Thiamine (Vitamin B1) - A common deficiency in disorders of energy metabolism, cardiovascular and nervous system dysfunction

SummerLite

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Thanks keyhole. Here is my experience with B1 so far. 8 days ago I started with 100 mg of the Allithiamine from Ecological Formulas. Didn't notice anything for 2 days so upped the dose to 200 mg. About an hour later I became very sleepy, I could have fallen asleep so I knew it was working. I slept unusually well that night, a very deep sleep. And this continued for several nights. I hadn't been taking the B1 at the same time as magnesium(only mag. just before bed) but after reading this thread again I started doing that. I'm also taking a B Complex at the same time. I upped the dose again to 300 mg which I did for 2 days but stopped since I had a disagreeable after taste., backed down to 250 mg for a few days and yesterday I did 200 mg. Today I didn't take any. The problem is, I get so sleepy and tired in the middle of the day and have had to take naps. Is this normal? I figured I may be deficient because I drink coffee every morning and every few weeks eat to many sweets. I've always had a problem with low energy. The B1 definitely helped my nervous system since I've felt more relaxed and over all more calm. A certain edginess is gone. I wonder if this tiredness is my body absorbing the supplements because of a substantial deficiency or I'm over doing it. If I continue on maybe I'll come out feeling better eventually if my body needs this but I don't know what is going on. I do feel like its helping me in some ways. When I sleep longer hours I feel much better during the day but when I need to get up earlier for work is when I'm usually tired later on. Maybe I just need more sleep. What is the connection to these supplements and deep sleeping like so many have mentioned here? I usually take Vit C daily as well.

Thanks, I hope you have some ideas for me. Forgot to mention, on the second day after upping the dose I felt a little dizzy, which past quickly maybe after 15 minutes.
 
Last edited:

monotonic

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Take it with zinc to normalize stomach acid production which may help prevent having the taste in your mouth. I just used zinc citrate.

It's possible the tiredness could be refeeding paradox, where the symptoms temporarily become worse.
 

SummerLite

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Another thing I forgot to mention is I've had a lot of oxalites in my diet for the last year, those leafy greens, which I thought may have helped with a deficiency.
 

SummerLite

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
I've gone 2 days without supplements and I'm still feeling drowsy, another nap in the late afternoon yesterday. So I did a Yandex search, the Russian search engine, and so far it looks like a great alternative to Google. Although I was looking for thiamine specifically making me tired, I didn't find much on that but many references to supplements affecting people in just the way I've described. Here is one link: Vitamins, they make me TIRED!

So Its this vitamin combo early in the day which I never had issues with before taking other suppliments. It's suggested to take the supplements at night. I did try this early on and wasn't able to sleep well and explained this by B1/mag helping energy production. But I'm going to give it another try in a few nights after this grogginess wears off. I've always taken magnesium before bed not in the morning or early afternoon which I've been doing for the last week.

I'm pleased that I'm able to recall and experience my dreams so well now. My dreams have always been important to me and I've paid close attention to them over the years. In the last 3 years or so, I've had trouble recalling them which is disappointing. I now wonder if this is due to a thiamine deficiency.
 

Tuatha de Danaan

Dagobah Resident
FOTCM Member
As I said before, keep an eye out because soon there might be something cleaner on the market in the UK. If all goes to plan, the idea is to have a source which is reasonably priced and available in Europe.

Keyhole, this post was from July 2019 and I was wondering if there was any development in a purer Allithiamine
available for U.K and EU or any updates you may have on recommendations.
 

Keyhole

Ambassador
Ambassador
FOTCM Member
Unable to tolerate carbohydrates or alcohol? Chronic burping, reflux, bloating & constipation/IBS? Chronic fatigue, dizziness, shortness of breath, poor circulation, POTS or tremor/vertigo? Unexplained low blood pressure, high heart rate, anxiety, brain-fog, poor body temperature regulation, or water retention? Poor exercise recovery, inability to gain/lose weight, light sensitivity?

If you have any collection of the above symptoms, and they have not been addressed by adequate dietary intervention, you may be suffering from thiamine deficiency.

In the video I examine the clinical signs and symptoms of thiamine deficiency, address some of the potential causes and risk factors, and then discuss why in many cases of severe deficit, diet alone is not sufficient.

I also go over a few recent case studies which demonstrate why supplementation is sometimes necessary to restore health in the context of a long term thiamine deficiency.

 

cope

Jedi Master
Dr Mercola about Thiamine: Vitamin B1 Is Vital to Protect Against Infectious Disease
While a limited number of drugs have been enlisted in the treatment of severe coronavirus (SARS-CoV-2) infection, a number of nutritional supplements have risen to the forefront for their apparent usefulness. In addition to quercetin, zinc and vitamins C and D, vitamin B1 (thiamine) may be vital to protect against infectious respiratory illness.
By dramatically increasing susceptibility to infections, thiamine deficiency could potentially have the ability to impact the spread of just about any pandemic infectious disease
Thiamine deficiency is also associated with the development of high fever, and according to a letter to the editor,21 “Is Parenteral Thiamin a Super Antibiotic?” published in the Annals of Nutrition & Metabolism in 2018, thiamine injections are “likely to eradicate microbial infections” causing the fever.
Thiamine is also part of Dr. Paul Marik’s sepsis treatment, which calls for 1,500 milligrams (mg) of intravenous ascorbic acid every six hours, 200 mg of thiamine every 12 hours and 50 mg of hydrocortisone every six hours.1
 

Tuatha de Danaan

Dagobah Resident
FOTCM Member
In the video I examine the clinical signs and symptoms of thiamine deficiency, address some of the potential causes and risk factors, and then discuss why in many cases of severe deficit, diet alone is not sufficient.

Just watched the video which was not only informative but very well laid out and super easy to understand. Thank you Keyhole for explaining why I am continually cold and unable to gain weight. Can't wait for your next videos to explain which form of thiamine is best to use.Considering the amount of fat and meat I eat in addition to supplements I should be as fit as a butcher's dog but I just can't reach that point.
 

mrtn

Jedi Council Member
Thanks Keyhole, it's interesting, especially the "getting worse" and "doesn't work anymore". I had similar experiences. At first taking Vitamin B1 seemed to do wonders, like a miracle.
(My main problems are brainfog, sluggishness of though etc.)

Here are some points i wrote down at the time (~2019-09):

- less cold (hand, feet etc.)
- need less sleep
- smoking isn't as draining for me as it is normally
- better concentration, cognitive improvements (speed of thinking and focus for example)
- less anxiety, less rumination, more relaxed, better mood (to the point of being positively 'wired', this was nice but weird at the same time, also difficult to get to bed in the evening because full of energy, sometimes i was laughing/giggling instead of falling asleep :umm:, maybe that was the B6)
- it stablilized after aprox. 1 month (I think this referred mostly to the weird energy and mood patterns as well as to increased dreaming)
- better tolerance of carbs (my usual diet is 95% beef)
- reduced acne skin problems (probably due to further giving up diary from milky coffee)
- no herx (not sure what this point is. I probably read somewhere that vitamin B1 supplementation could come with a herx reaction, but in my case everything just got better in the beginning)

some other points for context:

- since around 2018-10 I took a simple vitamin B complex (B1 is thiaminnitrate 15mg)
- since 2019-02 I took it more regularly and I added a second B1/B6 complex (B1 is thiaminchloridhydrochlorid 100mg, B6 is pyridoxinhydrochlorid 100mg)
- 2019-09: One week before my allithiamine arrived I took more or more regularly of the second higher dosed complex, which brought already some improvements (energy/mood/focus). Also noticed more energy during sleep (if that makes sense) like a lot of vivid dreams, probalby due to the B6.
- 2019-09: started with allithiamine, moslty 50mg/day. Around the same time I started to take iodine again, and I had the impression that the vitamin B and iodine work better together, because before i never felt much with iodine but now I have this energy boost that other people reported having from iodine, so I thought maybe it's the iodine that now actually works because of B1)
- then I got worse again (2019-11):
--- I got ill (flu like, but heavier than usual for me, I noticed the unusual shortness of breath / pressure on chest at the time and now in retrospective I think it was this shiny new covy :whistle:. It took many weeks to slowly shake it of)
---- my allithiamine was empty (exactly when i got ill, so no causation here)
---- I also tried higher doses of iodine at that time / before (10-30 drops of 5% lugols), this might have triggered something as well. Then I reduced and stopped iodine because it all felt like a mess and to reset.
- Later (after some gradual recovery, beginning of 2019-12) also slightly higher doses of allithiamine didn't improve anything as it did before when I started (I had brainfog again, difficulty to focus, no energy boosts), also not when adding another thiamine supplement (B1 thiaminchloridhydrochlorid but without the B6) which was quicker to get when my allithiamine was empty. Slightly higher doses means between 50 and 250mg allithiamine + between 100 and 1000mg thiaminchloridhydrochlorid.
- around 2020-01 I got better from that 'flu'. Started to take some zinc and copper and regularly iodine 10 drops/day (of 5% lugols)
- I took Magnesium and vitamin C pretty much all the time, more C when ill (up to 6g), usually 1 or 2g, now mostly 2g/day, sometimes more. Magnesium probably something like between 800 and 2000mg trimagnesiumcitrat(*)
- since 2020-02 I also take sodium bicarbonate and ginko biloba.

Sorry for all the details. The main point is that I found allithiamine/B1 to be a miracle when I started to take it, but that was only for some time and I could not repeat that experience. So I thought it was only by luck and that it had other reasons. But now I will rethink that, and maybe try different doses again, though I can't afford really high doses for longer periods.

BTW, the last time I ordered allithiamine I could find a 250 capsule bottle that ships to germany, which where difficult to find when this thread started IIRC.

(*) just now I see for 1000g that's actually just 150g of actual Magnesium >_<, I have to rethink that dose. How much trimagnesiumcitrat can/should I take to get a proper dose Mg?
 

Mariama

Ambassador
Ambassador
FOTCM Member
It should be up on US Amazon at some point this month. We are seeing about importing a few hundred into the UK, so will keep this page updated :)

Can't wait!

I started taking B100 complex !which includes 100 mg of thiamine after taking B complex with just 1,5 mg of thiamine and I have to say that my energy levels are up again.

I have watched a couple of videos you made about thiamine, Keyhole, and I think I am one of these people that need extra thiamine, which leaves me wondering what impact a purer Allithiamine will have on my health, since this B100 is already doing me a world of good.

Keep up the excellent work and thank you!!
 

monotonic

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
From what I've seen the Allithiamine only seems to be necessary if you have definite neurological symptoms. A friend started taking Thiamine HCl (at a higher dose since it is less absorbable) and reported all the same benefits that I did. That got me wondering if the special forms are really all that necessary for most people. I would start with a bottle of Allithiamine just in case there are genetic defects, but it can be expensive so maybe change to Thiamine HCl later and see how it goes.
 

Keyhole

Ambassador
Ambassador
FOTCM Member
So I have been quite heavily researching thiamine this past month or so. Specifically, I have been searching out papers which were published in Japan in the 1960s but were never translated into english. As Japan was the most heavily affected by thiamine deficiency initially, they piled lots of resources into studying the intricate details of this nutrient and the different forms. They were using thiamine TTFD to address all kinds of issues, although this information was never much brought to the West aside from the information provided by Dr Derrick Lonsdale.

I have written a few basic articles on this topic and done a couple of videos as well. I will post them here in case anyone wants to know more about vitamin B1!

Thiamine TTFD for throat muscle/vocal cord paralysis

Laryngo nerve paralysis addressed by thiamine TTFD!

Clinical Application of TTFD to Several Diseases of the Larynx and Electromyographical Assessment of the Effects of TTFD and TPD upon the Vocal Muscle

"TTFD (thiamine tetrahydrofurfuryl disulfide) was applied to 21 cases of recurrent laryngeal nerve paralysis, 19 cases of so-called muscular paralysis of the larynx, 6 cases of phonasthenia, 21 cases of “abnormal sensation” of the larynx and 1 case of hysteric aphonia. Satisfactory results were obtained in 23 of 32 cases who were followed up.

An additional experiment was performed in order to discuss the effect of TTFD and TPD upon the vocal muscle in the rabbit. The vocal muscle (thyroarytenoid muscle) usually presents electrical activity in the expiratory phase of respiration at rest. Intravenous or intraarterial injection of TTFD or TPD caused marked increase in the expiratory electrical activity of the vocal muscle. This finding appears to have some relation to the clinical effect of TTFD, though the pharmacological mechanism of the effect of TTFD or TPD upon the vocal muscle is remained obscure"

https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/…/11/2/11_113/_article/-char/ja

Thiamine TTFD in high doses for deafness

"Alinamin F (disulfide thiamine) was given, oral and intravenously, to neural deafness and satisfactory results were obtained. The effect was more pronounced in relatively early cases but it was also effective in a case of streptomycin deafness of 3 years standing.

Alinamin F was considerd effective in several cases, in which other agents were not used at the same time.
There was no difference in effect between the oral and the intravenous administration. No noteworthy side effects were observed. "

https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/…/…/56_10_568/_article/-char/ja

Massive Dosage Alinamin F Therapy of Perceptive Deafness

"Massive dosage alinamin F (TTFD) therapy (150mg / day) was performed on 267 ears suffering from various type of perceptive deafness.Therapeutic effect was found in 34.5% of the series.It must be emphasized that the earlier the patient began to undergo this treatment, the more favorable result was obtained. 79.2% of the patients who began to undergo the treatmant within one week from the onset of the disease proved effective, and in the cases that were treated within one month from the beginning of deafness 74.3% benefited from the treatment.

To our regret, nearly half of the series had began to undergo the treatment in more than half years from the onset of deafness with satisfactory result only in less than 30% of them.

The therapeutic effect was most markedly observed when the treatment was continued during two or three months."

https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/.../57/2/57_2_98/_pdf/-char/ja
 

Keyhole

Ambassador
Ambassador
FOTCM Member
Thiamine TTFD in heavy metal chelation

Did you know that thiamine TTFD acts as a heavy metal chelator, and seems to support clearance of metal ions through hair and urine?

In short, the prosthetic sulfur group attached to the TTFD molecule has a high affinity for SH-reactive metal ions including mercury, cadmium, lead, and arsenic. Although research is limited in this area, TTFD has been shown to increase the excretion of metals in the hair and urine, whereas benfotiamine does not.

TTFD may also help to protect against other forms of toxicity. This quality makes TTFD and other disulfide forms of thiamine unique.

 
Top Bottom