Homeland War

[aelyrsenn]

a heart felt voice of sanity from Croatia, perhaps this excellent analysis could be carried on SOTT of course after heavy editing as I am translating in haste:

http://civilka.wordpress.com/2012/11/19/vukovar-i-razderana-djevojka/

Vukovar and Mutilated Girl
No, I am not happy these days. I am not euphoric neither. I am sad, defeated and I have a knot in my belly. Why, for haven's sake, has massive triumphant feeling poured across the streets of Croatia, since Friday 16th. The reason for these celebrations is war, isnt it? And war is evil. War brings casualties on both sides of the trench, takes lives and leaves the scars on survivors. Acquitting verdict by Hag War Crimes Tribunal will surely soothe the wounds of 7 year incarceration for Gotovina and Markac in Hague jail, where they were paying for someone else' s bill, surely their families are satisfied. When their private happiness settles down there will be plenty of time for them for soul searching, to question if they did enough to stop the crimes of petty low lives and vultures.

Why not celebrate? Those generals led Croatia to victory and independence...I see every country celebrating their independence once a year...and am sure most of them fought for their country in war..Would you forbid that?Who are you?The only person in Croatia who is not happy about this...and am 90% sure why is that way...

 

[Regulattor]

Who are you?The only person in Croatia who is not happy about this...and am 90% sure why is that way...

Could you please elaborate what you mean by that?

 

[Z...]

Why not celebrate? Those generals led Croatia to victory and independence...I see every country celebrating their independence once a year...and am sure most of them fought for their country in war..

aelyrsenn have you read the article entirely? I think it gives pretty good and objective explanation.
I would like to remind you that one of the basic requirements for the Work ( which is the foundation and purpose of this forum) is sacrifice of all our sacred cows.

Would you forbid that?Who are you?The only person in Croatia who is not happy about this...and am 90% sure why is that way...

i am not the person that wrote this article. So that makes at least two of us ;)

Who are you?The only person in Croatia who is not happy about this... and am 90% sure why is that way...

this is pretty odd thing to say. Could you please clarify what do you mean by this.

edit: regulator posted the same question in the meantime

 

[aelyrsenn]

i mean who are you,what kind of person to judge only one country and their tradition?i would't say you are objective, as neither am I...but attacking only one side is not the answer.

 

[Regulattor]

That's a point! To be objective and not fall in trap of superficial, manipulative, subjective opinions! That's what this forum is about. To teach every person, regardless of nationality, religion or whatever other division there is today, to observe world and events in our lives as objective as possible. Only with this approach man can free himself from the chains of mechanicalness and its consequences.

Can you say that you are well and thoroughly informed or have all informations about events from 1991-1995 wartime? Can you clam that there wasn't any committed atrocities against Croatian citizens of Serbian nationality? Do you believe that everything that was broadcasted thru heavily controlled and manipulated state media apparatus is the truth? If you answered yes, then I'm must tell you, you have hell of the job before you in order to jump out of the burning wagon of identification and false opinions.

1991-1995 Homeland war was as any war from the "beginning" of the mankind, dirty, bloody, unreasonable and inhuman. The real victims are innocent civilians from both sides, that's how any war was, is and will be. There isn't any noble war, so wasn't ours!

Just look at the objective reality around you. What can you see? Can you see happy people around you? Do you think that guys who were soldiers on front lines have fought for Croatia like it's today? With high unemployment, no jobs and low wages, corrupted political establishment, indebted unborn children for god knows how many generations? I'm sorry but some of us are not in the mood to celebrate when house is falling apart!

 

[aelyrsenn]

That's a point! To be objective and not fall in trap of superficial, manipulative, subjective opinions! That's what this forum is about. To teach every person, regardless of nationality, religion or whatever other division there is today, to observe world and events in our lives as objective as possible. Only with this approach man can free himself from the chains of mechanicalness and its consequences.

Can you say that you are well and thoroughly informed or have all informations about events from 1991-1995 wartime? Can you clam that there wasn't any committed atrocities against Croatian citizens of Serbian nationality? Do you believe that everything that was broadcasted thru heavily controlled and manipulated state media apparatus is the truth? If you answered yes, then I'm must tell you, you have hell of the job before you in order to jump out of the burning wagon of identification and false opinions.

1991-1995 Homeland war was as any war from the "beginning" of the mankind, dirty, bloody, unreasonable and inhuman. The real victims are innocent civilians from both sides, that's how any war was, is and will be. There isn't any noble war, so wasn't ours!

Just look at the objective reality around you. What can you see? Can you see happy people around you? Do you think that guys who were soldiers on front lines have fought for Croatia like it's today? With high unemployment, no jobs and low wages, corrupted political establishment, indebted unborn children for god knows how many generations? I'm sorry but some of us are not in the mood to celebrate when house is falling apart!

That's the thing, someone here said in previous post, can't remember who, Gotovina is honest and honorable man...if thats so, than why not be happy for man's freedom after 7 years spending in jail? Why call it unfair trial?Be objective,but keep your emotions, otherwise you'll become empty machine...And as long as Serbs don't accept they were the one who attacked and accept responsability, no peace can be gained (as did Germans), because those 2 nations are not guilty in same amount. Yes the country is in 'banana state' but there is no reason not to celebrate someone's victory and gained freedom. Or you don't celebrate your birthday or any holiday because the current situation?
And I can say I know much more than the media is telling so maybe that's why our opinions disagree...

 

[Z...]

Why call it unfair trial?

Because International War Tribunal for Yugoslavia is an instrument of NWO and its political agenda. Whether you like it or not general Gotovina is just a pawn who spent 7 years in prison so that Croatia can join EU, there is nothing worth celebrating about this fact. Whether he is honest or not is hard to say and is besides the point.

Be objective,but keep your emotions, otherwise you'll become empty machine...

aelyrsenn you are clearly exhibiting emotional thinking which has nothing to do with experiencing a genuine emotion.
Patriotism, nationalism and religious devotion are installed programs not genuine emotions. These programs control our emotional center which then takes over our thinking facilities.

In 4th Way discourse, this refers to emotions taking over the functions of thinking. The intellectual center may be taken over by emotions and can be used to construct arguments for defending some decision purely based on emotions. An example would be the fantastic rationalizations true believers have recourse to when defending clearly deceitful, even psychopathic actions of their leaders.

Such 'thinking' is not affected by arguments appealing to reason. The intellectual center is isolated from these by a sort of wall formed by the emotional investment in one's belief. In the event of a long standing practice this can form buffers. Emotional thinking is an example of the wrong work of centers.

if you are serious about the Work glossary is an excellent resource for learning:
http://glossary.cassiopaea.com/glossary.php?l=All

 

[Regulattor]

At first it didn't look that like Gotovina and Markač would get out of jail any time soon, remember? Whole nation went into psychosis over first court sentences. International Tribunal was pronounced anti Croatian, war veterans demanded immediate cancellation of negotiations over EU admission, whole world was against us. Whole nation was stigmatized with joint criminal enterprise burden on our back. And then, suddenly we have quite a opposite verdict from appeal judges. Everything was right now, International Tribunal was most objective institution in whole world, there wasn't collective guilt, now we can join EU with clean hands, eh?

Sounds pretty suspicious to me. Didn't you ask yourself how can be such a turnover with first and appeal sentences? Just like in some Hollywood movie. International Tribunal is just as any high level international institution prone to deliver decisions with political aims. Sometimes you have to put Croats in line, sometimes Serbs, sometimes Albanians, that's how things are working. There isn't justice.

Can you celebrate something so artificial as is this court ruling? I can't. If we did pay attention to the reality then, maybe our generals wouldn't have to endure this show, maybe we could avoid war altogether, no one should die if we only knew about psychopats among us.

Same kind of people have, while war was still raging, pillaged economy away from battlefields, selling off what our parents and grandparents earned with hard work and unfortunately similar conditions. We didn't learn a thing from them. Have you ask yourself what would you eat soon, considering how things are developing, flags?

Or you don't celebrate your birthday or any holiday because the current situation?

As a matter of fact I can only now, after being here awhile, on this forum, celebrate my birthday with great joy. I enjoy my holidays also, but I'm always trying to stay connected with reality around me.

I also recommend you to check book section, you're going to find quite a few to explain why some of us don't celebrate this kind of events.

 

[aelyrsenn]

so are you suggesting we should've ignore their comeback?
it was staged of course,now they've fulfilled their part in joining croatia to EU they can be free..but still....
And i've read all that stuff you are suggesting,no need to pointing me to more books just because we don't share same opinions.

 

[anart]

so are you suggesting we should've ignore their comeback?
it was staged of course,now they've fulfilled their part in joining croatia to EU they can be free..but still....
And i've read all that stuff you are suggesting,no need to pointing me to more books just because we don't share same opinions.

aelyrsenn, this forum does not deal in opinions, it deals in facts. From what you've written thus far in this thread, only one fact is obvious - that you are emotionally invested and thus incapable of thinking objectively or communicating clearly about this situation. In other words, you are typing nothing but noise, so please stop. If you have facts to present, then present them - though I would also like to point out that this forum is not here to discuss a Croation war, so please keep the purpose of this forum in mind before going any further with this.

 

[aelyrsenn]

so are you suggesting we should've ignore their comeback?
it was staged of course,now they've fulfilled their part in joining croatia to EU they can be free..but still....
And i've read all that stuff you are suggesting,no need to pointing me to more books just because we don't share same opinions.

aelyrsenn, this forum does not deal in opinions, it deals in facts. From what you've written thus far in this thread, only one fact is obvious - that you are emotionally invested and thus incapable of thinking objectively or communicating clearly about this situation. In other words, you are typing nothing but noise, so please stop. If you have facts to present, then present them - though I would also like to point out that this forum is not here to discuss a Croation war, so please keep the purpose of this forum in mind before going any further with this.

I don't see anyone in this thread presenting facts,as yet nothing is completely uncovered,articles written by who knows who and who stands behind it...but ok, i guess it's easier to call me incapable...
last noise for you.Bye.

 

[anart]

so are you suggesting we should've ignore their comeback?
it was staged of course,now they've fulfilled their part in joining croatia to EU they can be free..but still....
And i've read all that stuff you are suggesting,no need to pointing me to more books just because we don't share same opinions.

aelyrsenn, this forum does not deal in opinions, it deals in facts. From what you've written thus far in this thread, only one fact is obvious - that you are emotionally invested and thus incapable of thinking objectively or communicating clearly about this situation. In other words, you are typing nothing but noise, so please stop. If you have facts to present, then present them - though I would also like to point out that this forum is not here to discuss a Croation war, so please keep the purpose of this forum in mind before going any further with this.

I don't see anyone in this thread presenting facts,as yet nothing is completely uncovered,articles written by who knows who and who stands behind it...but ok, i guess it's easier to call me incapable...
last noise for you.Bye.

Well, that was certainly anything but an emotional reaction... - and it proves the point that you are the person on this thread who is reacting emotionally and thus posting noise, due to your lack of objectivity. It's a behavior that does not have to define you - as always, your choice.

 

[Persej]

articles written by who knows who and who stands behind it...

Here is the official document of The International Criminal Tribunal for the former Yugoslavia (ICTY):

_www.icty.org/x/cases/gotovina/acjug/en/121116_judgement.pdf

Page 64:

"For the reasons set out below, I respectfully but strongly disagree with almost all of the conclusions reached by the Majority in this Appeal Judgement. Furthermore, I wish to register my disagreement with the approach taken by the Majority throughout the Appeal Judgement, and to distance myself from that approach."

Judge Carmel Agius


Page 121:

"In light of the above, I fundamentally dissent from the entire Appeal Judgement, which contradicts any sense of justice."

Judge Fausto Pocar

 

[arcturus]

Hi, yes the themes of this topic are here highly "hot."
Can i write here another two examples:
- the climate changes shows here in our land realy very very badly effect: for 14 days we have here in Slovenia the biggest flood ever!! There are so many houses, regions destroyed.... :( The river Drava was in small towns 7,5 m higher as normal; the normal wather is ab 400 qm/s.... the hingest was in the y. 1960: 2600 qm/s and now it was 3450 qm/s! The river Soca was 12 m higher as normal is! Reason: warm weather! It was snow in the mountains ab. one week ago and than was again 16 gr C. +
- did you know, that the Serbs call them self as "the oldest nation on the world ever" and the "nation of the God?"
They believe that they are directly childreens of the Atlantis. They found a part from orig. Css transcripts, where is the question about the race on the Atlantis. The answer form the Css was: "yes, there was a dark race called slaves" and this term the Serbs translates with "Slavs" = slavic race and they are saying anyway, that the Serbs are much older as the Slavic race. They are building really hard with many intelectuals and many spiritual educated peoples, scientists and with a lot of politic in this way to make propaganda of this nationalistic wievs. They have strong web forums with spiritual themes, with Css themes, with Ra material, with the translated Wave literature but there are also in the same web forums the topic with name "Serbs are the oldest nation the world."
They beliebe they have the oldest pyramide of the world, name is Rtanj. The builders of this pyramide werde the dark dogoons ab. 500 000 years ago in the past.
They have there some alternative communities on this pyramide. They says that the ex cheef of ex Yougoslavia the Tito's army knows this fact and they are saying, that on the hill of this pyramide are allways the ETs phenomena. The army of the Tito's was destroyed all of the entrances in this pyramide.
There are some spiritual ocultists in Serbia like Vera Bojicic, she believes she "knows" much more mistery about this pyramide. She says, that there is time very close, when this pyramide will get enormal negative power of destruction. She - the Vera is working many years with she's visualisations on the enery-field wich will to protect the Serbia and all people on the world and that's why the Serbs are the nation of the God's because they will to protect all people on the world against this negative power of this pyramide called Rtanj.

They are many storyes there like this one is and they are writing books about this themes. They believe really strong that only they knows the really truth history of the world - but all other nations on the world are highly corrupted.

I found this forums on the web when i was baned here for 2,5 years ago, because i was searching all the time forums, themes simmilar like here are, the Work, the transcripts of the Css, Pleadians, Ra etc.. and as i have said, on this Serbian's forum are the transcripts translated, but there are much other bad nationalistic topic as well.

:)

 

[Z...]

I found this forums on the web when i was baned here for 2,5 years ago, because i was searching all the time forums, themes simmilar like here are, the Work, the transcripts of the Css, Pleadians, Ra etc.. and as i have said, on this Serbian's forum are the transcripts translated, but there are much other bad nationalistic topic as well.

Arcturus why do you think this is relevant for this thread and especially after one of the mods said:

If you have facts to present, then present them - though I would also like to point out that this forum is not here to discuss a Croation war, so please keep the purpose of this forum in mind before going any further with this.

There are so many weirdo forums out there full of crazy people talking crazy things, dont you think its waste of energy discussing them.

It would the matter of common courtesy to tell us why were you banned the first time, and what has changed since then.