AUTOIMMUNE DISEASES CAUSED BY AN INFECTION?

Eboard10 said:
SeekinTruth said:
Interesting article, Eboard10. While the mechanisms discovered are interesting, it's astonishing, once again, how these so-called scientists use reduction to oversimplify everything, including how the overall immune system functions. If things were as oversimplified and mechanistic as they make out, I don't think life would have survived this long with the number of pathogens it's exposed to....

Totally agree with you, SeekinTruth. What surprised me the most about the article (for someone with no expertise in the field) was the assumption that innate immunity has no memory and that plants and insects possess only such immunity. If that were the case, then I don't see how many of the species could have survived the constant introduction of new pathogens in our ecosystem and the mutation of existing ones, considering their effect on gene expression. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it would render plants almost powerless in terms of adaptability to environmental changes.

edit: spelling

Yup, that was exactly what I was getting at. Plus, plant substances (i.e. herbal medicine) have many immuno-stimulating, immuno regulating, adaptogen, etc. properties that have been used for millenia and had lots of scientific studies published in recent decades. So not only do they help plants survive the onslaught of pathogens, they actually help humans and other animals deal with some of these too.


@ Aragorn: Thanks for the reply. I'm going to get and read Herbal Antivirals too. And I agree about making our own tinctures/herbal preparations.

Gaby, thanks for the additional notes.
 
Gaby said:
- To be continued.

- Probiotics produce lactic acid, bacteriocins, and hydrogen peroxide which are harmful for pathogens. They modulate the immune system and help regulate sleeping patterns.

- There are over 200 clinical studies with lactobacillus rhamnosus. It helps prevent antibiotic resistant diarrhea by lowering the intestinal pH through lactic acid.

- Saccharomyces boulardii, a healthy yeast, diminishes the chance of colon inflammation by Clostridium difficile. It also helps stimulate secretory IgA and intestinal IgG in the gut, which is crucial for immunity against pathogens. IgA also helps reduce food allergies and it also repairs the gut.

- Leaky gut is related with ankylosing spondylitis (a type of chronic inflammatory arthritis), rheumatoid arthritis, asthma, eczema and inflammatory bowel disease.

- Nutritional supplements that may support GI health includes larch arabinogalactan, glutamine. There are mixed feelings on glutamine because some say (i.e. from Mercola and Russel Blaylock) it promotes neurological excitotoxicity in vulnerable individuals.

- A word on epigenetics and caloric restriction to affect the sirtuin genes related to longevity mirrors what has been discussed on the keto and other threads.

- Increasing the production of Nrf2 which prevents the turning of NFKappaB and its subsequent cytokine storm is important. It can be achieved through several supplements such as resveratrol.

- Nutrients that effect DNA methylation and modify histones (epigenetic related changes): zinc; choline; betaine; pyridoxine; B vitamins, such as niacin, niacinamide, cobalamine, as well as SAMe and 5-methyltetrahydrofolate (5-MTHF).

- Zinc supports the phase I detox pathway of the liver. Combining zinc with methylation cofactors, such as methylcobalamin, SAMe and 5-MTHF is helpful.

- Phytochemicals which have an epigenetic effect include sulforaphane from broccoli, resveratrol; curcumin (turmeric), epigallocatechin gallate (EGCG) from geen tea.

- Optimizing mitochondrial function with CoQ10, acetyl-L-carnitine, D-ribose and phospholipids.

- Assisting phase I detoxification of the liver (AKA "the cytochrome p450 system") with essential amino acids such as lysine, threonine. Also through ellagic acid found in pomegranates, green tea, watercress, silymarin (milk thistle). The phase II detox pathway can be assisted with glutathione precursors such as glycine, dietary protein, cysteine, taurine. Also with ALA, artichoke leaf, B6, B12, ellagic acid, folic acid, magnesium, NAC, pantothenic acid, silymarin, sodium sulfate, watercress.

- Indol-3-carbinol, di-indol methane (DIM) and sulforaphane from cruciferous vegetables help modulate phase I and II detox liver pathways. They convert xenoestrogens into healthier compounds.

- A word on herbal experiments for treatment of resistant Lyme disease and co-infections, including those who relapsed after terminating antibiotic treatments:

* Dr. Horowitz tried with some success Dr. Zhang's protocols on patients who were either failing on antibiotic therapies or had frequent relapses once they stopped them. One combination was allicin (garlic) with a mixture of herbs called HH and Circulation P (which helps get the herbs deeper into the tissues). It was helpful, especially in those who had Candida problems. The garlic smell was an issue for some patients though.

* Odorless combinations involved Coptis, HH, Circulation P, or a third protocol using an herbal combination known as R-5081 with HH and Circulation P. They also added the herbs Cordyceps when there was significant fatigue and lack of stamina. Puerarin if there were memory and concentration problems. Artemisia if there were ongoing sweats and chills with babesiosis, and finally, the herbal product AI#3 (autoimmune III) when there was evidence of overstimulated immune system with inflammation.

* Still, some patients relapsed, so they tried the Cowden protocol and it involves herbs such as Samento, Banderol, Cumunda, Quina, parsley and Burbur. The combinations were designed by Dr. William Cowden. They target borrelia burgdorferi and may affect different co-infections through their anti-bacterial, antiviral, antiparasitic and antifungal properties. Burbur and parsley support detox pathways, especially during Herx reactions. Another version of the protocol addressed heavy metals with trace minerals, magnesium, chlorella and zeolite. It included serrapeptase for biofilms and Amantilla for anxiety and insomnia. Dr. Horowitz studies showed that chlorella and zeolite were not useful for heavy metal chelation though. The herbs worked in about 70% of patients.

* Some patients had severe Herx reactions with the Cowden protocol though, so they had to reduce antispirochetal herbs such as Samento, Banderol and Cumunda. Burbur and parsley were effective in around 30% patients for decreasing flares.

* On Stephen Buhner's protocols: [Stephen Buhner] suggested using Samento in combination with other herbs, such as Andrographis, Polygonum (Japanese knotweed/resveratrol), Stephania root, and Smilax (sarsaparilla) in patients with Lyme disease. Horowitz reports. "We find that we are able to use these herbs alone, or in combination, with patients both on and off antibiotics to help improve resistant symptomatology. For example, some patients with severe Herxheimer reactions have taken Smilax in combination with other herbs, i.e. Greenwood Herbal's Herxheimer formula, and found it to be effective, especially when alkalizing and using oral glutatione have inadequately controlled their symptoms. Green Dragon Botanicals in Vermont is another well-known source for these herbs. We have found them to be safe, but just as with classic medications, they are contraindicated under certain conditions (pregnancy, active gallbladder disease) and can have side effects, such as gastrointestinal upset, allergic reactions, or changing drug levels in the body."

* The last herbal regime they tried was Byron White protocol. It is a Chinese based regimen with a combination of formulas such as Coptis , allicin, clove, black walnut, wormwood. It has shown to be very promising for resistant patients who fail antibiotics, fail other herbal protocols, or continue to relapse after they are off from antibiotics.

* There are contraindications for herbal remedies and Herx reactions cannot be underestimated.

- To be continued.
 
Gaby said:
- To be continued.

- Fatigue is one of the most common complaints of those with MSIDS and Lyme disease.

- Mitochondria are the powerhouse of the cells, essential to produce energy. Mitochondrial DNA lacks a protective barrier against oxidative stress and toxins. Mitochondrial dysfunction can cause some of the same symptoms seen in persistent Lyme disease, i.e. neurological symptoms, musculoskeletal symptoms. Chemical toxins and even medications damage mitochondrial structures. He lists doxycycline in this list. It is important to provide some sort of mitocondrial protection. More below.

- Mitochondrial dysfunction can be a great imitator of many diseases. Mitochondria are abundant in muscles, heart, liver, kidneys and brain. Mitochondrial dysfunction in the heart manifests as conduction defects, palpitations, cardiovascular disease, congestive heart failure. In the muscles, it leads to weakness, atrophy, hypotonia, exercise intolerance, myofascial pain. In the liver, it can cause hypoglycemia as glucose production is impaired, fatty liver, cancer. In the kidneys, it can lead to kidney failure and loss of minerals. In the brain, it can lead to bipolar disorder, anxiety disorders, neurodegenerative diseases, etc. In the peripheral nervous system, it can lead to imbalances of the autonomic nervous system such as postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome, absent or excess sweating, problems with temperature regulation, tingling, etc. This is all worsened by oxidative stress from environmental toxicity in underlying co-infections.

- Free radicals produced in infections damage mitochondrial cell membranes and also activates microglia in the brain, producing a cytokine storm which leads to fatigue, muscle and joint pain, neuropathy, headaches, mood disorders and cognitive difficulties.

- He talks about metabolic syndrome, excess sugar, insulin resistance, AGEs (Advanced glycated end products), etc. His knowledge of diet is abysmal though. He recommends whole grains :rolleyes:

- It is important to turn on a switch called PGC-1 alpha, in order to increase energy production. This can be achieved with caloric restriction (probably the keto diet as well as it mimics caloric restriction in longevity studies) and also through the following supplements: L-arginine, ALA, resveratrol. L-arginine is contraindicated in certain patients with Lyme disease and MSIDS as it may increase sickness syndrome produced by the cytokine storm. Those with migraines, inflammatory bowel disease should also be careful with arginine. This is because L-arginine has an effect on the nitric oxide pathway which is also related with cytokine production (cytokine "storm"= IL6, TNF, etc.).

- Phosphatidylcholine and NT factor helps repair damaged mitochondrial cell membranes. But keep in mind Horowitz is not acquainted with the keto diet. To support mitochondrial function, he also recommends acetyl-L-carnitine, CoQ10 and NADH, the standard mitochondrial support supplements. D-ribose is also useful, but needs to be limited in those with insulin resistance and metabolic syndrome (those who would benefit from the keto diet!). Patients treated with atovaquone (hard core anti-malarials) for babesiosis and piroplasmosis should avoid CoQ10 as it impairs atovaquone's action.

- He describes a case report of someone who went from complete heart failure to nearly normal heart function with mainly mitochondrial support, detox, and antibiotics. It was pretty remarkable!!

- To be continued.
 
Gaby said:
- To be continued.

Hormones.

- Many people with chronic persistent infections have hormonal imbalances. Their adrenal function is low, they don't produce enough cortisol, they may also have hypothyroidism with or without thyroid antibodies. Women have menstrual irregularities, men may have early "andropause".

- Patients with hormonal imbalances often have fatigue and lack of stamina. They may be diagnosed with fibromyalgia, CFS, Gulf War syndrome (from Garth Nicolson's research), environmental illness, Lyme disease. But they all have one thing in common: FATIGUE. Related symptoms include: autoimmune disorders and rheumatological diseases, cancer, co-infections with bacteria and parasites, deconditioning, depression, food allergies, environmental toxins, GI disturbances, heart disease, metabolic syndrome, mitochondrial dysfunction, sleep disorders, viruses, vitamin and mineral deficiencies, yeast and mold.

- Hormonal imbalances also cause problems with maintaining or losing weight. It could be either hypo or hyperthyroidism, insulin or leptin resistance. An overactive adrenal gland (high cortisol) will increase weight, whereas low adrenal may result in weight loss. Low testosterone may result in weight gain as there is less muscle mass and it can shift fat to the abdomen area, just like with insulin resistance.

- Pain and inflammation are also part of the symptom complex of endocrine conditions. RA, lupus, CFS, fibromyalgia, etc. can result in immune disorders and neuroendocrine abnormalities. In RA and lupus, estrogen levels can accelerate and androgens such as DHEA can inhibit the development of the disease.

- Prolactin may also contribute to autoimmune conditions. Elevated prolactin levels have been associated with lupus and other diseases: autoimmune thyroid disease, addison's disease, eye inflammation (iridocyclitis).

- Growth hormone and prolactin also regulate inflammatory reactions .Both increase resistance to bacterial infections.

- Defects in the HPA (hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal) axis also results in hormonal imbalances. The hypothalamus also regulates temperature, hunger, thirst, the immune system, etc. Cytokines affect the HPA axis and thereby affect ALL hormones, specially the production of stress hormones such as cortisol. Cortisol is the main brake in the production of inflammatory cytokines. Although cortisol production is enhanced by cytokines, shutting down the production of cytokines will only take place if there is no cortisol resistance, and cortisol resistance can be seen in painful musculoskeletal syndromes such as fibromyalgia and Lyme disease. Defects in HPA are due to trauma, stress, infections.

- Autoimmune patients often have defects in the HPA axis (i.e. RA). These manifests as lower adrenal, thyroid, and sex hormone production by decreasing the pituitary hormones ACTH, TSH, and HCG (hypothalamic releasing hormones for the adrenals, thyroid, and sexual hormones respectively. There are more, this are only 3 examples). This causes abnormal growth hormone and prolactin secretion, with decreased prolactin activity, higher insulin levels and less endorphins which controls pain. There is more fatigue and joint pain.

- The underlying "cytokine storm" must be addressed (i.e. chronic persistent infections) and hormones must be rebalanced.

- New thyroid reference ranges by the American Association of Clinical Endocrinologists (AACE) in 2002: TSH is 0.3 to 3.0 and in some patients, TSH levels need to be on the lower end of the spectrum, i.e., a TSH close to 0.3 to see a significant clinical improvement.

- TSH and T4 (thyroid hormones) are both suppressed by cytokines. High cortisol levels may prevent T4 from converting to more active forms of thyroid hormones, T3 and free T3.

- 25% of chronically ill patients are deficient in iodine and other trace minerals. Iodine is necessary for thyroid hormones. Iodine deficiency is now considered to be an underlying cause of fibrocystic breasts. Patients treated with one drop of Lugol's solution (a concentrated solution with a high dose of iodine) have seen their cystic disease improve.

A word on adrenal dysfunction:

* During extended times of stress, the adrenal glands go into a "flight or fight" mode and secrete high levels of hormones like DHEA, aldosterone and cortisol. Cortisol's main functions include a proactive mode, in which it helps coordinate circadian rhythms, such as sleeping and eating, and processes involved in attention, learning, and sleeping and memory. But it also has a reactive mode, which enables us to adapt to and cope with stress. People with chronic persistent infections have stress which is caused by multiple infections. People often have to deal with the stress caused by the illness and its effects on their jobs, families, and friends. They have elevated cortisol levels during the day or at night, which keeps them awake when they are desperately trying to sleep. Phosphatidylserine at night (and up to three times per day) with adaptogens during the day such as rhodiola, ashwagandha, ginseng, B vitamins, vitamin C and pantothenic acid will help lower the stress response.

* Cortisol receptors are found throughout the central nervous system and are especially abundant in the limbic system and hippocampus, the parts of the brain involved with mood, learning, and memory. Chronically elevated cortisol levels may lead to adrenal fatigue and burnout. When cortisol levels are too high or too low, the memory and attention center in the hippocampus is affected. Atrophy of the hippocampus due to stress is associated with depression, PTSD, cognitive impairment and the breakdown of the blood brain barrier. Patients will experience fatigue, food cravings, mood changes, memory problems, and many of the symptoms seen in those with non-Lyme-MSIDS (especially with Mycoplasma spp and other intracellular infections) and Lyme-MSIDS.

* Chronically low levels of cortisone also interfere with immune function, and the MSIDS patient may have chronic infections symptoms that are resistant to antibiotics when they suffer from low cortisol levels.

* Phase I adrenal fatigue: fight or flight, high cortisol level in the morning. Supplements: phosphorylated serine mixed with melatonin. B5, B6, and vitamin C are also useful. So is EE :) (meditation and breathing).
Phase II adrenal fatigue: Normal or low cortisol level in the morning. Supplements: adaptogenic herbs added to the B and C vitamins, such as rhodiola, ashwagandha, ginseng, cordyceps (medicinal mushroom), adrenal glandular supplement.
Phase III adrenal fatigue: low cortisol levels, often related with decrease function of the HPA axis. There is fatigue and increased susceptibility to infections. Supplements: Low dose hydrocortisone. DHEA may also be added at this stage, or at any time when levels are low.

* DHEA elevates mood, calms emotions, increases alertness and helps improve memory. Pregnelolone is a DHEA precursor.

- Those with eye problems (blurry vision or double vision) should get an eye exam before starting Plaquenil (hydroxychlorquine) due to its potential side effects on the eye. If there is a history of significant digestive problems and Herx reactions, metronidazol could also be reserved for last.

- As mentioned earlier, those with severe symptoms who don't improve on antibiotics, may have a severe underlying adrenal imbalance which needs to be addressed.

- He covers the importance of addressing hormonal imbalances such as low testosterone in men. He recommends vitamin D, mung bean extract, zinc and high protein diets in order to increase testosterone. To decrease its conversion to estrogen, zinc and DIM (from broccoli) can be used.

- In women, symptoms often get worse right before or during menses. Women with MSIDS often have estrogen dominance or estrogen deficiency with or without early menopause. Iodine deficiency and xenoestrogens contribute to estrogen dominance. Detox can be achieved through FIR, cruciferous vegetables (DIM, sulforaphane). Progesterone (i.e. cream) stimulates GABA receptors in the brain and helps to achieve sleep.

- Hormonal deficiencies and hormonal imbalances are some of the most commonly overlooked causes for the failure of antibiotics in MSIDS.
 
Aragorn said:
I'm looking forward of reading (in both books) the sections of preparing your own tinctures.

Actually, I kind'a made my first "tincture". I made some juice from a big ginger root and put it in small flasks. I gave one flask to my wife just as she was leaving on a trip and having flu symptoms. We'll see if it has any effect. ;)

Just FYI, a tincture is an alcohol extract that takes weeks or months to prepare. Not the same thing as juice. Tinctures have an advantage over juice since the alcohol is able to extract both water and fat soluble constituents from the herbs. Juice, although probably quite potent, would still miss out on the fat soluble compounds. It would be equivalent to making a tea, only stronger, OSIT.
 
Thanks for the additional notes, Gaby. I'm going to save these in a document, as it's a great overview/summary.

dugdeep said:
Aragorn said:
I'm looking forward of reading (in both books) the sections of preparing your own tinctures.

Actually, I kind'a made my first "tincture". I made some juice from a big ginger root and put it in small flasks. I gave one flask to my wife just as she was leaving on a trip and having flu symptoms. We'll see if it has any effect. ;)

Just FYI, a tincture is an alcohol extract that takes weeks or months to prepare. Not the same thing as juice. Tinctures have an advantage over juice since the alcohol is able to extract both water and fat soluble constituents from the herbs. Juice, although probably quite potent, would still miss out on the fat soluble compounds. It would be equivalent to making a tea, only stronger, OSIT.

I think that's why Aragorn put tincture in quotes. Also, I'm pretty sure some tinctures don't take that long for the extraction process (and there's also water based tinctures, but, as you said, those don't extract fat soluble compounds/substances).
 
Hi,
I just listened to a presentation of the BioPure products by dr D Klinghardt.
The good thing is that he describes also the stages which he would go through in order to treat Lyme disease and coinfections, also other microorganism induced diseases.

_https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YT4Wz5PvBsM here is the presentation of necessary steps and the appropriate products

short presentation
1. first get the kidneys protected against a large load of toxins
- before detox load the whole gut with toxin binders
- trigger cells to eliminate toxins
- release heavy metals from the brain
- reduce inflammation

2. reduce electro smog induced toxicity
3. treating the parasites


_ http://retailbiopure.me/Alphabetically-c49/ here are the products of BioPure. Rather expensive...

The whole video is worth listening to as there are many good aspects he considers.

Just my 2 cents

Joy
 
Hello everyone, I'm in the third week of the protocol, after the advice of Gaby, on the serious effects it can have antivirals, I decided to follow him, as it stands made, now I'm in the week of antivirals, I'm taking valacyclovir , is what I could get locally, the strongest reaction I'm having is headache, mental confusion, much tiredness, and the first two days diarrhea, the protocol mentioned a week or two, I'm not sure of achieving two weeks antivirals, are necessarily two weeks? :huh:

As for doxycycline, my reaction is a slight headache, dizziness together with small and a lot of nausea, which as gradually decrease breakfast, I had some eruptions in the arms and legs (like pimples), which no longer they are a problem, since I started the protocol I have been taking a nap, 2 hours in the afternoon, sometimes until 3 hours, something strange is that fat bombs, causing me very nauseous, so I decreased their consumption, and I have lost some weight, I have a few years to consume xylitol, however I am reacting with a lot of inflammation, gases, when consumption (perhaps a relationship with biofilms or growth of some types of fungi?) I think nystatin help in this, this protocol to desahacerse of bad bugs, give me the idea as a kind of exorcism, you need knowledge, faith, will and desire to break free of these bugs,and hope that the body can function better. :shock:
 
I'm a bit past quarter way into the Lyme Coinfections/Mycoplasma and Bartonella book. Just wanted to mention that there is very detailed information of the cytokine cascades initiated by the infectious agents that create vicious circles of inflammation and cell degradation so that the parasites can scavenge the substances they need and protect themselves from host immune response. Later in the book there will be protocols to treat the cytokine cascades, along with going after the parasitic bacteria. These organisms are particularly devious in their strategies....
 
riclapaz said:
Hello everyone, I'm in the third week of the protocol, after the advice of Gaby, on the serious effects it can have antivirals, I decided to follow him, as it stands made, now I'm in the week of antivirals, I'm taking valacyclovir , is what I could get locally, the strongest reaction I'm having is headache, mental confusion, much tiredness, and the first two days diarrhea, the protocol mentioned a week or two, I'm not sure of achieving two weeks antivirals, are necessarily two weeks? :huh:

I would stop and see how you feel. Let us know if you notice an improvement or not. In any event, I would not do more than one week.

Garth Nicolson recommends the anti-virals, while other researchers like Richard Horowitz haven't noticed a clinical benefit with them. Due to their costs and side-effects, he doesn't recommend them.

I'm not planning to take them, unless I really really have to. Rather, I'll follow the suggestions of natural supplements by Horowitz posted a few pages back in this thread. There are plenty of possibilities for addressing viruses. Also, it seems that addressing co-infections and intracellular bacterial helps you to build resilience to fight off viruses.

It is important you read "Why Can't I Get Better" by Richard Horowitz. It will give you an idea as to what is the best strategy. Some people might find that the standard antibiotics suggested are not enough.

It also seems that hydroxychloriquine (plaquenil) is very important in conjunction with doxy and cycles of metronidazol. It can also be obtained from fludan.com

I started plaquenil a week or so ago, and after a couple of days, I started to feel much better. I still have Herx reactions with metro, with joint pain in my hands and feet, but pain goes down within 24 hours or so. Even though they still hurt, my hands and feet look less inflamed or not inflamed at all.

You need to be very well familiarized with the adverse effects of these drugs. You also need a blood test before starting the protocol and during the protocol as well in order to monitor possible adverse effects.

If you are unsure, network of what your taking and how you are doing. Perhaps you will benefit from other supplements which will cool down the inflammation triggered. Those anti-virals sound like too much, especially if your body is still adjusting to the antibiotics.

Take it easy!
 
Gaby said:
riclapaz said:
Hello everyone, I'm in the third week of the protocol, after the advice of Gaby, on the serious effects it can have antivirals, I decided to follow him, as it stands made, now I'm in the week of antivirals, I'm taking valacyclovir , is what I could get locally, the strongest reaction I'm having is headache, mental confusion, much tiredness, and the first two days diarrhea, the protocol mentioned a week or two, I'm not sure of achieving two weeks antivirals, are necessarily two weeks? :huh:

I would stop and see how you feel. Let us know if you notice an improvement or not. In any event, I would not do more than one week.

Garth Nicolson recommends the anti-virals, while other researchers like Richard Horowitz haven't noticed a clinical benefit with them. Due to their costs and side-effects, he doesn't recommend them.

I'm not planning to take them, unless I really really have to. Rather, I'll follow the suggestions of natural supplements by Horowitz posted a few pages back in this thread. There are plenty of possibilities for addressing viruses. Also, it seems that addressing co-infections and intracellular bacterial helps you to build resilience to fight off viruses.

It is important you read "Why Can't I Get Better" by Richard Horowitz. It will give you an idea as to what is the best strategy. Some people might find that the standard antibiotics suggested are not enough.

It also seems that hydroxychloriquine (plaquenil) is very important in conjunction with doxy and cycles of metronidazol. It can also be obtained from fludan.com

I started plaquenil a week or so ago, and after a couple of days, I started to feel much better. I still have Herx reactions with metro, with joint pain in my hands and feet, but pain goes down within 24 hours or so. Even though they still hurt, my hands and feet look less inflamed or not inflamed at all.

You need to be very well familiarized with the adverse effects of these drugs. You also need a blood test before starting the protocol and during the protocol as well in order to monitor possible adverse effects.

If you are unsure, network of what your taking and how you are doing. Perhaps you will benefit from other supplements which will cool down the inflammation triggered. Those anti-virals sound like too much, especially if your body is still adjusting to the antibiotics.

Take it easy!

Hi Gaby, thanks for your reply and tips, to-morrow close the week of antivirals, thank God, and next week we'll do blood tests, at the start also perform analysis, so I hope I can compare and see how everything goes, a question, in the case of hydroxychloriquine, the suggested dose is 200 mg twice a day, if I'm right, for how long be recommended hydroxychloriquine?
 
riclapaz said:
Hi Gaby, thanks for your reply and tips, to-morrow close the week of antivirals, thank God, and next week we'll do blood tests, at the start also perform analysis, so I hope I can compare and see how everything goes, a question, in the case of hydroxychloriquine, the suggested dose is 200 mg twice a day, if I'm right, for how long be recommended hydroxychloriquine?

If you are thin and small, you can take 200mg once per day. Otherwise yes, the recommended dose is 200mg twice per day. It should be taken while you are taking the doxy, so that would be some 6 months. If you have eye problems, you need an eye test before. One possible adverse effect from plaquenil is corneal and retinal abnormalities. Again, very rare. But Murphy's law and all that... if you have eye problems, best to have an eye test done before, during and afterwards. Otherwise, a standard annual check on your eyes should do.

Let us know how you are doing and if the blood tests are okay.
 
Gaby said:
It also seems that hydroxychloriquine (plaquenil) is very important in conjunction with doxy and cycles of metronidazol. It can also be obtained from fludan.com

I just did a search for it on fludan.com and it says they have no such product. So I put plaquenil into the search engine for Wikipedia and the spelling is different - Hydroxychloroquine - and this did come up on fludan.com. For those who are searching for it. And, of course, it's a bit expensive.

Gaby, how much do you think is needed for the period of time it needs to be taken?
 
Nienna said:
Gaby, how much do you think is needed for the period of time it needs to be taken?

At a dose of 200mg twice per day, around 74 grams throughout 6 months or so. If you are relatively thin and/or small, 200mg once per day could do.

They also have it at _http://www.internationaldrugmart.com/

It seems they accept international prescriptions, meaning I could file a prescription. But I'm not sure if it is necessarily more cheaper than fludan.com
 
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