What programs have YOU discovered?

The program that I discovered...or maybe it discovered ME, it was kind of hard to miss, is the big capital letters FEAR OF ABANDONMENT Program. This program is as old as me and has essentially ruled my life (and continues to do so, I am very sorry to report) with an iron fist and for as long as I can remember. My very sincere and often herculean efforts to eliminate it have brought only marginal results. I seem to be replaying the "loop" over and over with every new significant relationship in my life.

My mother, an intelligent educated woman who had me kind of young, received quite a handful when she had me, and apparently not exactly what she wanted or expected. I was a fussy baby due to the fact that I had a genetic abnormality under my tongue, i.e. I could not suckle properly and therefore was constantly hungry (very "conveniently" at the first major imprinting phase, which sort of makes one think... and is anyone surprised that I now have severe digestive and immune problems as an adult?). Consequently she could not handle this whole constantly-crying-baby-thing and simply withdrew form me emotionally. Which is absolutely devastating for a baby.

So now, I go through life faithfully replaying this pattern in an attempt to...learn something? correct a karmic pattern? or simply suffering due to a random genetic "glitch" (or not so random maybe).

If anyone has any thoughts on the matter I would be grateful. I have discovered that learning to live alone and not depending on others for emotional or any other support is important. But maybe there are other avenues to explore as well...
 
free4m said:
The program that I discovered...or maybe it discovered ME, it was kind of hard to miss, is the big capital letters FEAR OF ABANDONMENT Program. This program is as old as me and has essentially ruled my life (and continues to do so, I am very sorry to report) with an iron fist and for as long as I can remember. My very sincere and often herculean efforts to eliminate it have brought only marginal results. I seem to be replaying the "loop" over and over with every new significant relationship in my life.

My mother, an intelligent educated woman who had me kind of young, received quite a handful when she had me, and apparently not exactly what she wanted or expected. I was a fussy baby due to the fact that I had a genetic abnormality under my tongue, i.e. I could not suckle properly and therefore was constantly hungry (very "conveniently" at the first major imprinting phase, which sort of makes one think... and is anyone surprised that I now have severe digestive and immune problems as an adult?). Consequently she could not handle this whole constantly-crying-baby-thing and simply withdrew form me emotionally. Which is absolutely devastating for a baby.

It is terrifying for a baby and leads to a deep insecurity as an adult. It's also very, very common. It's basically being raised 'without' a mother which can put the entire emotional substratum on shaky ground.

f said:
So now, I go through life faithfully replaying this pattern in an attempt to...learn something? correct a karmic pattern? or simply suffering due to a random genetic "glitch" (or not so random maybe).

I, of course, can't say for certain, but usually it's in an attempt to get the connection that you could not get from your mother - an attempt to 'fix' the situation that you lived as an infant. Of course, you can't fix it, which means you're dooming yourself to suffer the same loss repeatedly.

f said:
If anyone has any thoughts on the matter I would be grateful. I have discovered that learning to live alone and not depending on others for emotional or any other support is important. But maybe there are other avenues to explore as well...

I see this is your first post on the forum, so, welcome. There is a thread on redirect writing exercises that might be really helpful for you. Basically, as an adult, you can go back and 'redirect' your thinking process about severe trauma and, in doing so, release yourself from the pattern of repeatedly trying to 'fix' what happened (which is impossible). Here is the thread - http://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php/topic,25989.msg309893.html#msg309893

You might want to head over the Newbies section and post a brief introduction so we can get to know you better (you can see how others have done it there). No personal info necessary - just what you're comfortable with writing.
 
I also have programs that I can't seem to fix what I do is let the emotion run through me feel it and then it passes and I move on. You don't have to let the loop/emotion effect a relationship or dictate your actions. It will always effect you but you can get to the point where it only effects you in inner feeling. It doesn't have to effect others. It is obviously uncomfortable to feel the program run in you but it seems like you understand where it came from and why its there and just being an observer of it is one way to mitigate the problem. Along with redirect, EE breathing program will help it has helped me get in touch with my emotions, EE has helped me understand the importance of compassion.
 
anart said:
f said:
So now, I go through life faithfully replaying this pattern in an attempt to...learn something? correct a karmic pattern? or simply suffering due to a random genetic "glitch" (or not so random maybe).

I, of course, can't say for certain, but usually it's in an attempt to get the connection that you could not get from your mother - an attempt to 'fix' the situation that you lived as an infant. Of course, you can't fix it, which means you're dooming yourself to suffer the same loss repeatedly.

f said:
If anyone has any thoughts on the matter I would be grateful. I have discovered that learning to live alone and not depending on others for emotional or any other support is important. But maybe there are other avenues to explore as well...

I see this is your first post on the forum, so, welcome. There is a thread on redirect writing exercises that might be really helpful for you. Basically, as an adult, you can go back and 'redirect' your thinking process about severe trauma and, in doing so, release yourself from the pattern of repeatedly trying to 'fix' what happened (which is impossible). Here is the thread - http://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php/topic,25989.msg309893.html#msg309893

You might want to head over the Newbies section and post a brief introduction so we can get to know you better (you can see how others have done it there). No personal info necessary - just what you're comfortable with writing.

Thank you for the thoughts and the welcome. I will head over there and post something.
 
Menna said:
I also have programs that I can't seem to fix what I do is let the emotion run through me feel it and then it passes and I move on. You don't have to let the loop/emotion effect a relationship or dictate your actions. It will always effect you but you can get to the point where it only effects you in inner feeling. It doesn't have to effect others. It is obviously uncomfortable to feel the program run in you but it seems like you understand where it came from and why its there and just being an observer of it is one way to mitigate the problem. Along with redirect, EE breathing program will help it has helped me get in touch with my emotions, EE has helped me understand the importance of compassion.

I also find that it helps, Menna, when I let the emotions run through me. Indeed it passes and I can move on. Yesterday I felt grief running through me, while I was researching here, walking the dog, doing the normal routine. When I woke up this morning these feelings of grief were gone. The same goes for feelings of outrage. I can picture the most heinous crimes that I would like to commit in my imagination (what I would really love to do to my ex) without even slightly acting on them. Amazing. :cool:

I will head over to the Redirect thread. I already read an article on French SOTT where it was mentioned.

And yes, EE, has also helped me in becoming more compassionate. So many good things are happening, too. :)
 
I have not read through more than a few posts at the beginning of this thread. I thought that if I didn't, what others say would not influence my thinking, and I wanted to open up to the group from what I have internalized and recognized so far.

This list is by no means exhaustive, but are only the programs which are obviously apparent.

-Ignorance; this one reasserts itself as I look and realize how much time wasted believing and accepting the untrue, although the more I try to discern, the less I trust myself and my limited understanding.

-Feelings of self-worth, closely connected to Feelings of worthlessness; this is a strong one which is emerging where I feel or want my opinions heard, that perhaps I would like to share what I have learned here on this forum but also realizing that without a complete understanding I trample on dangerous ground, similar to the warning from Jesus 'woe to him through which deceits come' (paraphrasing here)

-loneliness, this one is old and deep. It's connected to a conviction that I am unworthy of love, that I do not know what love is or how to express it, that I have never known it.

- Self-pity - Wow, this one connects all of the above (and all of the below, thinking more about it). Tells me if only this or this were different, then it would all be better

- Guilt associated strongly with my relationship with my parents. Being an only (lonely?) child, the blame for my feelings of isolation was placed squarely on them as the cause of my misery. As I grew up, I wanted nothing other than to escape their control and their 'old world' ideas. (in brief, my parents were immigrants from Italy who grew up during the depression. Although I was born here, we only spoke Italian at home, and I knew absolutely no English going to school. More reinforcement of the isolation program, which I railed against, again blaming them. Furthermore, my lack of compassion for them as my mother was disabled [having lost her left arm below the elbow and the use of her left eye during the bombing of WW2]; my father having been a factory worker with a very limited understanding of English, and (in my perception) a stubborn attitude in adapting to living in the US. All my misery I laid upon them, when in truth, once I was able to escape by getting married, it turned into an out of the frying pan and into the fire sort of thing. Again reinforcing all of the above.

- Shyness and sheepishness- a consequence of my ego, which I work to protect since a very young age. Fear of misunderstanding my intention, fear of loathing of my thinking, fear of not understanding everyday life -putting my foot in my mouth and not empathizing with others, fear of being misunderstood. Fear of a lack of importance of my opinions. As a bullied child, the wall built around my emotions to protect them (don't let them see you cry). Shyness is also connected to the ignorance program as it is better to keep your mouth shut than to prove how stupid you really are.

-Lack of Discernment connected to my be nice program, in which I need to learn that a snake is a snake and a scorpion is a scorpion; on the other hand, a dove is a dove. Not being able to tell the difference in my life. Easily fooled and follow the piper has been my mode of operation for a very long time. The be nice program is also connected with the desire to be accepted, in which I become who I want others to perceive in me.

- The morality program which only operates as a consequence of what I believe to be right, not realizing that what may be right in my eyes would not be right in another's. This one is connected to thinking that I am a good person, especially when I see what happens not only in the world but also in being judgmental in what I perceive to be right or wrong as I watch others as they interact with each other. Oh, how I love to tell myself I could never be like that!

A big shock for me was the realization that religion as promoted is just another means of control where I thought it actually was a means of obtaining freedom, love and understanding. This fragmented all I ever thought I knew about having a purpose in this world and the true aim of life, knocking me off the course I was on, thinking all the time it was the straight and narrow. I should have known it wouldn't be so easy. This also conditioned me in the laziness program; 'what a relief! the work was already done for me!!! ', preventing me from taking responsibility of my own life and my own situations. I am now viewing my life as a feeding frenzy of blame and of a consequence of 'accidents' over which I believed I had no control; again the laziness takes hold.

Any of these or derivatives thereof are constantly running in me and I believe I am beginning to see them and recognize them. By writing this here, I hope I can begin to look at myself more closely and perhaps stem the reactions, better control the emotions to try to channel into something positive and worthwhile. It would also seem that each of these feed from another source, a center from which I operate in my everyday life. This is something that is bigger than all of them, and controls them all and directs which aspect becomes manifest. As of right now, it has no name or identity of its own but somehow I sense it's presence. I fool myself into thinking this is my core, who I am, but it cannot be because I really do not know who I am or how I fit into this journey we all take together.


This is beginning to seem more like a confession than a recognition of programs as understood by the group here. But it is what I have identified and been able to covey.

I'll go back and read this thread now in its entirety as experiences of others will help uncover more and more as I search for a real person underneath the layers of lies and illusions which has become the person I now identify with. Thanks for the chance to crack the shell I surround myself with!

-maryjane
 
I’m reading through this thread, currently on page 14, but thought I would post.
I’ve been finding lots of programs lately. I is so helpful to read that we have so many similar programs, especially the ones relating to narcissistic wounding.
A core program is that it is wrong that I exist. The most helpful response I have to that is that I exist, whoever “I” is. I asked in EE a while back what lies I am still believing and telling myself. The answer was this program and the answer was that I exist. I still feel it running me a lot.
Other programs are fear-based. Self compassion. I just finished Mme. Saltzmann’s book and am finally reading ISOTM, I realize that I have been beating myself up for still having these programs and, from what I understand, which may be incorrect, by observing them with the third force, neutrality, robs them of their power and I can observe them and then ask myself for, or find the truth to give the lie. I’ve always had a fear of being homeless and this has been triggered in a big way after learning that the corporation I work for plans to phase my job out within the next year. They have already laid off the payroll person and consolidated with the head office back east. (I live on the west coast of Canada). I don’t know if I am just self-calming telling myself that it’s not where I am but who I am and what I See. I am not in a financial position to move to a safer area. My long-time friend who owns the house I’m renting a suite in has been talking for a year about moving to the interior. It seems it is an opportunity for me to let go of what I do not have control of – another person’s choices, and carry on with the Work and learning what I can each day. The 7.7 earthquake today and the tsunami warning has brought it all into sharper focus.
Another program that I’ve been rationalizing with for quite some time and which has kept me from posting anything personal or of value to me or anyone else is that I lack knowledge and am too stupid to post anything worth value. I can see the hierarchical mindset at work largely from fundie upbringing as well as childhood narcissistic wounding, violence and sexual abuse. I realize reading this thread that a big program is that y’all are so far along in the Work and don’t have any more struggles. What a LIE! The moderators struggling with saying what they see in a direct way, for example. Thank you for your honesty.
I found it helpful reading the thread on the response in the adolescent pre-frontal cortex to fear being different from children and adults. I must be careful not to use it as an excuse, but rather as an opportunity to be gentle with myself. My mother invited the pedophile into our lives when I was 11. I think it helps me to be kinder to myself when I find myself still responding to everything with fear. Also the discussion about not fighting the fear but going through it was so helpful. I’m finding the re-direct writing exercises are very helpful as well as Peter Levine’s book and the big 5 on narcissism.
I just keep reading and reading, books and threads. The KD seems to have had a great impact on calming the fear response as well. I do notice that when fear is triggered I still crave sugar, my comfort. Since I realized I have celiac disease and that all grains are literally poison in my body I remind myself that sugar is just as poisonous.
The greatest struggle for me still seems to be against the programs keeping me from contributing more actively in the forum. I think there are several, that I can figure it out on my own, which I know is a BIG lie, but it’s safer. Also I think the “when I’m perfect, when I’ve got it all figured out, I’ll have something worthwhile to contribute.”
Another one is shame and that most people haven’t been abused as much as I have, which is another LIE. It’s difficult to write this, self-pity program but there it is. Reading Amazing Grace shined light on some of those dark corners of self pity.
Another program is that I have to show how smart and knowledgeable I am, so that no one will know how really stupid and worthless I feel when I even think about posting. I think that may have been pretty obvious in some of my past posts.
There are lots of other programs but this post is already long enough so that’s it for now.
Oh, the suicide program. Thank you Niall for talking about this. I haven’t felt it running since I started doing EE. What a relief! It took me quite a while to realize that this was a form of interference, which could easily lead to self importance but having an idea of where it comes from helps fight it.
Thank you to everyone who shares and trusts the other members of this forum.
 
One of my programs is: you are ugly and because you are ugly you are not able to do anything good. Let me explain: when I was born I was a twin. My little sister died after 3 days. My father used to tell this story, very often and specially to his friends in front of me: that when the nurse came to announce to my father that my little sister died she told to my father “the beautiful died, the ugly survive”. You can imagine how shy and how I felt when this story was told and how incompetent I was even if my father laugh every time telling this strange story. In fact a very sadistic story. Around this my mother told me very often that because I was very strong I was de first to be out of her, “killing” my sister. So during many years, almost all my life, I had this mark on me that I was bad and I was very ugly. The consequences of this are abysmal: every time I go looking for a job it is very, extremely hard because I feel ugly, out of place, incompetent. Now I know this is a very huge program and I know that surely my father invented this story (or not). I also know that when I feel ugly it is a program in me and that when I feel rejected I am projecting this rejection to others, that in fact nobody rejects me, it is just the little girl that remembers the words of my father. Due to this program it is for me very hard to see pictures of me and when I put a picture of me somewhere it is really an act of courage. This program made me also feel always guilty (because the words of my mother) and guilty is another program that I have to work. I am a very shy person (even if I don’t look shy to others). This program also is maybe the reason I decided not to have children because I felt incompetent to be a mother. I know I am not ugly, I know that now but it took me many years to forgive my father.

When I discovered this program I was very surprised and the beginning of a sort of liberation. The beginning also to see other programs, and there are many others, many, many. It took many years to see beauty in me. If my father was alive I would ask him only one question: why were you incapable to see that I was a beautiful little girl? What is strange is that my father, in his letters to my grand-mother, was always telling her that I was a very funny little girl, always smiling and laughing.

Words have power and that’s maybe I decided to study literature. To have the power over life. That’s maybe I am surrender by books, addicted to books. Another program!

My English is not very good so it is always very hard to express emotions in another language that is not your primal language.
 
free4m said:
The program that I discovered...or maybe it discovered ME, it was kind of hard to miss, is the big capital letters FEAR OF ABANDONMENT Program. This program is as old as me and has essentially ruled my life (and continues to do so, I am very sorry to report) with an iron fist and for as long as I can remember. My very sincere and often herculean efforts to eliminate it have brought only marginal results. I seem to be replaying the "loop" over and over with every new significant relationship in my life.

My mother, an intelligent educated woman who had me kind of young, received quite a handful when she had me, and apparently not exactly what she wanted or expected. I was a fussy baby due to the fact that I had a genetic abnormality under my tongue, i.e. I could not suckle properly and therefore was constantly hungry (very "conveniently" at the first major imprinting phase, which sort of makes one think... and is anyone surprised that I now have severe digestive and immune problems as an adult?). Consequently she could not handle this whole constantly-crying-baby-thing and simply withdrew form me emotionally. Which is absolutely devastating for a baby.

So now, I go through life faithfully replaying this pattern in an attempt to...learn something? correct a karmic pattern? or simply suffering due to a random genetic "glitch" (or not so random maybe).

If anyone has any thoughts on the matter I would be grateful. I have discovered that learning to live alone and not depending on others for emotional or any other support is important. But maybe there are other avenues to explore as well...

Hi free4M, I have a very similar program. I've definitely dealt with it in the same way, too, and used to be completely helpless and at its mercy until, like you, I realized a likely source of the problem.

I want to second anart's advice about redirecting your thoughts since that might go a long way. The exercise has helped me see how, whenever I even see a woman, I am instantly transported back to that needy condition momentarily and, as she walks/drives away, I feel the total crush of "abandonment". I've redirected that to realize that this mysterious woman does not exist "out there" and it is damaging to project my damaged circuitry onto someone.

It does get better, and I no longer have such a horrible reaction (which may be due to something else, of course) so just be patient and I look forward to reading your introduction. :)
 
I’ve been thinking about the difference between self pity and sorrow/sadness. I have wallowed in self pity for much of my life, justifying myself. Reading the How Not To Be thread has really helped me to see that self pity attempts to manipulate and is a feeding opportunity, holds back the person indulging in it from growing. Observing and feeling sadness and sorrow, however painful in the moment, is an inner, personal process that does feed off of anyone, unless it becomes wallowing. How could I not see this? I’ve turned away from honouring these feelings in order to move through them and to the lightness on the other side. I see how I cut them off with self pity. I feel how toxic it feels inside me. I think it was also a way to try to control people by MAKING them feel my experiences. How ridiculous since no one can truly known another’s experience.

I am finding that when I feel sadness and discover what triggered it and trace it back to past history, I have the choice to be the parent I never had, give myself the kindness and compassion I did not receive and the sadness morphs into a feeling of peace. An example which comes to mind is seeing little girls with her fathers, seemingly happy and safe I would be overwhelmed with sadness. As I have worked through this I notice that now I just smile when I see them together. I am also finding that I experience much less sadness these days and much more curiosity, a thirst to understand the mechanical workings of these programs.

I am working with the fear programs I am discovering and would welcome feedback on what I have discovered. I notice how often when fear is triggered I cover it up with an angry reaction. I don’t know if this is a common response but I notice that it was a pattern of my mother. She turned the anger outward to physical violence against her children and turn it to inward violence against myself. I give the negative introject a field day/ I think I absorbed her fear as well as the anger and the two feed off of each other. Feeling the fear and asking who or what is feeling it is interesting. Which of my little I’s? Or just the predator needing to feed. It seems to always come back to my inner child. I think I’ve been confused about being the observer and having compassion for the wounded parts of me. I think that remaining neutral and observing, without compassion for myself is another programmed response-can’t have needs or be kind to myself. It’s amazing to discover that part of me can be the outside observer and another part can feel the effects of the program and give comfort in the moment, taking away the control from the program. It seems to be a tightrope, I’m highly suspicious of giving comfort and spilling into self-pity. Now I can feel the difference, one is freeing, the other is toxic.

I’ve been noticing that the fear runs my life, I give up my choices in the present, I get to not be able to respond, to hide behind my excuses, just am a continuous reaction machine. I sacrifice all that I can be in the present to the fear programs. I feel powerless to not have the body reactions, the fight-or-flight response but I am noticing they are not as intense as they were. After I post, however infrequently the backlash of the NI is pretty intense. I used this as an excuse not to post, but I think it can be a wonderful opportunity to work on some deeply rooted shame programs, and whatever others I discover.
 
MaryJK, the lack of discernment on your list, and thank you for expressing it so clearly, helps me see that this is also a program I find running often. I feel like I've got a dumbness lid over my head so often. Reading the posts of more experienced members of the forum is always a learning experience and it really is fun to become more aware of lacking something, even if I do not yet know what it is.
 
Bluefyre said:
I am working with the fear programs I am discovering and would welcome feedback on what I have discovered. I notice how often when fear is triggered I cover it up with an angry reaction. I don’t know if this is a common response but I notice that it was a pattern of my mother.

I have a core belief that I am deeply flawed which gives rise to an existential fear that I am not fit to exist. This fear is covered up by anger - which has provided the emotional fuel or energy to work towards making myself "worthy" of existing. I think that in such cases, anger is an adaptive response, doing its part to orient us towards life while the core fear drives us towards non-existence. It becomes a problem however if this anger is projected on others - which can happen when someone triggers the core belief of being fatally flawed.
 
obyvatel said:
Bluefyre said:
I am working with the fear programs I am discovering and would welcome feedback on what I have discovered. I notice how often when fear is triggered I cover it up with an angry reaction. I don’t know if this is a common response but I notice that it was a pattern of my mother.

I have a core belief that I am deeply flawed which gives rise to an existential fear that I am not fit to exist. This fear is covered up by anger - which has provided the emotional fuel or energy to work towards making myself "worthy" of existing. I think that in such cases, anger is an adaptive response, doing its part to orient us towards life while the core fear drives us towards non-existence. It becomes a problem however if this anger is projected on others - which can happen when someone triggers the core belief of being fatally flawed.

Hi Obyvatel,
You are saying about core beliefs. Could You point out literature about it? I know the term but something rings in me that it is worth studying more.
 
Obyvatel, thank you for your response. The sharing of your experience and perspective is much appreciated and SO helpful. It makes more sense that the core belief operating is that I am deeply flawed rather than the thought that runs that it’s wrong that I exist. Your wording more precisely describes the feeling of the program. So system 1 operates with this core belief and constantly runs this fear program and many other offshoorts in the background, and lately, more in the foreground or I'm just noticing them more? It also makes sense that anger is an adaptive response, especially when one is not aware of what is running in the background.

Rather than examining and questioning the core belief, system 2 attributes it solely to childhood abuse. So is it accurate to say that this core belief is programmed into us by the manipulation of the hyperdimensionals via the religions and other forms of control they have set up and the narcissistic wounding reinforces this belief in being deeply flawed and adds more programs stemming from this core belief? Just a thought.

Another question I have been thinking about has to do with the centers? I am ¾ of the way through ISOTM and the Learning to Sense and Control the Functioning of One’s Centers is next up for me to read on the forum. I know that I do not grasp what the centers are yet and how they function, or fail to function. But it seems that this core program is run from the emotional center and the moving center and steals energy from the sexual center, one form of abuse of the sex center? It seems that living in perpetual fear in childhood would affect the moving center as well as the emotional center and by exercising the intellectual center, such as it is, by rationally looking at this core belief and seeing the flaw while feeling the fear programs running without letting it control me is a way to not have the program control my thoughts and choices?

As for projecting the responsive anger on to others, I must own up to this. I’ve never been one to “lose my temper”, throw tantrums or verbally express the rage I often felt. It has always come out as cold anger, shunning, as I was shunned, the "you no longer exist" treatment. I think my programmed response as a result of being physically punished for showing anger in childhood, is to turn it inward. It also feeds my false sense of power to be able to turn away someone triggers the core belief. So by acting like they "no longer exist" I am also driving myself toward non-existence. This is so horrible and so ugly and I will not look away from how I operate. This core fear really is driving us toward non-existence isn’t it! I have never realized this. Thank you!!

This also sheds light on a question which I have been searching for a satisfactory answer to for years-in Silence of the Lambs when Lecter asked “What do you do with your anger Clarice?” If anger is an adaptive response to a core program, then dealing with the core program is what one “does” with the anger. It’s like the pus from a deep wound that keeps trying to tell you that there’s something you need to pay attention to or you end up with gangrene and the end of the existence of a limb.
 
Mikel said:
Hi Obyvatel,
You are saying about core beliefs. Could You point out literature about it? I know the term but something rings in me that it is worth studying more.

Core belief is a term used in cognitive therapy. I have not read any specific book that I can suggest to you but if you search on the internet, you will find references. My understanding of core beliefs are that they are unconsciously held beliefs about ourselves which drive a lot of our thoughts and behavior. These beliefs get formed in early childhood through experiences we had at the time. Our innate temperament also may play a role in the formation of such beliefs. Core beliefs are rather inflexible in nature. They operate outside our conscious awareness and act as filters through which we view the world.
 

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