The Vegetarian Myth

That recipe sounds delicious, LQB. I didn't like organ meats much when I was a child, but in my late teens, I started really liking them, especially liver with lots of sauteed onions. Now I LOVE it. The liver here is REALLY tender and delicious, especially when prepared right and eaten with butter. But I can understand having to get over a smell and bad associations like Gonzo. But there's a big difference between boiled kidneys in a commercial kitchen and organ meats using a delicious recipe, so there's still hope....
 
Regarding organ meats, making your own organ sausages or loaves sounds like a good way to get them in. I'm saying this because the liverwurst and braunschweiger they sell on uswellnessmeats has a lot of spices and some honey in it, 4-6g carbs per 85g.

So it looks like you could make your own. Maybe just blend the organ meats and put it in a loaf dish and bake it. Or stuff it in pork casings and make actual sausages. Though, I think you want to be careful with the rich source of Vitamin A in liver, and make sure you match it with enough Vitamin D.
 
SeekinTruth said:
That recipe sounds delicious, LQB. I didn't like organ meats much when I was a child, but in my late teens, I started really liking them, especially liver with lots of sauteed onions. Now I LOVE it. The liver here is REALLY tender and delicious, especially when prepared right and eaten with butter. But I can understand having to get over a smell and bad associations like Gonzo. But there's a big difference between boiled kidneys in a commercial kitchen and organ meats using a delicious recipe, so there's still hope....
Same here on the L&O - lots of onions, ghee, and some broth.
 
Today at noon EST Underground Wellness Radio is hosting Susan Schenck, author of "Beyond Broccoli". Apparently the author, like Lierre Keith, was a strict vegan for many years and began to find chinks in the armor of the vegetarian hypothesis as her health started to wane. Should be an interesting interview.

Found here: www.blogtalkradio.com/undergroundwellness/2012/04/20/when-a-vegetarian-diet-doesnt-work-w-susan-schenck

I think Undground Wellness Radio keeps the interviews accessible at the same link even after it's aired.
 
dugdeep said:
Today at noon EST Underground Wellness Radio is hosting Susan Schenck, author of "Beyond Broccoli". Apparently the author, like Lierre Keith, was a strict vegan for many years and began to find chinks in the armor of the vegetarian hypothesis as her health started to wane. Should be an interesting interview.

Found here: www.blogtalkradio.com/undergroundwellness/2012/04/20/when-a-vegetarian-diet-doesnt-work-w-susan-schenck

I think Undground Wellness Radio keeps the interviews accessible at the same link even after it's aired.

I listened to it last night. Some interesting info (mostly what we know) about what nutrients can only come from animal derived foods, etc., but she still thinks it's good to eat lots of veggies, especially raw, and eating meat sparingly like couple of times a week. Overall, I think she just hit a wall with the vegan diet and is little by little coming toward the truth. But, as I said, she is nowhere near to understanding all the benefits of a ketogenic diet and all the problems with eating a high fiber, high carb diet. FWIW.
 
There are many misconceptions in the way one must thrive on a vegetarian diet. You must consume at least 3,000 calories of fruit (equivalent of 30 bananas) to get all of the necessary amount of vitamins and minerals. You must also be eating some portions of greens. Humans are not meat eaters! Everyone needs to read the book 80-10-10 by Doug Graham and you will find out many things that will re-arrange your notion on how humans are suppose to eat. There is also a forum 30bananasaday.com that will enlighten any misconceptions you have about vegetarianism. You can get enough protein from eating 3,000 calories of fruit and veggies. You will be losing sleep and you will not be losing too much weight. It is a diet of abundance and you can never eat too much fruit.

AlternativeRealm
 
AlternativeRealm said:
There are many misconceptions in the way one must thrive on a vegetarian diet. You must consume at least 3,000 calories of fruit (equivalent of 30 bananas) to get all of the necessary amount of vitamins and minerals. You must also be eating some portions of greens. Humans are not meat eaters! Everyone needs to read the book 80-10-10 by Doug Graham and you will find out many things that will re-arrange your notion on how humans are suppose to eat. There is also a forum 30bananasaday.com that will enlighten any misconceptions you have about vegetarianism. You can get enough protein from eating 3,000 calories of fruit and veggies. You will be losing sleep and you will not be losing too much weight. It is a diet of abundance and you can never eat too much fruit.

AlternativeRealm

Hi AlternativeRealm,

Have you had a chance to read the entire thread?
 
AlternativeRealm said:
There are many misconceptions in the way one must thrive on a vegetarian diet. You must consume at least 3,000 calories of fruit (equivalent of 30 bananas) to get all of the necessary amount of vitamins and minerals. You must also be eating some portions of greens. Humans are not meat eaters! Everyone needs to read the book 80-10-10 by Doug Graham and you will find out many things that will re-arrange your notion on how humans are suppose to eat. There is also a forum 30bananasaday.com that will enlighten any misconceptions you have about vegetarianism. You can get enough protein from eating 3,000 calories of fruit and veggies. You will be losing sleep and you will not be losing too much weight. It is a diet of abundance and you can never eat too much fruit.

AlternativeRealm

You just walked into the WRONG bar, bud!
 
AlternativeRealm said:
... You must consume at least 3,000 calories of fruit (equivalent of 30 bananas) to get all of the necessary amount of vitamins and minerals. You must also be eating some portions of greens. Humans are not meat eaters! Everyone needs to read the book 80-10-10 by Doug Graham and you will find out many things that will re-arrange your notion on how humans are suppose to eat...

We should ignore all of our research and direct experience and simply believe you? Thank you -- I needed a good laugh. Enjoy the bananas.
 
Megan said:
AlternativeRealm said:
... You must consume at least 3,000 calories of fruit (equivalent of 30 bananas) to get all of the necessary amount of vitamins and minerals. You must also be eating some portions of greens. Humans are not meat eaters! Everyone needs to read the book 80-10-10 by Doug Graham and you will find out many things that will re-arrange your notion on how humans are suppose to eat...

We should ignore all of our research and direct experience and simply believe you? Thank you -- I needed a good laugh. Enjoy the bananas.

:dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance: (One of the only thing bananas are good for...)

Edit: Corrected number of bananas to be nutritionally correct
 
Approaching Infinity said:
Megan said:
AlternativeRealm said:
... You must consume at least 3,000 calories of fruit (equivalent of 30 bananas) to get all of the necessary amount of vitamins and minerals. You must also be eating some portions of greens. Humans are not meat eaters! Everyone needs to read the book 80-10-10 by Doug Graham and you will find out many things that will re-arrange your notion on how humans are suppose to eat...

We should ignore all of our research and direct experience and simply believe you? Thank you -- I needed a good laugh. Enjoy the bananas.

:dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance: (One of the only thing bananas are good for...)

Edit: Corrected number of bananas to be nutritionally correct

LOL!! :lol: :lol:
30 bananas, that's hilarious!!
 
Approaching Infinity said:
Megan said:
AlternativeRealm said:
... You must consume at least 3,000 calories of fruit (equivalent of 30 bananas) to get all of the necessary amount of vitamins and minerals. You must also be eating some portions of greens. Humans are not meat eaters! Everyone needs to read the book 80-10-10 by Doug Graham and you will find out many things that will re-arrange your notion on how humans are suppose to eat...

We should ignore all of our research and direct experience and simply believe you? Thank you -- I needed a good laugh. Enjoy the bananas.

:dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance::dance: (One of the only thing bananas are good for...)

Edit: Corrected number of bananas to be nutritionally correct

:lol: Hilarious (AND nutritious)! :P
 
Awhile back the New York Times had an essay contest, asking people to ethically justify the eating of meat. This was the winner of that contest.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/06/magazine/the-ethicist-contest-winner-give-thanks-for-meat.html?_r=1

A few weeks ago, we invited readers to make an argument for the ethics of eating meat. Thousands of readers submitted essays, and thousands more voted on the finalists that we posted online. Our panel of judges — Mark Bittman, Jonathan Safran Foer, Andrew Light, Michael Pollan and Peter Singer — chose the essay below as the winner. It will be published in the May 6 issue of the magazine.

The Ethicist: The Meat You Eat (May 6, 2012)

As a vegetarian who returned to meat-eating, I find the question “Is meat-eating ethical?” one that is in my head and heart constantly. The reasons I became a vegetarian, then a vegan and then again a conscientious meat-eater were all ethical. The ethical reasons of why NOT to eat meat are obvious: animals are raised and killed in cruel conditions; grain that could feed hungry people is fed to animals; the need for pasture fuels deforestation; and by eating meat, one is implicated in the killing of a sentient being. Except for the last reason, however, none of these aspects of eating meat are implicit in eating meat, yet they are exactly what make eating some meat unethical. Which leads to my main argument: eating meat raised in specific circumstances is ethical; eating meat raised in other circumstances is unethical. Just as eating vegetables, tofu or grain raised in certain circumstances is ethical and those produced in other ways is unethical.

What are these “right” and “wrong” ways of producing both meat and plant foods? For me, they are most succinctly summed up in Aldo Leopold’s land ethic: “A thing is right when it tends to preserve the integrity, stability and beauty of the biotic community. It is wrong when it tends otherwise.” While studying agroecology at Prescott College in Arizona, I was convinced that if what you are trying to achieve with an “ethical” diet is the least destructive impact on life as a whole on this planet, then in some circumstances, like living among dry, scrubby grasslands in Arizona, eating meat, is, in fact, the most ethical thing you can do other than subsist on wild game, tepary beans and pinyon nuts. A well-managed, free-ranged cow is able to turn the sunlight captured by plants into condensed calories and protein with the aid of the microorganisms in its gut. Sun > diverse plants > cow > human. This in a larger ethical view looks much cleaner than the fossil-fuel-soaked scheme of tractor-tilled field > irrigated soy monoculture > tractor harvest > processing > tofu > shipping > human.

While most present-day meat production is an ecologically foolish and ethically wrong endeavor, happily this is changing, and there are abundant examples of ecologically beneficial, pasture-based systems. The fact is that most agroecologists agree that animals are integral parts of truly sustainable agricultural systems. They are able to cycle nutrients, aid in land management and convert sun to food in ways that are nearly impossible for us to do without fossil fuel. If “ethical” is defined as living in the most ecologically benign way, then in fairly specific circumstances, of which each eater must educate himself, eating meat is ethical; in fact NOT eating meat may be arguably unethical.

The issue of killing of a sentient being, however, lingers. To which each individual human being must react by asking: Am I willing to divide the world into that which I have deemed is worthy of being spared the inevitable and that which is not worthy? Or is such a division hopelessly artificial? A poem of Wislawa Szymborska’s, “In Praise of Self-Deprecation,” comes to mind. It ends:

There is nothing more animal-like
than a clear conscience
on the third planet of the Sun.


For me, eating meat is ethical when one does three things. First, you accept the biological reality that death begets life on this planet and that all life (including us!) is really just solar energy temporarily stored in an impermanent form. Second, you combine this realization with that cherished human trait of compassion and choose ethically raised food, vegetable, grain and/or meat. And third, you give thanks.
 
whitecoast said:
Awhile back the New York Times had an essay contest, asking people to ethically justify the eating of meat. This was the winner of that contest.
<snip>

That was a pretty good, well informed essay, all things considered. Could get into certain things a bit deeper, but still, covered good ground for a short essay. Any large scale agriculture or animal raising operation is a horror in every way. Good to see some informed discussions in such a mainstream source, anyway.
 

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