Éiriú-Eolas - Breathing Program

Kay Kim

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Initially I felt strong tingling sensations, strong vibrations (even in my teeth) and coldness during & after the Beatha exercice. It felt as if I was "phasing out" into another dimension :lol: Then I started to breath more gently and it resulted to a milder form of hyperventilation (slight tingling and vibrating sensations), which is normal initially from what I read.

I have been doing EE about 5 years now. And from the beginning, I also felt coldness during and after the Beather/Bioenergetic breathing exercise.
And I understand that some of members also mentioned same symptoms in this thread.
And few times I was so cold, even felt in my whole inside bones too, but nowadays I no longer feel that coldness. It was strange and puzzled for long times, but I founded out the answers from transcripts.

August 24, 1996

Q: (L) Okay, I have two quick questions. Last Sunday morning, after the session the previous night, I had a very strange experience similar to what Al-Arabi describes as being in a 'state.' It was like being taken up into a condition of near madness, Ark was there [in a sort of vision], and then, when [the intense emotion of the visionary state] became unbearable, [I pulled myself back deliberately and fell into a state of] cold, shaking and rocking. I was shivering like I would never get warm and I could FEEL my soul rocking in my body [the same feeling that comes with an OOBE]. I would like to know exactly what this was?

A: Balancing of half-self.

Q: (L) What is a half-self?

A: Your starter version, relating to birth karmic imprint.

Q: (L) What in the world does THAT mean?

A: What you were assigned with at the onset of this incarnation.

Q: (L) Do you mean that this was 'starting' something? Like a starter in a car?

A: No, what you started with. This must be periodically re-balanced at apex of significant junctures.

[None of this made much sense at the time; it was only after reading Mouravieff and then re-reading Gurdjieff that more understanding came in terms of the lower centers and higher centers. I think the “half self” that the Cs referenced above was their way of describing the lower centers. Thus, this was probably an inflow of energy from the higher centers. Trust me, it was almost annihilating

July 16th 2009

Q: ...(L) So basically, we can recapitulate by saying that people need to learn to breathe. Breathing can change things in their physiology. And also they need to use the breathing to get themselves into a meditative state, or a state where they can do the bioenergetic breathing, which then helps them to release karmic and current life programs and issues and get a cleansing.
Once they've started to become cleansed, then they are able to - and this is supposed to be interspersed with, as I understand it - continuous input of data and information. They did say that you use this to deal with reality. This meditating and breathing is not an escape, this is a healing.....
 

Recto

Padawan Learner
Thank you Kay Kim for the info on those cold sensations. It also helpt me make sense of the localized cold sensations I've felt during POTS around the solar plexus and the sexual center. It therefore gives us at least one known bodily feedback indicating when a rebalancing of the lower centers occurs.
 

Recto

Padawan Learner
I had from time to time what felt like "energy work", swirling feeling around my sexual center (lower abdomen), pressure on my whole body and/or my third eye, feelings of waves coming out my solar plexus, etc. It kept me up at night as it wouldn't stop after the meditation.
Thank you Kay Kim for the info on those cold sensations. It also helpt me make sense of the localized cold sensations I've felt during POTS around the solar plexus and the sexual center. It therefore gives us at least one known bodily feedback indicating when a rebalancing of the lower centers occurs.

After some further research on the forum yesterday, I realised I made a labeling error (twice) when recounting my experience with the EE program. I can't edit my posts and I think it is important to correct as best we can statements of ignorance like these ones. Sorry about double posting.

When taking into account the correspondence given by the C's during the 13th of July session :

Q: Is this a correspondence that starts at the basal chakra which relates to the sexual center as described by Mouravieff?

A: No. The "sexual center" corresponds to the solar plexus.

Lower moving center - basal chakra

Lower emotional - sexual chakra

Lower intellectual - throat chakra

Higher emotional - heart chakra

Higher intellectual - crown chakra

Q: (L) What about the so-called seventh, or "third eye" chakra?

A: Seer. The union of the heart and intellectual higher centers.

I can more accuratly describe the swirling and coldness as associated with the lower emotional center (sexual chakra), located below one's belly button. The solar plexus corresponding to the sexual center had, while thinking about it, nothing to do with cold sensations I've sensed since they were located a bit higher, near the higher emotional center (heart chakra). I also failed to mention occasional burst of energy (words fail me to describe the exact sensation) at the top of my head corresponding to the higher intellectual center (crown chakra). All in all, a quite regular set of sensations shared, at least partly, with many people in this thread practicing EE over the years. We could see it as a significant dataset (including cold sensations) pointing toward an objective/real underlying energetic process taking place during EE practice.

A thread related to the centers/chakras's correspondence given by the C's can be found here. It contains, moreover, an adapted representation (i.e. their location in the body) made by @Ellipse, of the centers/chakras.
 
For years I have been doing EE just occasionally. Not enough for sure. Now I'm doing it for 3 weeks, every day.
Before sleeping. I finally took some time just for me. First I read and sing to my crystal. And then EE & PoTS.
It feels great but I still don't have any special sensations while doing it.
I'm just more calmer and aware of everything in and around me. Few times it was only specially warm feeling in heart area.
Since we're in our new home I finally have extra room where I can lock the door, isolate myself after anouncing my family
that I'm not avaliable any more for that day.
That's the first time I have my space and time only, without interruptions
(my doughter is not so little and husband is occupied with his stuff) and I will use it the best I can.
I'm honestly trying to catch up what I missed cause there is no much more left to do and I don't want to lose any more precoius time.
 

Keit

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FOTCM Member
The thing that troubles me about promoting intensive bioenergetic breathing exclusively is that we know some people become a little (and even a lot) unstable when they overdo it. That's why we recommend that people leave it out if they find 'too much is coming up'. With EE, they can continue benefiting from the pipe breathing and, of course, the prayer/meditation.

And that's just the emotional aspect. There are also physiological effects, like hypoxia

Well, apparently Dr. Andrew Huberman also talks in his presentations and lectures about Hoff's or bioenergetic type of breathing and other breathing exercises.

Here is a video where he provides a scientific/neurological background and also demonstrates the exercises. There is also a nasal breathing/hypoxic challenge exercise that apparently gauges inner stress level.


And this is his interview with Mikhaila Peterson. In the description there are detailed notes about the topics of conversation.

 

cassandra

Dagobah Resident
FOTCM Member
Thank you, Keit

I‘ve been feeling calm and happy after doing the full session during the last few months.
However, I do feel quite groggy and not quite present, which not only feels a bit awkward when
participating in the online session, but should I feel worried about this?

I‘ve been doing the programme regularly since I think last March. I feel like a layer of darkness has been lifted from me. I had a difficult childhood and youth, I felt powerless and angry, very resentful about it, but that too has all but vanished.

I think the romance novels, better health regime, interaction with the normal people here and EE is responsible.

Yas and logos5x5 are doing a fine job!
 

nicklebleu

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
However, I do feel quite groggy and not quite present, which not only feels a bit awkward when
participating in the online session, but should I feel worried about this?

I don’t think that is something to worry about - it’s probably a sign of coming back from a deep state of relaxation. It take some time to get back to full alertness. I tend to go to bed straight afterwards.

It happens to me quite often, sometimes to the point that I don’t want to get up and go to bed, even though I know that I will be more comfortable in the long run.

Hope this helps!
 

nicklebleu

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
I’ve had an interesting experience with EE that I would like to share.

I’ve been doing EE since its inception, sometimes diligently twice a week (with POTS interspersed), and sometimes less. I’ve had a few periods when I got off the program ’full-time’, but probably never for more than a few months at a time.

I’ve been following this thread from when it started in 2010 and read the testimonies of people on the program, always a bit envious of the results and experiences that these people shared - I for one was just doing the breathing and meditation out of a sense of duty. Sure, it felt relaxing, but there didn’t seem to be any major benefit. Mostly it felt like a chore - maybe like going for a run: it’s arduous, it takes discipline to get going, but once you’ve done it, you feel good, but more in line with a sense of achievment.

I’ve had back pain all of my life, sometimes excruciating for long periods of time, sometimes just humming along in the background. I’ve learned to deal with it and mostly just ignore it when it’s present, doing specific exercises - on the whole I manage it quite well, although at times it can be grating when it just doesn’t want to go away.

About two months ago, during the bioenergetic (round) breathing, I felt a POP - like a bubble burst, and something ’left’ or ‘got out’ of one of my most affected muscles in my back (quadratus lumborum on the left). And I immediately felt a releif in my back. It was still sore, as in sore like after some heavy exercise, but the quality was distinctly different. The next few days that soreness slowly dissipated, and I have been almost pain-free ever since.

I mentioned this vignette on our regular Aussie FOTCM chat, and one of the participants opined, that I may have dislodged an attachment. Maybe some of you remember when we all had Spirit Releasment Therapies - and I’ve had some very positive experience with that a few years ago, with the wife of one of the ‘founders’ of the technique by the name of William Baldwin. I thought this was an interesting thought, but hedged my bets, as it may well only be a temporary improvement.

And I would also like to bring your attention to Laura’s final assessment of the SRT, finding that to get rid of the ‘critters’ long term, you have to change the affinity ’they’ feel towards you to permanently dispel them. SRT works, but is only a quick fix, and in a sense it violates free will. So overall probably not a very good strategy.

Well, it’s now been more than two months, and my back hasn’t been as good as it is in a long time. So maybe by diligently doing EE, cleaning up some of the s+&t in my life and trying to be a better person, I might have slightly modified ‘the terrain’ so that my ‘back-stabbing critter’ found it unpleasant enough to stay and left.

Of course this is all speculation, but it might add to the varied testimonies of others. This post is for all of you who are plodding along doing the program more out of a sense of duty than of perceived benefit, as I did and wonder why - it just may take more time for you to experience the benefits that for others.

But it does work, that much is clear to me now - even if it may work on a more subtle level. So keep doing it - the ripe fruit to be picked may just be around the corner!
 

Ant22

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FOTCM Member
I have a question to EE instructors - or anyone who has the answer. Is there a reason why EE would be more effective or beneficial when done sitting down? I normally sit for Pipe Breathing and Warrior's Breath, but I lie down for Beatha and POTS. It's just more comfortable that way. But if doing Beatha while sitting down is more beneficial I'm happy to do it that way.
 

Ennio

SuperModerator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
I think that as long as you're paying attention to what your diaphragm is doing and the even pacing of the in-to-out breaths, etc. - you can get the full benefit of doing Beatha while lying down. And I agree, doing it on one's back is a lot more comfortable AND allows one to focus more on the breathing instead of also having to pay attention to good posture if one were to do it while sitting. At least for me.

I actually like to do the pipe breathing this way too btw, on my back, but prefer to stand while doing Warrior's Breath for a more vigorous and almost full body engagement {{{HA!!}}} - leaving my arms freer to do their thing as I reach up and pull down.

And while we're on the subject I'll add that though I don't often do stretching before EE, I have definitely noticed a 'deeper' experience of the practice those times that I've made a point to do some good stretching before hand; it really helping to open things up.
 

Lucius

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
I want to share my feeling. I like to experiment and explore sometimes. This time I measured the temperature of my hand (fingers). Before EE or during the day it is always 34.00 C. or lower. Yesterday's, after a full EE, my fingers had a temperature of 37.2 C (1-3 minutes after). Plus the hands are sweating. 10 minutes after 35.6 C. In addition I had shivers all over my body and a feeling of a large hm circles of energy around my hands (hands rested on my hips).
 

Nienna

SuperModerator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
I have a question to EE instructors - or anyone who has the answer. Is there a reason why EE would be more effective or beneficial when done sitting down? I normally sit for Pipe Breathing and Warrior's Breath, but I lie down for Beatha and POTS. It's just more comfortable that way. But if doing Beatha while sitting down is more beneficial I'm happy to do it that way.
Laura said from the beginning to do EE in a comfortable position; sitting in a chair, lying down or even in a recliner. The prime thing is to be comfortable, and warm so it you need a blanket, use it. It's very hard to concentrate on our breathing when we are also trying to keep in a certain pose. Being comfortable, to my way of thinking, is giving your mind free rein to concentrate on the breathing.
 

Ant22

Ambassador
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FOTCM Member
I think that as long as you're paying attention to what your diaphragm is doing and the even pacing of the in-to-out breaths, etc. - you can get the full benefit of doing Beatha while lying down. And I agree, doing it on one's back is a lot more comfortable AND allows one to focus more on the breathing instead of also having to pay attention to good posture if one were to do it while sitting. At least for me.
Laura said from the beginning to do EE in a comfortable position; sitting in a chair, lying down or even in a recliner. The prime thing is to be comfortable, and warm so it you need a blanket, use it. It's very hard to concentrate on our breathing when we are also trying to keep in a certain pose. Being comfortable, to my way of thinking, is giving your mind free rein to concentrate on the breathing.

Thank you for that Nienna and Ennio :flowers: I noticed that my breathing is deeper and better when I do it lying down and I don't need to focus on my body posture and hand positions as much that way. For some reason, no matter how I try I can never make myself fully comfortable when sitting down. The whole process is much easier and much less of a chore when lying down so it's really good news that I can do it like that without jeopardising the quality.
 

placematt

Jedi Master
I've had some interesting experiences lately with EE. Sometimes i tend to get really deep the POTS. Me breathing is so minimal and the area around my nostrils/mouth sort of goes into this numb sort of thing.

Alternatively, i did the Beatha sections for 4 nights in a row. And i think i was reckless with it. Im really feeling it now. Im at a stage where i feel like this massive emotional outburst is just sitting beneath the surface. Im on the keto/ carnivore diet so i mostly had a really stable mood for at least a month before hand. Currently though, my head feels like its just waiting to explode. Lots of memories i had forgotten have been coming up in beatha when i focus on the diaphragm and this build up of raw emotion. And i know the idea isn't to repress or suppress it. But its just sitting there and im not sure how to let it out. maybe it will come out on its own. of course i haven't done Beatha since Thursday gone and maybe i should take a break from it to let things calm down. but its been a notable difference in how i was a week ago and how my head, overall body is feeling. Don't want to use the term depression, but everything is just coloured really badly, thinking a lot about my parents, that dynamic, trauma in the past. Its got me pretty down. Guess i can only be patient at this stage
 
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