could successfully dissolve blood clots associated with heart attacks and stroke. Finally in 1980, after testing more than 173 natural foods, Sumi found what he was looking for.

Natto, a traditional Japanese soy cheese, was dropped onto an artificial thrombus (fibrin) in a petri dish and allowed to stand at 37ºC (approximately body temperature). Over the next 18 hours, the thrombus around the natto completely dissolved! Sumi named the newly discovered enzyme Nattokinase, which means "enzyme in natto." Dr. Sumi remarked that Nattokinase showed "a potency matched by no other enzyme." 56{pagebreak}

How blood clots form

Blood clotting is a natural process that allows the blood to thicken and form a clot or thrombus of blood cells. When a blood vessel is injured, platelets clump together and strands of the blood protein fibrin glue them together in order to stop the bleeding. Eventually the clot helps form a protective scab over a healing wound. If our bodies did not have the ability to clot blood, we would bleed to death after even a minor cut, which was often the case with hemophiliacs.

But sometimes blood clots form even when a person has not been wounded or cut. Although most blood clots naturally dissolve on their own without complications, there are two situations in which they can wreak havoc before they are reabsorbed by the body.

A thrombus can form in an artery which could block the flow of blood and cut off oxygen supply. This can trigger a heart attack and result in damage, destruction (infarction), or even death of the tissues (necrosis) in the heart. In the brain, blood clots also block blood and oxygen from reaching necessary areas, which can result in senility and/or stroke.5

A piece of the blood clot could form in one of the heart's chambers and then travel through the bloodstream, lodging in either an organ or an artery and cutting off the blood supply from that point, causing an embolism. An embolism is especially dangerous when it ends up in a lung.

The most common cause of these emboli are blood clots that form during atrial fibrillation. This is a disorder found in about 2 million Americans. In atrial fibrillation the heart's two small upper chambers (the atria) quiver instead of beating effectively. Some blood isn't pumped completely out of them when the heart beats, so it pools and clots. When a blood clot enters the circulation and lodges in a narrowed artery of the brain, a stroke occurs.

The chances of developing thrombi increase as we age

Although the human body produces more than 20 enzymes for making blood clots, it produces only one enzyme—plasmin—for dissolving them. The problem is, as we age the production of plasmin slows down, making the blood more prone to coagulation. And since plasmin is produced by endothelial cells throughout the body, it is possible to develop blood clots anywhere in the body.

To make matters worse, fibrinogen levels rise as we age.7 And high levels of fibrinogen levels usually lead to increased platelet aggregation, blood clots, and eventually heart attack or stroke. In fact, high fibrinogen levels are considered a more dangerous risk factor for heart attack and stroke than high cholesterol. A study of 2,116 men found that those with high LDL (bad) cholesterol but low fibrinogen levels had only one sixth the risk for heart attack than the men with low LDL and high fibrinogen.8

How does it work

Nattokinase enhances the body's natural ability to fight blood clots, and has an advantage over blood thinners because it has a prolonged effect without side effects.

Nattokinase:

Supports normal blood pressure
Prevents blood clots from forming
Dissolves existing blood clots
Dissolves fibrin
Enhances the body's production of plasmin and other clot-dissolving agents, including urokinase


Research studies

Nattokinase has been the subject of 17 studies, including two small human trials. In 1990, Dr. Sumi's research team published a series of studies demonstrating the fibrinolytic effects of Nattokinase.9 Here are some of them:

Dissolves blood clots

Researchers from JCR Pharmaceuticals, Oklahoma State University, and Miyazaki Medical College, tested Nattokinase on 12 healthy Japanese volunteers (6 men and 6 women, between the ages of 21 and 55). The researchers gave the volunteers 7 ounces of natto (the food) before breakfast, and then tracked fibrinolytic activity through a series of blood plasma tests.

In one test, a blood sample was taken and a thrombus (clot) was artificially induced. The amount of time needed to dissolve the clot was cut in half within 2 hours of treatment, compared to the control group. Additionally, the volunteers retained an enhanced ability to dissolve blood clots for up to 8 hours.9

Dr. Sumi's team also induced blood clots in a major leg vein in male dogs that had been given either four capsules of Nattokinase (250 mg per capsule) or four placebo capsules. Angiograms (x-rays of blood vessels) showed that the blood clots in the dogs that received Nattokinase had completely dissolved within 5 hours of treatment, and that normal blood circulation had been restored. Blood clots in the dogs who received the placebo showed no sign of dissolving 18 hours after the treatment.9

Researchers from Biotechnology Research Laboratories and JCR Pharmaceuticals Co. of Kobe, Japan, tested Nattokinase's ability to dissolve a blood clot in the carotid arteries of rats. Animals treated with Nattokinase regained 62 percent of blood flow, whereas those treated with plasmin regained just 15.8 percent of blood flow.19

In another laboratory study, endothelial damage was induced in the femoral arteries of rats that had been given Nattokinase. In normal circumstances, a thickening of the artery walls and blood clotting would occur, but they were both suppressed because of Nattokinase's fibrinolytic activity.10

Helps reduce high blood pressure

Human volunteers with high blood pressure were given 30 grams of natto extract (equivalent to 7 ounces of natto food), orally for 4 consecutive days. In 4 out of 5 volunteers, the systolic blood pressure decreased on average from 173.8 to 154.8. Diastolic blood pressure decreased on average from 101.0 to 91.2. This data represents about a 10.9 percent drop in systolic blood pressure and a 9.7 percent drop in diastolic blood pressure.5911

Wistar rats that were given natto extract showed a significant drop in systolic blood pressure also, from an average of 166 to 145 in just two hours, which further decreased to an average of 144 in 3 hours. This data represents an approximate 12.7 percent drop in systolic blood pressure also, from an average of 166 to 145 in just two hours, which further decreased to an average of 144 in three hours. This data represents an approximate 12.7 percent drop in systolic blood pressure within two hours.5,9,11

These tests all indicate that Nattokinase generates a heightened ability in the body to dissolve blood clots.{pagebreak}

Restores blood circulation

This is one of the most dramatic, documented stories about the effects of Nattokinase. A 58-year-old man had a blood clot in the retina of his right eye that caused fluid build up and bleeding. He started losing his vision in that eye and was admitted to a university hospital, where researchers prescribed a 3-ounce dose of natto to be taken before bed every night, in order to get the benefit of Nattokinase.

The man's bleeding completely stopped by the tenth day, and by the 20th day, his vision returned and he was released from the hospital. He continued to eat natto twice a week. When he had a retinal angiogram two months later, it showed that the blood clot was completely gone.12

Is Nattokinase for everyone?

This soy extract is considered extremely useful for those wanting a safe, drugless, non-aspirin alternative for healthy blood flow. Nattokinase is also a safe alternative for those who are off their feet because of illness, injury (including paralysis), or surgery.

Excellent for periods of inactivity

In the past few years, medical professionals began alerting the public about the increasing evidence that long flights and car trips put people at risk for deep vein thrombosis (DVT)—a blood clot that develops in a deep vein, usually in the leg. DVT is more common in women than in men, and in those over 40 years of age.

Deep vein thrombosis

DVT—blood clots inside veins found deep in extremities or body cavities—is a common disorder. A venous thrombus is a clump of blood cells, platelets, and fibrin (clot) which attaches to the inside walls of veins, can grow in size, and break off to travel downstream from the clot. If the clot stays localized, it can cause swelling and vein irritation. If part of it breaks off, it can cause blockage downstream, or become an embolus and result in a pulmonary embolus. In some instances, deep vein thrombosis may also contribute to other serious medical problems such as heart attack and stroke.

How safe is Nattokinase?

It is very safe when used according to the recommended dosage. People with ulcers, recent or pending surgery, or recent major trauma should not take Nattokinase. Anyone who has ever had neurosurgery or ischemic stroke in the previous six months should not take Nattokinase, as well as those who have had intracranial bleeding. Generally, people with bleeding disorders, or taking anti-clotting medication, should use this product only under the close supervision of a medical doctor.

Researchers have found that Nattokinase is four times more potent than plasmin, and works even more effectively than warfarin drugs because it continues to work for long periods of time, and it doesn't produce any side effects.

Conclusion

The traditional Japanese food Natto has been used safely for more than 1,000 years. The safety record of its potent fibrinolytic enzyme, Nattokinase, is based upon the long-term traditional use of the food and recent scientific studies.

Nattokinase has many benefits including its prolonged effects, cost effectiveness, and its ability to be used preventatively. It is a naturally occurring, food-based dietary supplement that has demonstrated stability in the gastrointestinal tract, as well as to changes in pH and temperature. It is definitely a nutritional supplement to consider adding to a cardiovascular health maintenance plan.

This article is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. Always consult with a physician before embarking on a dietary supplement program.

References

Soy intake shown to reduce mortality rate from cancer and CVD. Nagata C. Ecological study of the association between soy product intake and mortality from cancer and heart disease in Japan. Int J Epidemiol. 2000 Oct;29(5):832-6.

Fujita M, Nomura K, Hong K, Ito Y, Asada A, Nishimuro S. Biochem Biophys Res Commun 1993 Dec 30;197(3):1340-7 Biotechnology Research Laboratories, JCR Pharmaceuticals Co., Ltd., Kobe, Japan.

Clinical trials.gov. Epidemiology of Coronary Heart Disease in Men Aged 40 and Over. August 2004. National Institutes of Health. Sept. 13, 2004.
Link ↑
Suzuki Y, Kondo K, Ichise H, Tsukamoto Y, Urano T, Umemura K. Dietary supplementation with fermented soybeans suppresses intimal thickening. Nutrition. 2003 Mar;19(3):261-4.

Prevent Heart Attack and Stroke with Potent Enzyme that Dissolves Deadly Blood Clots in Hours. Health Sciences Institute, March 2002.

Hager, K. et al. Fibrinogen and Aging. Aging (Milano) 1994, 6:133-38.

Heinrich, J. et al. Fibrinogen and factor VII in the prediction of coronary risk. Arterioscler Thromb 1994, 14:54-59.

Sumi H. Interview With Doctor of Medicine Hiroyuki Sumi. Japan Bio Science Laboratory Co. Ltd.

Sumi, H. et al. "Enhancement of the fibrinolytic activity in plasma by oral administration of nattokinase." Acta haematol 1990, 84: 139-43.

Suzuki Y, Kondo K, Matsumoto Y, Zhao BQ, Otsuguro K, Maeda T, Tsukamoto Y, Urano T, Umemura K. Dietary supplementation of fermented soybean, natto, suppresses intimal thickening and modulates the lysis of mural thrombi after endothelial injury in rat femoral artery. Life Sci. 2003 Jul 25;73(10):1289-98.

Maruyama M, Sumi H. Effect of Natto Diet on Blood Pressure.JTTAS, 1995.

Nishimura, K. et al. Natto diet was apparently effective in a case of incipient central retinal vein occlusion. Japan Rev Clin Ophthalmol1994, 88:1381-85.

And lumbrokinase is made from earth worms :shock:

Here's a site, I can't seem to copy/paste from there http://nattokinasehearthealth.com/60/what-is-lumbrokinase/
 
No those were not the threads I was thinking of, truth seeker. But thanks for your help. If I remember correctly, they were from maybe 2007.

I still have a bunch of EDTA from the iron protocol.

About the Sycrometer of Hulda Clark, I never tried to build and use one because the detection process is quite involved. You need microscope slides of all pathogens you're looking for, and tissue samples also to put on the plates to know where the pathogens are. FWIW.
 
SeekinTruth said:
No those were not the threads I was thinking of, truth seeker. But thanks for your help. If I remember correctly, they were from maybe 2007.

Maybe this "Mycoplasma: An Interesting Trail ?"

https://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=6058.0

Probably best I used my search skills earlier before my post on Dr Clark, seems its well discussed already :)
 
Yeah, earthworms again! :)

It's curious, how the Leechbook from over 1000 years ago recommends earthworms for similar conditions. And it seems, that the Chinese have known this even way before that.
 
alkhemst said:
SeekinTruth said:
No those were not the threads I was thinking of, truth seeker. But thanks for your help. If I remember correctly, they were from maybe 2007.

Maybe this "Mycoplasma: An Interesting Trail ?"

https://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=6058.0

Probably best I used my search skills earlier before my post on Dr Clark, seems its well discussed already :)

No, that was the only thread that came up that had any relevance when I kept trying different searches (though it's only tangentially relevant - as I used mycoplasma as a keyword). Thanks for your help too. The threads I'm thinking of have very long background material on the military development of mycoplasma and other pathogens as biological weapons and also testing them on the unsuspecting public. At least one of them also included the work of Donald Scott.
 
SeekinTruth said:
About the Sycrometer of Hulda Clark, I never tried to build and use one because the detection process is quite involved. You need microscope slides of all pathogens you're looking for, and tissue samples also to put on the plates to know where the pathogens are. FWIW.

The Syncrometer does not operate as a resonant oscillator as claimed. If anything it is like a dowsing device. This leads me to think that dowsing or similar methods may be as effective or even moreso.
 
Well, we sure have accumulated a raft of information about what helps and how, and what doesn't, or might be only marginally useful. I suppose it would be very helpful if we could organize these things into a document with chapter headings, quotes and references, and a brief review of what the product or therapy does, how it is applied, etc. It's certainly enough for a very valuable book! Plus, I would like to have it all in one place.
 
Laura said:
Well, we sure have accumulated a raft of information about what helps and how, and what doesn't, or might be only marginally useful. I suppose it would be very helpful if we could organize these things into a document with chapter headings, quotes and references, and a brief review of what the product or therapy does, how it is applied, etc. It's certainly enough for a very valuable book! Plus, I would like to have it all in one place.

I was thinking the same thing, and started a document, but was stumbling over the fact that I still needed to connect a lot of these dots before I could really figure out where to start, what was relevant, etc. Think that I've got a good enough overview to be able to help out now though, at least in the area of organizing what has been posted into different categories. It'd be an excellent opportunity to connect these dots, so count me in.
 
Altair said:
Very interesting presentation.

The Clinical Implications of Gastrointestinal Biofilm with Stephen F. Olmsted, MD


https://youtu.be/hgrLBEKobxU

There are some screenshots from the video in the attached PDF (_http://www.multibriefs.com/briefs/icim/biofilm.pdf)
 

Attachments

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Hesper said:
Laura said:
Well, we sure have accumulated a raft of information about what helps and how, and what doesn't, or might be only marginally useful. I suppose it would be very helpful if we could organize these things into a document with chapter headings, quotes and references, and a brief review of what the product or therapy does, how it is applied, etc. It's certainly enough for a very valuable book! Plus, I would like to have it all in one place.

I was thinking the same thing, and started a document, but was stumbling over the fact that I still needed to connect a lot of these dots before I could really figure out where to start, what was relevant, etc. Think that I've got a good enough overview to be able to help out now though, at least in the area of organizing what has been posted into different categories. It'd be an excellent opportunity to connect these dots, so count me in.

If I had time, what I would do would be to copy/paste the best stuff into a word doc. I would use the various headers to sort/organize stuff because they show up the navigation pane on the left. So, when you come to a piece of info that goes under a particular heading/sub-heading, you can click in the pane and jump to that section and paste it there. I guess just getting the stuff into a document with each extract of text given a header will then evolve into an organizational system just be reading the headers. Word is very handy for doing this sort of thing. I find it indispensable for writing about history because I can make dates/years as headers and whenever I come across a bit that belongs in a particular year, I just jump there, paste it in and go to the next bit. This can be refined right down to months and days... which is handy!
 
Laura said:
If I had time, what I would do would be to copy/paste the best stuff into a word doc. I would use the various headers to sort/organize stuff because they show up the navigation pane on the left. So, when you come to a piece of info that goes under a particular heading/sub-heading, you can click in the pane and jump to that section and paste it there. I guess just getting the stuff into a document with each extract of text given a header will then evolve into an organizational system just be reading the headers. Word is very handy for doing this sort of thing. I find it indispensable for writing about history because I can make dates/years as headers and whenever I come across a bit that belongs in a particular year, I just jump there, paste it in and go to the next bit. This can be refined right down to months and days... which is handy!

I love doing that! It's very handy. The only problem is I don't have word right now, but there are several work-arounds for that, including emailing myself the document and working on it from another computer, or someone else on the forum editing it as we go along. Sounds like a great place to start though, and since I just got Plague Time I've also got a better framework from which to view this incredibly complex (and quite horrendous) situation. It's quite fascinating and, with a little bit of time, say a day or two, I should have a word document to report back with. Best to you on your healing!
 
Hesper said:
Laura said:
If I had time, what I would do would be to copy/paste the best stuff into a word doc. I would use the various headers to sort/organize stuff because they show up the navigation pane on the left. So, when you come to a piece of info that goes under a particular heading/sub-heading, you can click in the pane and jump to that section and paste it there. I guess just getting the stuff into a document with each extract of text given a header will then evolve into an organizational system just be reading the headers. Word is very handy for doing this sort of thing. I find it indispensable for writing about history because I can make dates/years as headers and whenever I come across a bit that belongs in a particular year, I just jump there, paste it in and go to the next bit. This can be refined right down to months and days... which is handy!

I love doing that! It's very handy. The only problem is I don't have word right now, but there are several work-arounds for that, including emailing myself the document and working on it from another computer, or someone else on the forum editing it as we go along. Sounds like a great place to start though, and since I just got Plague Time I've also got a better framework from which to view this incredibly complex (and quite horrendous) situation. It's quite fascinating and, with a little bit of time, say a day or two, I should have a word document to report back with. Best to you on your healing!

I set up a Google Doc file. Everyone (who has the link below) can edit it in browser (no registration by Google required)

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1uy2iTblKBKI162PkMe-lsdqUuLuiKBYYBMsebzfjk3Y/edit?usp=sharing
 
Laura said:
Well, we sure have accumulated a raft of information about what helps and how, and what doesn't, or might be only marginally useful. I suppose it would be very helpful if we could organize these things into a document with chapter headings, quotes and references, and a brief review of what the product or therapy does, how it is applied, etc. It's certainly enough for a very valuable book! Plus, I would like to have it all in one place.

Agreed. I'll admit I am thoroughly overwhelmed. Only just getting my head around basic gut issues and methylation, and now all this!

I think the information could also be used to formulate a kind of 'pre-protocol' to starting the heavy duty antibiotics, perhaps using enzymes, chelators, botanicals, monolaurin etc. and probiotics. Not to mention rife machines!
The number of potential tools collated here are impressive and also too much to use all at once IMO.

Hesper said:
Laura said:
If I had time, what I would do would be to copy/paste the best stuff into a word doc. I would use the various headers to sort/organize stuff because they show up the navigation pane on the left. So, when you come to a piece of info that goes under a particular heading/sub-heading, you can click in the pane and jump to that section and paste it there. I guess just getting the stuff into a document with each extract of text given a header will then evolve into an organizational system just be reading the headers. Word is very handy for doing this sort of thing. I find it indispensable for writing about history because I can make dates/years as headers and whenever I come across a bit that belongs in a particular year, I just jump there, paste it in and go to the next bit. This can be refined right down to months and days... which is handy!

I love doing that! It's very handy. The only problem is I don't have word right now, but there are several work-arounds for that, including emailing myself the document and working on it from another computer, or someone else on the forum editing it as we go along. Sounds like a great place to start though, and since I just got Plague Time I've also got a better framework from which to view this incredibly complex (and quite horrendous) situation. It's quite fascinating and, with a little bit of time, say a day or two, I should have a word document to report back with. Best to you on your healing!

If it's down to money you can get office for a free trial here: https://products.office.com/en-us/try and beyond that there are 'ways'.
OpenOffice can also be a good alternative in some situations.
 
RedFox said:
That's really interesting Shijing.
So it looks like EDTA is going to be really useful. Combined with it sequestering iron that the pathogens need to grow it should help a lot.
It also potentiates antibiotics (see here).

Yes, I think you and the couple of other people (Pierre, Yas, etc) who have looked again at the iron issue from an infection perspective are placing another significant piece of the puzzle -- Gaby also posted a relevant quote here:

https://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php/topic,38053.msg590871.html#msg590871

Your recent post about boron/clay and the GcMAF topic started by angelburst29 also seem like they might be important pieces. It's kind of astounding to see these various health issues that have been addressed on the forum in the past few years, which were seemingly disconnected, tied together under the umbrella of chronic infection -- even the part about parasites augmenting our Negative Introject that you highlighted in one of your linked posts! Personally, it's also a bit gratifying to realize that the heavy metal protocol I've been on the past 6 months may be helping to destroy biofilms, even though I was originally doing it to alleviate EMF sensitivity.

Carl said:
Agreed. I'll admit I am thoroughly overwhelmed. Only just getting my head around basic gut issues and methylation, and now all this!

You're not alone :) This would be a lot to take in even if we had the luxury of working on it exclusively 24/7, which unfortunately most of us don't. We're kind of past the "honeymoon phase" of making the big discovery, and now we're in the nitty-gritty research phase which requires most of the work, and can be tedious, tiring and confusing. I think that Laura's suggestion to start collating the information will help (and thanks to everyone who has already started working on this today!).

FWIW, I think the methylation information is quite important in all of this -- even if people don't know their polymorphism status, they can still do simple proactive things like avoiding folic acid and taking their B12 as methylcobalamin and B6 as P-5'-P. Even if you don't have methylation polymorphisms, these kinds of changes won't hurt you, but they might help in case you do.

Carl said:
I think the information could also be used to formulate a kind of 'pre-protocol' to starting the heavy duty antibiotics, perhaps using enzymes, chelators, botanicals, monolaurin etc. and probiotics. Not to mention rife machines!

I agree -- based on the posts people have made over the past few days, it looks like a pre-protocol of breaking down biofilms might be a useful endeavor before beginning the main long-term anti-microbial protocol. I'm guessing that this will soften up the critters so that they have less resistance once the real treatment begins. :evil:
 
Aragorn said:
Yeah, earthworms again! :)

It's curious, how the Leechbook from over 1000 years ago recommends earthworms for similar conditions. And it seems, that the Chinese have known this even way before that.

It's funny that my rolfer told me a couple years ago about a supplement made from ground-up earthworms that I could ask for at a local Chinese apothecary -- I never looked into it, but maybe I should! Thanks Alana for posting about nattokinase and lumbrokinase -- I still have some nattokinase from when LQB recommended it to me a couple years ago on the Endothelial Dysfunction thread, so I'm going to move that back into rotation.
 
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