DMSA for heavy metal detox - how long available?

Deckard

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Clay for internal use is very cheap and pretty efficient alternative to DMSA when it comes to heavy metal detox. It has very high affinity for positively charged ions.

http://www.naturalnews.com/023652_mercury_clay_body.html
 

Breton

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
I got all of my mercury fillings replaced last week.
Approx 1.5 hours, and all done one a once. Protection and breathing mask were used. It was about 900 euros.

Now I am waiting for DMSA (_http://www.dmsachelation.com/dmsa-store/) and supplements to arrive.

Since the protocol in Baker's book as well as the protocol suggested by email from the company that sold me the DMSA, are recommending urine tests for mercury, I visited my doctor today to set up the tests for me.

Since there is possibility of toxicity from DMSA itself, Baker's book also recommended tests for blood count, platelets, liver profile, creatinine (and BUN -whatever that is) so my doctor thought that was a good idea to get those (but not BUN as we did not figure out what it is yet).

In his opinion DMSA is a dangerous toxin and he does not recommend it at all. He was of the opinion, the dangerous form of mercury is the kind that is water soluble and will come out in the urine anyways, and he suggested I could monitor my urine for a few weeks without using DMSA at all. He thinks the type of mercury that is not eliminated this way is not harmful to the body and the DMSA is more dangerous, and best only used for serious overexposure like industrial accidents and such.

Anyways, it sounds like the typical practitioner not quite up to date on the effects of mercury and therefore I have not been discouraged to carry out my plan.

The only variation from the above protocol, is I will probably start with my own supply of normal vitamin C crystals as I have not learned to make the liposomal yet, and I have not ordered the expensive stuff on-line. However, I am re-thinking my decision, and I should probably at least order some and use it for part of the protocol, since it seems that it sounds much more effective way to take vitamin C from reading the vitamin C thread.
 

Breton

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
I may be totally wrong: but for some reason the thought of temporarily getting some rice flour gluten while doing a one-time detox does not trouble me.
It is quite a different type of gluten than other grains and a lot less of it. Further, using DMSA, itself is pretty harsh stuff, one might not notice much side-effects from the rice flour.
Will not the contamination from rice flour gluten clear itself out fairly well after the detoxing?
I suppose every individual might react differently to the rice flour gluten, and maybe if one is free for a long time it could cause more trouble than if just starting out on the clean diet... so take my thoughts with a huge grain of salt. I just put it out there if anyone has thought in a similar way.
 

fabric

Ambassador
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FOTCM Member
Foxx said:
fabric said:
I figured that pouring out the contents would have worked since the added ingredients (microcrystalline cellulose and rice flour) would normally be part of the gel cap and not mixed in with it since that's what they would add to aid in the production of the caps (like mag stearate) but I could be wrong.
I very well could be wrong on this one, but I think they usually add the rice flour in with the ingredients within the capsules as a lubricant or whatever they use it for, so dumping out the contents wouldn't avoid the rice flour. I don't think the capsule "shells" would be made out of rice flour--but again, I could be wrong.
Hi Foxx,

You're right, I contacted the manufacturer and it is included in the mix:

there is a tiny amount used as a flow agent so the correct amount of dmsa
get into each capsule, its mixed in you can not separate it
Breton said:
I may be totally wrong: but for some reason the thought of temporarily getting some rice flour gluten while doing a one-time detox does not trouble me.
It is quite a different type of gluten than other grains and a lot less of it. Further, using DMSA, itself is pretty harsh stuff, one might not notice much side-effects from the rice flour.
Will not the contamination from rice flour gluten clear itself out fairly well after the detoxing?
I suppose every individual might react differently to the rice flour gluten, and maybe if one is free for a long time it could cause more trouble than if just starting out on the clean diet... so take my thoughts with a huge grain of salt. I just put it out there if anyone has thought in a similar way.
Hi Breton,

I was having a similar debate in my mind as to the impact of the rice flour in the mix. I was looking back and it seemed like many were using the same DMSA from the dmsachelation website, which is the version that contains the rice flour. I didn't notice any reports on the rice flour having adverse affects, so if there were any perhaps they were masked by the effects of the DMSA detox itself? I think I will probably go ahead with what I have and if it doesn't work out I'll have to try something else.
 

dugdeep

Ambassador
Ambassador
FOTCM Member
fabric said:
You're right, I contacted the manufacturer and it is included in the mix:

there is a tiny amount used as a flow agent so the correct amount of dmsa
get into each capsule, its mixed in you can not separate it
So it IS an alternative to mag stearate. Guess I was wrong about that :-[
 
Has anyone experimented with using cilantro as a heavy metal chelating agent? This article gives the details but it's taken a half hour after you have taken chlorella in increasing doses from a tincture formula.

_http://www.jmbblog.com/2009/03/natural-affordable-chelation-for-all/
 

Eva

Jedi
I replaced all of my dental fillings with white ceramic amalgams in late 2010. It was the first step toward detox that I took, and my then new dentist was horrified to find a piece of an aponeurosis needle broken and stuffed in one of my teeth - so although she was a bit hesitant at first she was glad we did it eventually.
Back then I also threw out all plastic and Teflon from my kitchen and replaced it with stainless steel and glassware (and a recent addition of a cast iron frying pan). I even replaced all knives with plastic handles with wooden ones and for a few days I was scrutinising every item in my house for even a tiny bit of plastic on it and getting rid of it - even storage boxes.
Surely I overdid it a bit but eventually being surrounded by wood and wicker instead of that "dead" plastic felt much better.
I also bought a water distiller, which I still use.

Nearly at the same time I started the USD diet and the detox protocol (the detox shake and supplements) adjusted for no soy or tofu. Except, I couldn't afford DMSA and the IR sauna,
which I've now arranged to acquire until April. I suppose this was a really long drawn out preparation time but I'm slowly getting there.

And I regret never sharing the process here, because there were many emotional and physical ups and downs and it took quite a bit of self-persuasion to properly maintain goals. But then I thought there's no point in creating noise just to say what "I'm" doing. I mean, people already know what to do so what good is it for anyone?
I'm trying to detox from that suffocating attitude too now, hence sharing belated. I hope that's okay.
 

Breton

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Should I continue the detox protocol?

This past week I got my urine test results back for mercury after I did the first round with DMSA (the sample was taken just 2 days after taking the 3 day DMSA).

However it was quite low <5 nmol/l. (The test cannot measure anything lower). According to their guidelines anything less than 50 nmol/l is not toxic.

So the doctor and I discussed that perhaps it is not even worth it to continue the detox protocol since it seems my amalgams, nor their removal, nor my environment, has poisoned me with mercury.

Or should I just continue the detox anyways, to encourage removal of other toxins that were not tested?

I did start a second cycle since I had not had the tests back by the time I was due to start it.


BTW: we also did a liver profile, checked kidneys and platelets and so far the DMSA has not negatively impacted those, but he gave me a referral to get these tests again in a couple of months to see they are still ok.
 

Mikey

The Living Force
The chelators also remove other stuff aside from Mercury, e.g. Iron: https://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php/topic,28799.msg407967.html#msg407967
 

aragorn

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Re: Should I continue the detox protocol?

Breton said:
This past week I got my urine test results back for mercury after I did the first round with DMSA (the sample was taken just 2 days after taking the 3 day DMSA).

However it was quite low <5 nmol/l. (The test cannot measure anything lower). According to their guidelines anything less than 50 nmol/l is not toxic.

So the doctor and I discussed that perhaps it is not even worth it to continue the detox protocol since it seems my amalgams, nor their removal, nor my environment, has poisoned me with mercury.

Or should I just continue the detox anyways, to encourage removal of other toxins that were not tested?

I did start a second cycle since I had not had the tests back by the time I was due to start it.


BTW: we also did a liver profile, checked kidneys and platelets and so far the DMSA has not negatively impacted those, but he gave me a referral to get these tests again in a couple of months to see they are still ok.
In my understanding, a urine test isn't completely reliable what comes to detecting mercury levels in e.g. the brain. Here's a quote:

_http://www.dentalwellness4u.com/mercurydetox/testformercury.html
Testing for Mercury

Testing for mercury is the only way to objectively determine if your body is eliminating higher than normal amounts of mercury. But a warning in advance—the ADA and many of its pro-amalgam supporters don’t consider these tests meaningful. Sure, it’s true that testing for mercury has limitations. For example, no test can tell you where and how much mercury is in your body, how much is in your brain or how much damage it has done.

But it’s also true that many health professionals regard testing a valuable diagnostic tool.The medical profession uses a number of tests including fecal metals, blood, urine and hair analysis to determine if mercury is in the body and/or if it’s being excreted.

These tests will designate a level of mercury considered “normal.” What this means is that the majority of people that test at the “safe” level or below won’t yet exhibit symptoms of mercury poisoning. Two issues stand out here. First, “a majority” won’t exhibit symptoms—which means some at those levels will. Second, there is absolutely no “safe” level of mercury—every atom of it in your body is poisoning you to some degree. Plus, not all tests are equal and some can give misleading information or be misinterpreted to the point where you might think you aren’t mercury toxic but actually are.

Some people use the saliva test but I’ve omitted it because it can only detect mercury in the mouth. It neither indicates how much mercury is in the body, nor shows the amount of mercury being removed.

Urine Mercury Testing


As a diagnostic tool for mercury, the urine mercury challenge test is limited. For example, it provides little information about:

• what part of the body the collected mercury came from

• how much mercury is stored and where it’s located

• the health problems the accumulated mercury is causing

brain and central nervous system mercury

• the mercury the body removes naturally via the feces.

Two types of urine tests are commonly used. One is the unprovoked mercury urine test which doesn’t use a pharmaceutical mercury chelator and only reflects the amount of mercury the body naturally removes via the urine. The other is the urine mercury challenge (provoked) test, which uses a pharmaceutical chelator. Today, DMPS is the most commonly used pharmaceutical chelator for this test, but DMSA is also be used.

Unprovoked Urine Mercury Test

It’s impossible for the unprovoked urine mercury test to accurately reflect the total amount of mercury the body naturally removes every day. That’s because less than 10% of the mercury the body removes naturally passes through the kidneys and out through the urine, while about 90% is eliminated via the feces. Thus, an unprovoked urine mercury test can easily indicate a relatively “safe” reading when the total body burden of mercury could actually be much higher. For example, if the total amount of mercury the body eliminates in one day is 10 mcg, the unprovoked urine test would show less than 1 mcg. And unless you knew your kidneys were functioning normally, you couldn’t determine if what’s coming out is what healthy kidneys would normally remove.

Used alone it could lead you to believe that you aren’t that mercury toxic, when you actually are. I don’t recommend this test for evaluating your body burden of mercury, determining how much mercury is being removed from your body, or for deciding whether or not to participate in a mercury detoxification program.

Urine Mercury Challenge Test

When a urine mercury challenge test is done correctly (especially for those who still have amalgam fillings), the results will show a far greater amount of mercury being removed from the kidneys than the unprovoked urine test will. This is because the pharmaceutical chelators used to capture and remove mercury, DMPS or DMSA, are much more aggressive at removing mercury than the body’s natural chelators. Unlike the body’s natural chelators, pharmaceutical chelators remove the mercury they capture via the kidneys/urine pathway.

However, the challenge test can also be misinterpreted, especially if the kidneys are not functioning normally and are unable to release mercury effectively. When used as a one-time challenge test and evaluated just for mercury levels, this test can also be deceptive. Ideally, the urine challenge test should be done more than once, with the first one being used as a reference. You can then compare the results of future tests with the first one.

It’s also important to note that mercury isn’t the only metal that pharmaceutical chelators will find and remove. For example, DMPS has a greater affinity for other metals, including essential metals/minerals and, according to a study by Daunderer, DMPS will chelate them in the following order:
Return to Top

Selectivity of DMPS

1. Zinc

6. Lead

2. Tin

7. Iron

3. Copper

8. Cadmium

4. Arsenic

9. Nickel

5. Mercury

10. Chromium

DMPS will remove zinc, tin, copper or arsenic first, so it means less DMPS is available for mercury removal. Therefore, a single urine mercury challenge test could indicate comparatively low levels of mercury and not accurately reflect the real mercury levels in the body. DMPS’s lack of “selective intelligence” (also DMSA) points out the major problem with relying on a pharmaceutical chelator for mercury detoxification. Zinc and copper are essential metals and necessary for life. If they’re removed indiscriminately a mineral imbalance could result, potentially creating serious side effects. The body is far more intelligent and knows what to keep and what to eliminate.

In addition, DMPS does not cross the blood brain barrier and can’t be used to reflect brain and central nervous system mercury levels. Even if a provoked urine test shows mercury levels in the normal range, there can still be a significant amount of mercury in the brain and central nervous system. Thus, when you’re using the urine challenge test, and the results show a normal level of mercury, I suggest it be confirmed it with a fecal metals test—the latter will reflect brain mercury.
There also seems to be doubts among the scientists about DMSA:s ability cross the blood brain barrier. If that's true, I don't know what agent could get that nasty stuff out of your brain.

If I were you, I would gently continue detoxing with multiple methods, and not getting "too comfortable" with the idea that your mercury levels are low or nonexistent. Plus, as said, there are other toxins which DMSA can remove.
 

Breton

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Ok, Aragorn and Data -- thanks for shedding a bit more light on the topic. What you say makes really good sense to me!
 

Laura

Administrator
Administrator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
I would also like to encourage everyone who is "fit" to donate blood as often as you can. It gets rid of excess iron and stimulates the making of fresh blood cells.
 

Tomek

Jedi Council Member
FOTCM Member
Laura said:
I would also like to encourage everyone who is "fit" to donate blood as often as you can. It gets rid of excess iron and stimulates the making of fresh blood cells.
How often, Laura ?
 

salinafaerie

Padawan Learner
I apologize if I missed this but what is a good iron level to aim for for a woman? I just had a doctor tell me my iron was too low and to take supplements. :huh:
 

Laura

Administrator
Administrator
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FOTCM Member
How often? Depends on your levels. Generally, as often as the blood bank allows which is something like every two months for men and every three months for women.

Salinafaerie: your doctor probably doesn't have a single clue about what he is saying.

Both of you should read "The Iron Elephant". You can have "low hematocrit" and still suffer from iron overload. See these two threads for more info, but read the book!

http://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php/topic,30709.0.html

http://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php/topic,30982.new/topicseen.html
 
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