The Carnivore Diet

[3DStudent]

Anecdotally, I've always been a fan of liver anyway, and my local butcher is very obliging and supplied me with Ox heart and kidneys, so I've been enjoying including these organs in my diet for the variety and sheer deliciousness.. but are they necessary?

I don't know about the nose to tail approach, but I think organ meats are in fact necessary. That is, there is something that you get from them that you can't get from muscle meats alone. Definitely for Vitamins A and D in the case of liver. I eat a pound of liverwurst a week, which is something like 3 or 4 meals.

 

[Il Matto]

Thank you 3DStudent.

I think organ meats are in fact necessary. That is, there is something that you get from them that you can't get from muscle meats alone. Definitely for Vitamins A and D in the case of liver

That's pretty much the justification for eating 'nose to tail' according to Dr Saladino, who wholly advocates eating spleen, pancreas, heart, brain etc. He makes the point that our ancestors were unlikely to have wasted anything of an animal successfully hunted, and would most likely have prized the organs more highly over the muscle meats as they were aware of the nutrient density of the organs. This makes some sense to me. Which really just makes me curious about other public experts on the carnivore diet suggesting that eating organ meats is unnecessary..

 

[thewoman]

Listening to the recent health and wellness show about the Carnivore Diet with Phil Escott I think that it would be good to have a topic of it's own about it and maybe some people would like to test it and report back. Beside getting some advices and facts about the diet itself.

Phil Escott himself has written a book ARTHRITIS - The Best Thing That Ever Happened to Me, which isn't primarily about the carnivore diet. Though there are some other authors out there who wrote about it. In a quick search on Amazon Kristen Suzanne is one of many who wrote a book about it and maybe is a good starter to get an overview.

At least to my own story, I like to give it a shot since I'm more or less on an easy going Paleo Diet (with sometimes too many carbs) and after a longer time on a ketogenic diet it sounds like a good experiment. Especially considering my own health history of Diabetes, a life with almost no carbs is at least for me the best way to go when I'm looking back on my glucose levels. Anyway it sounds like fun, to do another experiment.

Here are some quotes from Kristen Suzannes book:



The question arises. How to start it and how to do it? Kristen speaks also about ketu-flu symptoms once you switch over, but that it maybe is easier when you are eating already less carbs.



The main thing I'm mainly concerned about is about losing weight again, but with eventually enough proteins this may not happen.

Anyway, I most likely start next weekend with it and give it a shot, but first some bad carbs need to be eaten, because once they are somewhere stored and I know that they exist it is hard to resist .

i am severely underweight b/c of digestive issues and want to GAIN weight as well. i am apprehensive about the diet b/c it is normal to lose weight, especially at the beginning. i started on it 20 days ago. i have back pain that is very uncomfortable and i understand that is indicative of the oxalate dumping that occurs and it's worse when going cold turkey. anyone experience this? and if you have successfully gained on it, what exactly did you do?

 

[thewoman]

I have the idea that this carnivore thing could be kind of like the ultimate reset switch for the body, and that it may not be that "meat heals" but instead it's the one thing from which we can derive nutrition without all the other gut-damaging stuff like lectins, fibre, gluten etc. It's like giving the gut a break to rest up and perhaps (hopefully) even heal itself. Who knows, perhaps beef or similar large mammal meat was the one thing we mainly subsisted on during evolution for a very, very long time and everything else is iffy.

As for the potential risks, non-organic and non-grass-fed meat will likely have high amounts of glyphosate in the muscle tissue and various other toxins in the fat. Having large amounts of muscle meats is also discouraged by some camps -at least without equal amounts organs and gelatine. And the keto folk also say don't eat too much protein, but that looks pretty much impossible on this diet.

Since we've heard such stories of miraculous recoveries of everything from autoimmune disorders to basic health niggles, I'm jumping in to try this for 30 days. Currently on Day 2. Headache, fatigue and flu-like symptoms so far.

Of course it all begs the question: what on earth is the root cause? For people with serious conditions, is there simply no other way to get through life than eating an extremely restrictive diet forever? A diet that does makes the symptoms go away, but if you slip up and eat a piece of salad then you get a month of depression and arthritis? There's a whole lot we don't know I guess.

Anyway check out Mikhaila's new video:

adding back foods when on strict carnivore is what concerns me as well. i can't eat like this forever, i just need some variety. i can go predominantly meat, but i just gotta have some kind of veggie and a tiny piece of dark chocolate at some point. the only thing i eat that isn't on the diet right now is coffee. not giving up my coffee. i do put a tablespoon of grass fed butter in it. i don't want to have to FORCE myself to eat in a strict way. i am on day 20 and my biggest, actually my only, issue is some pretty serious back pain. i had some toilet issues, constipated) for a few days at the beginning but epsom salts flushes handled that. i believe the back pain is kidney related. oxalate dumping! AARGH! if this was not happening, i would be good to go. am determined to hang in there and wait for the "magic" to happen. i have had awful ibs (the we don't know what is causing this label) for a few years and hoping this will fix. it sounds miraculous. i hope it is!

 

[goyacobol]

adding back foods when on strict carnivore is what concerns me as well. i can't eat like this forever, i just need some variety. i can go predominantly meat, but i just gotta have some kind of veggie and a tiny piece of dark chocolate at some point. the only thing i eat that isn't on the diet right now is coffee. not giving up my coffee. i do put a tablespoon of grass fed butter in it. i don't want to have to FORCE myself to eat in a strict way. i am on day 20 and my biggest, actually my only, issue is some pretty serious back pain. i had some toilet issues, constipated) for a few days at the beginning but epsom salts flushes handled that. i believe the back pain is kidney related. oxalate dumping! AARGH! if this was not happening, i would be good to go. am determined to hang in there and wait for the "magic" to happen. i have had awful ibs (the we don't know what is causing this label) for a few years and hoping this will fix. it sounds miraculous. i hope it is!

@thewoman ,

I see these are your first posts which are interesting and deserve some responses. If you could also introduce yourself in the thread

Newbies & Important Notices to All Members we would love to know how you found the forum with a brief introduction. You do not have to make it long. You can see how others have posted there.​

I could not view the Mikhaila video for some reason but I am guessing it is Mikhaila Peterson who is Jordan Peterson's daughter?

I know Mikahila is on a carnivore diet and having good results.

I am on a not super strict diet. I would categorize it as keto/paleo.

I do think it is a very individual thing based on our genetics as to how we adapt our diet to our body's needs.

I am not sure that "oxalate dumping" is the problem since some do not know if it is actually happening.

Here is one article:

What Is Oxalate Dumping? Symptoms and Ways to Prevent It​

The article says:
Typically, these symptoms are temporary and only last a few days or weeks as the body rids itself of excess oxalate stores.

That said, keep in mind that most of the symptoms described above are based on anecdotal evidence and not backed by research.

As for "i had some toilet issues, constipated) " I think the keto diet causes this issue for many. I did not notice it so much until recently after several years on a "keto/paleo" diet.

I found a good source of fiber helps quite a bit. I searched for a fiber source and found a cereal that seems to help called Smart Bran which has 17 grams of fiber per serving (3/4 cup).

The Cs do say that there is flexibility in how many carbs we consume based on our genetics. I don't want to get too esoteric or woo-woo but this is a forum based on the Cs communication to us through @Laura and the crew.

Session 9 April 2011:

Q: So, you’re saying when you work on yourself, and you change something from a certain level, that it acts on more fundamental levels even as far as your DNA? Which then enables you to receive finer or differently tuned energies, which can help to change you more? And if that happens, it enables you to achieve more and do more. Is that sort of what we’re getting at here?

A: Yes. Not quite clear as you put it; but close enough.

Q: (L) Do I need to be clearer?

A: When you do, you will.

Q: (L) Is there any relation between the above and the rashes that people here are having?

A: Watch the diet!

Q: (L) Does that mean as I think, being very careful about any carbs?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) is that because we are being beamed as I suspect? This HAARP activity?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) And so one must keep that in mind while this heavy beaming is going on. One needs to be extra careful in all respects of hygiene: physical, mental, emotional, spiritual.

A: Yes. As we said a moment ago, there are forces seeking to interfere with the process.

So, as you can see carbs got my attention.

But like many others, I miss some of those "carbs" too.

Session 26 July 2014:

Q: (dugdeep) I've got a whole paragraph here about diet, but I'll just break it down. [Regarding the paleo/keto diets], is it more about spiking insulin than it is about total carbs and protein?

A: Yes.

Q: (dugdeep) We were wondering about why these skinny people seem to lose what seems like too much weight. Is it necessary for them to keep a certain amount of insulin raised in order to not lose too much weight? Or can that be countered by eating more fat?

A: More fat. Insulin causes stress to the body across the board.

So more "fat" is actually good which is the opposite of what most nutritionists are telling us.

I think in the final analysis we need to realize we are all different genetically and need to adjust accordingly:

One context in which to view dieting takes in more than just the average view as suggested in the following session:

Session 4 April 2015:

(L) Okay, we have an individual who wrote:

"Since more than eight months ago I am in the hands of doctors who cannot detect what is my problem. Personally I think it may be something like inflammation in the bowel, such as Crohn's disease. Interestingly, these discomforts have started when I really started to follow a ketogenic diet, and as you have reported, can lead to changes in DNA... Therefore, I wonder if I experienced a DNA that has become a problem due to "the animal ancestor", which does not let me adapt to the diet? [Neanderthals suffered from psoriasis and Crohn's disease, says study]
Could you ask to the C's for a simple diagnostic to do something about it?"

(L) Is there something that you can say to this individual?

A: For many, the transition in diet is either not possible due to epigenetic factors, or must be undertaken very, very slowly. For some, the requirements for carbohydrates is higher. They need to fulfill this need as safely as possible. In this case, the individual has intuited the relationship and should do some experimental adjustments adding root type vegetables and some greens and berries.

Q: (L) What you're saying, I think, is that for some people, transitioning to functioning on ketones is much more difficult for a variety of reasons?

A: Yes

Q: (L) So, the ketogenic diet is not ultimately desirable for everyone?

A: No

Q: (Galatea) But then that also leads to the question about how being on a ketogenic diet helps you evolve and raise your FRV, and make you super-smart and strong?

(Chu) The path to transformation and all that...

(L) Are you saying that the people who can't do the ketogenic diet that they...

(Galatea) They can't evolve, or they can do it another way?

A: It is helpful to evolving and FRV for those who require it. For some, it is required that they follow an adjacent plan. There is a great range of individual types. As you may have noticed, the ketogenic path is very difficult and a challenge even for the people it is right for. Some others have a bit more leeway and less struggle. And in answer to your next question, indeed there is something like karma involved.

Q: (L) So are you suggesting that those of us who need the ketogenic diet have karma to pay off? That we're being tortured? [laughter] We were gluttons in past lives or something?

A: Close enough! But aren't you glad that a path is available?

Q: (L) Well, that leads to the question: You also once said that the development of the soul is married to the genetics. Is there something involved with that in this?

A: Yes

 

[nicklebleu]

I concur with goyacobol - diet is very individual, and while there are general guidelines that (probably) apply to almost anyone, the devil usually is in the detail.

Gluten is probably bad for at least 75% of the population.
Too many carbs is bad - however how much is too much? I was OK on a very-low carb diet (10g/d) for almost 3 years, until I wasn’t. I started to feel miserable and once I upped the (complex) carbs somewhat, I felt better.

I have come to the conclusion that to permanently be on a very-low carb/ keto/ carnivore diet is probably not a good idea. It is a bit like medicine - you take it when you need it, and once the ailment is better, you move on. Mikahila P. has a very severe form of juvenile arthritis, so for her being 100% carnivore might be the solution. But it might not be the solution for you.

So, you need to experiment with the amount of carbs, but also with specific foods. Often it is one specific food, or food group, that is problematic. There are the usual culprits - dairy, nightshades, lectin-rich foods etc.

One way to do that is (now that you are fully carnivore), to reintroduce certain foods every 3 days and see what happens. Do you feel better, more energetic? Or do you feel more tired, brain-foggy etc?

Hope that helps!

 

[thewoman]

i started on strict carnivore from what i considered a very healthy diet. organic, pasture raised animals, very clean, no junk fast food ever. i began to have constant stomach pain that was diagnosed as ibs, which we know is meaningless and just a label for they don't know the cause. i will not take pharmaceuticals of any kind so am looking for a way to reset my body and give it what it needs, which has obviously changed over the years.

my experience right now is that i am working with a doc who switched me to strict carnivore suddenly. i have read that is much rougher than transitioning and phasing out carbs gradually. but since i didn't do that, i am experiencing more severe symptoms. my back is so painful i have not been able to walk well and getting out of bed or from a chair can be excrutiating if not slow and careful.

this whole thing is so new i don't know what to expect and every new awful thing is scary. don't even know how much poop to expect since i hear it is much less on carnivore in general. i am experiencing some very strange waves of what i can only describe as cortisol flushes some nights, like last night, that are horrible with doom and gloom thougths, kept me up all night. last but not least, i came into this severely underweight, and have been nervous about that from the beginning since 99% of all the testimonials and reasons for people doing this in the first place is to LOSE weight. and i have indeed lost some weight but am afraid to get on the scale. that is the most concerning thing to me and i tend to catastrophise at times..

i am here for support. to hear others who have experiencing the same things. there aren't many places to reach out that have factual information and good experiences and information to share. i hope to get some help here and offer some as well along the way.

i found this forum through a search. it looked like the most active one. thank you for welcoming me. i hope we all get through this chaotic time soon and brand new.
i certainly hope to be posting a successful testimonial here at some point soon. i am not blessed with the seemingly immediate results some get.

 

[thewoman]

@thewoman ,

I see these are your first posts which are interesting and deserve some responses. If you could also introduce yourself in the thread

Newbies & Important Notices to All Members we would love to know how you found the forum with a brief introduction. You do not have to make it long. You can see how others have posted there.​

I could not view the Mikhaila video for some reason but I am guessing it is Mikhaila Peterson who is Jordan Peterson's daughter?

I know Mikahila is on a carnivore diet and having good results.

I am on a not super strict diet. I would categorize it as keto/paleo.

I do think it is a very individual thing based on our genetics as to how we adapt our diet to our body's needs.

I am not sure that "oxalate dumping" is the problem since some do not know if it is actually happening.

Here is one article:

What Is Oxalate Dumping? Symptoms and Ways to Prevent It​

As for "i had some toilet issues, constipated) " I think the keto diet causes this issue for many. I did not notice it so much until recently after several years on a "keto/paleo" diet.

I found a good source of fiber helps quite a bit. I searched for a fiber source and found a cereal that seems to help called Smart Bran which has 17 grams of fiber per serving (3/4 cup).

The Cs do say that there is flexibility in how many carbs we consume based on our genetics. I don't want to get too esoteric or woo-woo but this is a forum based on the Cs communication to us through @Laura and the crew.

Session 9 April 2011:


So, as you can see carbs got my attention.

But like many others, I miss some of those "carbs" too.

Session 26 July 2014:


So more "fat" is actually good which is the opposite of what most nutritionists are telling us.

I think in the final analysis we need to realize we are all different genetically and need to adjust accordingly:

One context in which to view dieting takes in more than just the average view as suggested in the following session:

Session 4 April 2015:

i am brand new here. what is "C"?

 

[Goemon_]

Cs is short for The Cassiopaeans.

 

[anartist]

i started on strict carnivore from what i considered a very healthy diet. organic, pasture raised animals, very clean, no junk fast food ever. i began to have constant stomach pain that was diagnosed as ibs, which we know is meaningless and just a label for they don't know the cause. i will not take pharmaceuticals of any kind so am looking for a way to reset my body and give it what it needs, which has obviously changed over the years.

my experience right now is that i am working with a doc who switched me to strict carnivore suddenly. i have read that is much rougher than transitioning and phasing out carbs gradually. but since i didn't do that, i am experiencing more severe symptoms. my back is so painful i have not been able to walk well and getting out of bed or from a chair can be excrutiating if not slow and careful.

this whole thing is so new i don't know what to expect and every new awful thing is scary. don't even know how much poop to expect since i hear it is much less on carnivore in general. i am experiencing some very strange waves of what i can only describe as cortisol flushes some nights, like last night, that are horrible with doom and gloom thougths, kept me up all night. last but not least, i came into this severely underweight, and have been nervous about that from the beginning since 99% of all the testimonials and reasons for people doing this in the first place is to LOSE weight. and i have indeed lost some weight but am afraid to get on the scale. that is the most concerning thing to me and i tend to catastrophise at times..

i am here for support. to hear others who have experiencing the same things. there aren't many places to reach out that have factual information and good experiences and information to share. i hope to get some help here and offer some as well along the way.

i found this forum through a search. it looked like the most active one. thank you for welcoming me. i hope we all get through this chaotic time soon and brand new.
i certainly hope to be posting a successful testimonial here at some point soon. i am not blessed with the seemingly immediate results some get.

I think @Turgon was experiencing weight loss concerns on the keto/carnivore diet, but I believe they were solved by increasing the amount of food (mostly proteins/fat) eaten. Hopefully he will be able to add some info here.

 

[goyacobol]

Cs is short for The Cassiopaeans.

i am brand new here. what is "C"?

@thewoman ,

@Goemon answered correctly. It is just a short acronym for The Cassiopaeans. You can find it used in many of the transcripts.

For example:

Session 11 March 1995:

March 11, 1995

Frank, Laura, Terry, Jan, SV

This was the session held on the evening of the day we gave a demo at the local MUFON meeting. At that meeting, one of the attendees placed a gauss meter on the table beside the board and every time the Cs responded to a question, it buried the needle. (Gauss meter: an instrument for measuring the intensity magnetic fields.)

Q: (L) Hello.

A: Real UFOs SV.

Q: (T) The word is coming off the board because the surface is too slick to hold the ink. {We were using a new board and had added several words and punctuation marks to it.}

A: Density.

I was not sure how familiar you are with @Laura's book. If you could post a short introduction in

Newbies & Important Notices to All Members​

it would help us to know how to answer better I think.

 

[thewoman]

@thewoman ,

@Goemon answered correctly. It is just a short acronym for The Cassiopaeans. You can find it used in many of the transcripts.

For example:

Session 11 March 1995:


I was not sure how familiar you are with @Laura's book. If you could post a short introduction in

Newbies & Important Notices to All Members​

it would help us to know how to answer better I think.

thank you! i posted my stories in the newbies i thought. if not, i don't know where it went. someone responded to it earlier, so it must be posted somewhere. sorry...have to get accustomed to this. appreciate the good help!

 

[Gwenllian]

thank you! i posted my stories in the newbies i thought. if not, i don't know where it went. someone responded to it earlier, so it must be posted somewhere. sorry...have to get accustomed to this. appreciate the good help!

There is no post of you in the newbies section, I just checked.

So, welcome to our forum @thewoman! If you introduce yourself in the newbies section we can get to know you a bit better, but it doesn't have to be anything personal. Just how you found us, whether you read Sott and so on. You can look at other threads of newbies, if you don't know what to write. Thank you!

If you have any trouble posting in the newbies section let us know. We are here to help! In the title you could write something like: Hello, thewoman here (just an example).

 

[thewoman]

There is no post of you in the newbies section, I just checked.

So, welcome to our forum @thewoman! If you introduce yourself in the newbies section we can get to know you a bit better, but it doesn't have to be anything personal. Just how you found us, whether you read Sott and so on. You can look at other threads of newbies, if you don't know what to write. Thank you!

If you have any trouble posting in the newbies section let us know. We are here to help! In the title you could write something like: Hello, thewoman here (just an example).

ok, i just tried again. i clicked on the link you have for newbies and all important notices. i don't see mine there when i hit post reply.

 

[Goemon_]

ok, i just tried again. i clicked on the link you have for newbies and all important notices. i don't see mine there when i hit post reply.

Your introduction has appearded in the newbies section Today at 6:15 PM.
It may have been moved from elswhere by a moderator.