How much of what the Cs say is 'symbolic'?

Joe said:
On another thread I wrote:

Quote from: Joe on May 18, 2016, 07:38:14 AM
While it's certainly useful and fun to contemplate how things might develop, I think it is also important to maintain a good degree of openness about those same things, allowing us to respond more fluidly to whatever might come along.

* * * * *
This is something that has been on my mind lately. The question of to what extent is what the Cs say 'symbolic'. Some of it very likely is, but how much of the rest of it? Btw, by symbolic I mean how the things they describe that are not part of our observable reality, or accessible to us, might actually manifest in our reality. Perhaps similar to the way apparently supernatural events in myth and allegory were used at certain points in history to describe real events.

I tend to actively try to not take a literal interpretation of what they say for 2 reasons. One is because we have almost no personal, direct experiential reference for much of what they say about 'reality', if we take it literally, in which case, any hypothesizing we do will be just that, hypotheses. The second, related to the first, is that looking at possible symbolic meanings may give us a more 'tangible' reference point or a way to 'translate' the more abstract ideas they convey into terminology or concepts for which we do have a reference or at least part of one.

Any thoughts?

This reminds me of the fundamentalists’ views of their religious texts . . . which is strictly literal vs those who read those same texts as allegories, metaphors, parables, and symbolic.

My vote is to not reduce ourselves to the fundamentalist-literal interpretation of what the C’s say in all cases.

Maybe we are required to see beyond the literal translation in order to SEE the metaphorical, symbolic interpretation.

A translation is literal. An interpretation is seeing beyond the literal.

Maybe the Law of Three could also apply? There’s the literal. There’s the symbolic. Then there is the specific situation or circumstance where one or the other (or both) can be applied?

I suspect this is where a bit of discernment might come into play?

Just some thoughts. FWIW
 

Richs

Dagobah Resident
Dirgni said:
BHelmet said:
One symbolic comment the C's did suggest is the "California falls into the sea" comment. I have always wondered about that.
Could it mean Cali goes into 4D?

In history of the earth things like this happend. When you see all this sinkholes all over the world and the ring of fire not far from California and all those earthquakes happening there, it could be that something will happen to California. It could be that "California falls into the sea" is symbolic or that it goes into 4D. But it could also be one of those literal warnings they gave us.

It is possible that it is a little of the symbolic and the literal in some sense. If there is a 10+ magnitude earthquake along the offshore fault next to California, there is a real possibility of a huge tidal wave much larger than the one that hit Japan. It could be a few hundred feet in height and completely wash away many of the coastal cities there. If it hits at a magnitude 10 or an even higher magnitude, well, most of California would be destroyed by the earthquake itself, along with much of Oregon and maybe Washington too. Damage might even extend to neighboring States.

California doesn't have to literally "fall into the sea" for massive destruction to occur and perhaps millions of people to be killed. Those who survived would most likely have to be evacuated as there would be little or no infrastructure to support them. In this scenario, California might just as well have fallen into the sea.
 
As for California falling into the sea . . . did any of you read those news articles on SOTT a few months ago where much of the land abutting the ocean in Pacifica (near San Francisco) is disappearing. The home owners who live on the edge of that cliff are pretty worried.

I'll see if I can find those articles.

25 January 2016 -- https://www.sott.net/article/310974-Huge-waves-hit-already-battered-Pacifica-coastline-in-California

05 February 2016 -- https://www.sott.net/article/311730-Pacifica-California-residents-on-edge-as-2nd-sinkhole-opens-along-seawall

02 March 2016 -- https://www.sott.net/article/313597-Another-sinkhole-opens-along-Pacifica-Californias-coastline

I suspect that, as far as these people living near that decaying shoreline are concerned, California (at least their little portion of California) is literally falling into the sea.

Ouch! :/
 

whitecoast

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Paraphrasing what the Cs once said, nobody and no thing external to a person (or the network in which they are actively involved) is going to 'save' anyone:

I also don't think that anything really "needs" saving either. Nature is perfect fundamentally, isn't it?
 

luc

Ambassador
Ambassador
FOTCM Member
theoria said:
I think a symbol is sort of like a higher dimensional form. The shape that the symbol takes here on 3D is a shadow of this higher dimensional form. Just as a 3D form, like a cube, can be represented in a 2d shape as a square. This square is only one plane of a cube, and there is practically infinite planes/squares in a cube. So a symbol from a higher dimension can be interpreted infinite ways in our dimension. It is not that we cannot describe or speak of symbols, but that they can each be described literally endlessly, all the while being only one symbol, one common message.

Maybe everything the Cs say is symbolic in the sense that we each have the opportunity to project our own personal, informed definition upon their messages. Personal, in the sense that it is an individual lesson we should each take responsibility for. Informed, in the sense that we apply our knowledge of a proposed "objective" reality in defining their messages.

However if we just leave it at this personal, even if informed level, then our interpretation would never go beyond a merely subjective function.

Perhaps this is why the Cs urge networking, because only if we each share our individual interpretations of a symbol/message, will we have a more complete view of the symbol's true form. No one person can ever have the "answer". Everyone, put together, will have the "answer".

Graduation to 4d could be just a symbol that we are interpreting too literally. As if some sudden "rapture" will occur at some point in time which will beam a select group into another dimension/density. It could be that the transition/graduation/ascension has to do with our gradual discovering of something which we had never noticed before, but which has always been right under our nose. Only those who care to look will see it. Or perhaps there really will be some momentous event that catalyzes a shift in perception for those who are ready. I'm really not sure.

Thanks theoria for sharing this - very insightful IMO.

Maybe this ties in with the concept of variable physicality - that these "symbols" change their form (as perceived from 3D) according to the observer and his/her understanding? And maybe this is amplified if a collinear group shares their observations?

Sometimes I notice how my perception changes according to my inner state - for example, if I feel bloated and not well, people may look different to me - thinner, bigger, more/less healthy etc. I think this is a fairly common thing if we project our "stuff" to others. But, where to draw the line? Is it just my perception, or does "physicality" also changes in a way according to our perceptions? If we think about quantum phenomena and so on, this could be the case... Also, the Cs said that for higher STS beings, what they wish becomes actual reality for them - but if it is not aligned with objective reality, they need more and more energy to maintain the illusion, until the whole "reality bubble" bursts, just like the stock market bubbles, and just like the bubble our Western "reality creators" created with their global debt- and war-based empire.

Maybe the slow-motion burst of the "empire bubble" we are witnessing here on 3D is a reflection of the "symbolic" higher reality where 4D-STS-beings live in their own bubble of wishful thinking, which manifests in our 3D reality as this horrible state of the world and full-scale-ponerization, but their "reality bubble" up there is about to burst... Or maybe it is only bursting for us because we notice and witness it, and thus separate ourselves from the STS reality bubble?

Well, it makes one a bit crazy to think about these things... FWIW.
 

Nienna

SuperModerator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
BHelmet said:
One symbolic comment the C's did suggest is the "California falls into the sea" comment. I have always wondered about that.
Could it mean Cali goes into 4D?

In case anyone wanted to reread that part of session 941126, here it is:

Q: (L) Well, let's not denigrate literal
translations or at least attempts to get things
into literal terms. I like realistic art work. I
am a realist in my art preferences. I want
trees to look like trees and people to have
only two arms and legs. Therefore, I also like
some literalness in my prognostications.
A: Some is okay, but, beware or else
"California falls into the ocean" will always
be interpreted as California falling into the
ocean.
Q: [General uproar] (F) Wait a minute, what
was the question? (L) I just said I liked
literalness in my prophecies. (F) Oh, I know
what they are saying. People believe that
California is just going to go splat and that
Phoenix is going to be on the seacoast, never
mind that it's at 1800 feet elevation, it's just
going to drop down to sea level, or the sea
level is going to rise, but it's not going to
affect Virginia Beach even though that's at
sea level. I mean... somehow Phoenix is just
going to drop down and none of the buildings
are going to be damaged, even though its
going to fall 1800 feet... (T) Slowly. It's
going to settle. (F) Slowly? It would have to
be so slowly it's unbelievable how slowly it
would have to be. (T) It's been settling for
the last five million years, we've got a ways
to go in the next year and a half! (F) Right!
That's my point. (T) In other words, when
people like Scallion and Sun Bear and others
say California is going to fall into the ocean,
they are not saying that the whole state, right
along the border is going to fall into the
ocean, they are using the term California to
indicate that the ocean ledge along the fault
line has a probability of breaking off and
sinking on the water side, because it is a
major fracture. We understand that that is not
literal. Are you telling us that there is more
involved here as far as the way we are
hearing what these predictions say?
A: Yes.
Q: (T) Are we understanding what you are
saying?
A: Some.
Q: (T) So, when we talk about California
falling into the ocean, we are not talking
about the whole state literally falling into the
ocean?
A: In any case, even if it does, how long will
it take to do this?
Q: (LM) It could take three minutes or three
hundred years. (T) Yes. That is "open" as
you would say.
A: Yes. But most of your prophets think it is
not open.
Q: (J) Yeah, because they think they have the
only line on it. (T) Okay. So they are thinking
in the terms that one minute California will
be there and a minute and a half later it will
be all gone. Is this what you are saying?
A: Or similar.
Q: (T) So, when we are talking: "California
will fall into the ocean, which is just the
analogy we are using, we are talking about,
as far as earth changes, is the possibility that
several seismic events along the fault line,
which no one really knows the extent of...
A: Or it all may be symbolic of something
else.
Q: (L) Such as? (J) All the fruitcakes in
California are all going to go off the deep
end together. (L) Symbolic of what?
A: Up to you to examine and learn.
Q: (L) Now, wait a minute here! That's like
sending us out to translate a book in Latin
without even giving us a Latin dictionary.
A: No it is not. We asked you to consider a
reexamination.
 

bjorn

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
[quote author= 7/23/1995 ]A: Well, just to give you an example: how do you know that you ever "leave" your body? The question is not: do you ever leave your body, its how do you know that you do?
Q: (L) I guess you don't.
A: Let us give you a parallel. If you saw a rainbow in the sky and that rainbow was later no longer visible, would you then say: "Did that rainbow spill onto the mountain?"
Q: (L) I don't get it. No I wouldn't because I would know that the rainbow is the refracting of light on water or ice in the atmosphere.
A: That's what you know. But, then again how do you know that anything you know is, in fact, the true representation of reality?
Q: (L) We don't.
[/quote]
 

Neil

Jedi Council Member
FOTCM Member
Joe said:
I wonder if anyone else finds it difficult to reconcile the idea of a 4D reality to which we might 'graduate' and which, if taken literally, implies a rather stupendous and radical change and leap forward in our abilities, with the fact that most people here are still struggling to handle some of the most basic and mundane aspects of 3D life, like getting a handle on emotions, thinking, actions, relationships, responsibility etc.
Well, before I had really delved into the Cassiopaean material I believed in what I'll call the "Star Trek model". A civilization spent many thousands of years evolving and making choices at different junctures as to which way they would go. It would gain mastery of building and maintaining a planetary civilization. Then, if those choices created a stable enough substratum, it would venture out into space and eventually figure out how to viably travel outside of its own star system. Then, having contact with other sentient life and exploring all of the oddities that exist in the galaxy would lead to another long learning cycle that would last many thousands of years as the civilization is tested to determine whether it can last as a galactic civilization. Towards the end of that period, having explored the entire galaxy, the civilization may begin experimenting with temporal manipulation, how everything is connected, and altering the fundamental structure of reality; coming more and more into contact with the "cage" representing the limitations of 3D reality. This stage would seem to last some many thousands of years, even though time would be very much selective and variable at this point, until the race learned all there was to know about 3D reality. Finally, they would gain some kind of noncorporeal existence, and ascend to a higher level of reality like the Q Continuum. This model is simplistically linear but it follows a logical progression. I used to lament the fact that I wouldn't be around for any of the really interesting stuff.

At the other extreme, you have the "rapture model" where you go straight to the noncorporeal existence if you have enough faith and become a dedicated disciple of God.

The Cassiopaeans seem to be suggesting that the reality is somewhere between those two extremes. How far to one end or the other of the spectrum is the $64K question. The 4th Way and the Wave would would seem to be a way that ultimately allows one to experience the fundamental structure of reality in a very visceral and personal way without the long technological evolution and exploration and supposedly this can be done in 1000 years. Especially taking into account the newer transcripts, it doesn't happen all at once, but there are sudden sharp steps, that I guess are like a "thermonuclear blast." There are a series of smaller blasts instead of one large one. This doesn't get you quite to the "Q Continuum" stage, you would be somewhere between that and the "temporal manipulation" stage, and it then it would take many thousands or perhaps millions of years (from our perspective) before the possibility of moving to an immortal, entirely nonphysical existence could be realistically contemplated. The purpose of 3D is not to learn everything there is to know about physical reality, this seems to continue into 4D, but to gain a certain degree of responsibility toward it. This is still taking the transcripts pretty much literally, though.

And as an interesting aside, in the literal vs symbolic debate, this session stuck out in my mind.
Session951104 said:
Q: (T) OK, I just want to get this straight, so I can follow this. I know some of our conversations have gotten rambling... We've skimmed over things, and moved on to other things in order to get a lot of stuff in. OK, let's talk about the bases. (L) What's the first, most significant thing about the bases we need to know?
A: No, suggest point blank.
Q: (T) OK, point blank questions. Do these bases exist? Let's start with yes or no answers.
A: Yes.
Q: (L) How many are there? (T) Are there bases in the United States of America?
A: Close.
Q: (T) There are no bases within the boundaries of the Continental U.S.? (L) No, they are in other dimensions and densities, is that correct?
A: Yes.
Q: (T) They can be entered through entranceways within the United States and other places within the world?
A: Transdensity.
Q: (L) OK, transdensity points...
A: No. Bases are.
Q: (L) Bases are transdensity. (T) So the bases are transdensity, in other words they exist throughout the densities in the same location. No, no, that won't be right... (L) they exist in a trans-density state. (T) So they exist in third...
A: Yes.
Q: (T) They exist in third, fourth, whatever...all at the same time. (L) Maybe they could come in to our density when necessary and then go out of our density when necessary.
A: No.
Q: (L) They are in another density.
A: No.
Q: (L) They are in another dimension. (T) They are in all densities...
A: Trans.
Q: (L) They transit at all densities?
A: Start at three.
Q: (L) They start at three... (T) They go through four, five is not the density they can go into, so they go through six...
A: Assume.
Q: (L) Assume; you're assuming... (T) No, I'm asking, they start at three, you say; where do they go from there?
A: To five.
Q: (L) Three to five. (T) They cover three, four and five?
A: Yes.
Q: (T) Why do they cover five? You've said that five is the level of contemplation... (L) Why not? That makes sense, to have one there, too.
A: Yes.
Q: (L) They can take them through there. They work there. (T) Well, I need to understand this, they've said different things about the fifth density, in different sessions. OK,
A: No.
Q: (L) I'll tell you, hold on. One of the things that came through: it was the session when I was asking questions about [my son's] experiences under hypnosis, so it was back fairly early on. And I asked a series of questions about what he perceived. Now, he had an alien abduction experience that he described in another lifetime, seemingly. He described what amounted to having this screen thing put over his face, and the red dots, and the programming and the beings in the silver robes standing around, and then being shunted through this tunnel, and finding himself in this dark space where there were all these black-hole things all around him. I asked, was this an alien abduction in another lifetime and they said no, it was a fifth density life review. I said, are some of these beings we perceive as aliens, and some of these experiences we perceive as alien abductions, actually events or experiences on fifth density? And they said yes. (J) Life review... that's real important. (L) Right. So what they're saying is, and when they're talking about taking souls on the battlefield, and so forth, obviously we have fifth density "alien" and they've said that the term is used loosely. I mean, we might perceive them as alien, but they were fifth density workers, so to speak. That was their job, to do whatever it was they did, or they perceived it as their job. So that, to have these bases transit the densities up through fifth, would make perfect sense because of the kind of work they're doing. Is that...
A: There is so much extremely vital stuff about this subject, that it would be wise to stay with it until completion.
Q: (T) We plan on staying with it, we're trying to understand this... (L) You remember when my brother was here, they kept wanting us to come back to the subject of the bases. And we didn't, we wandered off. (T) Our problem is, we wander a lot of the time. We're worse than Carl Sagan as a group here. We wander off on tangent ideas, and go from one thing to the next. We never stay on a subject. OK, the bases are trans-density bases; they go from the third density to the fifth; they exist in the third, fourth and fifth density all at the same time, is this correct so far?
A: Close.
Q: (T) Now, when a being, a soul, whatever, is in the base, do they exist in all three densities at the same time?
A: No.
Q: (L) Hold on, I've got an idea...
A: When you are in a skyscraper, do you exist on all floors at the same time?
Q: (J) No, but you have got to know where the elevator is! (L) Is there something like an elevator... (J) Yes, seriously! (L)... that can move you, if you're in these locations, from one density to another, and experience these bases, these trans-density bases, at different levels?
A: It is an elevator!
Q: (L) OK, so these bases are points... it is an elevator, so these bases may be places that if you are taken to them, are in them, that through these portals, or trans-density bases, you are thereby able to transit the densities?
A: You are able anyway.
Q: (L) OK, but are these specific locations... OK, it is an elevator... (T) Well, not an elevator as we perceive an elevator... (J) Conceptually, yes. It's a conveyance, it's a method.
A: No.
Q: (T) No, that it isn't an elevator as we perceive it? (L) Is it an elevator for...
A: Literally.
Q: (L) It is literally an elevator?
A: Yes.
Q: (L) So you go there to get on to go to different densities?
A: Yes.
Q: (T) So, it is that easy?
A: Yes.
Q: (L) So you go to these bases, to go to different densities...
A: Although, it is possible to enter 4th and 5th in other ways too!
Q: (L) OK, are these beings, these other density beings, creating and utilizing these bases for mass movement of beings or artifacts, from one density to another? Is that what they're doing here?
A: No. They live on 4th, so they construct 4th density bases.
Q: (L) I'm getting it... So, the fourth density beings construct fourth density bases. These fourth density bases then somehow interface with third density in a certain point in space-time, and they then influence third density beings to build third density bases at this interface point, and through these interface points they are able to move back and forth between densities. Is this getting
close to the idea?
A: The only ones who need to use this approach are 3rd D.
Q: (L) OK, so these are fourth density... (J) They are for our use? They are for third density being use.(L) OK, so our people have built these bases, using technology, perhaps... OK, let's take it one step at a time. Are these bases constructed by third density beings?
A: Partially.
Q: (L) Are they constructed by third and fourth density beings?
A: Yes.
Q: (L) Are they constructed for the use of third density beings?
A: No.
Q: (L) Are they constructed... (T) Are the third density bases constructed for the use of third density beings?
A: Both.
Q: (T) Both third and fourth. OK, and there's a way for the fourth density beings, an elevator, to move from fourth to third; from their fourth density base to the third density base.
A: Vice Versa.
Q: (L) They said they were built for us, not for them.
A: No.
Q: (L) OK, they were built by us to allow us to get there...
A: No.
Q: (L) Then, I lost it! (T) They were built so that they can have a place to move and operate in third density even though their main base is in fourth density. They come here, and interact with third density beings, and do their third density stuff while they're here, because they can exist there, because fourth density spills over into it through the other bases. (L) OK, so when people go to these bases, and see aliens and humans interacting together, are they in fourth density, or third density?
A: Both.
Q: (L) Either or. OK. The next question is... (T) Both? Now, wait, they can either be in third or fourth. But you said, if you see them interacting together... (L) Are they both at once?
A: Mostly on 4th.
Q: (T) OK, so the bases in third density here, are bases for whomever is working with the fourth density beings, that they can exist in it over long periods of time. The fourth density beings can come through to this density, by use of the base.. . [Dogs start howling in the back yard, distracting the session.] ... Now, I've lost my train of thought. OK, we've got a base, bases that exist... (L) Who... (T) Third, fourth and fifth, and they can transit between third, fourth and fifth... The bases are STS bases, let's establish that. (L) That's an assumption...let's ask. (T) Are the bases STS bases?
A: Mostly.
That entire session was very interesting, but the elevator part is what really made me kind of crazy. I was with Laura, this had to be some kind of "esoteric elevator." But the Cassiopaeans stated quite clearly that it was not. I was also kind of curious how metaphorical these "bases" were, but they seemed to have some level of physicality to them, they could be reached with a very physical, mundane, run of the mill elevator. Even to 5D no less! if that wasn't a corrupted session, I have to say the mental image kind of throws me for a loop.
Joe said:
Thanks for the input Luc, very insightful. Maybe one place to start looking at the possible symbolic meaning of some of the things the Cs say would be to look at the way we use or talk in, symbolic terms, where something has a 'nuts and bolts' explanation and also a more abstract or symbolic explanation.
I remember reading something about explaining the electrical grid to a caveman. Since the wheel was the most advanced piece of technology known to them (according to the official history anyway) you had to use that as the basis of your analogy because it was as close as you could get. So here is my reconstruction of it.

There exist untold numbers of tiny men you cannot see who like to run faster than a lightning strike through tunnels made of certain shiny silvery or bronze colored elements. If you build tunnels for them, they can be persuaded to move your wheels. By placing a wheel at one end, and using the wind from a fire to make it move, they can be induced to run. You then connect the tunnel to another wheel at the other end, and allow the tiny men to push upon it. If they come out of the tunnel at the right angle, the wheel will appear to move by itself. These tunnels can be constructed throughout the entire world to move all of your wheels. Just as you have many different sizes and thicknesses of wheels, the tiny men interact with many different types of wheels to do things which would seem magical to you. The tiny men are often very choosy about the types of wheels they interact with, requiring a very fine construction, but with the proper smarts, they can do almost any task for you. Keep in mind that we speak in metaphors, the reality is much more complex, but that is basically how it works.

So the "tiny men" are purely metaphorical, representing electrons, the tunnels are cables, and even though most technology to generate power and run equipment is based on the wheel, our understanding of the wheel is a bit more advanced and expansive than the caveman's. Not sure where you can go with that, but those are my musings on it.
 

luc

Ambassador
Ambassador
FOTCM Member
Neil said:
That entire session was very interesting, but the elevator part is what really made me kind of crazy. I was with Laura, this had to be some kind of "esoteric elevator." But the Cassiopaeans stated quite clearly that it was not. I was also kind of curious how metaphorical these "bases" were, but they seemed to have some level of physicality to them, they could be reached with a very physical, mundane, run of the mill elevator. Even to 5D no less! if that wasn't a corrupted session, I have to say the mental image kind of throws me for a loop.

Same here - thanks for posting this session. It sort of ties in to the numerous hints by the Cs about 4D being "higher", that people with awareness will "rise like eagles" and so on. My current understanding is that on 4D, beings have a "higher perspective" - while we in 3D are part of all the mayhem that is going on on our level, from 4D you operate more on an "energetic" level, looking "down" on all the energies stretching through time and space. So I take the elevator image more as something symbolic - you rise from the "storm" of 3D energy exchanges to "above the storm", where you can look at all this from a quiet/completely still place outside of time.

This reminds me of the "portal" that is supposed to be in the Middle East:

Session 3 June 1995 said:
Q: Obviously this is a big one... it relates directly to the crossed shin bones, the skull, the shoulder blades, knees, elbows and a lot of other symbology... the exposed breast of the Masonic initiate. In the Bible where it says that Jesus was scourged, it is actually a word that usually means the pressing and squeezing that cause milk to express from the breast. On page 33 of 'Bringers of the Dawn,' Barbara Marciniak writes: 'there have been different portals on earth that have allowed different species, creator gods from space, to insert themselves. One of the huge portals that presently being fought over is the portal of the Middle East. If you think back over the history of the Earth, you will realize how many dramas of religion and civilization have been introduced in that portal. It's a huge portal with a radius of 1,000 miles or so. This is why there is so much activity in the Middle East. This is the portal that the Lizzies use.' Could you comment on that information. Are there other portals that are that large which are used by positive entities?

A: Portal is dual.

Q: So any can use it. Is it correct that this is a large portal over the Middle East?

A: Statements made in publication are close, but not absolute.

Q: Is this idea of portals extremely significant. Are they fought over?

A: Yes, but you do not need to explore these truths, until you have learned more.

When I first read this, I thought that the Lizzies are kind of sending some guys through that portal to influence history or something, but maybe it makes more sense to see it from an "energetic" perspective: obviously, the middle east was and is playing a very important role in the programming of our minds, so in a sense, if we look at the history of the last few thousand years or so as a whole, a lot of energy is concentrated there, a lot of "energy exchange" is going on. So in a sense, what is/was happening there over the millennia, and most importantly how we perceive and react to it, IS an expression of energies coming from higher densities.

So maybe we shouldn't think of some kind of literal portal in the middle east where some Lizzies walk through or something, but more of a "portal" between that "storm" that is our 3D reality, and that place outside the storm that is still and beyond time. From there and through this "portal", higher "symbolic" energies can be "injected" that are equivalent to a certain drama playing out over time as we perceive it. How excatly this mechanism works is beyond us for now of course. But the point is that the "portal" is just a symbol for something we cannot grasp - because these things are beyond linear time, on a level of finer energies that we can only become aware of by carefully observing 3D reality and applying clear thinking/deductions, but not directly (yet?).

FWIW
 

Yas

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Laura said:
[Snip]
As the Cs pointed out, 4D is more or less HERE all the time - as are the other densities, so what is it that is preventing us being part of it? Also, as the Cs pointed out, 4D is as much state of awareness as it is change of state. Your state won't change until your awareness does, and your awareness won't change until you change your state. Kind of a Catch 22. It is only with super-efforts, as Gurdjieff said, and help of the network, that you can bootstrap yourself out of the old state into a new one.

They gave lots of clues about this, like "seeing the unseen" which I talked about in some detail in The Wave, but we have learned OH, so much MORE in the past 14 years of the ongoing hands on experiment!!!

Thanks Laura!

I've been wondering about this in many occasions too and the best I can understand is that densities are kind of like "layers" in reality. It's not that we "jump" to another reality but all of it is right here at the moment and it is our awareness that makes the difference in what we can perceive of it. Just like the excerpt form Tertium Organum you include in The Wave (although you say it isn't scientifically accurate, I think it gives a good perspective to understand a bit about densities... as well as Flatland). So, as you say, what matter is what we can see, and what we can see is determined by many factors, but the one we are in control of is our choices... we can choose to gather information and apply that information to our lives, and we can also choose to make the effort to learn from this life in these conditions (3D, Earth, etc...). By doing this, we might start seeing more and more, and maybe we will be able to see new aspects of reality one day.

For me this can be understood by lowering the abstract concepts to things that we can experience in our lives. For example, a few years ago, I didn't know about how the body works, and then, I started learning about that and my whole understanding changed. I see our bodies as microcosmos where we are "the cosmic mind" for our microbes (if we are conscious of course), and the microbes and cells in our bodies are just like we humans, and animals and plants and every other thing that has a function. Then there are parasites that infect the body, and make it malfunction, similar to psychopaths on Earth... and we, our body's "cosmic mind" can send in some "earth changes" and "meteors" to bring balance to this microcosmos again. Well, I feel a bit silly when writing about this, but is an analogy that has been in my mind for a while :P One of my points is that, experiences, information and knowledge bring new understandings and we start seeing different aspects of reality that we didn't see before. I even believe it is possible that many here have so much more knowledge than me, that they can actually "be" in a slightly "different reality", because they can see more of it, but our realities overlap in what we can both see.

Another thing that is important to me is the stoic idea of differing what we can change and we can't. What can we control and what not? We don't have control of 4D beings and what the may do to us, but we do have the chance to choose to protect ourselves in ways that we are capable of. I think it's good to keep an open mind about the actual reality of these beings and other concepts that the Cs tell us, as means to amplify our perspective of the universe and to know that there is much more that we yet don't understand. Nevertheless, in more practical terms, it's best to take care of our lives in 3D, start from what we can see and understand, so to say... then we might meet new challenges from the new perspectives we achieve by this work... ending with a bit OSIT :lol:
 

3DStudent

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Yas said:
One of my points is that, experiences, information and knowledge bring new understandings and we start seeing different aspects of reality that we didn't see before. I even believe it is possible that many here have so much more knowledge than me, that they can actually "be" in a slightly "different reality", because they can see more of it, but our realities overlap in what we can both see.

Yeah, when I look at my own knowledge gained and think, "We'll this is what I know and it's profound and leaves me in awe. Surely other members know more and have connected more dots. What is their awareness level?" Not that it's any kind of competition.

And I half jokingly wonder, is anyone in the forum going to say, "Hey guys, um, we're in 4D, and everything's weird, but it also all makes sense." Or they've got one toe in, so to say. But if it's awareness level that counts, then surely us still below that level of awareness are a subset of it, so we only understand things from our level. And you can only explain to a child things in a way that he or she will understand. And so I think there are sort of micro jumps even in 3D where you gain a broader understanding, and you can see down in a better perspective, but not up until you reach that plateau.

Which brings to mind putting one on the step behind you. I get an image of a pyramid, although that's a bit STS oriented. Maybe a spiral staircase is better.

I've always thought 5D life review would be really "Heavenly" or etheral. Like I'm an angel-like being or orb of light surrounded in bright light pondering things. That it seems like an abduction experience, or physical hospital visit seems kind of physical and nuts and bolts. Oh, and that multi-density elevator must have some trippy music! :P ;)
 

bjorn

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
[quote author= 3D student]I've always thought 5D life review would be really "Heavenly" or etheral. Like I'm an angel-like being or orb of light surrounded in bright light pondering things. That it seems like an abduction experience, or physical hospital visit seems kind of physical and nuts and bolts.[/quote]

I don't get it either. Maybe 5D entities can assist us in more ways than we know. (spirit guides?) And how do you even 'build' a portal to 5D. It's out of reach of 4D because it shines from 7D and is linked to 5D. And those portals are only meant to open when you return 'home' to 5D for you, and nobody can interfere with it. Do these portals somehow exist natural at certain places? And 3/4D decides to 'build' there bases there? And that has benefits? Because I don't see how 3/ 4 D can 'build' portals to 5D.



The C's also once said that airports are used by both. (Like underground Denver airport) Meaning by STS and STO? And that not all bases are STS. So some are STO?

[quote author= November 4, 1995 ]Q: (T) OK, so the bases in third density here, are bases for whomever is working with the fourth density beings, that they can exist in it over long periods of time. The fourth density beings can come through to this density, by use of the base.. . [Dogs start howling in the back yard, distracting the session.] ... Now, I've lost my train of thought. OK, we've got a base, bases that exist... (L) Who... (T) Third, fourth and fifth, and they can transit between third, fourth and fifth... The bases are STS bases, let's establish that. (L) That's an assumption...let's ask. (T) Are the bases STS bases?
A: Mostly.[/quote]

[quote author= July 12, 1997]Q: Well, this is what we are looking at! I have even discovered that Sir Francis Bacon's name is even derived from "beech," and that his Latin signature has the gematria number of 17 - and January 17 is the feast day of St. Anthony, who replaced St. Augustine in this affair somewhat... and I have connected the Rosicrucians all over the blasted planet, for crying out loud! And, who is who here? Just who are the good guys?
A: Airports are used by both.
Q: Well, what is THAT supposed to mean?
A: Transdimensional Atomic Remolecularizer.
Q: You mean there is a TDARM at the Denver Airport?
A: Not that simple... and much, much deeper meaning. Did you catch the latest report about Neanderthals and DNA and how it relates to you? [/quote]

What do they mean with used by both? Is it the same as with 'The illuminati' (focused on the pathway: service to self) and 'The Quorum' (focused on the pathway: service to others) mentioned in the transcript?

That STS tolerates STO because they are somewhat aware that they can't live without them? (To much entropy causes planetary destruction) And that STO understands that without STS, lessons cannot be learned. And because of this they work together at some level?

According to the transcripts 'The Qourum' keeps track of prophesies? What does it mean? That they advice STS what the future will bring on 3D earth if they do this or that? I mean, being blinded by wishful thinking they can't see very far ahead. And if every action you take can invite planetary destruction and both parties don't want that. Having someone at 'your side' that is STO can help a great deal?

But here is where I give up. It's like we have some pages of a book. But most of it is missing. Maybe some things are not that relevant right now and we are only given the right material as to proceed from there. The rest can come later?
 

Joe

Administrator
Administrator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
Neil said:
That entire session was very interesting, but the elevator part is what really made me kind of crazy. I was with Laura, this had to be some kind of "esoteric elevator." But the Cassiopaeans stated quite clearly that it was not. I was also kind of curious how metaphorical these "bases" were, but they seemed to have some level of physicality to them, they could be reached with a very physical, mundane, run of the mill elevator. Even to 5D no less! if that wasn't a corrupted session, I have to say the mental image kind of throws me for a loop.

This was a good example of what I was getting at. When asked if there are bases in the US, the Cs say 'yes'. The Pentagon is one. So you go to the Pentagon and all you find is bricks and mortar. There is no "other density" base at the Pentagon, so you won't find one, no matter how hard you look, because you look only in 3D. From the Cs perspective though, it is a "trans-density base", because with their ability to see more than 3D, they see it. So for now, we have to just take everything the Cs says in this respect as theoretical, in the same way that theoretical physicists posit the existence of things they cannot see or even measure with instruments. Some things can be assumed to exist, but only as a result of the trace of 'mark' they leave that can be measured.

Neil said:
There exist untold numbers of tiny men you cannot see who like to run faster than a lightning strike through tunnels made of certain shiny silvery or bronze colored elements. If you build tunnels for them, they can be persuaded to move your wheels. By placing a wheel at one end, and using the wind from a fire to make it move, they can be induced to run. You then connect the tunnel to another wheel at the other end, and allow the tiny men to push upon it. If they come out of the tunnel at the right angle, the wheel will appear to move by itself. These tunnels can be constructed throughout the entire world to move all of your wheels. Just as you have many different sizes and thicknesses of wheels, the tiny men interact with many different types of wheels to do things which would seem magical to you. The tiny men are often very choosy about the types of wheels they interact with, requiring a very fine construction, but with the proper smarts, they can do almost any task for you. Keep in mind that we speak in metaphors, the reality is much more complex, but that is basically how it works.

So the "tiny men" are purely metaphorical, representing electrons, the tunnels are cables, and even though most technology to generate power and run equipment is based on the wheel, our understanding of the wheel is a bit more advanced and expansive than the caveman's. Not sure where you can go with that, but those are my musings on it.

That's an interesting exercise! :D
 

Joe

Administrator
Administrator
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FOTCM Member
3D Student said:
I've always thought 5D life review would be really "Heavenly" or etheral. Like I'm an angel-like being or orb of light surrounded in bright light pondering things. That it seems like an abduction experience,

That's an interesting thought 3D student. I wonder if the programming of mainstream religion around the 'after life' and 'heaven' might not be very useful to someone who anticipated lots of humans dying and ending up in "4D" and, with the expectation of just 'floating around with the angles', might not be much more easily manipulated. Those who, on the other hand, have an expectation of getting on with stuff just like before, might have a better chance of not being conned. Basically, the two different assumptions might be:

1) If after I die I wake up and things are a bit weird but I'm still 'here', then my job is to figure out what's going on and what I need to be doing

or

2) When I die I'm going to wake up in heaven with Jesus and the angles and float around preening my wings, playing a harp and eating ambrosia for eternity.

Seems to me number two is much better for hedging your bets!
 

Meager1

Dagobah Resident
FOTCM Member
Interesting thread!
I wonder if it was ever asked about the possibility of bases under the oceans?
Assuming the pressure wouldn't bother them, that would be the perfect place to hide a base.
 
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