Session 29 May 2021

Since this is an English forum, please post in English. If you do not speak English, you can use an online translator such as DeepL. There are quite a few people on the forum whose mother tongue is not English and they use online tranlators so that they can read and post in English.

It is more externally considerate for the person who is posting to do this than to expect everyone else to do this in order to read your posts. Thank you. :-)

Comme il s'agit d'un forum en anglais, veuillez poster en anglais. Si vous ne parlez pas anglais, vous pouvez utiliser un traducteur en ligne tel que DeepL. Il y a pas mal de personnes sur le forum dont la langue maternelle n'est pas l'anglais et qui utilisent des traducteurs en ligne pour pouvoir lire et poster en anglais.

Il est plus respectueux de l'extérieur pour la personne qui poste de faire cela que d'attendre que tout le monde le fasse pour pouvoir lire vos messages. Merci.

Traduit avec (version gratuite) :-)
"A: Modifying the concept of gravity may help. But consider dark things in terms of your former question about fine structure and its relation to light and "electricity"."

This is a very interesting point. The current model of the four fundamental interactions does not fully convince me. However, I really like the concept of gravitoelectromagnetism. In this concept, the gravitational and electromagnetic interactions are unified. This is a step towards UFT.

Some time ago, teleparallelism suddenly revealed itself to me as well. In this theory, mass not only bends but also "twists" space-time. I think teleparallelism and gravitoelectromagnetism may be beautifully linked.

It seems to me that this approach can be innovative in some way. Perhaps it will not require an explanation based on the concepts of dark matter and energy.
"A: Modifying the concept of gravity may help. But consider dark things in terms of your former question about fine structure and its relation to light and "electricity"."

This is a very interesting point. The current model of the four fundamental interactions does not fully convince me. However, I really like the concept of gravitoelectromagnetism. In this concept, the gravitational and electromagnetic interactions are unified. This is a step towards UFT.

Some time ago, teleparallelism suddenly revealed itself to me as well. In this theory, mass not only bends but also "twists" space-time. I think teleparallelism and gravitoelectromagnetism may be beautifully linked.

It seems to me that this approach can be innovative in some way. Perhaps it will not require an explanation based on the concepts of dark matter and energy.
Teleparallelism aka absolute parallelism seems nice to me in a Cartan connection kind of way. Relates to that extra one-form I mentioned in the information topic. The twist (torsion) might be spin rather than mass related maybe. A conformal graviton and longitudinal/timelike photon might be the same thing but for conventional gravity and the transverse photon, there are force strength things to worry about aka the fine structure and the gravitational constant. For this I think Kaluza Klein geometry and sort of effective mass for gravity force carriers might come into play (kind of weak boson-like but it's more literal for the weak force). The conformal graviton probably can handle dark energy and the galaxy rotation curves without dark matter. Missing matter might still be something dark.
Greetings and thanks to all the team for what they do.

Sorry for the error in the previous empty publication, I had the wrong button. I was going to hit preview and at that moment the window scrolled and I pressed the publish button. If you can delete it, great.

(Joe) Feeling a 'wall' of terror or fear...

I think I know that feeling. It's unpleasant, before I got here, I remember while researching UFO or ghost issues for clues as to which came first "the chicken or the egg", "god or the greys/lizards" only to realize and come to the conclusion that everything they said about Lucifier described humanity itself "geez! I am, we are Lucifer?", I felt a strange fear and as if they were moving around me. Sometimes it smelled like flowers, sometimes like sulfur, if I walked down the hallway of my house, I felt like I was being followed. It's not the typical instinctive fear, it was something that was activated to avoid continuing what I was doing.

(L) Well, yeah, eventually! The thing is, I think that there's a lot of free will that's going to be involved in that. People who get a vaccine, will they or will they not take any protective measures? Do they or do they not have certain genetic factors that make them stronger or weaker than other people? Do they or do they not have pre-existing conditions? Will they or will they not take care of themselves if they do get sick? I mean, there are so many factors for each individual person that I don't think you could possibly get any kind of percentage on even at this point.

I have only seen them make vaccination plans, but never plans to test to see if the person is fit to be vaccinated or not, for obvious reasons. If they actually did that, the vaccinated people would be much less hindering the schedule. If it has been determined that the virus really affects the cardiovascular level, isn't there a range of known diseases and levels of involvement that they can use as a basis for testing focused on that, and hasn't there been enough evidence of all the collateral damage to guide them in developing the necessary measures to determine whether the person is fit to be vaccinated or not? I think that should be the inherent responsibility of these health "professionals", except for those who are heartless and part of the agenda. Hence the no autopsies.
The typical excuse "that's wasting too many resources, there will always be people who are going to die, it's normal" and the psychopathic view "that's the plan, let it spread makes them the resource we need". People still believe in what is officially said about covid and they are moved by fear, but I don't know, something tells me that if the fear they have of being contaminated moves them to get vaccinated like cattle when they are branded, the same fear of knowing that they are at risk of being seriously affected by being vaccinated, would create the opposite effect hindering the agenda and I think we have seen it, even if it is a little, for some reason they are instituting more tyrannical measures of offering money for the vaccinated to denounce and fine the unvaccinated and a "common" person with that degree of responsibility over others, it is like creating guerrillas that go against the neighbor, it gives room to harm another person for many other reasons far from "not being vaccinated".

Q: (L) That's good enough. Yeah, we already got the news in our newspaper today that starting in July, all the prices are going to be up, taxes on imported products, all the businesses and manufacturing jobs that are small businesses are all going to be just completely done in. And they HAVE to know that it's going to happen! I know Lobaczewski says that when psychopaths are in charge, they make stupid decisions and put stupid people in power who make further stupid decisions. They don't think things through. They have NO concept of consequences. That alone, one might think, could explain the stupidity of the actions that are going on today. However, surely, SURELY they must have a rational two or three advisors who will tell them that if you do that, this is going to happen and you're basically killing the goose that laid the golden egg, shooting off your foot, and cutting off your nose to spite your face - sorry for mixing metaphors, but that's what they're doing!

(Joe) That's been happening, and those advisors have been brushed off.

(L) Lobaczewski described what a country under a pathocratic... I mean, everything goes downhill. There are no supplies, long lines for toilet paper, all kinds of things like that. That could be just what we're seeing.
Q: (L) I tell ya, people: it's all really depressing out there. The thing is, we had all of this predicted to us 25 years ago. We knew it was coming; we just didn't know how.

(Andromeda) It's surreal to see it actually happening.

(L) It's Bizarro World.

The imaginary line of struggle between left and right is also being erased, because those who claimed to have the best interest of the people, today are contradictorily showing that they really had no interest in improving anything and little by little they have been adopting the measures of those who for so many years have been pointing at them as the absolute evil. It reminds me a lot of an article of the old sott where it was said that the left was nothing more than the cushion of the right, the option for when the right hanged the people so much, they would look for a way out, but it turns out that they were the same but of a different color. "The revolution and the fight for your mind" I think it was called.

For those who think they are safe for not being in the USA or a country with a higher psychopathic degree it is a good article to take up, there are many articles that today we should have well ordered and at hand. A super glossary!.

We are not safe, it is only a matter of time before the tide rises and sinks us under the same sea. In my country, today it is more evident how they have been joining the enemy that they defamed so much for years "if you can't beat the enemy, join them". In El Salvador, nothing more and nothing less, there is a leftist financed by the US, a greater show of contradiction that should call attention to so many signs that there are, a leftist with a US flag shirt asking for help. There is always the one who says "ah that was not a real leftist" What is a real left or right, really? If their speeches only cause more division and hatred among the people, it doesn't matter what color they are, their actions speak for their own self-interests.

(L) So anyway people, it's beyond crazy. Y’all know it, I know it. There are some other people who just don't happen to be members of our group that know it too, but I don't see that there are that many. The only thing I know to do is to keep yourself in an emotionally stable state in the best way you can while at the same time continuing to interact with all your peeps - the forum, questions, discussions, etc. Years ago I once asked the Cs... because one of the things that was going on behind the scenes of the early sessions were endless - ENDLESS - minute discussions of every aspect of reality. Everything I thought, everything other people thought - among our small group that was there meeting at my house in Florida. At one point, I asked the Cs if all this endless discussion is supposed to be helpful. And they said yes, you bet it is! That's the essence of networking. The thing about it is, when you get into a discussion in a network situation, you've got to be open to what other people say. You can't go into it with an assumption that you already know something. You can't think that the way you think is necessarily what is correct or accurate or objective - mainly objective. I knew years ago that I couldn't possibly be objective because I kept screwing up so bad. It took me awhile to figure that out, but I did finally get it. If you have all kinds of issues and problems in your life, it's because you're not talking enough, sharing enough, and you're not sharing SINCERELY. If you're going to talk to somebody about your problems and you lie to them, how are they going to help you? Or if you leave something out? So, all I can say is that we just got to get through this because I don't see any other way to deal with it and it's extremely unpleasant. It probably wouldn't hurt for everyone to re-read Castaneda's The Fire From Within where he talks about stalking and petty tyrants. That was one that really stuck in my mind where he sets the guy up and he ends up in the stall with the horse and the horse goes after him. We have got to figure out ways to stalk this thing... We have a WONDERFUL opportunity to learn the art of stalking with that world and environment out there. Maybe we should start a thread about it and discuss it some more. How are we dealing with it? How are we surviving it? So, anyway people... Is anybody totally awesomely inspired and awe-struck and everything by this whole process? Do you finally get it that it's just really... work. It's just work. Is everybody happy you finally got to be in on a session?
If you have all kinds of issues and problems in your life, it's because you're not talking enough, sharing enough, and you're not sharing SINCERELY.

Could we do small groups behind the scenes like you did in your home in Florida so that members can discuss in a more direct way what they want to express? is it the right time for some members to do so? I even go a little further, are there interested people from the same country to join together to help us in these times to form a group even to create a job stability, to join our knowledge, to join our skills to improve our livelihood to what is to come?

For a long time I would like to participate in this direct way, sometimes one shares a lot, but sometimes what I read in the forum is not as concrete as what I can find in the books and I feel the information fragmented perhaps because of my way of learning between what seems to each one what he reads and what is better understood and that is where I do not see a collinearity. That led me to stay away from the forum for a long time and even wanted to throw in the towel with all this. Sometimes I asked myself, "Could it be that I am saying a lot of stupid nonsense or are they detecting some program in me that they feel is not worth responding to and I am not aware of?" and if that were the case, I would even like to know so I would have something to work on, I would like to be brutally confronted with a mirror, I feel I need it. I feel I need a group that communicates, that we can thoroughly go into detail about our reality.

(L) Last time they said something was coming up, we got COVID! [laughter] So I don't know what's coming up, but... Does anybody here feel unable to keep your wits about you in the coming months or year or two? I mean, we've got to do it. What other choice do we have? Run out in the street and start screaming and run in front of a truck or something? There aren't many options. Let's face it: the zombie apocalypse is coming.

(Andromeda) Take it gracefully!

How can we take something like this in gracefully? We will have to have a strong heart to leave behind those we do not wish to abandon. If I had nothing to lose, I wouldn't care what happens to me. I was able to detect health problems that would lead to the death of 3 people close to the family. One having that knowledge, being able to do something about it and having to deal with the very ignorance of their family members holding out false hope when they already knew they were not going to survive, being used as experiment pigs, were people who had no reason to die now. The three people had previous heart problems, they get the vaccine, they get worse, they enjoy the joy of a physic (temporary joy), and then they die just like that. Good for those who don't have to go through that.

Having to tell my parents, "what more evidence do you want? read the ****** information! people are dying from getting that stuff, neither the Russian nor the Chinese are reliable now, they started to have flaws too. If they don't want to read it, ok, but I thank them to leave all the necessary papers of inheritance, debts or whatever in order. I don't want siblings that I supposedly never had to fight inheritance or legal problems with debts to show up. If something happens to them, just don't complicate my life once they are no longer here or appear to me as a ghost asking for forgiveness. At least funeral insurance don't even worry about paying, two coins for the boatman and to the ember".
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A year has passed since this session, and everybody can now feel the inflation. There's been a massive increase in price. The Cs said that chances are high that economic collapse would happen within 24 months, which would mean total collapse around May 2023. But before the economy gives its last breath, we will see massive increase in price, and it is still within the real of possibility that collapse might happen sooner. I wonder what Christmas 2022 is going to be like. I remember a session where Laura was talking a dream that she had, and if I remember correctly the economic went down after Christmas around January/ February. It could be next year.
For a long time I would like to participate in this direct way, sometimes one shares a lot, but sometimes what I read in the forum is not as concrete as what I can find in the books and I feel the information fragmented perhaps because of my way of learning between what seems to each one what he reads and what is better understood and that is where I do not see a collinearity. That led me to stay away from the forum for a long time and even wanted to throw in the towel with all this. Sometimes I asked myself, "Could it be that I am saying a lot of stupid nonsense or are they detecting some program in me that they feel is not worth responding to and I am not aware of?" and if that were the case, I would even like to know so I would have something to work on, I would like to be brutally confronted with a mirror, I feel I need it. I feel I need a group that communicates, that we can thoroughly go into detail about our reality.

Thanks for this post of yours, Alma. I think it would be best to start a personal thread in the Swamp with your request for a mirror in the title.

I read in this post that you have a deep desire to be part of group in your area that meets up in person to network and 'frequency bond'. While a thread in the swamp may not be all of what you are asking for, I think that a is a good step in the right direction!
Thanks for this post of yours, Alma. I think it would be best to start a personal thread in the Swamp with your request for a mirror in the title.

I read in this post that you have a deep desire to be part of group in your area that meets up in person to network and 'frequency bond'. While a thread in the swamp may not be all of what you are asking for, I think that a is a good step in the right direction!

Thanks to you for the suggestion iamthatis, I thought about that some time ago, it explained the false expectation I had some time ago when I started in the forum. In fact I recently read what I had posted years ago and I apologize if at any time I said something inappropriate or reflected some bad attitude or lack of education towards some people or someone in specific. I really don't even understand myself the crazy things I wrote in those days (laughs), I'm really sorry.

That way of looking at it due to the emotional need of that moment has changed. At this moment when I refer to finding a collinear people, I mean finding the right people in my daily environment, people with whom you can move forward and grow mutually according to the work, have a work team, confront each other in a healthy way, create a business together, and face the changes that are coming, can I explain myself better? and little by little that help has been arriving as I try to be as conscious as possible to unblock areas of my life and do my part. But to see that there are people who have the opportunity to do this work there directly and they don't take advantage of it or it was just too much for them because they thought they were going out there just to have a good time when there are others who would like to and can't, it's sad.

Honestly, from then until now, just out of respect for the lives of everyone who is really doing this work in a brutally honest way, from Laura to the whole great group of people who have come into her life and made all this possible, out of respect, I don't feel like I should ask for absolutely nothing. Because one must also be aware of their own lack of responsibility, everyone knows very well what they are doing wrong and in that sense, asking for a reflection now, would be hypocritical of me .... What am I going to "ask for", do you validate, that they tell me what I already know I am doing wrong? is wasting their time and energy.

It is not enough to come here and think you are saved like going to church every Sunday and going out and doing the same old things as if it were a soul laundry.

Today, I try to exhaust all possible resources before asking for help and I still life with "calm", I trust the signs of life and signs of all of you that I read here when I need help, even in their needs for support and feedback that revolves around it, of the rest my friend, I will accept the score that I have at the end of my days in this cycle.
In this session, there was:
A: Again things may heat up a bit and create unpleasant frissons in many. Do not be dismayed or alarmed. Continue to work and build your network and connections. As we have said before, all this is evidence of the anxiety as the big changes approach. This will pass. Have faith and love. Goodbye
That was during the COVID vaccination campaign.
Before even COVID, there was:
A: Be aware that a new world will dawn! Be not oppressed by the death throes of the old world. Goodbye.

The above two excerpts have meaning beyond the time they appeared. One example could be the article Sergey Glazyev: People badly understand what's going on which made me think that the outcome of the current Russia-Ukraine (US/NATO++) conflict may not be what either Russia or the US would have preferred as seen from the perspective of the old world.
The special military operation revealed a plan prepared in advance by the US power and financial elite to seize power in Russia. It includes the following components and stages.

1. To exhaust the Russian armed forces in a war with well-trained and directly controlled by the Pentagon armed forces fighters, "stitched" by the nazi vertical of officers appointed by the intelligence agencies of the United States and Britain; to turn the population of Ukraine into zombies infected with Russophobia; at the same time, to turn the world community against Russia, bringing charges of war crimes and genocide against its leadership. On this basis, confiscate Russia's foreign currency assets and impose total sanctions against it, causing the maximum possible damage. This stage is actually completed.

To terrorise the Russian population by shelling border villages and military infrastructure facilities, sabotage of transport, hacker attacks; to affect the public consciousness with a stream of negative fake news and anti-government propaganda through social networks; to impose, through their agents of influence in the financial and economic authorities, the implementation of an economic policy blocking the mobilisation of resources, including: inflating interest rates, continuing the export of capital, encouraging monetary and financial speculation, manipulating the ruble exchange rate, inflating prices. Thus, to repeatedly aggravate the effect of sanctions and provoke a collapse in production and a decline in living standards. This stage is in full swing.

Provoking, against the background of falling living standards and losses during the special military operation, protest moods and destructive socio-political actions with the aim of overthrowing the legitimate government; the use of the entire arsenal of methods of organising "colour revolutions" financed by the Comprador oligarchy under the promise to unfreeze assets seized in the US-European jurisdiction; in parallel, the preparation of organisational and ideological foundations for separatist actions in the regions. This stage is under active development.

This plan also provides for the following tasks:
  • consolidation of US control over the European Union and NATO countries;
  • the use of the armed forces of Poland, Romania and the Baltic states, as well as mercenaries from Western countries, the Near and Middle East in combat operations against Russia;
  • the destruction of the male population and the de facto enslavement of women and children of Ukraine for the subsequent development of this territory in the interests of the power and financial elite of the United States, Britain and Israel.
The implementation of this plan, in fact, is aimed at the destruction of the Russian world, followed by the American "deep state" plans to destroy Iran and block China.

Due to the objective laws of world economic development, this plan is doomed to failure. The United States will not be able to win the global hybrid war unleashed by them to maintain its global hegemony. They are irreversibly losing it to China, which is rapidly strengthening as a result of anti-Russian sanctions.

In an effort to inflict as much damage as possible on Russia, Washington, London and Brussels played their main trump cards: a monopoly on the issue of world currencies, the image of an exemplary legal democratic state, faith in the "sacred" right of private property. Thus, they have put all countries independent of them before the need to search for new global currency instruments, risk insurance mechanisms, restore the norms of international law and create their own systems of economic security.

Anti-Russian sanctions did not strengthen, but, on the contrary, undermined the global dominance of the US and the EU, which the rest of the world began to treat with distrust and apprehension. They dramatically accelerated the transition to a new world economic order and the relocation of the centre of the world economy to Southeast Asia. Russia needs to stand its ground in the confrontation with the United States and NATO, bringing it to its logical end, so as not to be torn between them and China, which is irreversibly becoming the leader of the world economy.
By going into Ukraine and enter a conflict more actively that had been simmering for eight years, instead of willingly submitting to the plan of the US and NATO already in place, Russia and the rest of the world/humanity has gained an advantage for the long term.

While many of course believe the Western narrative, more people are alert. The PTB can still sneak up and confiscate what they can after a false flag cyberattack, (blaming Russia) a snowstorm, (blaming CO2) or a plague (blaming ???), or inflation, or food shortages, or a natural catastrophe of a different order, but things are not as easy, as if they could have ambushed a fully unsuspecting populace.
In this session, the publishing of Laura's book From Paul to Mark was announced. Below are excerpts about Paul from the sessions, mostly chronological:

Who did Paul encounter on the road to Damascus
Session 7 October 1994
Q: (L) Who did Paul encounter on the road to Damascus.

A: Spirit of the 6th density.
"Give to Caesar that which is Caesars."
Session 9 June 1996
Q: (L) D4's next question: what did Paul say during his out of body experience, and why were these things not 'lawful for a man to speak?'

A: Jesus said: "Give to Caesar that which is Caesars."

Q: (L) How does that apply to this question?

A: Ponder for learning.

Laura’s note: This last exchange above takes on an all-new meaning in light of the recent (2013) discoveries that point to Julius Caesar having been the real “Jesus”.
Session 26 December 1998
Q: When the person who was later represented as Jesus lived, was that, as Paul described it, a New Covenant of Blood?

A: No.
Paul of Tarsus
Session 9 April 2011
(L) Did Paul of Tarsus put the new testament together?

A: Nope.

Q: (Burma Jones) Did Paul of Tarsus actually exist?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) Are parts of the new testament composed of Paul’s actual writings?

A: Yes.

(L) How close are they to what he originally wrote?

A: 70 percent.

Q: (L) Did Paul of Tarsus belong to any philosophical school or mystical group?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) Was it one of the mystery religions?

A: Similar to them but older. There are traces here and there. You have been doing well reconstructing this. You could say that this communication is part of same.

Q: (L) Is this what Gurdjieff referred to as esoteric Christianity?

A: Yes.
Judas was the "patsy" utilized to supplant Caesar
The following discussion includes many names and topics that later appeared in FPTM. It is a long excerpt; Paul is bolded to make it easier to navigate.
Session 11 October 2014
(L) Now, I have this handy little book "Judas of Nazareth" by this guy, Daniel T. Unterbrink. First of all, he talks about this Judas of Galilee who apparently he believes was the original prototype for Jesus. Now, is he correct in what he is saying about this Judas the Galilean?

A: Judas was the "patsy" utilized to supplant Caesar.

Q: (L) Okay. Well, it appears that this group that was created by this Judas of Galilee was the so-called "Jerusalem Group" of the zealots, the Sicari, and what he calls the Jerusalem Christians because of course he is operating from the assumption that the Jerusalem Group were the earliest Christians because they proclaimed their Judas of Galilee as Christ. But apparently this Judas was crucified in something like 19 AD, which was quite early in the game. Paul came along and was interacting with this group of individuals and apparently he was thrown out of the group. This is evident that he was thrown out of the group from his own authentic letters because he was at war with this group. This Interbrink of course calls Paul the evil one, says that he was just out to get money, create a church, make himself rich, and all that sort of thing. I find that a little difficult to swallow because I read the Pauline Letters, and this is a very complex individual. When I think about how this guy describes these Sicari, these zealots, they “whack everybody's pee-pee and follow these dietary laws” gang... You put one in one hand, and one in the other, and Paul wins every time. I mean, I'm sorry! So, was Paul an evil guy the way Unterbrink has pejoratively described him?

A: Not even close!

Q: (L) Was Paul a member of the Herodian family? That is, was the Saul who WAS a member of the Herodian family as described by Josephus the same Saul that was the Apostle Paul?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) So, in other words, Paul was not from Tarsus? Is that correct?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) Paul was... Where was Paul from?

A: Near Jerusalem.

Q: (L) Okay. Why was it said that Paul was from Tarsus? Why was this added to the legend?

A: To conceal and reveal.

Q: (L) What do you mean? Conceal and reveal? What would Tarsus reveal?

A: Where Antony spent time, where veterans retired, where the development and perpetuation of the Caesar cult actually took place.

Q: (L) So there were combinations of, say... I mean... Okay, I'm not going to ask any more about that because I've got to think about it some more. Okay, the other thing is that in the Slavonic version of Josephus, there is a story of the Star of Bethlehem. Obviously in the gospels, the birth of Jesus is all messed up. But supposedly, the Star of Bethlehem appeared at the time of the birth of this guy Judas of Galilee, and this was recorded in the Slavonic Josephus. The way they described it was:
"The star image appeared to us signifying the birth of a king by whom the whole world will be held. And gazing on that star, we have been making our way for a year and half to this city, and we have not found the son of a king and the star is now hidden from us." But while they were on the way home, that remarkable star appeared to them again.

And Herod said, "Can you show it to me?"

"We reckon the whole world can see it."

They stepped out onto an open porch and showed him the star. But as they were on their way, the star again disappeared.
(L) So of course Josephus interpreted this star as the Sign of Vespasian, but the interesting thing about it is, is that this star according to the timeline of Unterbrink, appeared in 25 BC. Now, in my Comet book here {waves book}, I have been adjusting the dates of comets according to my adjustment of the dates of Halley's Comet. As a result of my adjustments, which I’ve penciled in, there's a comet listed as occurring in 46 BC, which is supposedly two years before the death of Caesar. However, in my re-dated system, this is actually 25 BC. By standard dating, there is no comet 25 BC at all, but according to MY dating, I have one that's 25 BC which matches Unterbrink’s timeline based on Slavonic Josephus. The comet book says,
"The Chinese text Han Chu is the oldest source to report this object. A guest star [a guest star can often mean not a comet, but a supernova] was seen sometime during the month of 46 BC, June 20th to July 18th. It appeared at the division of Mao, the Pleiades, and stayed about five degrees to the east of Chwon Shay [which is Perseii]. The object is bluish-white with rays."
(L) So, is my corrected dating of this object on target?

A: Close.

Q: (L) Okay. Is this what they were talking about in their dating of the birth of this guy Judas the Galilean?

A: Close.

Q: (L) Okay... Am I off in my dating?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) How much am I off on that one?

A: 11 years.

Q: (L) 11 years?

(Chu) Forward or backward in time?

A: Subtract.

Q: (L) So you're saying move it forward to 14 BC?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) And that would put it when you said that the historical, Jewish Jesus was born?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) So, this guy Judas the Galilean was the teacher guy/rebel leader/whatever who became the prototypical Jewish Jesus?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) Now, there is a problem because supposedly the Testimonium Flavionum that was inserted into Josephus about Jesus happens to occur at exactly the place where, were Josephus to write about the death of this Judas of Galilee, it would have been there. It appears that insertion was not really so much that it was just made up about Jesus, but that they just changed the name and it was actually describing the death of this Judas of Galilee. Is that correct?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) So they could easily change names without having to really write anything new. Okay. Now there's... Okay, well if I'm off 11 years there, then that means I've got to readjust everything. Is that what we're getting at here? I have to adjust everything 11 years?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) Well...

(Perceval) Well, fooey!

(Approaching Infinity) That Halley's Comet stuff is so complex when you take into account that there might be like 500 years added in, and then you have all these supposed comet sightings in between all those years...

(L) Well, I have to get back to the drawing board obviously, because all of my plans have been discombobulated with that 11 year discrepancy. Does anybody else have a question of some importance because now I'm all messed up and I can't ask any more of my questions?

(Approaching Infinity) You want to ask about Baby Caesar?

(L) What about Baby Caesar?

(Approaching Infinity) If his story was either taken on by Augustus, or if the Jesus story... if either of those people stole it from Caesar?

A: The Baby Jesus Story is an amalgamation of Mithras and Caesar. The story of "Jesus" causing wonder among the "Doctors of the Law" is referring to Caesar. Augustus borrowed an element or two of the tale of Caesar, but mostly not.

Q: (L) Okay. Hmm. Well, that doesn't help me at all, does it? Was there anything remarkable about Caesar's birth?

A: Comet.

Q: (L) So there was a comet at the time of his birth, and that was the main thing. A comet at his birth, and a comet at his death. Is that it?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) But, no “laid in the manger” business, no wise men, nothing like that.

A: No.

Q: (Pierre) But the comets meant something. It was not only random chance, was it?

(L) But all the stuff about Jesus and the manger and being born in a cave or whatever...

(Perceval) Well, how long was the comet in the sky, and how many were born at the same time?

(Pierre) But an individual having a comet at his birth and at his death...

(L) Is kind of special. I mean, look at Mark Twain!

(Perceval) But how many people were born at that time? It doesn't necessarily relate to Caesar. If it was there in the sky for a week or two weeks, then you've got hundreds of people being born with the comet in the sky. But from a human point of view, people took it as a sign...

A: Receivership capability!

Q: (L) So there can be hundreds of people born with the emanations of a comet in the atmosphere, but only the one that has the receivership capability would be affected or influenced by it?

A: Yes

Q: (L) So it can be very important, but only for...

(Perceval) From a hidden perspective, and not from an ordinary human perspective. Was the cult surrounding Caesar after his death perceived as a threat by someone at that time or thereafter?

A: Indeed! Caesar advocated treating the poor and the masses with care and kindness.

Q: (Perceval) So they were threatened enough to kill him and undo pretty much everything he had done... But, was there a real threat that his teaching would have spread across the world and changed everything?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) The ideas of communalism, sharing, caring, mercy etc.

(Perceval) What I'm trying to do is contrast the extent of that threat of changing the world in a positive way with what they did to his story. And we still have it today! They didn't just stamp it out at the time and then forget about it. We're still lumbered with the deception. So, it's so big and so monstrous... Like opportunistically, they killed two birds with one stone... "We can get rid of Caesar and his teachings, and then we can also have this new religion that gets us what we want!"

(L) Yeah, a religion of passivity, obey your masters, give them all your money, pay your taxes, and all this kind of stuff.

(Perceval) Yeah, maybe the perception at that time was that a new organized religion was necessary...

(L) Was Paul the author of those things where he advised people to pay their taxes, render to Caesar and all this kind of stuff?

A: Partly, yes. But he was being wise as a serpent and gentle as a dove. What he wrote in his letters was the "milk", he only gave the meat in person.

Q: (L) Okay. Well, is there anything that we want to... We've been here for a longer time than I expected. My backside is really... Are you raising your hand, Approaching Infinity? I can't see your hand, but...

(Chu) Approaching Infinity is giggling there...

(L) Alright Approaching Infinity, come on.

(Approaching Infinity) Allegedly, one of the earliest things about the Jesus people was their communal meal, the Eucharist. Was there something about Caesar's life, or something that he did, that led to that?

A: Not in particular, however it came to be a sign shared because Caesar made sure that the hungry were fed and if his soldiers were hungry, he shared their suffering. The "meal" was another aspect borrowed from Mithras. Notice that the clue about Tarsus points to Mithraism also. Finally, elements of Caesar's last supper were incorporated into the story as well!

Q: (Perceval) Caesar's last supper?

(Kniall) Yeah, he had a meal and he was asked how he would like to die.

(L) And he said it didn't matter, just as long as it was quick. [...]
To be continued:
In the process of writing From Paul to Mark, Laura read many books, and many ideas were discussed in the sessions:
Paul saw a cross - Caesar's image on the trophaeum
Session 7 February 2015
Q: (L) Alright, speaking of learning. I've been really, really buried in these books. Ark can back me up here. The amount of reading I've been doing is intensive. I practically sleep while I'm reading, or read while I'm sleeping. It's no joke. I get up and I start reading an hour or two before I even show up for breakfast. Then I have my breakfast, and I go back up and I read, and I read, and I read... I read until I go to bed. And then, I take the book with me to bed and read in bed.

(Perceval) So, what you're trying to say is that you've been reading a lot.

(L) Yeah.

(PoB) That's something new!

(Pierre) So, you've been learning a lot and you deserve a few answers.

(L) Yeah, that's exactly what I'm getting at. [laughter] I've been working really, really hard and I really would like to have a few little answers. Now, the first thing is that I've found that it seems to me that the Jewish Jesus was composed of literary elements of several different characters that Josephus wrote about. There was Simon of Perea, there was Judas the Galilean, and there were a couple of others though I can't remember their names. These guys were revolutionaries more than anything. But of course as we know, one man's revolutionary or terrorist is another man's freedom fighter. They were basically devoted to their religion, the Jewish faith, and they could not bear the idea that Romans were living in and ruling their Holy City, appointing their priests, and basically just telling them what to do. According to their religion and their very strong religious beliefs, the only ruler they were supposed to have was god, and god's rule was mediated by the priests. The priests were selected by the people, not by the Roman procurator. So, they were really unhappy, and you can understand that they had a serious beef. So, they were pushing a more strict form of their religion among some of these groups, and Josephus describes it as the Fourth Philosophy. They were gathering support among all the people of Judea/Israel/Palestine, whatever, for a big revolutionary push against the Romans. This is what I see as the original group that later people referred to as The Jerusalem Church. It wasn't really a Christian Church in any sense of the word. It was a group that was religious primarily, but underneath and behind the scenes, they were literally fomenting rebellion and coordinating an upcoming revolution and arming and preparing religiously and materially to rebel against Rome. Okay, is that correct so far as I have described it?

A: Yes

Q: (L) Alright. So the next thing is that it seems to me that Paul... First of all, he may or may not have been from Tarsus, but he was probably not a Roman citizen as Acts portrays him. That was just a literary device to get him to Rome in a particular way. He was a Hellenic Jew who lived either in Damascus or Antioch or in those areas. It seems to me that the Jews of Jerusalem who were members of this revolutionary group came to his area and were recruiting using their religion hooks. This is where he began to persecute them. He says he was a Pharisee, and they were a very very strict form of Judaism, so that would be a natural point of opposition between them. Am I correct so far about that?

A: Yes

Q: (L) Okay, so that was really the extent of the persecution, that he was a Pharisee, and he riled other Pharisees up against them. I'm thinking that quite possibly that the stoning of Steven never took place. Am I correct?

A: Yes

Q: (L) So it seems that several of the revolutionary leaders beginning with Simon of Perea and Judas and Mathias, who may or may not have been killed back at the time of Herod the Great, that there was a belief that they had been “resurrected” in a certain apocalyptic sense. There was a stone found with an inscription called the Gabriel Revelation Stone where it's believed by Israel Knohl, who wrote a book about it interpreting it, that it referred to the death of Simon of Perea. Is that in fact the case?

A: Yes

Q: (L) And Simon of Perea was told in this inscription that three days after his death that he would rise again. He was told to rise. It was also implied in this inscription that the blood of martyrs such as Simon and others, who may have been grossly misrepresented by Josephus, was like some sort of magnetic substance that reached up to heaven and could attract the vengeance of god. I found this to be very fascinating. These ideas were going around in Israel at that time, at least among some groups including those who produced the Dead Sea Scrolls. The books of Enoch, preserved in Ethiopic, I believe, but fragments of it were found in the Dead Sea Scrolls, are a case in point. It may not have been common knowledge. But it seems to me that somehow all of this got mixed up with Greco-Roman ideas of resurrection/apotheosis of heroes as gods, and that this was something similar to that. It looks like these ideas of the blood of their martyrs being the attractor for the coming vengeance of their god was what this group of revolutionaries was preaching. And they were all claiming that they had seen their dead leader, so to speak, risen from the dead, i.e. Simon of Peraea or Judas the Galilean or whoever else may have been involved in this. These were not physical resurrections, they were just visionary. The question I have is: Did they really believe that, or were they just using that as propaganda to work up people's support for their revolutionary cause?

A: Some saw then others claimed to see also.

Q: (L) Okay. So, at this point, is this where the name "Jesus" comes in here? Was this Jewish revolutionary leader, or several of them who died, were they referred to as Joshua - Joshua being the right-hand man of Moses? Is that the idea? And so they called him Joshua in his risen state, whereas while alive, he may have had any name? Simon of Perea, or Judas the Galilean?

A: Yes

Q: (L) Okay, I'm working my way somewhere. Ya'll just be patient here. So Paul had a vision after he'd been persecuting these people. Did he think that he saw this Jewish guy that was killed by the Romans?

A: Not exactly.

Q: (L) Well, it seems that he had dealings with them...

A: He interpreted wrongly though that was only due to his environment. How did Simon die?

Q: (L) Soldiers were chasing him through the desert, and one of them whacked him with his sword, and killed him. I think they beheaded him.

A: No cross?

Q: (L) No, no cross. Okay...

A: Paul saw a cross.

Q: (L) So Paul saw a cross.

A: Caesar's image on the trophaeum.

Q: (L) So, what you're saying is that, excited by all the talk and the stuff that was going on around and about messiahs and so forth, I dunno... I can't even figure that out. What you're suggesting is that Paul had a real vision which he at first mis-interpreted but then figured it out?

A: Yes

Q: (L) And Paul's theology seems to be very similar to the realities you've described to us as being 4th density and inhabited by 4th density denizens, and a place that you move to or graduate to after you live a life in this world or realm.

A: Yes

Q: (L) Even his idea of the spiritual body is similar, because he says flesh and blood cannot inherit in this kingdom. And then he says something about the body being sown as a seed, and then it grows as a spiritual body. So it's almost as if he's talking about another reality where there's variability of physicality or something. He even says that those that are still here at the time of the change that he was expecting would be changed in the twinkling of an eye.

A: Yes

Q: (Perceval) What was the nature of Paul's vision?

A: He saw Caesar and thought it was a Jewish individual. However, he soon sorted things. Paul was desperately trying to save people and transform the world and so he "became all things to all people" when it served the aim. The group in Jerusalem were as much in his sights for salvation as anyone.

Q: (L) So if I get this right, what you're saying is that he may initially have thought that he was seeing a Jewish individual, but he quickly realized that it was not a Jewish individual because he was no dummy. And he knew that Simon of Perea had not died on the cross, that it was Caesar on the Trophaeum?

A: Yes

Q: (L) Nevertheless, he blended his Caesar with a Jewish guy for the sake of...

(Perceval) The group in Jerusalem?

(L) So in other words, he did this consciously?

A: Yes

Q: (Perceval) He had to tailor the message to the masses.

(L) So when he did this where the Jews were concerned, was he giving the same message to everybody?

A: No

Q: (L) Well, he clearly says that he becomes all things to all peoples. When he's with Jews, he's a Jew. When he's with Gentiles, he's a Gentile. But his main thing, and he said it: All he knows is Christ was crucified. And he develops his theology, which was a vision of a 4th density world, and he spends almost ZERO time whatsoever talking about any human being or historical person. I guess that was deliberate, that his focus was on the 4th density manifestation, and he completely ignored or de-emphasized deliberately any human individual? Is that kind of what he was doing?

A: Yes

Q: (L) That leads to the big problem here. There was a church in Rome. It was supposed to be a Christian church in Rome before Paul ever went to Rome. He wrote the Book of Romans to this church. Was this a Jewish church?

A: No

Q: (L) So this was not a Christian church in the sense of Jewish people, a Jewish synagogue, who were aware of their Jewish messiah and worshipping their Jewish messiah?

A: No

Q: (L) Was it, in fact, a Gentile church that was worshipping at least something along the line of Caesar?

A: Yes

Q: (L) This would have been at least two generations after the assassination of Caesar, so a lot of things can happen in two generations.

A: Yes

Q: (L) When Paul went to Rome, because this is the funny thing... Everything seems to emanate from Rome even if the Book of Acts claims that everything emanated from Jerusalem. It's almost as though...

A: When "Acts" claims, assume the opposite.

Q: (L) Okay. There's some kind of controlling thing emanating from Rome. What happened when Paul arrived in Rome? Was he taken to Rome as a prisoner from Jerusalem?

A: He never went to Jerusalem the third time.

Q: (L) He never went to Jerusalem the third time, but he went to Rome. And when he went to Rome, how was he received by the church there?

A: Warmly.

Q: (L) Well, that doesn't make a whole lot of sense. It seems to be that that's where all of the corruptions of the worship of Caesar and the corruption of the Jewish Jesus emanated from.

A: Remember that all that happened after the destruction of Jerusalem.

Q: (L) So, we don't really know what was going on. Oh, okay. I have a theory that Paul went to Rome much earlier than others think. That would make sense, because if the real Jesus was not somebody who died in 29 or 30, but was instead somebody who died in 4 BC or whatever, then everything has to be put back. So did Paul go to Rome in 48 or 49?

A: Yes

Q: (L) Did Paul then go to Spain?

A: Yes

Q: (L) Where did Paul die, in Rome or in Spain?

A: Spain.

Q: (Chu) So is he St. James de Compostela?

A: Close!

Q: (L) So maybe it was Paul who was buried in the Tomb of St. Jacques?

A: Yes

Q: (Perceval) So you have to go on a pilgrimage, Laura!

(L) I've gotta go on a pilgrimage!

(Pierre) Walking!

(Perceval) You can do it on a bike.

(L) Can I ride a horse?

(Perceval) You can drive as long as your keep your head out the window. It's taking in the air.

(Chu) There's a tenuous link, but there's a shell in both cases. The shell is the symbol for St. Jacques / St. James, and there's also the shell for Venus / Caesar.

A: Yes!!

Q: (L) Venus was the ancestry of the Julii. So, it's all beginning to clear up. It's clear as mud now.

A: Enough on your plate! You are making excellent progress!

Q: (L) But I want to ask another question. [laughter] Let me ask just one more question.

(Perceval) If Laura goes to the tomb of St. Jacques knowing that Paul is buried there, will she have a divine revelation that will answer everything?

(PoB) Is she going to meet Putin there?

A: No

Q: (L) Did Paul and the people in this Jerusalem church together come up with the idea of replacing the worship of Julius Caesar with this Christ figure who was universal more or less?

A: Yes

Q: (L) Did they plan on it being a Jewish Jesus?

A: No, that came later.

Q: (L) But he did, in fact, persuade them that they should refocus from Caesar to a universal creator god. Is that it?

A: Yes

Q: (L) Because that is the strong concept among the Jews.

A: Yes

Q: (L) So, there was some persuasion done by Paul with this Jerusalem church, and they started changing and shifting things for a period of time. Then, along came the destruction of Jerusalem. After that, everything got shifted around and reworked for some reason.

A: Politics.

Q: (L) So the Roman church thought that it would be... I can't figure it out. I'm too tired.

A: Yes. Goodbye.
Did Paul ever reincarnate?
Session 8 August 2015
(Approaching Infinity) Did Paul ever reincarnate?

A: Yes

Q: (Approaching Infinity) Anybody we might recognize?

A: No
"In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump ..."
Political commentary on the US 2016 election, inspired by formulations in Revelation, and 1 Corinthians 15:52. This excerpt is different from others in this collection.
Session 12 November 2016
Q: (L) Two bible passages have been brought to my attention today. One is the passage from Revelations about the w-h-o-r-e of Babylon being dressed in scarlet and purple, and of course Hillary Clinton wore purple in her concession speech to Donald Trump. And now we have the lovely verse that Joe presented to me from the Apostle Paul. What does it say?

(Joe) It says, "In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed." (1 Corinthians 15:52)

(L) So anyhow, basically it includes the words "last trump" which is fascinating in terms of the transcripts I’ve been reviewing recently. As Joe pointed out, the text has Trump, zombies and sudden changes... Everything that is happening at this point in time. It's all cheerful good news! Okay, what are our questions? We want to ask about this election. First of all, did Hillary actually win the popular vote as is being said at the present time?

A: Not by a long shot!
It is all about creating community at a higher level of being
Session 25 March 2017
In the weeks prior to this session, I had been continuing to dig into research on the apostle Paul, looking for clues to understand what he was thinking and doing and how it might connect us to the “Julius Caesar as model for Jesus” idea. The last two Paul books I read were by Troels Engberg-Pedersen, and they really knocked my socks off. All the ideas coalesced there. Even though this scholar doesn’t have the wider view that I utilize, his exegesis of Paul’s writing/thought in terms of Stoic models was just brilliant. There are so many parallels between Paul, Stoics, Gurdjieff’s 4th Way, and the Cs that it is truly astonishing. I also see the parallels to Zoroastrianism, Jewish/Christian apocalyptic (derived from Zoroastrianism) and the Cs description of densities and their denizens. What was most useful was that Troels (ya gotta love a guy with a name like that!) created a graphic model of what participation in Stoicism, Pauline Christianity, and The Work is supposed to accomplish for the individual and it is all about creating community at a higher level of being.

I’ve been thinking about all this a lot, and had a few exchanges with Approaching Infinity about it – he’s read/reading the books also – and I wanted to bring it to the group as soon as possible because I felt it was very important and would be very helpful to many. For a few weeks I’ve been wanting to ask questions about these ideas and we kept cancelling the idea of a session because one or the other of us (mostly me) were simply not up to it energetically. So, finally, last night, rather late, I said “let’s do it – I feel like I can do it for at least an hour or so.” After checking with others, they said they could do it too, and so we did and here it is.

Session Date: March 25th 2017

Laura, Andromeda, and Galatea at the board

Pierre, Niall, Joe, Chu, Ark, Data, Scottie, Possibility of Being, Opal the Peekaboo Kitty

Q: (L) Today's date is what, March 25th, 2017? We just have the home crew here tonight because we haven’t been able to actually schedule a session because of health issues. [Review of those present] Alright... Long time no C! At least for conversation... we’ve sure been communicating while selecting crystals pretty darn regularly!

A: Now is a good time to learn!

Q: (L) And who do we have with us this evening?

A: Frilipiaea of Cassiopaea. Good evening! You have brought two books here tonight which contain great insights. We can see the many questions in your mind. Let us answer in advance that, yes, it is true that a network can operate as suggested. Also, the model of personal transformation is exactly correct with the modifications you have devised.

Q: (L) So, in other words, I was prepared to ask all of these questions, and I had my books with me, and you just basically stole my thunder! [laughter]

(Galatea) No! They helped you. It's called helping.

A: Yes
To be continued:
In the first excerpt of this post, the discussion concerns how materialism came to dominate by convincing people they ought to give up a belief in an invisible world and thus deprived them of knowledge and awareness of the other world, that of intelligences, spirits and ancestors, which Laura connects to "a great cloud of witnesses, as the apostle Paul put it."
Session 22 September 2018
Q: (L) Oh, the fact that science has completely discarded any idea that non-material intelligence exists and can act on matter reminds me of something in the Bell Witch book:

It would be a shameful display of one's ignorance to deny on general principles the existence of the thing or fact, in the face of such evidence, because he did not witness it, and cannot comprehend it.

(L) That's what was happening at that time: rationalism was even taking hold within religious circles. I think that spiritualist phenomena were a threat to the mainstream religions and they thought that they could better their position by throwing the baby out with the bathwater. The author then points out that this was not the position of John Wesley, the founder of Methodism.

Mr. Wesley, however, was bold in speaking his sentiments and rather boasted of his belief in witchcraft. He wrote and spoke about the Epworth ghost that haunted the family some thirty years.

...[O]ne of the most striking features in Wesley's religious character was his deep rooted, intense, powerful and impelling convictions of the dread realities of an unseen world.

(L) And then he quotes Wesley:

"With my last breath, will I bear my testimony against giving up to infidels one great proof of the invisible world; I mean, that of witchcraft and apparitions, confirmed by the testimony of all ages. The English in general, and indeed, most of the men of learning in Europe, have given up all accounts of witches and apparitions as mere old wives' fables. I am sorry for it, and I willingly take this opportunity of entering my solemn protest against this violent compliment, which so many that believe the Bible pay to those who do not believe it."

(L) In other words, he's saying that people who are religious are giving up their belief in the invisible world under the pressure of the rationalism.

"I owe them no such service. I take knowledge these are at the bottom of the outcry which has been raised, and with such insolence spread throughout the nation in direct opposition not only to the Bible, but to the suffrage of the wisest and best of men in all ages and nations. They well know (whether Christians know or not) that the giving up of witchcraft is in effect giving up the Bible; and they know, on the other hand, that if but one account of the intercourse of men with separate spirits be admitted their whole castle in the air - deism, atheism, materialism - falls to the ground. I know no reason, therefore, why we should suffer even this weapon to be wrested out of our hands. Indeed, there are numerous arguments besides this, which abundantly confute their vain imaginations. But we need not be hooted out of one; neither reason nor religion requires this. One of the capital objections to all of these accounts is, 'Did you ever see an apparition yourself?' No, nor did I ever see a murder; yet I believe there is such a thing. The testimony of unexceptionable witnesses fully convince me both of the one and the other."

(L) So, that is part of the whole materialist thing, which is to deprive people of the knowledge and awareness of the other world: the intelligences, spirits, ancestors, 4th density beings, astrals, elementals, and so forth that surround us – a great cloud of witnesses, as the apostle Paul put it. The great intelligences that helped life to come into being, the Transient Passengers as the Cs put it! We see around us what the world has become because of denying the reality of it. Humanity is setting itself up to become a “dream in the past”. When the Cs say to pay close and careful attention to reality, right and left, they don’t just mean 3 D reality! Alright, next question.

(Chu) In the book Evolution 2.0, it talks about how the restructuring of DNA and recoding in order to rearrange the code and create something new happens mainly in response to heat shock, pollution, hazardous chemicals, absence of food, or presence of food that's harmful – that is, under hardship conditions and extreme conditions - and it happens all in a few hours. I was wondering if this is an explanation for why suffering is conducive to learning?

A: Yes

Q: (Chu) And is this the reason why nowadays when times are "good" as Łobaczewski defined it, for certain segments of the population, that part of humanity seems to be devolving?

A: Yes

Q: ( Artemis) People avoid suffering at all costs.
The expression above - a great cloud of witnesses - is from Hebrews 12:1 "Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight and the sin that clings so closely," For a discussion of the Letter to the Hebrews, see From Paul to Mark, p. 82-84. Hebrews is considered "a Pauline-affiliated text" (p. 377).

Paul came along with his vision of the merciful savior
The next excerpt begins with reflections on the roots of Islam, which leads into a response and discussion about the origins of the Judaism, Christianity and Islam.
Session 29 December 2018
(L) Yes... I guess I'm gonna put the cat among the pigeons. I've got two topics in my mind. The first one is the black hole of Mecca. Now, this guy Peter Townsend - which is probably a pseudonym because he probably won't write under his own name since he fears for his life - says that Mecca didn't exist and that Islam as a religion started out in very strange ways. Basically, he says that Islam is not a very friendly religion according to his way of thinking. Now, I don't think we need to ask any questions about the research he did, because that's all pretty plain and clear. But his conclusions are that Islam needs to be reformed or something needs to be done about it because it's not a very friendly bunch of people at present due to the beliefs that are inculcated into them from birth. Aside from the teachings in Islam that all other religions are wrong and only Muslims are right, and Muslims are entitled to kill non-believers, he's basically suggesting that inherent in Islam is a corruption, that the religion itself is inherently bad. But we've been discussing it, and we don't see that there is that much difference between one fraudulent religion and another. I mean, Christianity and Judaism are both pretty bad in some ways. So, I don't see... Is Islam inherently corrupt and a bad influence in general?

A: Consider carefully the developmental pathways of the three test cases. First you have Judaism. It began as a widespread cult of comet/storm god worship. It was reformulated to meet the needs of a dispossessed people and encourage solidarity among them. Christianity had a dual beginning. First was an apocalyptic cult of intolerance and violence. Second was a message of spiritual transformation based on the life of an extraordinary man full of mercy. Islam is the miscegenation of the worst of both. How can there be any positive elements out of complete falsehood?

Q: (L) So, you're saying that Islam is a mix of the worst parts of Judaism and Christianity? [Review of last answer] Is it possible that there was a strong influence of the Dead Sea Scroll people on the formulation of Islam?

A: Indeed!

Q: (L) And based on the studies of the Dead Sea Scrolls people, that was a bunch of schizoid psychopaths.

(Joe) Were they Jews?

(L) Yeah. They were Jews that thought all other Jews were corrupt and only they had the truth, and they were all itching to go out and kill everybody who didn’t believe the way they did. There is a whole field of studies devoted to the Dead Sea Scrolls and related texts such as the Books of Enoch and Enochian apocalypticism. I’ve got quite a bit of it covered in my text on Paul, Josephus and Jesus.

(Joe) So they were the origin of the first wave of Christianity. And then Caesar came along.

(L) Well, actually, Paul came along with his vision of the merciful savior, Caesar. This was the background to the several puzzling references in the New Testament to a conflict between Paul and the “Jerusalem Christians”. There was the Dead Sea Scrolls types, Zealots, etc, and then Paul. Again, I’ve covered this pretty well in my yet-to-be-published book on the topic. And don’t forget that the creators of Islam borrowed heavily from the stories of Abraham and Moses which the Jews invented with models of real historical figures of Greek and Egyptian history back when the OT was written in about 272 BC. All of that is discussed by Gmirkin and Wajdenbaum. (Argonauts of the Desert etc.} The inventors of Islam didn't know that they were creating stories based on already invented stories, etc.

(Joe) So the worst of both Judaism and early Christianity would be intolerance and violence and storm god worship. Islam more than any of the religions is influenced by cataclysms in that sense, no?

A: Yes

Q: (Joe) At the time that it appeared, was there stuff going on? It was the Dark Ages, right?

A: Yes

Q: (L) So that would give a perfect explanation for why they were attracted to that apocalyptic literature. It was a time when it had the most meaning.

(Joe) And it's relatively recent.

(L) And also if some of these people like Heinsohn and Fomenko are right about years being inserted into the historical timeline, it could have been even more recent and more close together than we think. History is such a muddle because of all the manipulations.

(Andromeda) So Islam is based mostly on fear and avoidance, whereas even Judaism had the idea of solidarity behind it. And Christianity had spiritual development. Islam has none of that.

(L) No, there doesn’t appear to be anything about real spiritual development in Islam other than trying to model oneself on Muhammed and “submitting” to his alleged declarations; that’s a bit problematical when you find out that the original model of Muhammed was probably a Dead Sea Scrolls inspired apocalypticist, likely a schizoid psychopathic fanatic. Go out and kill some people and you get grapes in the afterlife, not naked women. You get grapes.

(Andromeda) How many grapes? [laughter]

(L) 72!! Well, that was one of things that was really surprising. Apparently, there was a mistranslation or misunderstanding of the word somehow, and so you only get 72 grapes. [laughter]

(Andromeda) A lot of people are gonna be very disappointed! [laughter]
Later in the same session, there is:
It doesn't really matter if the masses of people know for sure that the character of Jesus was modelled on Paul and Caesar - it's the idea of a type of person and the idea of the person being anointed or Christed to bring new concepts to humanity, to act as an “ancestor connection” so to say for the purposes of inspiration and help.
The context is:
(Chu) The thing about the 4D labs... We were talking earlier about free will and all that. So, how would it work at a practical level? Are there Good Guys Labs, Bad Guys Labs, and the bad guys interfere as much as they can, while the good guys are not allowed to interfere, but just to protect? Or because the person asks?

A: When asked and when it will not cause a disturbance in life lesson plans.

Q: (L) So in a certain sense...

(Joe) It's dependent on the person's life lesson plan. If their plan is to experience something nasty, then they're probably not gonna get any help. If it's part of some maneuver by some other forces trying to subvert that life plan, then you get help.

A: Yes exactly.

Q: (L) So, basically from what I've been putting together from our discussions over the past few years, it seems that there are beings in 5D who can share their lessons and energy with us if we're connected in some way like genetically or some spiritual connection or whatever – really, almost like ancient ancestor worship. Then there are beings in 4D who are basically like angels and demons who can help or harm. So, some of the ancient depictions of life and spiritual realities aren't that far off. Is that what we're saying here?

A: Yes

Q: (L) And, it's just some of the details that are muddled up.

(Andromeda) Caricatured.

(L) Most, most interesting. I was thinking recently that it doesn't really matter if the masses of people know for sure that the character of Jesus was modeled on Paul and Caesar because the thing is that it's the idea of a type of person and the idea of the person being anointed or Christed to bring new concepts to humanity, to act as an “ancestor connection” so to say for the purposes of inspiration and help. Pauline Christianity if it's understood and followed correctly, is probably a good thing. We're Paleochristians. We believe in the original way that was taught by Paul based on Caesar and his own visions, but there are other Christians who have variations which can be better or worse depending on the interpreters. What Paul did to oppose those murdering apocalyptic Dead Sea Scrolls types, and to change Roman and Greek perceptions, was nothing short of a miracle in and of itself. He must have had help. So anyway, that was just my musing. Time to say good night.

A: Blessings in Christ! Good bye.
Faith is confidence in things not seen
Session 23 March 2019
(L) Well, it's what the Apostle Paul said: Faith is confidence in things not seen, and he also said that we can KNOW all about God by observing what has been created, that is, things that CAN be seen. If I can see the freakin' images of the images of the microscopic machines in the cell, and we're talking about... These are machines that convert light into sugar, water, and oxygen. 15 MILLION of them can fit on an area the size of an I-phone pixel!! [laughter]

(Andromeda) That's crazy!

(L) That... That is the most astonishing engineering...

(Joe) It's so obtuse of human beings to not accept that. Human beings' conscious experience of the development of technology has been precisely that: being able to engineer things at a smaller and smaller level. So if you see the same thing in nature, how can you not say it was designed? If I designed it, how could it not be in another mind to design that? It's massively more complex, and it takes a lot of engineering and thought and design to make a microchip. Then you look at the body and you see things that are massively more complex, and you go, "No! That happened by accident!" Did the microchip happen by accident? Why would you even think it happened by accident?

(Ark) Something occurred to me when I was on my bike today. So, I am riding, right? And there is a butterfly in front of me. I ride, and the butterfly just flies in front of me. Probably it has some fun for doing that. Now, there is this road, and there is this butterfly flying. And we were both going against the wind. And then I am thinking: Okay, we have these Boeings with AI that are crashing. I've never seen a butterfly that crashed! [laughter] And then it goes against the wind! There is a software somewhere in the butterfly which is SO ADVANCED that it is... It cannot consciously compute anything, but something is doing it! So, how it can fly against the wind with almost no power?

(L) And that tiny little butterfly has a tiny little brain... it's so small!

(Ark) What I want to know is: Where is the software which is SO powerful and so universal?! It's crash-proof! Where does it come from? Is it in the genes? Or after the butterfly is born, it downloads from somewhere this software? Where is it?

(Pierre) It's the information field [makes patented Pierre Information Field Gesture].

(L) Information field. So, your question is: Where does the butterfly's software come from?

(Ark) Yes.

A: As Pierre said, it is information fully and freely given/received via the antenna of the proteins.

Q: (Scottie) So, can I fly like a butterfly if I have a different antenna? I've always wanted to fly, so...

(PoB) Why we cannot fly?

(L) Because we don't have the right antenna!

(Ark) We don't have the hardware for flying.

A: When you get enough knowledge, sure!
The virtues of Paul in the protection list: "love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control"
Session 18 May 2019
The discussion of the list begins:
A: You have made a thoughtful list so please read it!

Q: (L) Well, alright... I've made a list. To protect oneself against hyperdimensional manipulations and harm, I'd say one of the primary things is to avoid dissociating.

A: Yes.
Q: (L) So, I guess I've covered everything. Well, I have Divination on the list... For everyday use, we use I Ching, and I think a lot of group members do the same. I think we've got that covered. One thing that I was noting down on my little list here was that the Apostle Paul listed things to avoid, and then things to enhance. The vices that he listed, things that one should avoid, were: fornication, licentiousness, enmity, strife, jealousy, anger, selfishness, dissension, envy, drunkenness. Well, that's all pretty standard. I think it's a good basic list and you can apply it in different ways depending on your circumstances. Then he listed the virtues: love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Self-control was kind of an interesting one for him to have on that list. And: no self-conceit, no provoking one another, and no envy. Then he said at the end of his list, "Whatsoever a man sows, that will he also reap”, and “let us not grow weary or lose heart." So, I thought that those were rather positive things to think about.

A: Most important to remember the "sowing" part in the context of this discussion.

Q: (L) Oh, you mean about your antennae and how your antennae determines your future. What you sow, you reap. So, if you're not taking care of your inner landscape and the immediate world around you in terms of your group and your associations and so forth, you're screwing up your antenna and then you're going to have a bad future because your antenna will attract the wrong things. Is that what you mean?

A: Yes
Getting "saved" or "made righteous" - is not necessarily an instantaneous thing
Session 28 December 2019
(L) Okay. I guess we should ask some general questions. Maybe I'll ask about this book I just finished about Paul and the Gospel of Mark. Have I pretty much laid things out as accurately as possible?

A: And more than that!

Q: (L) In this recent book I read about Paul, it basically exhibits what Paul was seeing or perceiving in his visions, or his conversations, or his channelings with Jesus I guess you'd call it. It's pretty much what we have received via this communication. Now, this guy interprets righteousness as absolution. I would like to ask about this absolution/righteousness issue. What did Paul actually mean?

A: Something rather like what you and others have experienced as "cleansing" or "opening" of the conscience as Gurdjieff described it.

Q: (L) So in other words, this getting "saved" or "made righteous" or having absolution or whatever is not necessarily an instantaneous thing?

A: Exactly. But it can be in rare instances.

Q: (L) But for most people, it would be more like what Jeanne De Salzmann describes in the First Initiation. First, you have to get to the point where you can really see yourself, see your lies, see how you have identified with your false personality, and grow that spiritual part of yourself which is the "spirit self" as Paul describes it - as opposed to the fleshly self. Paul says that flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God. What he means is not necessarily that you have to die, but that it is that inner self, that awareness, that conscience, that spirit self that has to be brought to awareness and then grown and solidified, more or less. That is being "saved", so to say.

A: Yes

Q: (L) And that's pretty much what Paul says because he doesn't describe it as an instant process. He says you need to work out your salvation with fear and trembling. So it's something that requires work and time. And yet Christianity as it exists today has distorted this to where they say, "Oh, all you have to do is come down to the altar and say you believe" and that's it. That's just not the way it works.

A: Consider that much editing and confusion has entered the texts for impure purposes.

Q: (L) Impure purposes... You mean like people seeking power and control?

A: Yes

Q: (L) So am I right that the Book of Mark was an amalgamation of elements of Paul's Christ overlaid on Judas the Galilean, and the Judas the Galilean figure was completely stripped of his revolutionary character and that sort of thing?

A: Yes

Q: (L) So there was a Jewish Christ, and there was Paul's Christ. They were combined to make Jesus of Nazareth, the hippy who went around in sandals doing miracles?

A: Yes

Q: (L) Any other questions?

(Joe) Who was Paul's Christ?

A: Caesar!

Q: (Joe) Did Paul know that?

A: Yes
To be continued:
In the first excerpt of this post, the discussion concerns how materialism came to dominate by convincing people they ought to give up a belief in an invisible world and thus deprived them of knowledge and awareness of the other world, that of intelligences, spirits and ancestors, which Laura connects to "a great cloud of witnesses, as the apostle Paul put it."
Session 22 September 2018
These excerpts are an excellent compilation and serve as a very good reminder - thanks Thorbiorn! 🙂
The first excerpt in this post is from three weeks before COVID lockdowns:
Making your choices based on the unseen world or on unseen realities
Session 22 February 2020
(L) Things are getting nutty, ya know? It's getting really weird. So, just as a little reminder to myself about what it is that we're supposed to be doing... [laughter]

A: FRV modulation and synching!

Q: (L) So in other words, we're supposed to be modulating our FRV - i.e. our receivership capability - by work on the self, and synchronizing with all of the members of the group in order to... what?

A: Anchor the frequency of the new reality.

Q: (L) So in other words, there are a number of possible new realities and it depends on either... Okay, is it that a group can anchor a frequency and thereby determine the template of the new reality for all?

A: Not exactly. Determines which branch you will move to.

Q: (L) So anchoring a frequency as a group in a sense is not exactly like creating the new reality... It's more like choosing. Is that it?

A: Yes yes yes

Q: (L) So it's all a question of choice. What reality do you want to experience? And therefore you modify your FRV or you get into association with others of the FRV you think is the right one or desirable or whatever. And then you all start vibrating together. Well, in this Reality Transfer book we just read, he talks about these pendulums and what you are saying sounds sort of like what he describes as a pendulum. He doesn't talk about what they are, but he thinks that all pendulums are bad or evil .

A: He is wrong. Dead wrong.

Q: (L) So some of these pendulum-type attractors can be good?

A: Essential in fact. One must choose.

Q: (L) Well, choosing makes me think of what the Apostle Paul was saying when he talked about making... I mean, basically what it amounted to was making your choices based on the unseen world or on unseen realities. In a funny sort of way, today I had like a little realization because I was trying to understand why for Paul, the death of his Christ or the crucifixion was THE most important thing. For him it was the death, not the resurrection. It finally occurred to me that the reason it was so important was because - and this is according to Paul - his Christ went to his death with absolute faith even in the face of everything being wrong and against him. The way it's depicted in the Gospel of Mark, not only did the disciples not understand, not only is he abused, tortured, and rejected by literally everybody... I mean, everybody flees from him in the Gospel of Mark, which is the first gospel. Everybody. There are no women at the cross. There are no supporters. There's nobody. He did that willingly - the way it's depicted, and it's an allegory - because his faith in the unseen necessity and the other world and what would happen after the death was so strong he could and would do it. It was a matter of this faith that what was unseen was more real and lasting that the seen reality. Am I right? Seeing the unseen is the key?

A: Yes

Q: (L) So Paul was concerned with restoring humanity to the Edenic state. He uses the symbol as one man, the First Adam, and death came to all. And then by one man life came to all. It struck me that the possibility... Well, what the C's have said is that when the Fall happened, it happened to everyone. It wasn't just like one person. It happened to everyone. So it seems to me that this primal man that is Adam is a representation of all. It's not just one man that caused everybody to go kaflooey. And they've said that it was the female energy consorted with the STS reality. Is that what we're looking at here, only the reversal of the process? In other words, a group of people that have that kind of faith that in the face of everything being literally awful as it is in our world today, that they still have faith in the other reality, they still have faith in doing good, doing right, being loving, that they do not buy into the whole Darwinian materialistic thing, and basically they don’t believe those lies and by those means they are able to, at a certain point in time that Paul called the culmination of the ages, be restored to this Edenic state... in other words a 4D STO reality. Am I interpreting that correctly?

A: Oh that was beautiful!! We are impressed!

Q: (L) Well la-dee-da! So that's basically what the anchoring of the frequency is about. And that's part of the interior state that people have to be in in order to anchor that frequency - to have that kind of faith. It’s not where you are, but who you are and what you see? Even in the face of everything being against your ideas, against what you think, against what you've figured out...

(Joe) Even things inside you being against you. The internal fight. You have faith that doing what it doesn't like that you will kind of achieve something worth having.

(Andromeda) Right.

(Joe) It's internally and externally at the same time.

(L) So it's not faith IN Jesus as Ashworth points out. It's faith OF Jesus that sets the example. And the example was put in a metaphor of the story of this crucifixion or death, but the metaphor represents basically the crucifixion of every person. They're crucified inside and outside because they are faced with this reality that rejects their consciousness, their more or less divine connection, their spiritual connection. They say that everything is just random mutations and random evolution, and that's wrong. That's the Big Lie.

A: Yes. We can retire now!

Q: [laughter] (Niall) That's something Laura would say. Hmm...

(Artemis) That was YOU speaking! [laughter]

A: We are you at another level.

Q: (L) Anybody have any other questions?

(Artemis) Do you guys want to ask about Jordan Peterson? Do you even care about him anymore?

(L) Yes we do. We're very sorry, but...

(Niall) He made a mistake.

(Joe) And they mentioned suffering before. I think he's learned a lot.

(Joe) In line with your analogy of Adam and the original Fall and stuff, how many souls fell?

(L) With that event?

(Joe) Yeah, was it a finite number?

A: No.

Q: (L) I would say it was more like a group of them created a situation that set a trap and then began reproducing and attracting more and more into the trap. It just became like... a black hole.

(Joe) Yeah, that's what I mean, but like an original...

(L) An original group?

(Joe) Yeah. In a certain sense, flipping it around like you have a group now being a vanguard of the new reality and leading in a certain sense, or like they said in the last session about saving other people... Spreading information...

(L) So in other words, how many souls were existing at 4D STO reality who at that moment... I think they... No, they didn't. We never asked that question.

(Joe) It's probably a lot more complicated than that. I was thinking that it doesn't change, ya know what I mean? That it's...

(L) The thing is, it could actually literally have been a couple who created the...

(Joe) Started the ball rolling...

(L) Just as it could be one person who could set an example who could start the ball rolling the other way. So, even though we understand these things as metaphors, there can certainly be a very concrete reality to all of it, ya know?

(Joe) Yeah.

(L) Alright then. We'll say goodnight unless you have anything to add.

A: Keep the faith all! Goodbye.
Mark: "he was amalgamating Paul's theology with the Jewish messiah who was basically a radical zealot."
Session 15 August 2020
(Joe) I just thought of one question about your book. I was wondering if Paul ever explicitly spoke about Caesar at the time?

A: Yes

Q: (Pierre) Or maybe only to initiates.

(L) I dunno... It could have been to initiates, or it could have been public. It could have been widely understood. So much has been destroyed and changed.

(Joe) But Mark never did that, right?

(L) I think Mark embedded it in the story: the dove, symbol of Venus at the baptism... There are plenty of allusions to it. What he was doing was he was amalgamating Paul's theology with the Jewish messiah who was basically a radical zealot.
People were concerned about their loved ones who had gone on before. Paul dealt with that several times.
The first mention of Paul in this session is in a response to a question about the pre-Roman fire cult.
Session 29 May 2021
(L) "There is a trend in North America of what appears to be a revival of the pre-Roman ancestor and fire cult described by Fustel." I don't know that I necessarily agree with that. I read your post about it, iamthatis, and it would have taken me a long time to write a response about it. I would have had to go and dig out my Fustel and get into searching the text and everything (and my brain is focused on other things). I don't think that that's necessarily what's going on. I'm not too sure that an ancestor and fire cult is necessarily a bad thing. I guess it depends on how it's... find me this guy. I want to see him while I'm talking to him. [Technical mojinations ensue...] Okay, there he is... Okay, I don't know that I necessarily agree with that view of it that it's a bad thing. And I think that you missed something in your analysis even though it sounded logical. I read it and I thought what you were saying sounded about right, except I had this deep internal reaction that maybe what Fustel was talking about is not quite the same thing. I mean, consider the fact that when we talk about hyperdimensional beings or we talk about the Cs or we talk about communicating or respecting or honoring our own ancestors, those are many of the things they were doing in earlier Christianity. People were concerned about their loved ones who had gone on before. Paul dealt with that several times. The interesting thing about the fire cult - I don’t know how much you've read about Zoroastrianism - but there's a lot of similarities between the ideas of Zoroaster and some of the ancient Roman fire cult ideas. Remember also that Fustel didn't have the whole banana since he wasn't relating this to things such as Zoroaster. But I think the general idea for the Zoroastrians was that the fire... Well, some of them. I can't swear this was true for the Zoroastrians. But the fire was a god itself. Agni or whatever to the Indo-europeans. It was kind of the mediator between human beings and the other gods. It consumed the sacrifice, which meant that it transformed it into something that they could consume. The idea was that the gods couldn't maintain the creation or the order of the world if they were not strengthened or fed or had an interaction with human beings. So, that very well may be true. We know that 4th density consumes energy from human beings. So, whether or not it's necessary for humans to exist in order for the gods to exist (and I use 'gods' loosely), and whether it's necessary for gods to exist for humans to exist... Those things are kind of uncertain. We get things like that from inference. So, I don't know that there is evidence for an ancestor cult being revived in North America. I think most of them are too damn materialistic. I think materialism is their god. And I think it would probably be a good thing if they did start thinking about their ancestors. It might scare them into good behavior once in awhile. Okay, iamthatis, you're off the hot seat now. [laughter] I think you need to study those things just a little bit more to get some clarity on that.
When you understand Paul correctly, and you can understand it from a comparative reading between his letters and the gospel of Mark, it really is very similar to what the Cs have said.
(L) [...] How many of y’all have read my book? Raise your hand.

(Joe) All 600 pages? No chance!! Give it some time.

(L) I just want y’all to know that that book should be on the bookshelf of every member of FOTCM.

(Chu) They JUST got it!

(L) So everybody should have it on their bookshelf. FOTCM is called Paleochristianity because we had some ideas about it back in the early days. Then of course I decided to find out exactly what paleochristianity was... [laughter] So, uh... Cart before the horse and all that.

(Joe) And now you wrote the book on it.

(L) And now you know what your religion is all about. What really was gratifying was that my intuition as well as a few of the Cs hints turned out to be correct. When you understand Paul correctly and you can understand it from a comparative reading between his letters and the gospel of Mark, it really is very similar to what the Cs have said. The Cs have said that the original sin was what, covetousness? That's kind of what Paul says.

(Joe) Attachment.

(L) Attachment. Separation. So when you read it as I've laid it out for you, think about how it relates to what the Cs have said. I didn't put anything really esoteric in there because it's mostly intended for a general audience that knows nothing about the Cs or general esoteric subjects. It's an academic book written for the lay person with no weirdness, okay? But as you're reading it, imagine how many of the Cs concepts come into play there in Paul's theology. You have to get a physical copy on your shelf because if the internet goes down or if there's an EMP and your Kindle is fried, you'll be sorry!! [laughter] When I finish the book on Caesar that's going to be kind of like a biography, I think I'm going to do a final small volume - and I think Harrison and I already have some text ready for that volume - where we're going to show how it all meshes together: Cs, Paul, Caesar, the whole nine yards. But that'll be for internal consumption only. My new book and the one on Caesar will be general consumption and anybody can read it.

(Chu) And as hlat posted on the forum the other day, your book actually helps to explain to other people what we do and how we live and stuff. We've had several opportunities here to test it. If you mention the Cs, people think you're crazy. But if you mention Paul, you're just another Christian. And there are many things you can convey that way. It's not just for our own knowledge, but also for spreading good ideas.

(L) I just love Paul. You know? I just really love him. I love Caesar too. Really great guys that lived, what, 2000 or 1500 years ago? They brought some really great ideas and they haven't been improved on since. The Cs even talk that way.

(Chu) They don't believe you that it's going to be a small book. [laughter]

(L) Oh... well... Stop it! [laughter] Stop it!

(Joe) A doorstop.

(L) I couldn't make it any shorter! I'm sorry!

(Joe) No, they mean the next one.

(Chu) The Caesar one.

(L) Oh, well... We'll see. I mean, I'm almost 70 years old! Y’all have to take care of me so I can get these books written before I go all to pieces. So, let's keep me operating, and I'll do it. I still have a lot to say. [laughter] I really do! So, we're going to say goodnight. I always hate to say goodnight because I like to look at your faces. I wish everybody could come here. And maybe that's something we could add to our visualizing or shaping the future thing... So we could all finally be together. Alright kids, I'm really tired and it's getting late. And we have to go feed our cat because we don't want her to shrink! [Lots of goodbyes]
The Parable of the Sower with commentary
Session 18 September 2021
Q: (L) Today is September 18, 2021. The usual suspects: [Review of those present] Okay, let's begin. Hello. Is anybody out there?

A: Gloriaea in excelsis!

Q: (L) Is that your name?

A: First part will serve.

Q: (L) So, Gloriaea. And you just added the 'in excelsis' to that?

A: Yes

Q: (Artemis) We already had a Gloriaea at the board.

(L) It's from a song.

(Chu) It's a latin thing.

["Gloria in excelsis Deo" is Latin for "Glory to God in the highest"]

(L) So, as Gaby pointed out, what I said before the session is a question. I can't think of a specific question that I want to ask, except for the fact that I feel the need for a session because things are so strange. I feel this building sensation of inner stress - like a tension. Waiting for the other shoe to drop. Something like that. So, what's going on?

A: Now would be a good time to ponder the lessons contained in the Parable of the Sower.


The Parable of the Sower (sometimes called the Parable of the Soils) is a parable of Jesus found in Matthew 13:1–23, Mark 4:1–20, Luke 8:4–15 and the extra-canonical Gospel of Thomas.[1]

Again Jesus began to teach by the lake. The crowd that gathered around him was so large that he got into a boat and sat in it out on the lake, while all the people were along the shore at the water’s edge. He taught them many things by parables, and in his teaching said: “Listen! A farmer went out to sow his seed. As he was scattering the seed, some fell along the path, and the birds came and ate it up. Some fell on rocky places, where it did not have much soil. It sprang up quickly, because the soil was shallow. But when the sun came up, the plants were scorched, and they withered because they had no root. Other seed fell among thorns, which grew up and choked the plants, so that they did not bear grain. Still other seed fell on good soil. It came up, grew and produced a crop, some multiplying thirty, some sixty, some a hundred times.”

Then Jesus said, “Whoever has ears to hear, let them hear.”

When he was alone, the Twelve and the others around him asked him about the parables. He told them, “The secret of the kingdom of God has been given to you. But to those on the outside everything is said in parables so that,“‘they may be ever seeing but never perceiving, and ever hearing but never understanding; otherwise they might turn and be forgiven!’”

Then Jesus said to them, “Don’t you understand this parable? How then will you understand any parable? The farmer sows the word. Some people are like seed along the path, where the word is sown. As soon as they hear it, Satan comes and takes away the word that was sown in them. Others, like seed sown on rocky places, hear the word and at once receive it with joy. But since they have no root, they last only a short time. When trouble or persecution comes because of the word, they quickly fall away. Still others, like seed sown among thorns, hear the word; but the worries of this life, the deceitfulness of wealth and the desires for other things come in and choke the word, making it unfruitful. Others, like seed sown on good soil, hear the word, accept it, and produce a crop—some thirty, some sixty, some a hundred times what was sown.”

Q: (L) Well, I wrote about it in From Paul to Mark. There was somebody who was giving a really interesting interpretation whose work I cited. It was his deduction from his analysis of the text that the Parable of the Sower was one of the secrets of the Kingdom of God which was that there were different types of human beings and that they simply were that way by their very nature. But at the same time, the wiles of the devil were always working, too. So there are people of different types. Any further comment on that? We can discuss it on the forum.

A: These are the times that try men's souls. And perhaps now you can understand the full meaning of that statement. Some souls do not do well under stress and pressure and the human system is constructed to alleviate stress by whatever means necessary.
Paul was right: the end of the world WAS coming
(Pierre) I'm trying to reconcile the AD timeline of history and the BP timeline, ice cores and dendrochronology. There seems to be one matching marker at 536 AD - a year without summer, very cold, very bad weather - seemingly matching the 1500 BP mark with a converging cooling all over the planet revealed by ice cores and tree rings. So my question is: Is it a real match?

A: Yes

Q: (Pierre) In a previous session you mentioned about 470 years added between us and Julius Caesar. If it matches, it means these 470 years were added before 536 AD?

A: Yes

Q: (Pierre) It means Caesar died about 70 years before this 536 event?

A: Yes

Q: (Pierre) Wow. It means there's no late or middle Roman Empire!

A: Yes

Q: (Pierre) Everything is collapsing. Yes, yes, yes. It's all gone. That's what we thought.

(L) And documents were faked to fill in the gap.

(Niall) Fake emperors and stuff.

(Joe) If there's a kind of rough mirror in this go-round, first Caesar and then a Dark Ages and collapse... And then in our era, a close match might be JFK as this era's Caesar. 1963. Plus 70 years is 2033.

(Pierre) Oh, I see what you mean.

(Niall) So 70 years after Caesar's death. So it's 44 BC. What's 44 + 70? So it's right after the fall, kaboom, it's gone. In fact, Paul didn't live very long.

(Pierre) Kaboom, and you transition to the Justinian plague.

(L) So in other words, Paul was right: the end of the world WAS coming?

A: Yes

Q: (Pierre) And the 2 or 3 missing centuries after the Justinian plague, they were not made up. They were there, but there was nothing going on because everybody was dead!

(L) Yeah, 90% death rate in the archaeology around Rome.

(Joe) Does that mean that JFK and Laura are this era's Caesar and Paul? [laughter]

(L) Oh, stop it! [laughter]

(Joe) Well, answer the question!

A: Silly!

Q: (Joe) Silly? That means yes.

(Niall) But when was the Jewish War then? And Josephus? That would have to be AFTER the collapse...

(Joe) Where's your Jewish War, Laura?

(L) I don't think there was a Jewish War.

(Joe) Somebody could have just been writing a fairytale...

(L) There was stuff going on at that time, like rebellion, but... Sorting out that MESS would be a labor of Hercules. I mean, Hercules was asked to clean the Augean stables. He was not asked to refill them. [laughter]

(Joe) All those events can be... I mean, you take events that happened in our recent history and you imagine someone chronicling that, you could expand that out over a long period of time. The amount of stuff that has happened if you took discrete events over the past 20 years, you could expand those out over a long period of time if you want.

(L) Sure. You could just write stuff and make some editorial changes, add stuff, re-use stories, and... I mean, look what I found that happened with Gregory of Tours vs. the Eastern Empire records. The whole history of Gregory of Tours fits into a slot that is completely blank in the records of the Eastern Empire. It's as though they stole that material and used it to write his history. God, how many times did they do that... Alright, anybody else have any questions? I'm getting depressed. [laughter]

(Chu) I have a related one. With all this fudging of history, is it true that there was never any vulgar Latin, and the chronology as it's depicted is wrong?

A: Yes

Q: (L) It affects everything - EVERYTHING. It's like a falling domino. It's enough to make you want to run out of the house screaming!
On Paul's use of Judaism in his message
Session 30 October 2021
Q: (Ryu) Did Paul believe Yahweh was the same god as Caesar's or did he use the Jewish religion as a template for his message?

A: Latter.

Q: (L) I think he was just using the Jewish god as a stand-in. He didn't really have much in the way of anything to reference. At the time, there were all these different gods. Then of course the Jewish god was claiming to be the only high creator god. That's what Paul was working with.

(Ryu) And did he come back after his life in the Roman Empire?

A: Yes

Q: (Joe) Who did he come back as? Anybody notable?

A: No

Q: (Joe) He was just hanging out being a farmer or something.
Is Paul the real name of "our" Paul?
Q: (Juba) Is Paul the real name of "our" Paul?

A: No

Q: (Juba) If not, what was it?

A: Zacaria.

Q: (Juba) Are Mark, Matthew, and Luke real names, or behind them were some obscure groups of people?

(L) I suspect Mark might have been a real name. Matthew might have been a real name of somebody who was involved with the writing of Matthew. Then Luke may have been too, but there were also obscure groups of people about them. Read my book and that should become clear.
It was said above that Paul's name was Zacaria. In Session 11 October 2014 it was said it was Saul. One might not exclude the other.

About Paul's Kingdom of God
Session 27 Aug 2022
(NewEngland Seeker) My question is taking Laura's commentary on the Secret of the Kingdom of God and linking that to the C's April drop dead date. Since Aries is the zodiac sign for April would the drop dead be a reference to a hyperdimensional being, i.e., Aries?

(L) $25 in the jar! [laughter]

(Joe) Aries is gonna kill us all.

(L) No, it's just kind of a... Where is this person? Lemme see him. Move that camera down so I can see you. That's pretty stretching it, dontcha think? You don't think so?

(NewEngland Seeker) [something about it being a hyperdimensional or a 3d related event]

(L) Well, I don't see how that relates to Paul's Kingdom of God except that you're talking about it the broad sense of it being a hyperdimensional thing. My emphasis was on the fact that the Kingdom of God was, as far as Paul could see, inclusive of individuals who were basically inclined in that direction while there were other individuals who were not so inclined. They were inclined in the STS direction. And basically, in Paul's Kingdom of God, you could only be inclined in the proper direction. Those who believed the lies or couldn't see or understand were not yet able to perceive the unseen. So, you're asking about Aries in terms of Aries being something like the war god, is that...?

(NewEngland Seeker) Correct. Something like a dark hyperdimensional being.

(L) So, let's ask: Is the April Drop Dead Date a reference to a hyperdimensional being such as Aries, i.e. the God of War?

A: Not exactly.

Q: (L) Is it more a reference to something that will manifest on Earth in our 3d reality at some future April time?

A: Yes
It is a real miracle that Mark and Paul's letters were actually saved
Session 14 January 2023
(Elohir) After having read your excellent book about Paul, we can easily understand that Mark was inspired by him and then Matthew and Luke made their own histories inspired by Mark, changing some important things to fit in their own agenda. Everything could have been perfect for some people if we had never retrieved the letters of Paul or if Mark had been completely erased/lost. Could we say that a well-intentioned person saved the letters of Paul and then Mark against all odds, especially against STS will?

A: Yes!!

Q: (L) So, some well-intentioned person. I think that Paul and Mark survived in very small communities that were Pauline communities. There was not a vast proliferation of copies, which is why there's so little left.
(L) Okay... Yes, it is a real miracle that Mark and Paul's letters were actually saved. Absolutely.

(Chu) That's it for questions.

(L) Alright then.

(Chu) One more question.

(Elohir) Has Marcion been considered good or smart enough to be provided with the letters of Paul? Has he been part of a group that wanted to save the truth against the Church of Jerusalem?

(L) Yeah, I'm convinced that it was Marcion who got it through that particular dark time and collected as many as he could find and put it together. Alrighty, I'm kind of exhausted here. Are there any questions we should have asked that we didn't ask? Please consider them asked and give us any advice that's available at the present time.

A: You are all doing well. We know it is difficult, but a bit more humor might help. Also do have some fun together! Goodbye.
Paul knew Plato's "Apology", but it did not influence his ideas about Christ
Session 25 February 2023
(T.C.) Was Paul familiar with Plato's "Apology" (about the death of Socrates)?

A: Yes

Q: (T.C.) Did it influence his ideas about Christ?

A: No.

A note about the name of Mark
From Middle English Mark, from the Latin praenomen (i.e. first name) Mārcus, derived from Mārs, the Roman god of war, originally Māvors, from Proto-Italic *Māwortis.
Marcus is a masculine given name of Ancient Roman pre-Christian origin derived either from Etruscan Marce of unknown meaning or referring to the god Mars.
If Mark is derived from Mars, it also connects to the Month of March:
The name of March comes from Martius, the first month of the earliest Roman calendar. It was named after Mars, the Roman god of war, and an ancestor of the Roman people through his sons Romulus and Remus. His month Martius was the beginning of the season for warfare,[1]
Caesar was murdered on the Ides of March, the 15th of March
The Ides of March (/aɪdz/; Latin: Idus Martiae, Late Latin: Idus Martii)[1] is the 74th day in the Roman calendar, corresponding to 15 March. It was marked by several religious observances and was a deadline for settling debts in Rome.[2] In 44 BC, it became notorious as the date of the assassination of Julius Caesar, which made the Ides of March a turning point in Roman history.
Mark Antony was a close ally of Julius Caesar
The name of Marcion who gathered the letters of Paul is said in the Wiktionary for Marcion to be a diminutive form of Markus.

The name Markus and its derivatives were very common in Roman times, and there is probably little connection between the name of the Gospel of Mark and all the other people and incidents, but as a mnemonic device it might work just fine.
Thank you for this compilation Thorbiorn and the time to gather and post. When we started reading FPTM I had a lot of resistance, mainly the echoes of the fundie BS I grew up with, an absolute aversion to a the "scriptural" text. However, I knew that there were important reasons for Laura to spend so much time and effort in writing this massive tome, so the least I could do would be to set aside all the brain babble and forge ahead with at least a grain of faith in the process. A few lights are going on and I am so grateful for Laura's magnificent book, the opportunity to participate in discussions in the workshop with Logos5x5 and the group.
Thank you for this compilation Thorbiorn and the time to gather and post. When we started reading FPTM I had a lot of resistance, mainly the echoes of the fundie BS I grew up with, an absolute aversion to a the "scriptural" text. However, I knew that there were important reasons for Laura to spend so much time and effort in writing this massive tome, so the least I could do would be to set aside all the brain babble and forge ahead with at least a grain of faith in the process. A few lights are going on and I am so grateful for Laura's magnificent book, the opportunity to participate in discussions in the workshop with Logos5x5 and the group.
Ditto @Bluefyre. And kudos to you @thorbiorn, for a magnificent job on this compilation. It's a real blessing to be part of this Fellowship where so much time, effort, and love is so freely given in the search for truth.
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